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post #6721 of 6855
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwsat View Post

I missed the first season (maybe the first two seasons) of Breaking Bad. I caught up in the first place by availing myself of one of the AMC marathons. A marathon really is a great way to catch up. I came to The Walking Dead late too and caught up on it the same way. Anyway, I am really looking forward to seeing every episode of Breaking Bad again.

I'm streaming off Netflix .. they have all but this years episodes posted ..
post #6722 of 6855

S3 of TWD will be added to the streamimg episode package Sept 29-this Sunday.

post #6723 of 6855
Quote:
Originally Posted by wco81 View Post

So Showtime wouldn't pay him enough and he left.

Oh well ...

Well, he's working on Nurse Jackie now, which is a Showtime show, so that's probably not it. I think he really just wanted a break.

I found this article which highlights some of Clyde Phillips' thoughts about the final season (and the last four seasons in general), as posted on Reddit. He's clearly as disappointed in the show's fall from greatness as we are:

http://www.uproxx.com/tv/2013/09/former-dexter-showrunner-agrees-season-crap-thinks-finale-killer/
post #6724 of 6855
Quote:
Originally Posted by cuzzin View Post

Well, he's working on Nurse Jackie now, which is a Showtime show, so that's probably not it. I think he really just wanted a break.

I found this article which highlights some of Clyde Phillips' thoughts about the final season (and the last four seasons in general), as posted on Reddit. He's clearly as disappointed in the show's fall from greatness as we are:

http://www.uproxx.com/tv/2013/09/former-dexter-showrunner-agrees-season-crap-thinks-finale-killer/

Thanks - Right in line with our thoughts I think. It's obvious writing was the only missing ingredient of the last few seasons.
There were moments the cast injected, but without a great hold on the story, it falls apart.
post #6725 of 6855
Hi. I haven't seen S8 of "Dexter" yet (gotta watch "Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind" to maybe start to get myself back on track, if you know what I mean frown.gif ). But, while the thread is still active with the post-ending reaction, I'd like to ask the "Dexter" faithful if they can look back and point to a specific "jump the shark" moment for the series when they think "Dexter" went completely and irrevocable off the rails.

To me, looking back (and without having seen the just-concluded season), it has to be S6's out-of-nowhere plot point of the Deb character developing a sexual crush of her foster bro. This was primarily, besides the funny asides and stylistic bits, a character-driven show with Deborah and Dexter as the twin towers holding the entire fantasy/narrative somewhat grounded in the familiarity of a family dynamic, of the real human bond between Dex and Deb. That nobody saw coming the Deb crush on Dex (so it qualifies as a true 'WTF!' blindside) doesn't excuse that it betrayed the essence of a key character's seasons-long arc that had not been developed or foreshadowed. Anybody got another one?

Hope to write about the "Dexter" finale when I get around to see it... eventually. frown.gif
post #6726 of 6855
Quote:
Originally Posted by dad1153 View Post

Hi. I haven't seen S8 of "Dexter" yet (gotta watch "Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind" to maybe start to get myself back on track, if you know what I mean frown.gif ). But, while the thread is still active with the post-ending reaction, I'd like to ask the "Dexter" faithful if they can look back and point to a specific "jump the shark" moment for the series when they think "Dexter" went completely and irrevocable off the rails.

To me, looking back (and without having seen the just-concluded season), it has to be S6's out-of-nowhere plot point of the Deb character developing a sexual crush of her foster bro. This was primarily, besides the funny asides and stylistic bits, a character-driven show with Deborah and Dexter as the twin towers holding the entire fantasy/narrative somewhat grounded in the familiarity of a family dynamic, of the real human bond between Dex and Deb. That nobody saw coming the Deb crush on Dex (so it qualifies as a true 'WTF!' blindside) doesn't excuse that it betrayed the essence of a key character's seasons-long arc that had not been developed or foreshadowed. Anybody got another one?

Hope to write about the "Dexter" finale when I get around to see it... eventually. frown.gif
dad, you are so late to the game here....
post #6727 of 6855
Quote:
Originally Posted by dad1153 View Post

I'd like to ask the "Dexter" faithful if they can look back and point to a specific "jump the shark" moment for the series when they think "Dexter" went completely and irrevocable off the rails. (

Good question and you may be right about Deb's crush on Dexter which was horrible. I think I go back to Season 4 and Dexter's trying to deal with a baby. I know that it was a plot point and they tried to make it work. I just never felt that it worked and it seemed to be the beginning of Dexter's sloppiness and acting out of character to try to make a storyline. It was the beginning of the end in that the writing was terribly inconsistent from then on. Even in seasons (such as Season 4) which had some good parts, that's when my eyes started rolling. I know people love Season 4 but I thought it was pretty bad until the Thanksgiving episode.
post #6728 of 6855
Quote:
Originally Posted by oink View Post

dad, you are so late to the game here....

Agreed, and by the time he watches and posts his thoughts this thread will be deader than a doornail. With that said, I concur with dad1153 about season 6 being the one that originally spun way off the rails. Season 7 brought things back into focus and was pretty darn good if you ask me, and then season 8...well, you know.
Quote:
Originally Posted by daryl zero View Post

Good question and you may be right about Deb's crush on Dexter which was horrible. I think I go back to Season 4 and Dexter's trying to deal with a baby. I know that it was a plot point and they tried to make it work. I just never felt that it worked and it seemed to be the beginning of Dexter's sloppiness and acting out of character to try to make a storyline. It was the beginning of the end in that the writing was terribly inconsistent from then on. Even in seasons (such as Season 4) which had some good parts, that's when my eyes started rolling. I know people love Season 4 but I thought it was pretty bad until the Thanksgiving episode.

I get what you're saying, but they had to set up the "holy crap" ending scene, so I am able to look past it concerning season 4. Season 6 was terrible, but I think the real defining moment is when the writers decided to give Dexter real emotions; that's what kind of slowly derailed things. I'm no doctor or psychologist, but as far as I know psychopaths don't all of the sudden develop real emotion, and in Dexter's case, magically lose the desire to kill. Season 5 explored this nicely, but in the end Dexter decided he wasn't willing to give up his "Dark Passenger" and told Lumen he'd take hers on as well. Now later down the road they completely forego that idea? Huh?

OR, you could probably blame the change of showrunners on the derailment. I liked Phillips' proposed ending...
Edited by Nuance - 9/26/13 at 5:21am
post #6729 of 6855
I find it shocking that 'Dexter's biggest fan on AVS hasn't watched any of this last season! Shocked, I tells you! eek.giftongue.gif
post #6730 of 6855
Quote:
Originally Posted by archiguy View Post

I find it shocking that 'Dexter's biggest fan on AVS hasn't watched any of this last season! Shocked, I tells you! eek.giftongue.gif

That's because he's not Dexter's biggest fan - I am. I'm also Batman...and Ironman. biggrin.gif
post #6731 of 6855
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuance View Post

Agreed, and by the time he watches and posts his thoughts this thread will be deader than a doornail. With that said, I concur with dad1153 about season 6 being the one that originally spun way off the rails. Season 7 brought things back into focus and was pretty darn good if you ask me, and then season 8...well, you know.
I get what you're saying, but they had to set up the "holy crap" ending scene, so I am able to look past it concerning season 4. Season 6 was terrible, but I think the real defining moment is when the writers decided to give Dexter real emotions; that's what kind of slowly derailed things. I'm no doctor or psychologist, but as far as I know psychopaths don't all of the sudden develop real emotion, and in Dexter's case, magically lose the desire to kill. Season 5 explored this nicely, but in the end Dexter decided he wasn't willing to give up his "Dark Passenger" and told Lumen he'd take hers on as well. Now later down the road they completely forego that idea? Huh?

OR, you could probably blame the change of showrunners on the derailment. I liked Phillips' proposed ending...

Great comments. For me, the only wiggle room was in whether Dexter really was a psychopath, or had just been convinced he was by Harry. They used to tease us a little with that possibility, but like so many other storylines they just sorta dropped it.

My overall view of the final seasons is that the "big concept" was still good but they dropped the ball on the details. It seems to me the writers were so focused on the story arc they didn't notice how sloppy and implausible the individual episodes became. They expected the story would gloss over their mistakes, but Dexter was never really about the story. As Hilary might say about the show: "Its the characters, stupid."
post #6732 of 6855
Quote:
Originally Posted by lonwolf615 View Post

For me, the only wiggle room was in whether Dexter really was a psychopath, or had just been convinced he was by Harry.
IMO, you ARE what you DO.wink.gif

Quote:
Dexter was never really about the story. As Hilary might say about the show: "Its the characters, stupid."
+1000000000
post #6733 of 6855
The final view of Dexter, siiting in the chair, his eyes blacked. The Dark Passenger has returned.

What everyone missed, is that he's not in the Great Northwest. He's up in New Hampshire and shacks up next door to Heisenberg! Two psychopaths lament their lot in life.biggrin.gif
post #6734 of 6855
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuance View Post

Agreed, and by the time he watches and posts his thoughts this thread will be deader than a doornail. With that said, I concur with dad1153 about season 6 being the one that originally spun way off the rails. Season 7 brought things back into focus and was pretty darn good if you ask me, and then season 8...well, you know.
I get what you're saying, but they had to set up the "holy crap" ending scene, so I am able to look past it concerning season 4. Season 6 was terrible, but I think the real defining moment is when the writers decided to give Dexter real emotions; that's what kind of slowly derailed things. I'm no doctor or psychologist, but as far as I know psychopaths don't all of the sudden develop real emotion, and in Dexter's case, magically lose the desire to kill. Season 5 explored this nicely, but in the end Dexter decided he wasn't willing to give up his "Dark Passenger" and told Lumen he'd take hers on as well. Now later down the road they completely forego that idea? Huh?

OR, you could probably blame the change of showrunners on the derailment. I liked Phillips' proposed ending...
I'm mixed on it... as much as the absence of emotion was pushed he never seemed completely flat, like Saxon he had that one woman in his life that evoked emotion. For Saxon his mother for Dexter it was Deb. It seems after Rita was gone he had some miraculous birth of emotion resulting short term relationships with other damaged goods gals. I was a bit unimpressed with the finale, for me finding Rita the way he did was one of the high watermarks for season shockers. I liked the addition of Vogel in this but really wished that would have come to a boil with her Saxon and Dex in the final episode.

My only question is what is the need he is left with as mountain Dex? His ned to kill was "replaced" by Hannah who he let go so now what? He's just going to do some logging and sit at his kitchen table thinking about how much he hates himself?
post #6735 of 6855
Quote:
Originally Posted by General Kenobi View Post

I liked the addition of Vogel in this but really wished that would have come to a boil with her Saxon and Dex in the final episode.

My only question is what is the need he is left with as mountain Dex? His ned to kill was "replaced" by Hannah who he let go so now what? He's just going to do some logging and sit at his kitchen table thinking about how much he hates himself?

Perhaps a "two fer one in the plastic encased kill room .. ?? .. tongue.gif

If I were to speculate on Dex self imposed exile in whatever area he ended up in .. (I'm thinking it was Canada .. ) which set's up the 6 episode guest appearance on Histories Ax Men .. and since he's grown a beard, a short stint on Duck Dynasty ..
post #6736 of 6855
Quote:
Originally Posted by mgkdragn View Post

Perhaps a "two fer one in the plastic encased kill room .. ?? .. tongue.gif

If I were to speculate on Dex self imposed exile in whatever area he ended up in .. (I'm thinking it was Canada .. ) which set's up the 6 episode guest appearance on Histories Ax Men .. and since he's grown a beard, a short stint on Duck Dynasty ..

How about Survivor? Dex on a tropical island, winning by default as the other contestants mysteriously disappear...
post #6737 of 6855
Quote:
Originally Posted by lonwolf615 View Post



How about Survivor? Dex on a tropical island, winning by default as the other contestants mysteriously disappear...

Giving a whole new meaning to "The tribe has spoken" .. I like it .. wink.gif
post #6738 of 6855
Quote:
Originally Posted by mgkdragn View Post



If I were to speculate on Dex self imposed exile in whatever area he ended up in .. (I'm thinking it was Canada .. )..
I'm hoping the Pacific NW....
I can think of a lot candidates for his table.biggrin.gif

Quote:
Originally Posted by lonwolf615 View Post



How about Survivor? Dex on a tropical island, winning by default as the other contestants mysteriously disappear...
LOL.
post #6739 of 6855
Quote:
Originally Posted by mgkdragn View Post

Giving a whole new meaning to "The tribe has spoken" .. I like it .. wink.gif

I think NBC already tried that route ... although, I only made it through one episode of it.
post #6740 of 6855
Quote:
Originally Posted by dad1153 View Post

Hi. I haven't seen S8 of "Dexter" yet (gotta watch "Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind" to maybe start to get myself back on track, if you know what I mean frown.gif ). But, while the thread is still active with the post-ending reaction, I'd like to ask the "Dexter" faithful if they can look back and point to a specific "jump the shark" moment for the series when they think "Dexter" went completely and irrevocable off the rails.

To me, looking back (and without having seen the just-concluded season), it has to be S6's out-of-nowhere plot point of the Deb character developing a sexual crush of her foster bro. This was primarily, besides the funny asides and stylistic bits, a character-driven show with Deborah and Dexter as the twin towers holding the entire fantasy/narrative somewhat grounded in the familiarity of a family dynamic, of the real human bond between Dex and Deb. That nobody saw coming the Deb crush on Dex (so it qualifies as a true 'WTF!' blindside) doesn't excuse that it betrayed the essence of a key character's seasons-long arc that had not been developed or foreshadowed. Anybody got another one?

Hope to write about the "Dexter" finale when I get around to see it... eventually. frown.gif

Gotta say - right there with Ya. It was the sign. Show runner, writers, whoever - getting paid.
I think I posted a rant here, but it's not a solo opinion.

Be Well Dad
E
post #6741 of 6855
i like actress aimee garcia's comments on the ending of the finale. (she played jamie, dexter's nanny)

they (the fans) wanted it to have a nice, neat little bow on top of the present. but I think it's the saddest thing to see a protagonist, this charming serial killer that you've learned to root for, to not have his father, not have his kid, not have his girlfriend, not have his sister, not have his friends, and not even have his inner thoughts. that last scene, he doesn't even have his voiceover, so to me that's him punishing himself for everything that he's done. it's so much more heartbreaking than escaping through death. but it was hard for people to swallow that. no one wants to see their favorite anti hero so sad."

read full article here
post #6742 of 6855
Quote:
Originally Posted by kittycarole View Post

i like actress aimee garcia's comments on the ending of the finale. (she played jamie, dexter's nanny)

they (the fans) wanted it to have a nice, neat little bow on top of the present. but I think it's the saddest thing to see a protagonist, this charming serial killer that you've learned to root for, to not have his father, not have his kid, not have his girlfriend, not have his sister, not have his friends, and not even have his inner thoughts. that last scene, he doesn't even have his voiceover, so to me that's him punishing himself for everything that he's done. it's so much more heartbreaking than escaping through death. but it was hard for people to swallow that. no one wants to see their favorite anti hero so sad."

read full article here

Thanks for the link.

I don't think fans would have been upset with the final ending had the rest of the season been brilliant. In my opinion, fans were more upset about the lack of creativity and intensity with this season overall. The very ending was actually pretty good, but the 11 episodes that led up to it were virtually meaningless. The season as a whole could have been so much better, but instead it was an epic fail.

Just my $0.02
post #6743 of 6855
Quote:
Originally Posted by kittycarole View Post

i like actress aimee garcia's comments on the ending of the finale. (she played jamie, dexter's nanny)

they (the fans) wanted it to have a nice, neat little bow on top of the present. but I think it's the saddest thing to see a protagonist, this charming serial killer that you've learned to root for, to not have his father, not have his kid, not have his girlfriend, not have his sister, not have his friends, and not even have his inner thoughts. that last scene, he doesn't even have his voiceover, so to me that's him punishing himself for everything that he's done. it's so much more heartbreaking than escaping through death. but it was hard for people to swallow that. no one wants to see their favorite anti hero so sad."

read full article here

I agree with that 100%. Dexter is suffering a fate worse than death (for him, so familiar with death). He's lost literally everyone he ever cared for, he's solely responsible, and he'll be completely alone for the rest of his life. I never saw 'The Shield', but I understand it ended in a similar way (the anti-hero, an adrenaline junkie, being stuck in a boring desk job - the worst possible fate for a guy like him).
post #6744 of 6855
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuance View Post

The season as a whole could have been so much better, but instead it was an epic fail.

indeed the season overall could have been better. i dare say even much better. but i just can't bring myself to say it was an epic fail. because i don't believe it was. or just won't let myself believe it was.

Quote:
Originally Posted by archiguy View Post

I never saw 'The Shield', but I understand it ended in a similar way (the anti-hero, an adrenaline junkie, being stuck in a boring desk job - the worst possible fate for a guy like him).

i did see every episode of the shield. and now that you make me think about it, the end scenes of the shield's finale are indeed similar to dexter's.
post #6745 of 6855
Quote:
Originally Posted by kittycarole View Post

indeed the season overall could have been better. i dare say even much better. but i just can't bring myself to say it was an epic fail.

I can. This show was one of the biggest falls from grace I've ever seen. After the original show runner left, it was all downhill. Scott Buck is a decent writer, but he has no business being in charge. The big event most fans were waiting for, after so many teases, was to see Dexter finally caught/revealed as the BHB. It could have been so epic, but instead we got this Hannah love story crap.

Also, The Shield was an infinitely better show and doesn't even belong in the same sentence as Dexter.
post #6746 of 6855
Quote:
Originally Posted by kittycarole View Post

i like actress aimee garcia's comments on the ending of the finale. (she played jamie, dexter's nanny)

they (the fans) wanted it to have a nice, neat little bow on top of the present. but I think it's the saddest thing to see a protagonist, this charming serial killer that you've learned to root for, to not have his father, not have his kid, not have his girlfriend, not have his sister, not have his friends, and not even have his inner thoughts. that last scene, he doesn't even have his voiceover, so to me that's him punishing himself for everything that he's done. it's so much more heartbreaking than escaping through death. but it was hard for people to swallow that. no one wants to see their favorite anti hero so sad."

read full article here
Although I admire Ms. Garcia, I don't agree with her conclusions.

Serial Killers are always alone in a world of their own construct.
They don't have friends, family, or relationships of empathy/caring...they can't.
OTOH, Dex is not a classic Serial Killer.
What he is...is a fantasy.

The only conclusion appropriate in his case was his death...either by the State, by someone's hand, or even an odds-defying accident of some sort.
post #6747 of 6855
Quote:
Originally Posted by oink View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by kittycarole View Post

i like actress aimee garcia's comments on the ending of the finale. (she played jamie, dexter's nanny)

they (the fans) wanted it to have a nice, neat little bow on top of the present. but I think it's the saddest thing to see a protagonist, this charming serial killer that you've learned to root for, to not have his father, not have his kid, not have his girlfriend, not have his sister, not have his friends, and not even have his inner thoughts. that last scene, he doesn't even have his voiceover, so to me that's him punishing himself for everything that he's done. it's so much more heartbreaking than escaping through death. but it was hard for people to swallow that. no one wants to see their favorite anti hero so sad."

read full article here
Although I admire Ms. Garcia, I don't agree with her conclusions.

Serial Killers are always alone in a world of their own construct.
They don't have friends, family, or relationships of empathy/caring...they can't.
OTOH, Dex is not a classic Serial Killer.
What he is...is a fantasy.

The only conclusion appropriate in his case was his death...either by the State, by someone's hand, or even an odds-defying accident of some sort.

I don't agree with your conclusions either.

Personally my ending would have put in Argentina with Hana and Harrison. But I would have ended it with something happening where he sees something that would line up with the code and gives the viewers a look where you are unsure of his intentions. Maybe a look of concern on Hana's face and confusion/anger on Harrison's face. Then end it. Once Deb was dead it meant that there was no happy ending so give the viewers some respite, but trepidation.
post #6748 of 6855
Quote:
Originally Posted by archiguy View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by kittycarole View Post

i like actress aimee garcia's comments on the ending of the finale. (she played jamie, dexter's nanny)

they (the fans) wanted it to have a nice, neat little bow on top of the present. but I think it's the saddest thing to see a protagonist, this charming serial killer that you've learned to root for, to not have his father, not have his kid, not have his girlfriend, not have his sister, not have his friends, and not even have his inner thoughts. that last scene, he doesn't even have his voiceover, so to me that's him punishing himself for everything that he's done. it's so much more heartbreaking than escaping through death. but it was hard for people to swallow that. no one wants to see their favorite anti hero so sad."

read full article here

I agree with that 100%. Dexter is suffering a fate worse than death (for him, so familiar with death). He's lost literally everyone he ever cared for, he's solely responsible, and he'll be completely alone for the rest of his life. I never saw 'The Shield', but I understand it ended in a similar way (the anti-hero, an adrenaline junkie, being stuck in a boring desk job - the worst possible fate for a guy like him).

The Shield's ending was weird for everyone (except Ronnie... poor Ronnie, and Lem! As seen in Dexter as well, Lem is just a fool). It seemed unsatisfying to the viewer and Vic, but it was what Vic wanted and it spared him from jail while devastating every other character on the show. I can't say I was happy with it, but it worked well. Though that explanation doesn't make much sense when you read it.
post #6749 of 6855
Quote:
Originally Posted by drhill View Post

The Shield's ending was weird for everyone (except Ronnie... poor Ronnie, and Lem! As seen in Dexter as well, Lem is just a fool). It seemed unsatisfying to the viewer and Vic, but it was what Vic wanted and it spared him from jail while devastating every other character on the show. I can't say I was happy with it, but it worked well. Though that explanation doesn't make much sense when you read it.

The major difference between endings, for me, was Vic's sly grin right before fadeout. If you recall, he hears sirens going past his office late at night, whereupon Vic holsters his gun and has this little sly look on his face. To me it seemed he was going out for some cowboy action, and that even though he destroyed his entire world, he was still out there in the shadows operating and getting his fix.

Contrast that with Dexter...the look on his face was blank nothingness. No message to the audience. Just a whole lot of nothingness (which I guess is the message).

My $0.02 at least.
post #6750 of 6855
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jdog35 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by drhill View Post

The Shield's ending was weird for everyone (except Ronnie... poor Ronnie, and Lem! As seen in Dexter as well, Lem is just a fool). It seemed unsatisfying to the viewer and Vic, but it was what Vic wanted and it spared him from jail while devastating every other character on the show. I can't say I was happy with it, but it worked well. Though that explanation doesn't make much sense when you read it.

The major difference between endings, for me, was Vic's sly grin right before fadeout. If you recall, he hears sirens going past his office late at night, whereupon Vic holsters his gun and has this little sly look on his face. To me it seemed he was going out for some cowboy action, and that even though he destroyed his entire world, he was still out there in the shadows operating and getting his fix.

Contrast that with Dexter...the look on his face was blank nothingness. No message to the audience. Just a whole lot of nothingness (which I guess is the message).

My $0.02 at least.

So long ago I didn't remember that part.
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