5.1/7.1 PCM, HDMI, and DSP - An Explaination of the Future-Proof receiver - Page 98

I suspect most will also pass 2.0 PCM from other digital sources, and at least some (esp. TVs without 2.0 analog out) will do an AtoD for 2.0 from (e.g.) an attached VCR, or analog audio from a VHF ('BASIC') cable channel, so that all audio is passed to an attached AVR through one Toslink.

Dude,

Please explain that.
Thank you

Sir, I clearly stated I don't care to be addressed as a [dude]. Did you clearly READ I addressed you: SIR? I hope we understand each other.
Again thank you.

wow.

Zenyatto, is English your first language? Because it sounds like you are not understanding something very fundamental, and there is a clear communication lapse. Try to be nicer next time you ask questions which are then DIRECTLY ANSWERED, DUDE. Thank you.

Thank you SoundChex for the very polite response to my largely rhetorical question

I actually knew the answer, I was just posing the question to hopeully beat into Zenyatto's head how he is completely missing the post of the discussion in his wild outbursts

What OR WHO gives you the right to call me a dude? What is your problem?

C'mon dudes. Lets just chill. (assuming that's okay)

Are we clear?

hate to break it to you sir, but I am not the one who has the problem. what gives YOU the right to blow up at people on an internet forum who are providing you with a legitimate response to a question? Saying "thank you" and "sir" after every sentence doesn't give you the authority to act like an jerk, which you are doing. Again, you are TOTALLY out of line with the tone of your responses.

Besides, "dude" isn't even an insult!

I am asking a legitimate question, is English your first language? Because you are TOTALLY misunderstanding the issue, and seem to be unable to accurately assess other people's tone.

I am perfectly calm I just don't understand what this guy is flipping out about.

As Walter said to "The Dude":

Yeah, what we had here dude, was a failure to communicate.

seriously, all you did was provide a clear answer to a simple question! don't you feel badly now about the trouble you have caused?

that's what you get for insulting the intelligence of others and putting words in their mouth with your clear, specific and respectful response to the question asked. I hope you have learned your lesson.

Yes, HDMI can carry audio and video together from a source to a receiver. But that's not what you are doing in this case. I looked at the manual, p. 24. It is showing that the video from the AVR is feeding the TV thru HDMI. That same cable is feeding audio into the TV, but you probably don't care--you hear the audio from the speakers driven by the AVR.

That HDMI cable feeding video into the TV has no abilty to return the audio from the TV back into the AVR.

The TV in this scenario has no HDMI output, so they are instructing you to bring in the TV's audio in via your choice of S/PDIF (coax or optical) or 2-ch analog.

i just updated the firmware to my denon 4306 which is supposed to add 7.1pcm over hdmi support. i am also using an lg bd390 player. what is the best way to test i am getting 7.1 pcm? do i choose pass-through or multi ch on my lg player and what BD is definitely 7.1 that i could test? I own a lot of BD's so if anyone can suggest a popular one, more likely than not I own it and could try it out.

Don't use pass thru, as the AVR cannot decode the HD codecs. You need them decoded in the BD player. And make sure "secondary audio" is turned off, as that will interfere with the hi res PCM, too.

You can find the list of 7.1 BDs here. Very handy tool.

Roger, I thought secondary audio was only a concern for bitstreaming? I thought, with PCM output, the player could mix the secondary audio in without issue?

I would like to share an observation of mine. I have a Samsung LN40A650 A1F LCD tv receiver. I have a Directv HD-DVR attached via HDMI to the tv. I have a Sony Dream System DAVFX900W DVD 5.1 audio system hooked up to a another HDMI input on the tv. The Sony and Directv hyave no connections between them. The Sony unit outputs the sound of the Directv HD-DVR via the Samsung tv. My conclusion is that the Samsung can reroute sound out to the receiver. Given all the wire hookups over the years, this to me was very cool to discover. HDMI components now talk to each and apparently can configure themselves in a useful way.

Sony provided this ability, perhaps other AVRs don't. It would interesting to know which do though for reference.

It can mix, but from all I have heard, the mixing is done using the core audio stream instead of the high-rez stream. I think this is a matter each player maker decides, as maybe it saves MIPs to do that.

That's pretty cool. When I as reading the features of the new HDMI 1.4 spec to see about 3D, it also mentioned that they would be able to feed audio back, just as you described, so I thought that was something new for 1.4. Maybe it exists already.

How do you tell the Sony AVR you want to hear it the TV? Which input do you select?

The setting this works on is TV/VCR 1. I don't have anything else plugged into this mini AVR system.It doesn't work when I select DVD or any other setting like AM or XM or TV/VCR 2. It doesn't appear to be two way on one HDMI. The TV is outputting to the AVR on its HDMI connection while receiving from the Directv HD-DVR's HDMI connection. The Sony Dream System is early HDMI circa 2007 IIRC.

Oh, I think I get it. The TV has an HDMI output, and you are selecting it on an input to the Sony. Ok, that's still a 1-way connection as far as HDMI is concerned.

I first thought the Sony's HDMI output was also feeding the TV, and yet TV audio came backwards to the Sony from it.

1) ALL the tvs that have an AUDIO OUT jack on them can of course send audio from the tv to another device/component such as an av receiver. If they couldn't what would be the point of having the audio output jacks?

2) The reason it only works on TV/VCR1 is because that is the AUDIO connection you chose to use on the back of your Sony receiver. If you had chosen TV/VCR2 then audio would only be heard when you selected TV/VCR2.

3)Since I do not know how exactly you connected all these device I cannot say for sure whether the audio from the HD-PVR is coming directly from that device or from the HD-PVR via the Samsung tv. To determine this, simply start at the TV/VCR1 INPUT on the back of the Sony and follow the cable. If it ends in the tv's AUDIO OUTPUT jack then yes, your conclusion is correct that your Samsung is rerouting the sound to your receiver but not exactly as you believed. If after following the cable, you find that it ends at the HD-PVR AUDIO OUTPUT jack, then you currently are receiving the sound directly from the HD-PVR. Either way, you are NOT receiving it at the receiver back through the HDMI port.

To summarize: No, the hdmi ports are NOT talking to each other to pass audio. The hdmi port on the Sony is an output ONLY port and the hdmi ports on the Samsung (as all current tvs) are input ONLY ports. The audio is being carried by other cables (composite or coaxial or optical) separately to the Sony receiver to be played. See points number 2/3 above.

Lastly, I suspect-since I can't see your setup-that you have composite (red and white) cables connected from the output of the Samsung tv to the input tv/vcr1 of the Sony receiver. For true separate/the best 5.1 channel audio from your Direct tv box (not dolby prologic) you should connect a digital audio output cable (coaxial or optical) to one of your Sony receiver inputs (either tv/vcr1-2) if you haven't done so already.

HTH


psigp

My blu ray player and receiver both process PCM and bitstream
Some music and movies are primarily PCM.
Is it better to have the decoding done in the player or the receiver.
Also my DVD player can decode 6 channel bitstream or 2 channel PCM which is better.
And if I set the DVD player to 2 channel pcm and the receiver to PL11x music what will I hear stereo or surround 7 channel.
Thanks

Search functions are not for newbies I guess.

In answer to your many-times-before-asked questions:

1) There's no way to tell without knowing something about the decoding hardware, and even then whether it actually makes a difference likely requires matching the settings and doing the comparison double blind. I would use the AVR , personally, because I like every input format to be decoded and processed by one box. And even if they turn out to sound different under such conditions, which one sounds 'better' is your call.

2) which is 'better' depends on whether you like surround sound or two-channel sound better. They're very different.

3) 2-channel will be upmixed to 5.1 channel by DPLIIX. 5.1 Channel will be upmixed to 7.1 channel.

I beg your pardon?

Thank You! for the response.
I do look through the threads and I have seen many different responses to the same question.
I was looking for a response from someone with experience and who was not condescending.
As I tell my patients there is no such thing as a stupid question except the one that was never asked.
thank you again for your response.

If you had said what particular BR player and AVR you have a better response would probably have been given.

You should not assume that all BR players and AVR's are alike when asking such a question. Remember, Garbage In--Garbage Out. That might very well apply here.

fafner

I thought that this was a generic thread about processing.
I just want to enjoy my theater.
I am sorry that my questions are perceived as garbage.
If there is a thread dedicated to rules and etiquette please refer me to it.

i've recently noticed that some bd pcm tracks are 7.1 but the dts-hd or the truehd are only 5.1, any of you DUDES have input on that?