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PT-AX100U or PLV Z5 - Page 2  

post #31 of 103
In my view, you (begu) made a nice, educated choice. Congratulations and good luck with your projector. If possible, please keep us updated with your impressions about image quality, colors, etc. (screenshots welcome!).

Thank you.

Jigesh
post #32 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by daffeh
so basically, if i were to throw a 90" wide image from about 16feet in a room that has one large window (that kan be darkened for the most but there is always some leakage) i can still go for th Z5?
I really was under the impression that the panny was the only one that could still throw a decent image from that distance with some ambient light

I'm in pretty much the same boat as you -- except I'm looking at either a 96" wide or 104" wide screen from about 16'-19' (depending).

Looking for something to hold over until 1080p becomes reasonable. Like the Sanyo warranty and price, etc. Just need to make sure it's going to be bright enough with that size screen.
post #33 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by jigesh
In my view, you (begu) made a nice, educated choice. Congratulations and good luck with your projector. If possible, please keep us updated with your impressions about image quality, colors, etc. (screenshots welcome!).

Thank you.

Jigesh
Yes, I'll try. I have had three pjs before, z1, ae700, ae900 and only the sanyo was problem free. :) But I have enjoyed every projector upgrade.

z1 -> ae700: more resolution and better contrast, colours, and light output, less fan noise, digital picture input
ae700 -> ae900: no more VB, cleaner pic, better contrast+colours
ae900 -> z5: cleaner pic, way sharper, better colour+contrast, more quiet, one more HDMI, light adjust (lens iris), dust cleaning and hopefully longer lamp life with no annoying things (iris noise, lamp flicker)

The most important upgrade was ae700, 8bit vs. 10bit colour and much less fan noise and digital input.

Of course the VB was gone after ae900 upgrade and picture was more clean 'DLP like' (no fixed pattern noise and aperture of D5 was greater than D4 panels).

All I can say that about 900 euros for every year You get stellar performance for Your money. And the difference between Z1 and Z5 is so big, I wouldn't believe it when I was using my Z1. But still I did enjoy the movies WAY better off my old Z1 than some regular tv. :)

Now I think I could live with my Z5 for two years, but You never know ;)
post #34 of 103
Begu - Nice writeup. Other than sharpness did you find contrast or color reproduction significantly better on the AX100 over the AE900? Also any hint of VB on either the 100 or Z5?
post #35 of 103
Begu,

Awesome write up man! If you wouldn't mind answering a question. Do you think the Z5 has enough lumens in it's brightest mode for say a superbowl party with moderate, that is above average ambient light? I know the Panny can do it cause I've seen it. But I am really liking the Sanyo warranty and the auto lens cover and the HDMIx2 and the price. I guess really all the Panny has the brightness and the smooth screen. But then again I wont be siting that close to the screen anyway and my house faces north/south so the light isn't really bad in my room. The Z5 sure looks like a great machine. Thanks Begu! Cheers!!
post #36 of 103
Thanks for the replies on the 1080p/24 subject (I'm in the UK and don't think I can get hold of Home Theater mag.), I have been doing a bit of research via Google and certainly now realise that it is not a factor for the moment.

Several of the sources of information seem to be suggesting that it will not become all that important either, as no display device will ever actually be able to display @24 as it would be too slow, and DVD players should be able to easily convert the signal from the disc with no loss of quality and output at @60. This seems to suggest that all you will need is a 1080p/60 input on the projector. I have also read that inputting a pure @24 signal into a @60 input will similarly not pose a loss as the display device will itself also be able to make the conversion to display rate with no impact on the picture.

I do not understand the maths behind these theories, and I don't know how this compares with what Home Theater Magazine have written. I would have thought that the rate would have to be cleanly multipliable to avoid anomalies, but maybe not. Having done a bit more research however, I have been able to satisfy myself that for the moment at least, with this purchase, 1080p/24 is not an issue.
post #37 of 103
The contrast of ax100 vs. ae900 was clear advantage of ax100. But the difference isn't huge, which was to be expected. Colours were better too, but not with big margin.

NOTE: The above is achieved, when ax100 is in cinema1 mode and ae900 is in cinema1-3 mode. BUT: if the ae900 is used in dynamic mode WITH colour filter (FL-DAY, 81EF or similar) the contrast and black level are about the same. Still I saw slight advantage in ax100. And of course the ae900 fith filter and dynamic mode needs adjusting for the colours, the ax100 won't need any or some minor adjustments only.

So tu sum up: If You had ae900 with no additional filters, the ax100 is really better in contrast and some better in colour. If You had ae900 with filter (in dynamic/video mose) the difference in contrast isn't so big. But You won't need any tweaking, You get right off good colour using ax100:s cine1 mode. And in either case You get more lumens and a way sharper picture, that is for sure. (and the ax100 is quieter than ae900) So the ax100 wins in every aspect.

The Z5 light output: I would say that using rather small screen (I have 80" diagonal, but grey 0.8 gain) the z5 has enough light, especially if You are not using colour filter with it ( I use ).

It is like this: the lens iris cuts the light to half (very noticeable). I have it in the closest position with colour filter to cut light more (30%) and lamp in eco-mode, but the image is in dynamic mode (turned the lamp to eco though). And the image is viewable in very little ambient light (like few candles in the room). But of course if watching movies the dark scenes won't look good. But in comlete darkenss this mimimum light output is almost too much in bright scenes.

Then I can open the lens iris fully, which doubles the lumens. This mode is for ambient light only, because it is too bright for dark room viewing in bright scenes. Still I have the lamp in eco and the FL-DAY filter in front of the lens.

If You won't use the colour filter and turn on the normal or A1/A2 lamp mode, the image is very bright. I believe then it delivers the promised 1100 lumens, but I don't have a meter here. And You can use a white 1.0 gain screen, if You mostly watch in ambient light.

But please note, this is my personal viewing preference, some might find ti too dark or too bright. It always depends how You like it. But I like it better than ae900, that is enough for me :) And in some aspects it is better than ax100, and again in some aspects it is worse than ax100.

The only minus for this pj is the fact that it rises the fan speed if installed upside down, like the ae700/900 and Z4 did. But I have it in proper way, so it isn't upside down. Of course You can use the service menu tweaks to make it behave more silently, look the z4 tweks thread.

And speaking of tweaking, the serivice menu can be used to adjust the iris, fans etc. At least in Z4, the iris could be made to act slower/faster and to open/close more or less. :) And I think the iris works a bit better than in Z4, this has been stated by cine4home too. And I did get an idea to test if th black level would improve more with the service menu tweaking (to make the iris close a bit more). So waiting a z5 tweak thread :)
post #38 of 103
This is a really informative thread. Thanks for the great summary begu :)

It's clear your assessment is your educated and tested opinion without agenda. For that, I thank you. :)

Kind of a weird dilemna....the Sanyo actually has more of what I like (according to pjcentral's review) better contrast, 3 D look, sharper image etc...but the Panny's no slouch in those areas too. Plus, Art said the Panny could easily throw a great image on his 128 inch Firehawk. So the added brightness might be better if you want a larger screen?

Tough decision!

Does the Sanyo have better quality control? I know I owned a Panny PT 200u and 300u and both went south with issues. Took about 2 years b4 the 300u started having panel issues. Kind of surprised I am even considering Panasonic....

One more ? Does the Sanyo do the Constant Image Height thingie? :)
post #39 of 103
I have the PJ TX100 at present, but my new Sanyo Z5 will arrive from Australia, to me in NZ in approx 2 days time. I do love the results of the 100 but I do believe the Z5 is going to be better!

I have a matt white screen 2.6mt wide, and do need an image with some punch!

The 100 is looking great out of the box, but I still think I will get a better result from the Z5 when it arrives.

Im sure the Sanyo Z5 will deliver a better contrast ratio and deliver the blacks closer to 35mm film, which Im after!

I will report my findings soon. Stay tuned :)
post #40 of 103
Hi 70mm, can you please share with us where you are ordering your Z5 from? Thanks
post #41 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xander
Hi 70mm, can you please share with us where you are ordering your Z5 from? Thanks
Sorry I cant do that on here :rolleyes:
post #42 of 103
AX100 seems to have picture-quality related improvements over 900; while Z5 somehow seems (to me) to have, relatively minor upgrade (like number of inputs, and very minor change in contrast and brightness despite the same lamp being used) over Z4 based on reviews and product specifications. Am I missing something?
post #43 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by jigesh
Z5 somehow seems (to me) to have, relatively minor upgrade (like number of inputs, and very minor change in contrast and brightness despite the same lamp being used) over Z4 based on reviews and product specifications. Am I missing something?

good question
post #44 of 103
Quote:
Several of the sources of information seem to be suggesting that it will not become all that important either, as no display device will ever actually be able to display @24 as it would be too slow
IMO the development of 24p home projection is of critical importance in taking the next step to theater-like presentation. The sources you've read are incorrect on the display frame rates. The playback devices will be able to output 24p and the display devices will show them at a multiple of 24 (48, 72 fps). This is, in fact, what happens in contemporary film projectors -- each frame is flashed at the audience twice to eliminate flicker.

Thanks to all -- particularly begu78 -- for the great posts in this thread.
post #45 of 103
Thanks Begu78 for the review.

I think I will wait for 1080p's projectors either from epson,Sanyo or Panny. I only had my AE900 for 3 months with Hoya C filter and running on Dynamic mode I guess the contrast is not that big of a jump to upgrade plus the wife might kill me!! it does take alot of time to tweak the AE900 but I think I got it now to the point where i don't mess with it except for bright movies i switch to Normal mode instead of Dynamic.
post #46 of 103
I was told by a few AVS sponsored companies that though the projector central reviews make it look like these projectors are similar that the Sanyo can't touch the Panasonic in terms of the overall product. Don't shoot the messenger :)
post #47 of 103
It's possible that the reason they told you that is because the AX100 cost more and they make a bigger profit selling that projector.
post #48 of 103
And do those companies offer the Sanyo?
post #49 of 103
I wonder exactly what terms of the overall product would mean. Does that include the excellent econo lamp mode flicker that apparently half the units have and horseshat warranty or just the 2000 lumens? Wheeeeeeeeee :eek:
post #50 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by begu78
Yes, I'll try. I have had three pjs before, z1, ae700, ae900 and only the sanyo was problem free. :) But I have enjoyed every projector upgrade.

z1 -> ae700: more resolution and better contrast, colours, and light output, less fan noise, digital picture input
ae700 -> ae900: no more VB, cleaner pic, better contrast+colours
ae900 -> z5: cleaner pic, way sharper, better colour+contrast, more quiet, one more HDMI, light adjust (lens iris), dust cleaning and hopefully longer lamp life with no annoying things (iris noise, lamp flicker)

The most important upgrade was ae700, 8bit vs. 10bit colour and much less fan noise and digital input.

Of course the VB was gone after ae900 upgrade and picture was more clean 'DLP like' (no fixed pattern noise and aperture of D5 was greater than D4 panels).

All I can say that about 900 euros for every year You get stellar performance for Your money. And the difference between Z1 and Z5 is so big, I wouldn't believe it when I was using my Z1. But still I did enjoy the movies WAY better off my old Z1 than some regular tv. :)

Now I think I could live with my Z5 for two years, but You never know ;)

I cannnot but more than agree with you. Notice how the Sony/Panasonic groups are plagued by quality issues, while the PLV discussions center around tweaking mostly.

There is a simple reason why Sanyo offers the 3 year warranty, and having a light controlled room and a high gain Carada screen i am more interested in the 10,000 contrast on the Z5 than in all the gimmicks offered by the opposition.

I bought my first ever PJ, the PLV-Z3 2 years ago, and never failed me. Once a big blue spot developed, and was delighted to see it gone after i blew the panels with the pump supplied with the PJ.

Now, with the HDDVD revolution i still see a lot on my screen, detailed images through my HD Leeza scaler.
post #51 of 103
This is funny. A year ago I was agonizing about the decision between the Z4 and Panny 900. I went with the Z4 because the lens shift was better, I liked the automatic lens cover, and I'm sitting far enough away so that SDE isn't really an issue. I also lean toward the sharper picture of the Z4. The only other thing that made the Z4 my choice was that after playing around with both models at J&R here in NYC, the Z4 seems like it's built sturdier. It seems like the same old story with the Z5 and 100. It seems the strengths and weaknesses of both are the same.

Panny advantages: Brightness, no SDE, better out of the box performance without calibration.

Panny weaknesses: inferior lens shift, picture slightly less sharp, inferior warranty, inferior build quality.

Z5 advantages: Sharper, higher PQ with proper calibration, Great lens shift, excellent warranty.

Z5 weaknesses: Lower Lumens output, SDE for those sitting close to the screen, Calibration needed to get the best performance.

When I got my Z4, I hooked it up and couldn't believe how easy it was to get it lined up with my screen. My PJ is on a shelf toward the front of my seating area. The lens shift is so good, I didn't need to use any keystone correction. I immediately used a quality video calibration disc and set all the settings accordingly. It took about 3 hours to get it hooked up and calibrated. When I first put on an HD program, my hair was practically standing up and I had a look of excited amazement on my face. I didn't let my wife look at the HT room while it was in construction so it would be a suprise. I hooked up my Oppo up converting DVD player and I popped in Star Wars Ep IV. I sat my wife in one of the front recliners and had her shut her eyes until the movie started. When she opened her eyes she couldn't believe what she was seeing. All she kept saying was "Oh My God!!!" It was a great experience and everything I had hoped for all those years I dreamed of having my own HT. A year later, we still enjoy our HT greatly. We wait for good releases to come out on DVD and never dream of going out to the movies.

Whatever choice you make, if this is your first PJ, you are going to be thrilled. Just enjoy the experience whatever choice you make.
post #52 of 103
I'm planning on getting the Z5. With an 81 inch diagonal screen at 10 feet viewing distance, what are the chances of getting the SDE?
post #53 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by bmxsummoner
I'm planning on getting the Z5. With an 81 inch diagonal screen at 10 feet viewing distance, what are the chances of getting the SDE?

I have a 96 inch diagnal and sit about 11 ft and never was bothered by SDE. In fact people have sat much closer and never complained about it. Make your purchase and enjoy.
post #54 of 103
I had the Z1 and was using a 72 inch diagonal grey screen at a 10 to 12 feet viewing distance and I could see a little SDE on certain scenes. I now have a Z4 with the same grey screen and viewing distance and see no SDE at all, under any circumstances. Z5 should be the same.
post #55 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by boblinds
The sources you've read are incorrect on the display frame rates. The playback devices will be able to output 24p and the display devices will show them at a multiple of 24 (48, 72 fps).
This takes me back to square one. I have spent hours on google trying to find any reliable information on this, but it does not seem to be available. Does anyone have a URL or two to share on this subject?
post #56 of 103
Thanks for the help guys! :)
post #57 of 103
Now that I have both the Panasonic PT AX100 and the Sanyo PLV-Z5 I can say the results are far better on the Z5 than the 100.

Im using a 2.6mt wide matt white screen, with the Oppo OPDV971H player through HDMI.



The major things I have noticed are:



1. There is virtually no grain in the image on HDMI and the result is incredibly smooth & silky. All my test DVD’s have never looked this way before. Wow!

2. The image is far shaper than the 100 without any edge ringing at all. NO screen door from normal viewing.

3. I thought the 100 was the first projector that I felt looked something like 35mm film, but the Z5 completely surpasses the 100. It’s the first projector I have ever seen, where the image has none of that video look!

4. The image seems totally noise free, from any artifacts!

5. The colour is the most natural I have ever seen on ANY projector and nothing looks artificial at all. Peoples faces finally look real!



I don’t know what it would look like on another DVD player, but on the Oppo its much better than the 100.
post #58 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by 70MM
Now that I have both the Panasonic PT AX100 and the Sanyo PLV-Z5 I can say the results are far better on the Z5 than the 100.

Im using a 2.6mt wide matt white screen, with the Oppo OPDV971H player through HDMI.



The major things I have noticed are:



1. There is virtually no grain in the image on HDMI and the result is incredibly smooth & silky. All my test DVD’s have never looked this way before. Wow!

2. The image is far shaper than the 100 without any edge ringing at all. NO screen door from normal viewing.

3. I thought the 100 was the first projector that I felt looked something like 35mm film, but the Z5 completely surpasses the 100. It’s the first projector I have ever seen, where the image has none of that video look!

4. The image seems totally noise free, from any artifacts!

5. The colour is the most natural I have ever seen on ANY projector and nothing looks artificial at all. Peoples faces finally look real!



I don’t know what it would look like on another DVD player, but on the Oppo its much better than the 100.
Are those results straight out of the box or did the Z5 need some calibration?
post #59 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by 70MM
The image is far shaper than the 100 without any edge ringing at all. NO screen door from normal viewing.
Thanks, sounds amazing! The reviewer on projectorcentral said he turned the sharpness to minimum and enhancement to level 1. What settings are you using for the sharpness or is it totally default settings so far? It would also be interesting to hear your general comments viewing on the component input if you give that a go. Thanks again!
post #60 of 103
Quote:
Originally Posted by BRI59
Thanks, sounds amazing! The reviewer on projectorcentral said he turned the sharpness to minimum and enhancement to level 1. What settings are you using for the sharpness or is it totally default settings so far? It would also be interesting to hear your general comments viewing on the component input if you give that a go. Thanks again!
I have not seen any reson to turn the sharpness down at all its so clean straight out of the box. I did put enhancement to 1. This is just the best projector!
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