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Official SVS Owners/Support Thread. - Page 300

post #8971 of 15826
Quote:
Originally Posted by cr136124 View Post

Oh man, I assumed you were at home waiting for the babies.
Well, hopefully you'll manage to pick them up today.

That would have been great to get them delivered in my living room, but I always assumed I'd have to fetch them myself. Now considering everything we planned for the weekend I'm not even sure I'll be able to get there tonight (my GF is shopping with a friend and I'm supposed to babysit biggrin.gif). Worst case scenario I get them tomorrow morning...
post #8972 of 15826
Quote:
Originally Posted by MitchPope View Post

Ed has said that the Sledge amps work best at 0 dB, so if you aren't way off on your AVR trim levels, you could drop your AVR sub trim by 5 dB and increase your sub by 5 dB for maximum punch.
http://www.avsforum.com/t/889659/official-svs-ultra-13-thread/9720#post_21863907

SVS subs come set (out of the box) at -20bs. When did Ed say the amp works best at 0 dbs?
post #8973 of 15826
Quote:
Originally Posted by Auditor55 View Post

SVS subs come set (out of the box) at -20bs. When did Ed say the amp works best at 0 dbs?

Take the time to posts linked in MitchPope's reply. Ed says that the Sledge 800 and 1000 amps are able to output more peak power the closer you get them to 0 dB. Of course the point is moot if you don't plan to be limited by the amp rolleyes.gif But what Ed proposes as for setup is to use the highest sub amp gain possible on the Sledge 800/1000 without having the AVR trim level stuck at the minimum.
post #8974 of 15826
Torture!!
post #8975 of 15826
I'm just putting this out FYI for anybody that may be interested. 1.5 years ago, I bought a PC12-NSD for my media room (15'x16'x9'=2160 sq. ft.). This speaker was the first real sub that I've ever had and was very pleased with the overall quality. But, physically, I couldn't quite find the right spot for it (in my somewhat cramped room) to eliminate nulls/peaks in the response. I started reading audio theory (first to admit I'm far from an expert on the subject) and came to the conclusion that multiple subs were the answer. Referring back to my limited floor area, two subs are the most I could put in. After rationalizing the cost to myself, I put down the money for another PC12-NSD. Got it a few weeks ago. It took about three hours of work (opening cabinets, re-wiring, Audessy setup/SPL measurements) to get going. But, I am very happy with the result. Of course, no room will have a perfect response without sound treatments (and I'm not going to do that). But, my response curves are VERY good now. Plus, with two subs, I have a TON of headroom to play with, if I so desire (grin). So, I guess the message of this post is that multiple subs really do help a room. And, as other people have already noted, the folks at SVS really are helpful, friendly and knowledgeable. As earlier mentioned, the quality of their subs is superb. I highly recommend them.
post #8976 of 15826
Thanks Vidop for your assessment. Despite having just purchased dual PCs myself I'm still a bit skeptical in the whole dual subs vs single sub at twice the price debate -- though it always depend on the particular situation. The problem I have is that I both upgrade the number of subs and the individual models so it will be hard to tell which is the cause of the difference. It will take a bit of time before I can do specific tests (duals vs single, also sealed vs 16 Hz vs 20 Hz tune). But I'm planning to give honest feedback here on that topic. Anyway I'm encouraged by your experience.
post #8977 of 15826
Quote:
Originally Posted by neutro View Post

Thanks Vidop for your assessment. Despite having just purchased dual PCs myself I'm still a bit skeptical in the whole dual subs vs single sub at twice the price debate -- though it always depend on the particular situation. The problem I have is that I both upgrade the number of subs and the individual models so it will be hard to tell which is the cause of the difference. It will take a bit of time before I can do specific tests (duals vs single, also sealed vs 16 Hz vs 20 Hz tune). But I'm planning to give honest feedback here on that topic. Anyway I'm encouraged by your experience.

Why arre you skeptical about dual subs vs a single sub?
post #8978 of 15826
Quote:
Originally Posted by Auditor55 View Post

Why arre you skeptical about dual subs vs a single sub?

I'm not that skeptical since I *did* order dual subs. But I'm still a bit skeptical that it's worth paying double for a dual subs setup, versus spending that money on a better single sub. Or, as I would have done, spending less money on a single better sub but not at twice the price. There is little doubt in my mind that running two subs vs one of the same provides lots of advantages. The question is, is it worth paying twice the price for duals; or in other word, is the cost of opportunity worth it.

For example, in my case, I did buy two Pluses, out of curiosity. This will probably provide me with more output than a single Ultra, but as stated before, I'm pretty confident that I won't need even half of that for the next 5 years at least. And, a single Ultra would have cost me several hundred dollars less. So what I'm really curious about is -- does it really sound that much better or not. If it sounds better and I find out it's not worth as much money as I paid, well I have lots of options (return an extra sub, sell it to a friend, etc.). But I will probably use it anyway just for the kick of having such an overkill setup (and benefit from it even if I feel it was not totally worth the money).

At the Plus price point, what you can buy in terms of single sub for the same price as duals is very impressive. You can afford lots of the most reputed subs out there, period; for example, I probably could have imported a single Submersive or Captivator. In my case I would not have been able to fit that into my living room -- at least not as well as dual cylinders -- but it's something to think about anyway.
post #8979 of 15826
Quote:
Originally Posted by MitchPope View Post

I have, but it only does +/- 3 dB, so it barely changes in Quick Measure. I've been playing around in SketchUp, maybe this will help shed some light on my graphs and where I can/can't put things.

I was under the imprssion from the PDF of the owner's manual that the P-EQ was +3 -12. So instead of trying to boost the lows, can't you trim the peaks on either side and then raise the overall volume?

Perhaps another owner can comment on if what I am saying makes sense. Your success with this will help me decide if I should replace my sub with a PC-13 Ultra.
post #8980 of 15826
Guys i have a question, coming from an eD A2-300, when i get my SVS Pb12 setup and everything, what will i notice in regards to the sound quality of the bass? will it be like more responsive and puncy? clean? i mean im trying to figure out what upgrading to a pb12 from my eD A2-300 going to gain me..

i dont listen at high volumes, i do like to raise the volume around 60 for music , gaming etc, sometimes around 70.. so im wondering ,what difference will i notice with the bass? is the upgrade from the a2-300 to a pb12 going to be worth it?
post #8981 of 15826
Ok guys the boxes are in my living room. I'll try to find time to unpack and try to setup tomorrow. Boxes are a tad bigger than I expected, but just a tad. I expect the size of the subs themselves to be exactly what I thought. It's the only thing I can say for now biggrin.gif
post #8982 of 15826
Quote:
Originally Posted by neutro View Post

Ok guys the boxes are in my living room. I'll try to find time to unpack and try to setup tomorrow. Boxes are a tad bigger than I expected, but just a tad. I expect the size of the subs themselves to be exactly what I thought. It's the only thing I can say for now biggrin.gif

Piiicccccssssss!!!

biggrin.gif
post #8983 of 15826
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Isble View Post

I was under the imprssion from the PDF of the owner's manual that the P-EQ was +3 -12. So instead of trying to boost the lows, can't you trim the peaks on either side and then raise the overall volume?
Perhaps another owner can comment on if what I am saying makes sense. Your success with this will help me decide if I should replace my sub with a PC-13 Ultra.
You're probably right, I've never thought to turn it down. I've made space and will see if corner loading it will get rid of that null and get ARC to set my crossover to 120 as suggested. If not, I will try to tame the peaks with PEQ and crank it up a bit to see if that works.
post #8984 of 15826
Neutro, I'm glad you got your order. I placed an order last Sunday night and it was picked up the Fedex ground and I will have to wait unil Monday to get it. It had to come from the west coast to east coast. I guess Thanksgiving didn't help speed the delivery. With what I paid for shipping and handling, I would have thought it wouldn't have taken a full week to get it.

No, it wasn't SVS with their free shipping. I would have expected it to be slow if I hadn't paid for it. I ordered from Hsu.
post #8985 of 15826
Quote:
Originally Posted by neutro View Post

Ok guys the boxes are in my living room. I'll try to find time to unpack and try to setup tomorrow. Boxes are a tad bigger than I expected, but just a tad. I expect the size of the subs themselves to be exactly what I thought. It's the only thing I can say for now biggrin.gif
Sweet! Let me say your in the minority for not being surprised by the size. IMHO things always appear bigger than they seem. Even my 65" tv. In the store I was like yup that's perfect but I would love the 70". Themn when it was delivered I was more like wow that thing is huge!! Same with all my svs subs. Minus the SB of course lol

Good luck

Looking forward to your thoughts
post #8986 of 15826
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Fineberg View Post

Even my 65" tv. In the store I was like yup that's perfect but I would love the 70".

The wife and I always marvel at how small the 60" TV is when on display at Costco compared to how big one appears when on our entertainment stand. A 60" TV on display in Costco looks about the size of a 46" TV at home. What's with that?
post #8987 of 15826
It's the surroundings. No doubt. The very high ceilings and nothing to refer it to make it appear small.

Although now Thani have the 65 in my house fr almos a year. I think I need bigger tongue.gif
post #8988 of 15826
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Fineberg View Post

It's the surroundings. No doubt. The very high ceilings and nothing to refer it to make it appear small.
Although now Thani have the 65 in my house fr almos a year. I think I need bigger tongue.gif

And those 80" LCD screens have become so cheap compared to five years ago as manufactures are starting to push 90" screens and 4k reproduction. It's a conspiracy I tells ya. tongue.gif
post #8989 of 15826
Yeah the 80" picture is crap though unless you still want to spend 5k on them
I was going to get the 80" sharp for the same price as my 65 vt30. But I went with the better picture over 15" of added size
post #8990 of 15826
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prime316 View Post

Neutro, I'm glad you got your order. I placed an order last Sunday night and it was picked up the Fedex ground and I will have to wait unil Monday to get it. It had to come from the west coast to east coast. I guess Thanksgiving didn't help speed the delivery. With what I paid for shipping and handling, I would have thought it wouldn't have taken a full week to get it.
No, it wasn't SVS with their free shipping. I would have expected it to be slow if I hadn't paid for it. I ordered from Hsu.

Yeah, cross-country through Thanksgiving... one week is actually pretty fast. I bought a Hsu once, also cross-country, and it was in my home in something like four days as I recall. Musta sucked to wait a week, but in your case, I wouldn't blame the manufacturer. Incidentally I placed an order for a PC12-NSD on December 22nd last year, and took delivery on December 24. Yes! This actually happened!
post #8991 of 15826
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Fineberg View Post

Yeah the 80" picture is crap though unless you still want to spend 5k on them
I was going to get the 80" sharp for the same price as my 65 vt30. But I went with the better picture over 15" of added size

Yes, agreed, picture quality over size but compared to where we were just ten years ago, in of itself, at any price and quality, an 80" screen is a marvel. Remember the foils of 60" rear projection TV's of the 80's? Another technological marvel is that PB12-NSD sub of yours; price/performance/quality What can I say but, It's a good time to be a Home Theater buff. biggrin.gif

Yesterday, for a delivered price of $450.00, I put in an order for a Anti-Mode, 8033S II. Fifteen years ago, this type of focused frequency room analyzer/correction DSP style product was unimaginable at any price not to mention the sonic benefits of Audyssey, MultEQ XT or XT32. And for a few hundred dollars more, so sonically we can see our room, we have the "must have" OmniMic. biggrin.gif

(The wife has been informed, my next toy is an OmniMic.)

-
Edited by BeeMan458 - 11/24/12 at 6:35am
post #8992 of 15826
can someone please answer my question? im going to place an order for a pb12 nsd today but i want to make sure i dont make a wrong/useless choice.. im upgrading from an eD a2-300 , what difference will i mostly notice?
post #8993 of 15826
Quote:
Originally Posted by neutro View Post

Take the time to posts linked in MitchPope's reply. Ed says that the Sledge 800 and 1000 amps are able to output more peak power the closer you get them to 0 dB. Of course the point is moot if you don't plan to be limited by the amp rolleyes.gif But what Ed proposes as for setup is to use the highest sub amp gain possible on the Sledge 800/1000 without having the AVR trim level stuck at the minimum.

While the Sledge 800/1000 amps were originally set to -20 gain, they have been shipping with a 0 dB gain setting for probably 8 months at least. The above is correct - these amps will make the most peak power the closer they are set to 0 dB. So to the extent possible (while still maintaining your target calibration level), run your AVR trim cooler and the Sledge gain hotter and this will allow the amp make the most peak power.
post #8994 of 15826
Quote:
Originally Posted by neutro View Post

I'm not that skeptical since I *did* order dual subs. But I'm still a bit skeptical that it's worth paying double for a dual subs setup, versus spending that money on a better single sub. Or, as I would have done, spending less money on a single better sub but not at twice the price. There is little doubt in my mind that running two subs vs one of the same provides lots of advantages. The question is, is it worth paying twice the price for duals; or in other word, is the cost of opportunity worth it. For example, in my case, I did buy two Pluses, out of curiosity. This will probably provide me with more output than a single Ultra, but as stated before, I'm pretty confident that I won't need even half of that for the next 5 years at least. And, a single Ultra would have cost me several hundred dollars less. So what I'm really curious about is -- does it really sound that much better or not. If it sounds better and I find out it's not worth as much money as I paid, well I have lots of options (return an extra sub, sell it to a friend, etc.). But I will probably use it anyway just for the kick of having such an overkill setup (and benefit from it even if I feel it was not totally worth the money).

Dual subs provide far more benefit IMO than a single subwoofer of equal (or nearly equal output). Absolutely worth the investment both subjectively and objectively - don't second guess your decision. Try the single vs. duals both properly set-up and optimized and I'm confident you'll concur duals was totally the way to go.
post #8995 of 15826
Quote:
Originally Posted by lamonsasa View Post

can someone please answer my question? im going to place an order for a pb12 nsd today but i want to make sure i dont make a wrong/useless choice.. im upgrading from an eD a2-300 , what difference will i mostly notice?

I found this thread on the eD a2-300.

From all my research, consistently, the PB12-NSD, at this price point, rises to the top over "ALL" other competitors in power, depth of extension, flatness of frequency response, THD and price. My opinion, based on months of web based research, form factor (size and appearance) a consideration, one would have to go to a Hsu, ULS-15 to find a better price/quality subwoofer.

http://www.data-bass.com/data?page=system&id=66

In the short, what I'd expect you to most notice will be the "WOW!" factor as much of the quality differences are minute (hidden minute, measurable quality differences) as opposed to upfront and in your face. In the short, again, based on months of research, at this price point, unequivocally, the PB12-NSD would be my first, last and only choice.

My current list of subs (price/performance), based on (again with the) months of web based research are:

Klipsch, RW-12d > SVS PB12-NSD > Hsu, ULS-15 > Funk, 18.0C.

As you can see, the above research recommendations are product based as opposed to manufacture based. Do with the above what you will. There's nothing I can find that would make one second guess their PB12-NSD purchase other than, in all truthfulness, the need to be purchased with the expectation of having, at minimum, two subs. The point, if you're worried about having your head turned by another subwoofer in the near future, it's because you're looking at a more expensive subwoofer.

Did that help?

.....rolleyes.gif

P.S. I'd recommend one consider buying an Anti-Mode, 8033S II ($450.00 delivered) in which to help dial your subs in so they'll play and get along well with your room acoustics.

-
Edited by BeeMan458 - 11/24/12 at 7:36am
post #8996 of 15826
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Fineberg View Post

Yeah the 80" picture is crap though unless you still want to spend 5k on them
I was going to get the 80" sharp for the same price as my 65 vt30. But I went with the better picture over 15" of added size

whatever....you just haven't seen a good source on my 80". believe me i'm all about a great pq. seeing the 80" at stores with their crappy feeds=crappy pq..
post #8997 of 15826
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ed Mullen View Post

While the Sledge 800/1000 amps were originally set to -20 gain, they have been shipping with a 0 dB gain setting for probably 8 months at least. The above is correct - these amps will make the most peak power the closer they are set to 0 dB. So to the extent possible (while still maintaining your target calibration level), run your AVR trim cooler and the Sledge gain hotter and this will allow the amp make the most peak power.
those pc13u's must be really slow movers for you guys then. i just got mine from you about two months ago and the sledge was set to -20. nothing better than buying year+ old stock at full retail.biggrin.gif
post #8998 of 15826
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeeMan458 View Post

I found this thread on the eD a2-300.
From all my research, consistently, the PB12-NSD, at this price point, rises to the top over "ALL" other competitors in power, depth of extension, flatness of frequency response, THD and price. My opinion, based on months of web based research, form factor (size and appearance) a consideration, one would have to go to a Hsu, ULS-15 to find a better price/quality subwoofer.
http://www.data-bass.com/data?page=system&id=66
In the short, what I'd expect you to most notice will be the "WOW!" factor as much of the quality differences are minute (hidden minute, measurable quality differences) as opposed to upfront and in your face. In the short, again, based on months of research, at this price point, unequivocally, the PB12-NSD would be my first, last and only choice.
My current list of subs (price/performance), based on (again with the) months of web based research are:
Klipsch, RW-12d > SVS PB12-NSD > Hsu, ULS-15 > Funk, 18.0C.
As you can see, the above research recommendations are product based as opposed to manufacture based. Do with the above what you will. There's nothing I can find that would make one second guess their PB12-NSD purchase other than, in all truthfulness, the need to be purchased with the expectation of having, at minimum, two subs. The point, if you're worried about having your head turned by another subwoofer in the near future, it's because you're looking at a more expensive subwoofer.
Did that help?
.....rolleyes.gif
P.S. I'd recommend one consider buying an Anti-Mode, 8033S II ($450.00 delivered) in which to help dial your subs in so they'll play and get along well with your room acoustics.
-

thanks man, the Klipsch, RW-12d reference is not even close to the pb12 right? cuz i saw it was like on sale the other day for 299 or something..
post #8999 of 15826
Hey Guys,

I'm debating between an SVS PC12-NSD vs Outlaw LFM-1 Plus. I was set on the SVS sub, but the $499 BF deal on the outlaw is very enticing. Taking overall price/performance into account, which way would you guys go out of these two options?
post #9000 of 15826
Quote:
Originally Posted by lamonsasa View Post

thanks man, the Klipsch, RW-12d reference is not even close to the pb12 right? cuz i saw it was like on sale the other day for 299 or something..

You're right, the Klipsch, RW12d isn't even close. It's an upgrade path subwoofer. I was trying to show where I place subs based on online information I've found as a form of encouragement for your intended purchase decision.

At the price point of the PB12-NSD, my opinion, there is a better performing subwoofer.
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