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Official Sony XBR2 (60" & 70") Owner's Thread - Page 195

post #5821 of 12044
Quote:
Originally Posted by cctvtech View Post

You are connected directly to an antenna or cable? Did you set up the Channel List (page 26 of the Operating Instructions) and optionally the Setup Service for TV Guide (pages 38-46 of the Operating Instructions)?

Also, the TV power has to be off overnight to pick up the listings.

Hi cctvtech,

Thanks, yes I did do those initial settings a couple of times and it is connected directly to the Cable input. I do have a Panasonic DVR that is getting TV guide lists and that has always worked fine.

The XBR2 has been off every night for over a week. Sony TS suggested going through the whole install process again, which may be needed, but as with everyone setting up the all the inputs and channel lists is a couple hours of work and would be my last alternative LOL!!

Did yours work right the first time?

Thanks again,
Al
post #5822 of 12044
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dinomon View Post

Were u able to tweak the PQ as your XBR1 was? I don't know for some reason, I still can't convince myself that XBR2 has the same PQ has my (Green Blob) XBR1 PQ. I did lots of tweaking, but still not happy as was with my XBR1.

Hi Dinomon,

I am also a convert from the XBR1. I have also been tweaking for a week and the picture quality is a tad different. One thing I noticed though, if I switch to the XBR2's own QAM cable tuner and watch some of the "in-the-clear" HD channels over cable or OTA attenna, picture quality is about the same as the XBR1.

It's going from the HD cable box to HDMI that does not look quite as sharp as it did on the XBR1 to me.

I am wondering if the XBR2 HDMI 2.0 ports that support 1080p, if there is maybe some conversion loss that did not happen on the XBR 1.1 1080i ports.

I am curious, are you watching through an HD cable box, Direct TV etc via HDMI, or on the XBR2 tuner?

If you have "in-the-clear" hd cable channels or OTA Broadcasts , see if they look more like the XBR1.

Al>
post #5823 of 12044
Quote:
Originally Posted by albotti View Post

Hi Dinomon,

I am also a convert from the XBR1. I have also been tweaking for a week and the picture quality is a tad different. One thing I noticed though, if I switch to the XBR2's own QAM cable tuner and watch some of the "in-the-clear" HD channels over cable or OTA attenna, picture quality is about the same as the XBR1.

It's going from the HD cable box to HDMI that does not look quite as sharp as it did on the XBR1 to me.

I am wondering if the XBR2 HDMI 2.0 ports that support 1080p, if there is maybe some conversion loss that did not happen on the XBR 1.1 1080i ports.

If you have "in-the-clear" hd cable channels, see if they look better to you and let me know.

Hi Al,

When I watch HD channels (OTA), the PQ is pretty much similar to my previous XBR1, but feels like somthing small is missing.. But still HD is great..

When I watch SD digital (OTA & Satallite), the PQ is not anywhere close to XBR1. XBR1 had a really good PQ for SD channels also..
post #5824 of 12044
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dinomon View Post

Hi Al,

When I watch HD channels (OTA), the PQ is pretty much similar to my previous XBR1, but feels like somthing small is missing.. But still HD is great..

When I watch SD digital (OTA & Satallite), the PQ is not anywhere close to XBR1. XBR1 had a really good PQ for SD channels also..

Hi Dinomon,

Ok, yeah its hard to put a finger on it, the flesh tones are harder to dial in.
My tuner channels are real nice, the black levels seem a tad better, and there is less silk screen effect we first used to complain about LOL!! ah the old days.

But from channel to channel its not as consistent yet, I agree!! maybe with enough adjusting we'll find the right mix!!

I am going to try the Component inputs this week from my Cable box to see if it may be better and if it is conversion related. It shoudnt be, but I need to see.

Al>
post #5825 of 12044
Quote:
Originally Posted by albotti View Post

Hi Dinomon,

Ok, yeah its hard to put a finger on it, the flesh tones are harder to dial in.
My tuner channels are real nice, the black levels seem a tad better, and there is less silk screen effect we first used to complain about LOL!! ah the old days.

But from channel to channel its not as consistent yet, I agree!! maybe with enough adjusting we'll find the right mix!!

I am going to try the Component inputs this week from my Cable box to see if it may be better and if it is conversion related. It shoudnt be, but I need to see.

Al>

I am not saying XBR2 is bad, but I found that the PQ is far grainer than XBR1. The XBR1 PQ just snapped and jumped out at you. The XBR2 seems softer and grainer. XBR1 looked perfect straight out of the box with very minimal tweaking.
post #5826 of 12044
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dinomon View Post

I am not saying XBR2 is bad, but I found that the PQ is far grainer than XBR1. The XBR1 PQ just snapped and jumped out at you. The XBR2 seems softer and grainer. XBR1 looked perfect straight out of the box with very minimal tweaking.

It is time to get your set calibrated. NO SET looks perfect out of the box with very minimal tweaking. The XBR2 needs some adjustments made by someone who knows what they are doing. After the proper adjustments are made you will see why the XBR2 is a notch above the XBR1.
post #5827 of 12044
Quote:
Originally Posted by pwiss View Post

It is time to get your set calibrated. NO SET looks perfect out of the box with very minimal tweaking. The XBR2 needs some adjustments made by someone who knows what they are doing. After the proper adjustments are made you will see why the XBR2 is a notch above the XBR1.

But I always wonder why Sony doesn't make these set look perfect out of the box without paying extra on calibration.. We already pay a lot to buy these sets, and should we be getting a good set... hum...
post #5828 of 12044
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dinomon View Post

But I always wonder why Sony doesn't make these set look perfect out of the box without paying extra on calibration.. We already pay a lot to buy these sets, and should we be getting a good set... hum...

This has been answered several times already. Its because their (and all other manufacturer's) sales are driven by how good the set looks under bright florescent (blue) lights on the sales room floor against all the other displays set to "vivid", not in your darkened house.
post #5829 of 12044
Quote:
Originally Posted by albotti View Post

Did yours work right the first time?

Yes, and it is picking up on the TV Guide listings but I rarely use the cable directly. Mostly I use the cable box and DVD's.

Quote:
Originally Posted by albotti View Post

But from channel to channel its not as consistent yet, I agree!! maybe with enough adjusting we'll find the right mix!!

I noticed the same thing with my XBR2. The color intensity and hue vary more from channel-to-channel than the XBR1.
post #5830 of 12044
Quote:
Originally Posted by pwiss View Post

It is time to get your set calibrated. NO SET looks perfect out of the box with very minimal tweaking. The XBR2 needs some adjustments made by someone who knows what they are doing. After the proper adjustments are made you will see why the XBR2 is a notch above the XBR1.

I doubt if ISF calibration can fix color intensity and hue differences between channels. And although I don't have the test equipment that umr has, I was involved in broadcast and studio equipment long enough to know how to get the best out of a TV.

The XBR1 was closer to ideal out of the box and it adjusted closer to ideal than I can make the XBR2. I'll admit that a good ISF calibrator can probably do better but at the very least the job would be harder on this set than on my 50" XBR1.

The XBR2 still looks excellent when tweaked properly on any given HD channel but it is pain having to adjust it each time I change channels, especially on SD channels.
post #5831 of 12044
So i take it the XBR 2 doesn't do as good as the XBR1 on SD. What about HD though, is it better or the same and is the XBR2 horrible on SD?


I never had a Rear projection and the XBR 2 will be my first. Im not really going to watch SD sources.
post #5832 of 12044
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hi My Name Is View Post

So i take it the XBR 2 doesn't do as good as the XBR1 on SD. What about HD though, is it better or the same and is the XBR2 horrible on SD?


I never had a Rear projection and the XBR 2 will be my first. Im not really going to watch SD sources.

The XBR2 can look as good as the XBR1 on any source. It just doesn't always stay as good from channel to channel without tweaking for each program.

I don't see how you can avoid watching SD for now. There's too little programming in HD.
post #5833 of 12044
Quote:
Originally Posted by EricBergan View Post

This has been answered several times already. Its because their (and all other manufacturer's) sales are driven by how good the set looks under bright florescent (blue) lights on the sales room floor against all the other displays set to "vivid", not in your darkened house.

Hence, the "vivid" setting. So why are the normal and custom settings not set up properly for home use?
post #5834 of 12044
Quote:
Originally Posted by cctvtech View Post

I doubt if ISF calibration can fix color intensity and hue differences between channels. And although I don't have the test equipment that umr has, I was involved in broadcast and studio equipment long enough to know how to get the best out of a TV.

The XBR1 was closer to ideal out of the box and it adjusted closer to ideal than I can make the XBR2. I'll admit that a good ISF calibrator can probably do better but at the very least the job would be harder on this set than on my 50" XBR1.

The XBR2 still looks excellent when tweaked properly on any given HD channel but it is pain having to adjust it each time I change channels, especially on SD channels.

Maybe I'm just not picky. HD channels look great and SD channels (on cable) look like overly compressed garbage. Having used three different XBR1s and an A2000 I can't say SD channels looks worse on the XBR2. There's not much that can be done so I don't have particularly high expectations for the PQ of SD channels.

The XBR2 has been getting a bad rap lately but in my opinion, the XBR1 was really the beta for the XBR2. No blue hue for me. No green blob. 1080p over hdmi. The XBR1 was a nightmare for many people but inevitably some people will always say the old times were better.
post #5835 of 12044
Quote:
Originally Posted by cctvtech View Post

I don't see how you can avoid watching SD for now. There's too little programming in HD.


uhh how much TV do you watch?

ESPN
ESPN 2 HD
NFL Ticket
ABC
NBC
FOX
CW
CBS
National Geographic
Discovery Channel
HBO
SHowtime

Between Gaming and watching movies ( which i do way more then I watch TV), why wouldn't that be enough media footage to watch on my free time between school and work? Some of you watch too much TV I see.
post #5836 of 12044
I'm not saying that the XBR1 didn't/doesn't have its faults. But despite the OB problems, the XBR1 had an overall better PQ out of the box that required less tweaking to get it right.
post #5837 of 12044
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hi My Name Is View Post

uhh how much TV do you watch?

ESPN
ESPN 2 HD
NFL Ticket
ABC
NBC
FOX
CW
CBS
National Geographic
Discovery Channel
HBO
SHowtime

Between Gaming and watching movies ( which i do way more then I watch TV), why wouldn't that be enough media footage to watch on my free time between school and work? Some of you watch too much TV I see.

I can see where he's coming from. For Prime Time, there's quite a bit of HD programming (although the quality of such programming is always debatable ).

I don't watch ESPN or ESPN2 HD unless it's football season or World Cup.

I don't subscribe to premium channels.

National Geogaphic and Discovery HD isn't bad but usually those channels aren't high on my priority list. (They're usually good in between shows or when there's nothing else on.)

TNTHD gets a lot of playtime at our house though.

There's also Universal HD but they have less than spectacular programming most times.

Without PrimeTime OTA programming, the HD offerings are defnitely lacking IMO.
post #5838 of 12044
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hi My Name Is View Post

uhh how much TV do you watch?

ESPN
ESPN 2 HD
NFL Ticket
ABC
NBC
FOX
CW
CBS
National Geographic
Discovery Channel
HBO
SHowtime

Between Gaming and watching movies ( which i do way more then I watch TV), why wouldn't that be enough media footage to watch on my free time between school and work? Some of you watch too much TV I see.

I don't watch that much sports in general. I also don't get NFL Ticket or National Geographic in HD. I do get PBSHD and A&E pseudo-HD. I also watch the other Discovery networks and many other channels that are not in HD yet.

It depends what's on. I'm not going to watch crap just because it is in HD. And I don't play video games, at least not on the TV.

Even on the local network HD channels, many programs are still in 4:3 SD, especially syndicated shows like Jeopardy.
post #5839 of 12044
Quote:
Originally Posted by cctvtech View Post

I'm not saying that the XBR1 didn't/doesn't have its faults. But despite the OB problems, the XBR1 had an overall better PQ out of the box that required less tweaking to get it right.

YMMV I guess. PQ on the XBR2 seemed at least as good to me as the XBR1 san the blue and green demons. Even the A2000 seemed fine out of the box (and only after a few weeks developed the dreadful color discoloration.)

It's almost pointless to argue this because this is entirely subjective and what the few experience (or believe to have experienced) may or may not represent the majority.
post #5840 of 12044
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dinomon View Post

Were u able to tweak the PQ as your XBR1 was? I don't know for some reason, I still can't convince myself that XBR2 has the same PQ has my (Green Blob) XBR1 PQ. I did lots of tweaking, but still not happy as was with my XBR1.

Yes........ lots of tweaking trying different things to get the picture to 'pop' out like the XBR1. Looks better than before but still not quite there yet. I really had to dial down the red and lower my saturation controls to minimize the red push this display has. Also, had to turn on the edge enhancement control to low and the detail enhancer to medium where as I never had to use these two controls on the XBR1
post #5841 of 12044
Quote:
Originally Posted by albotti View Post

Hi Dinomon,

Ok, yeah its hard to put a finger on it, the flesh tones are harder to dial in.
My tuner channels are real nice, the black levels seem a tad better, and there is less silk screen effect we first used to complain about LOL!! ah the old days.

But from channel to channel its not as consistent yet, I agree!! maybe with enough adjusting we'll find the right mix!!

I am going to try the Component inputs this week from my Cable box to see if it may be better and if it is conversion related. It shoudnt be, but I need to see.

Al>

You know.....I was thinking along the same lines if the PQ change could have come from the different HDMI versions between the XBR1 and XBR2? When you switch over to component you will probably have to re-calibrate before evaluating the PQ......let us know your findings........
post #5842 of 12044
Quote:
Originally Posted by cctvtech View Post

The XBR2 can look as good as the XBR1 on any source. It just doesn't always stay as good from channel to channel without tweaking for each program.

I don't see how you can avoid watching SD for now. There's too little programming in HD.

That's very true, there are only little HD out there currently. I really wish there's a setting in XBR2 that you can change to make it work like XBR1 on SD.
post #5843 of 12044
Quote:
Originally Posted by cctvtech View Post

I noticed the same thing with my XBR2. The color intensity and hue vary more from channel-to-channel than the XBR1.

I agree with this assessment and this is what has been once of my biggest headaches with the XBR2. I tweak one channel to look pretty good but then if I turn to another it can look pretty bad!?!? This phenomenon can even occur within the same program if the scene changes......perfect example while watching My Name is Earl (HD) last night the outdoor daytime scenes looked sharp and colors looked accurate (or at least close).....however during the indoor bar scenes and outdoor night scenes the colors look overly intense and the overall PQ was no longer very sharp (crisp)!?!?
post #5844 of 12044
Quote:
Originally Posted by Desert Heat View Post

You know.....I was thinking along the same lines if the PQ change could have come from the different HDMI versions between the XBR1 and XBR2? When you switch over to component you will probably have to re-calibrate before evaluating the PQ......let us know your findings........

I don't use HDMI yet due to my current receiver not having it. My observations are with component video.
post #5845 of 12044
Quote:
Originally Posted by Desert Heat View Post

Yes........ lots of tweaking trying different things to get the picture to 'pop' out like the XBR1. Looks better than before but still not quite there yet. I really had to dial down the red and lower my saturation controls to minimize the red push this display has. Also, had to turn on the edge enhancement control to low and the detail enhancer to medium where as I never had to use these two controls on the XBR1

Can you please post (or PM) your SD settings on the XBR2 Settings/Tweaks post: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=739074
post #5846 of 12044
Quote:
Originally Posted by maximum360 View Post

Maybe I'm just not picky. HD channels look great and SD channels (on cable) look like overly compressed garbage. Having used three different XBR1s and an A2000 I can't say SD channels looks worse on the XBR2. There's not much that can be done so I don't have particularly high expectations for the PQ of SD channels.

The XBR2 has been getting a bad rap lately but in my opinion, the XBR1 was really the beta for the XBR2. No blue hue for me. No green blob. 1080p over hdmi. The XBR1 was a nightmare for many people but inevitably some people will always say the old times were better.

IMHO, they pushed the envelope too hard on the XBR1 hence the mind blowing PQ yet inevitable blob or stain problems. Seems like they scaled back on the XBR2. PQ no longer mind blowing but still good in it's own right and without the blob/stain problems to boot!
post #5847 of 12044
Quote:
Originally Posted by cctvtech View Post

I don't use HDMI yet due to my current receiver not having it. My observations are with component video.

Thanks.....that tells me the PQ issues are the same and have little or nothing to do wit the HDMI harware change.
post #5848 of 12044
Yesterday while watching a DVD (through HDMI -Video 7), during movement, I see lots of fuzziness. I don't remember noticing that on my XBR1 watching the same DVD. Any ideas?
post #5849 of 12044
Quote:
Originally Posted by Desert Heat View Post

IMHO, they pushed the envelope too hard on the XBR1 hence the mind blowing PQ yet inevitable blob or stain problems. Seems like they scaled back on the XBR2. PQ no longer mind blowing but still good in it's own right and without the blob/stain problems to boot!

Color and hue control have nothing to do with the OB or related parts.
post #5850 of 12044
Quote:
Originally Posted by Desert Heat View Post

IMHO, they pushed the envelope too hard on the XBR1 hence the mind blowing PQ yet inevitable blob or stain problems. Seems like they scaled back on the XBR2. PQ no longer mind blowing but still good in it's own right and without the blob/stain problems to boot!

I guess we have to agree to disagree. With an LED lamp and better black levels and contrast ratio, the XBR2 would be just about perfect. Even without those, it still trumps the XBR1 (and I've already explained why I think so).

Anyhow, I'm done with this.

I hope you get your problem fixed.
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