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Official SVS Owners/Support Thread. - Page 377

post #11281 of 15839
Quote:
Originally Posted by ffactoryxx View Post

My SVS has a Crossover Toggle button to disable or enable. Do I still need to right all the way to the right towards 120 hz?

If you are handling the crossover with your AVR, I'd just hit disable on your sub. If for some reason you are not, then I'd leave it on and set to 80hz.
post #11282 of 15839
My brand-spankin-new PB1000 just showed up at the office... cant wait to get home and busy this bad boy out! My first Subwoofer... biggrin.gifbiggrin.gifbiggrin.gif
post #11283 of 15839
Quote:
Originally Posted by malokevi View Post

My brand-spankin-new PB1000 just showed up at the office... cant wait to get home and busy this bad boy out! My first Subwoofer... biggrin.gifbiggrin.gifbiggrin.gif
Congrats !! Oh and how new did you say it was ? tongue.gifbiggrin.gif
post #11284 of 15839
Why, brand-spankin, of course! smile.gif
post #11285 of 15839
Quote:
Originally Posted by malokevi View Post

Why, brand-spankin, of course! smile.gif
That's pretty darn brand-spanking new!! biggrin.gif
Btw welcome to The SVS family smile.gif
post #11286 of 15839
Quote:
Originally Posted by malokevi View Post

My brand-spankin-new PB1000 just showed up at the office... cant wait to get home ... biggrin.gifbiggrin.gifbiggrin.gif

My new SVS is a week old now, so you're as excited as I was last week. If you like yours half as much as we like ours, you'll be ecstatic.

Have fun tonight, and post back with first impressions! 🍺
post #11287 of 15839
Quote:
Originally Posted by malokevi View Post

My brand-spankin-new PB1000 just showed up at the office... cant wait to get home and busy this bad boy out! My first Subwoofer... biggrin.gifbiggrin.gifbiggrin.gif

Congrats! Give it a spank for me.
post #11288 of 15839
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lecter83 View Post

In any event, if at any time the family leaves your home free.

You guys are extremely lucky. I was too biggrin.gif I got home a bit earlier today and managed to perform the test.

Here are the test parameters:

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
  • Source: Underworld: Awakening (Werebeast scene) from the Reference 2 Demo Disc. The .m2ts file in the STREAM folder was played on a laptop using XBMC 12. Audio was bitstreamed to the receiver.
  • AVR: Volume was set to 0 dB from reference. Crossover was 100 Hz. Audyssey was enabled.
  • EQ: The sub output goes through a MiniDSP. The MiniDSP performs gain adjustments and also has a single low-pass shelf filter to act as a house curve. The LPF cutoff is at 40 Hz, with a Q of 0.5 and a gain of 8 dB, producing a boost of +4 dB at 40 Hz, +6 dB at 20 Hz and a max gain of about +7 dB even lower. In that regard, one can consider that the subs are running a bit hot.
  • Subs: both subs are in 16 Hz tuning, with their gain at 0 dB (max), but the MiniDSP feed them signals at different levels. LPFs are disabled, no PEQs are used on the amps.

Net result is that OH BOY IT'S LOUD there was no distortion or weird flapping sound that I could hear. I never set my setup this loud so that was a bit of a shock at first. I had to control my fight-or-flight reflex in order to take the short video below. That was an amazing test, but I'd say the sound coming from the rest of the speakers are more disturbing than the subs.

I also managed to monitor the MiniDSP levels at the input and outputs. The input of the MiniDSP was not clipped, with only about 4.5 dB of headroom to spare. On the output side, both output are quite a bit attenuated with respect to the input, so the max signal was far from clipping, with more than 10-12 dB to spare (not sure exactly). This means that the inputs to each sub were quite comfortably below the max output of the MiniDSP. Since the subs were set to 0 dB, one can imagine that the headroom for each sub was also greater than 10 dB.

In short, I think I had still plenty of headroom in my case, and I was still far from stressing the subs as much as Mantaray and Lecter managed to do, even with the subs relatively hot at and below 20 Hz. I would have had to raise the volume by several dBs more to stress the subs, and passerby's were already looking distressed and trying to see what was happening in the house, so I decided against doing it.

In the video below, I think it's also clear that driver excursion was way under what Mantaray posted. Sorry for the shakycam, the hyperactive autofocus, the scratch on the baseplate and the hairballs. Bizarrely this was just after a visit from the cleaning lady.

post #11289 of 15839
That was awesome Man your sub looked like a Grenade launcher biggrin.gif
That's pretty much what my ultra and plus look and sound like cool.gif
post #11290 of 15839
Actually... the hairballs help to display how much air the speaker is moving. eek.gif

Pretty cool. biggrin.gif
post #11291 of 15839
Quote:
Originally Posted by neutro View Post

You guys are extremely lucky. I was too biggrin.gif I got home a bit earlier today and managed to perform the test.

Here are the test parameters:

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
  • Source: Underworld: Awakening (Werebeast scene) from the Reference 2 Demo Disc. The .m2ts file in the STREAM folder was played on a laptop using XBMC 12. Audio was bitstreamed to the receiver.
  • AVR: Volume was set to 0 dB from reference. Crossover was 100 Hz. Audyssey was enabled.
  • EQ: The sub output goes through a MiniDSP. The MiniDSP performs gain adjustments and also has a single low-pass shelf filter to act as a house curve. The LPF cutoff is at 40 Hz, with a Q of 0.5 and a gain of 8 dB, producing a boost of +4 dB at 40 Hz, +6 dB at 20 Hz and a max gain of about +7 dB even lower. In that regard, one can consider that the subs are running a bit hot.
  • Subs: both subs are in 16 Hz tuning, with their gain at 0 dB (max), but the MiniDSP feed them signals at different levels. LPFs are disabled, no PEQs are used on the amps.

Net result is that OH BOY IT'S LOUD there was no distortion or weird flapping sound that I could hear. I never set my setup this loud so that was a bit of a shock at first. I had to control my fight-or-flight reflex in order to take the short video below. That was an amazing test, but I'd say the sound coming from the rest of the speakers are more disturbing than the subs.

I also managed to monitor the MiniDSP levels at the input and outputs. The input of the MiniDSP was not clipped, with only about 4.5 dB of headroom to spare. On the output side, both output are quite a bit attenuated with respect to the input, so the max signal was far from clipping, with more than 10-12 dB to spare (not sure exactly). This means that the inputs to each sub were quite comfortably below the max output of the MiniDSP. Since the subs were set to 0 dB, one can imagine that the headroom for each sub was also greater than 10 dB.

In short, I think I had still plenty of headroom in my case, and I was still far from stressing the subs as much as Mantaray and Lecter managed to do, even with the subs relatively hot at and below 20 Hz. I would have had to raise the volume by several dBs more to stress the subs, and passerby's were already looking distressed and trying to see what was happening in the house, so I decided against doing it.

In the video below, I think it's also clear that driver excursion was way under what Mantaray posted. Sorry for the shakycam, the hyperactive autofocus, the scratch on the baseplate and the hairballs. Bizarrely this was just after a visit from the cleaning lady.


Thank you very much for testing.

So now I have a conclusion clear. Is configuration problem with the AVR. Depending on what kind of equipment we are using, it may be more or less compatible with the subwoofer.
Simply adapt the output to appropriate and preventing "sledge" operates in maximum gain = 0, may give you all the power you want, as long as the AVR is maintained at 0db on subwoofer channel and up power from the subwoofer amplifier.

Whenever I want to feel visceral shock in my tiny living room (10 m2) only power I have to climb the "sledge" and never those unwanted noise sounded.

PS: My girlfriend is going to give the second PB12 + dsp
post #11292 of 15839
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lecter83 View Post

So now I have a conclusion clear. Is configuration problem with the AVR.

I'm not so sure about that. As I said, I think I was still pretty far from the sub's limits, as I was more than 12 dB short of the sub input's full dynamic range. I should have noted the exact number though. It's hard to tell because I can't see my drivers at the same angle as Mantaray's, but it seems to me that they were not moving as much.

As for the AVR output, it's either clipped or not. And there is less chance for the AVR output to be clipped if the gain on the sub is high and the trim level on the AVR is set lower.

What I suspect is that setting the gain to 0 dB on the Sledge amps allows a bit more oomph, power spikes that push the Plus to its limits close to reference levels when two are used in a 5000+ cu ft room such as Mantaray's, or when a single one is used in a smaller room such as yours. Lowering the gain on the sub may curb those power spikes, limiting the dynamic range a bit but keeping the drivers from getting to their limits.
Quote:
PS: My girlfriend is going to give the second PB12 + dsp

Am I reading this correctly? Your girlfriend is giving you another Plus as a *gift*? Wohaaa you're a lucky man Lecter biggrin.gif
post #11293 of 15839
Quote:
Originally Posted by neutro View Post

Am I reading this correctly? Your girlfriend is giving you another Plus as a *gift*? Wohaaa you're a lucky man Lecter biggrin.gif

Correct!

What is not is when you will do ... So waiting for the surprise.

biggrin.gif
post #11294 of 15839
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lecter83 View Post

So now I have a conclusion clear. Is configuration problem with the AVR. Depending on what kind of equipment we are using, it may be more or less compatible with the subwoofer.
Quote:
Originally Posted by neutro View Post

I'm not so sure about that.

Neither am I.

The DSP tuning SVS employs should handle that circumstance, irrespective of what any gain is set for. When the driver reaches its limit - no matter how it arrived there - its reached the limit, at which point the DSP steps in and says 'no more for you'. That should always occur before the driver starts making unpleasant sounds. As I said before, SVS is famous for their approach to limiters. While I suppose anything is possible, I still have a hard time believing it's being breached.
post #11295 of 15839
Quote:
Originally Posted by neutro View Post

You guys are extremely lucky. I was too biggrin.gif I got home a bit earlier today and managed to perform the test.

Here are the test parameters:

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
  • Source: Underworld: Awakening (Werebeast scene) from the Reference 2 Demo Disc. The .m2ts file in the STREAM folder was played on a laptop using XBMC 12. Audio was bitstreamed to the receiver.
  • AVR: Volume was set to 0 dB from reference. Crossover was 100 Hz. Audyssey was enabled.
  • EQ: The sub output goes through a MiniDSP. The MiniDSP performs gain adjustments and also has a single low-pass shelf filter to act as a house curve. The LPF cutoff is at 40 Hz, with a Q of 0.5 and a gain of 8 dB, producing a boost of +4 dB at 40 Hz, +6 dB at 20 Hz and a max gain of about +7 dB even lower. In that regard, one can consider that the subs are running a bit hot.
  • Subs: both subs are in 16 Hz tuning, with their gain at 0 dB (max), but the MiniDSP feed them signals at different levels. LPFs are disabled, no PEQs are used on the amps.

Net result is that OH BOY IT'S LOUD there was no distortion or weird flapping sound that I could hear. I never set my setup this loud so that was a bit of a shock at first. I had to control my fight-or-flight reflex in order to take the short video below. That was an amazing test, but I'd say the sound coming from the rest of the speakers are more disturbing than the subs.

I also managed to monitor the MiniDSP levels at the input and outputs. The input of the MiniDSP was not clipped, with only about 4.5 dB of headroom to spare. On the output side, both output are quite a bit attenuated with respect to the input, so the max signal was far from clipping, with more than 10-12 dB to spare (not sure exactly). This means that the inputs to each sub were quite comfortably below the max output of the MiniDSP. Since the subs were set to 0 dB, one can imagine that the headroom for each sub was also greater than 10 dB.

In short, I think I had still plenty of headroom in my case, and I was still far from stressing the subs as much as Mantaray and Lecter managed to do, even with the subs relatively hot at and below 20 Hz. I would have had to raise the volume by several dBs more to stress the subs, and passerby's were already looking distressed and trying to see what was happening in the house, so I decided against doing it.

In the video below, I think it's also clear that driver excursion was way under what Mantaray posted. Sorry for the shakycam, the hyperactive autofocus, the scratch on the baseplate and the hairballs. Bizarrely this was just after a visit from the cleaning lady.


Quote:
Originally Posted by JimWilson View Post


Neither am I.

The DSP tuning SVS employs should handle that circumstance, irrespective of what any gain is set for. When the driver reaches its limit - no matter how it arrived there - its reached the limit, at which point the DSP steps in and says 'no more for you'. That should always occur before the driver starts making unpleasant sounds. As I said before, SVS is famous for their approach to limiters. While I suppose anything is possible, I still have a hard time believing it's being breached.

Ok guys and gals, here is a clip I just captured with my phone (Selene encounters a "super lycan", later revealed to be Quint - Ch. 9 @ 47:02)
When recording I never heard any unwanted sounds but when I replayed it I could clearly hear some sort of flapping noise. So I went back and replayed it a few more times and it sounded perfect each time.

Could this be the case where my phone just can't handle the lower frequencies and is introducing this flapping sound instead of what I'm actually hearing.
post #11296 of 15839
Quote:
Originally Posted by hyghwayman View Post

Could this be the case where my phone just can't handle the lower frequencies and is introducing this flapping sound instead of what I'm actually hearing.

Hmmm. Good point. But...

  • I think Mantaray could clearly hear the flapping noises.
  • It could be that the sound from the rest of the setup is masking the flapping sound. I know I for one was straining to try to listen to any flapping sounds, but my ears were already ringing from the sheer output from all other speakers.
  • It could indeed be the shockwave from the drive at close range, hitting the phone mic, that causes that sound. In my case the phone was not directly in front of the driver.

EDIT: you could test again at a much lower level, where you're absolutely sure not to hear any distortion, to see if the flapping sound is still present on the phone. Or, you could record from the side of the sub to see if it changes anything. It does sound like a flag flapping in the wind; maybe it's just the crest of the high-SPL wave hitting the mic.

Lecter, did you actually hear the flapping on your sub or was the flapping only on your recording?
Edited by neutro - 8/8/13 at 11:52am
post #11297 of 15839
Quote:
Originally Posted by neutro View Post

Hmmm. Good point. But...

  • I think Mantaray could clearly hear the flapping noises.
  • It could be that the sound from the rest of the setup is masking the flapping sound. I know I for one was straining to try to listen to any flapping sounds, but my ears were already ringing from the sheer output from all other speakers.
  • It could indeed be the shockwave from the drive at close range, hitting the phone mic, that causes that sound. In my case the phone was not directly in front of the driver.

EDIT: you could test again at a much lower level, where you're absolutely sure not to hear any distortion, to see if the flapping sound is still present on the phone. Or, you could record from the side of the sub to see if it changes anything. It does sound like a flag flapping in the wind; maybe it's just the crest of the high-SPL wave hitting the mic.

Lecter, did you actually hear the flapping on your sub or was the flapping only on your recording?
Are you saying in could be Mantarays ear drums flapping eek.gifbiggrin.gif
post #11298 of 15839
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheFactor View Post

Are you saying in could be Mantarays ear drums flapping eek.gifbiggrin.gif

Lol. What I'm saying is that I'm pretty sure Mantaray implied he was actually hearing the flapping sound live, not just on his recordings smile.gif

In the hyghwayman's case, either the flapping sound are there but drowned by other sounds, or the flapping sounds are just an artifact of phone recording. It would be quite interesting to know which is the case.

If the flapping experienced by Mantaray, Lecter and (possibly) hyghwayman is indeed present, we must know if this is for pushing the sub too hard, if it's a defect, or if it's a setup issue. hyghwayman had its level at -10 dB from reference, and this was with an SB13-Ultra. It was my understanding that sealed subwoofers would be even stiffer and less susceptible to hitting limits. And the Ultra driver is on another level compared with the Plus, and the amp is 1kW RMS. So if the flapping sound is not an artefact, I wonder if this could be something so simple as hard clipping of the input for example, and the flapping sound was just the driver trying (in vain) to reproduce the clipped waveform at high level.
post #11299 of 15839
Gentlemen, alright and maybe some Ladies.

My problem with the flapping sounds are fixed or completely gone!!!

Ed Mullen from SVS helped me to solved the flapping sounds. I no longer need to turn down the Trim Level on the receiver anymore. These Pluses sounds so good now that I wanted to turn UP the Trim Level. LOL!

What a difference the Pluses sounds now!!

Do you want to know what was the issue that made the flapping sounds?
post #11300 of 15839
Thank goodness I was getting very concerned for Mantarays hearing and had a hearing test all ready for him biggrin.gif
http://youtu.be/h5l4Rt4Ol7M
post #11301 of 15839
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheFactor View Post

Are you saying in could be Mantarays ear drums flapping eek.gifbiggrin.gif

LOL!!!

Excellent!
post #11302 of 15839
Quote:
Originally Posted by mantaraydesign View Post

LOL!!!

Excellent!
biggrin.gif All kidding aside are you making any progress ?
post #11303 of 15839
Quote:
Originally Posted by mantaraydesign View Post

Do you want to know what was the issue that made the flapping sounds?

That's cheap biggrin.gif
post #11304 of 15839
Reloading to see the answer...
post #11305 of 15839
Type faster already!
post #11306 of 15839
I will get back to you NEXT YEAR. LOL!
post #11307 of 15839
The problem was one of the Plus wiring was not connected correctly within the amp. The black wire and the red wire was not connected correctly. I just had to switched them around and all is good!

What I do not understand is why would it effect to other Plus? Because the other Plus wiring was fine or correct. For some reasons, the flapping sounds was produced on both subs. Is it because I am using the Y adapter?

So if you have the flapping sounds like mine, you may want to open up the amp and see if the wiring is connect correctly. The red and black wire.
post #11308 of 15839
Quote:
Originally Posted by mantaraydesign View Post

The problem was one of the Plus wiring was not connected correctly within the amp. The black wire and the red wire was not connected correctly. I just had to switched them around and all is good!

What I do not understand is why would it effect to other Plus? Because the other Plus wiring was fine or correct. For some reasons, the flapping sounds was produced on both subs. Is it because I am using the Y adapter?

That's weird... I would have thought inverting the driver polarity would just invert the phase. Maybe the connection was not good in the first place?

So you fixed one sub and the other got fixed too ??? That's even weirder. Now I'm confused. But I'm really glad you got this fixed.
post #11309 of 15839
Quote:
Originally Posted by neutro View Post

Hmmm. Good point. But...

  • I think Mantaray could clearly hear the flapping noises.
  • It could be that the sound from the rest of the setup is masking the flapping sound. I know I for one was straining to try to listen to any flapping sounds, but my ears were already ringing from the sheer output from all other speakers.
  • It could indeed be the shockwave from the drive at close range, hitting the phone mic, that causes that sound. In my case the phone was not directly in front of the driver.

Mantaray has indeed stated that which truly sux and is the reason I made the video.

It sure was loud eek.gif and I was thinking the same thing so I turned all my other speakers down during my critical listening and never heard any flapping sounds with just my ears

The only other time I've ever heard that noise was from another recording I made (when I first got my sub I recorded the Stadium scene from Dark Knight Rises) I just replayed that scene again and no flapping noises heard biggrin.gif
post #11310 of 15839
Great news Mantaray !! Now it's time to enjoy !!
I can't remember who it was but someone mentioned the flapping noise also and was sent a new amp and it still did it . I hope he reads this because maybe his were wired wrong also .
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