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Owners ONLY thread >>> 60"/70" XBR2 <<< Settings/Tweaks - Page 31

post #901 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by skb View Post

I didn't find very much about these two items in this forum.
I'm talking about the Oppo 981 and the Sony KDSR60XBR2. Now that I own both is there any detail anywhere about settings for the Oppo and the Sony together.

Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks

several users have reported better PQ by setting the 981 to output 480P. one said a calibrator set his to 480p because of a green push at 1080p. i have mine outputting 1080p.
check out the oppo 981 thread for specific recomedations for the player settings regardless of TV type.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=760726
and remember to use one of the calibration disc also. (avia,DVE,getgray)
post #902 of 1290
Thanks
post #903 of 1290
VGA to DVI adapter, then a DVI to HDMI adapter.

Is this possible with my laptop to KDSR60XB2?

Any picture loss encounted for this hookup?

Thanks
post #904 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by skb View Post

VGA to DVI adapter, then a DVI to HDMI adapter.

Is this possible with my laptop to KDSR60XB2?

Any picture loss encounted for this hookup?

Thanks

Not going to work at all. VGA-DVI-A(analog), is completely different from DVI-HDMI digital. No need to do that though if you are fixed on using VGA, as the sets already have a VGA port. The main problem with using VGA seem to be the inability of the set to fully map a 1080p image via that input, leaving a black border all around. I also have some doubt you will have a laptop that's going to handle doing much other than be able to allow you to use the XB2 as a giant monitor @ 1080p. You need a quite good on board video card by laptop standards to do much at 1080p and a laptop that does support 1080p to begin, in which case it should already have a DVI port as per some of Dell's inspiron models going back a bit over 3 years ago.
post #905 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by OzHDHT View Post

The main problem with using VGA seem to be the inability of the set to fully map a 1080p image via that input, leaving a black border all around.

Yea, I see that annoying border with my XBox HD/DVD ---> XBox 360 ---> VGA In on the XBR2 60".

Has anyone heard if Sony is planning on ever fixing this?

J
post #906 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jarin View Post

Yea, I see that annoying border with my XBox HD/DVD ---> XBox 360 ---> VGA In on the XBR2 60".

Has anyone heard if Sony is planning on ever fixing this?

J

I don't think they intended the VGA input to be that well relied upon, giving all other the forms of HD video connectivity the set has. More like M$ should have included HDMI on the 360 that they are now shafting existing 360 owners by releasing the 360 elite with an HDMI port. Component 1080i should get you through, otherwise why not trade up to the 360 elite and be done with it?
post #907 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by OzHDHT View Post

I don't think they intended the VGA input to be that well relied upon, giving all other the forms of HD video connectivity the set has. More like M$ should have included HDMI on the 360 that they are now shafting existing 360 owners by releasing the 360 elite with an HDMI port. Component 1080i should get you through, otherwise why not trade up to the 360 elite and be done with it?

According to Sony the next generation of SXRD will be able to accept a 1080p signal over VGA.
post #908 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by OzHDHT View Post

Component 1080i should get you through, otherwise why not trade up to the 360 elite and be done with it?

Yea, it is. Honestly, the set looks gorgeous with the picture from the HD DVD off the 360, I can't see how it could be improved much, 1080p or not. And I have no desire for the Elite. I think the XBR2 will satisfy me for quite some time. The XBR3 I suppose I could've waited for, but I didn't and I don't regret it. Overall, after 14 days with it, I'm happy I got it.

J
post #909 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by OzHDHT View Post

Not going to work at all. VGA-DVI-A(analog), is completely different from DVI-HDMI digital. No need to do that though if you are fixed on using VGA, as the sets already have a VGA port. The main problem with using VGA seem to be the inability of the set to fully map a 1080p image via that input, leaving a black border all around. I also have some doubt you will have a laptop that's going to handle doing much other than be able to allow you to use the XB2 as a giant monitor @ 1080p. You need a quite good on board video card by laptop standards to do much at 1080p and a laptop that does support 1080p to begin, in which case it should already have a DVI port as per some of Dell's inspiron models going back a bit over 3 years ago.

I have an Dell Inspiron 8100 which is about 5 years old. It does not have a DVI port on it.

I guess I'll have to live with the black border.

I wish there was some way to induce 1:1 image mapping just for the the PC input via the service menu. I assume this subject has been beat to death on this forum anyway with no solution.

It seems strange that at 800 X 600 that my image is bigger than 1600 X 1200.

thanks anyway.
post #910 of 1290
VGA to DVI Scaler made by Gefen.

Has anybody tried this with the Sony 60 or 70"?

The VGA to DVI Scaler PLUS connects traditional analog video graphic cards (VGA) to DVI compliant digital monitors. The VGA to DVI Scaler PLUS, enables users to connect laptops or legacy PC computers equipped with HD-15 video connections, to the new DVI (digital visual interface) video display format. The VGA to DVI Scaler PLUS will also work with component video sources such as DVD players and set top boxes.

How it works
Simply connect the supplied VGA (M-M) cable to the input side of the VGA to DVI Scaler PLUS. Then connect the DVI monitor or projector to the DVI output of the VGA to DVI Scaler Box. The converter generates the compatible analog to digital conversion signals to make the connection between the analog input and the digital output work. Control of the Scaler is easily handled by the included IR Remote control.
post #911 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by skb View Post

I have an Dell Inspiron 8100 which is about 5 years old. It does not have a DVI port on it.

I guess I'll have to live with the black border.

I wish there was some way to induce 1:1 image mapping just for the the PC input via the service menu. I assume this subject has been beat to death on this forum anyway with no solution.

It seems strange that at 800 X 600 that my image is bigger than 1600 X 1200.

thanks anyway.

Quote:
Originally Posted by skb View Post

VGA to DVI Scaler made by Gefen.

Has anybody tried this with the Sony 60 or 70"?

The VGA to DVI Scaler PLUS connects traditional analog video graphic cards (VGA) to DVI compliant digital monitors. The VGA to DVI Scaler PLUS, enables users to connect laptops or legacy PC computers equipped with HD-15 video connections, to the new DVI (digital visual interface) video display format. The VGA to DVI Scaler PLUS will also work with component video sources such as DVD players and set top boxes.

How it works
Simply connect the supplied VGA (M-M) cable to the input side of the VGA to DVI Scaler PLUS. Then connect the DVI monitor or projector to the DVI output of the VGA to DVI Scaler Box. The converter generates the compatible analog to digital conversion signals to make the connection between the analog input and the digital output work. Control of the Scaler is easily handled by the included IR Remote control.

As I suspected your 8100 is not going to be that useful as it is with your XBR2 due to it's age and being limited to 1600x1200, therefore not even making it up to 1920x1080p. I'm not sure what you're trying to achieve with it other than as an large monitor as there would obviously be zero point in trying to use it for any media playback. Adding that Gefen VGA-DVI converter would in my eyes be a real waste of money just to achieve a 'full screen' display. If it were me I would seriously consider biting the bullet and just getting a new laptop.

It could be a simple difference in the way the TV handles lower resolutions via the VGA i.e. the way it scales them that causing 800x600 to appear 'bigger' than 1600x1200.
post #912 of 1290
I have a 70" XBR2 and have spent many, many weekends calibrating the picture, carefully tweaking the white balance, etc., and I think I have finally achieved a great picture.

And one of the way I achieved a great picture is setting Contrast (Picture) to Max. [Let the beatings begin!]

Every time the subject of Contrast comes up there are dozens of people around that quickly point out that it should NEVER be set to Max. On older CRTs you would get blooming. And on newer ones you might have one of the primary colors drop off, causing white balance configuration to be difficult. Or you have whiter-than-white disappear.

But after much testing I can attest that I get no blooming, I can see WTW and there is no color drop off. I've used tools such as HFCR and Spyder to verify the latter. If I use anything less than Max the picture just looks dull.

Most people that have posted their settings on this forum use Contrast around 85-90. Is anyone using Max? Does anyone have a real reason why Max is not good on this TV?

One of my theories is that the bulb simply isn't bright enough on a 70" to cause problems.

I welcome your comments. My goal is only to improve my picture, if possible. The beatings are just gravy.
post #913 of 1290
when i used avia to calibrate my oppo981 input i ended up with picture at max. this seemed to be correct acording to the test supplied on the disc. for the TV input i have at 85. i guestamate aproximately 2500 hour on the bulb. mine is a 60"
post #914 of 1290
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyFunBoater View Post


Most people that have posted their settings on this forum use Contrast around 85-90. Is anyone using Max? Does anyone have a real reason why Max is not good on this TV?

One of my theories is that the bulb simply isn't bright enough on a 70" to cause problems.

I welcome your comments. My goal is only to improve my picture, if possible. The beating are just gravy.

It definitely won't cause blooming - that only happens on CRTs.

On my set, if I put up a gray scale ramp, and then set contrast to Max, I definitely see a spot where the white turns bluish, indicating I've run out of red and green.

But, there are lots of controls that overlap here. Contrast/brightness/Iris/Powersaving probably all have an impact. The Auto Iris settings, in particular, will dynamically adjust contrast/brightness. Of course, some of Sony's other auto settings will also probably play a part here, if you don't have them turned off.

So, you've probably found a combination of all of those, where max contrast doesn't end up color shifting. Or you just got a great set that doesn't run out of any of one or two of the primaries!

eric
post #915 of 1290
When my set was calibrated it ended up at 87 due to minor color issues above that point. Max won't cause any major issues. Only the pickiest calibrators would probably notice. Or we could all just use the CNET recommended setting of 46
post #916 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by EricBergan View Post

It definitely won't cause blooming - that only happens on CRTs.

On my set, if I put up a gray scale ramp, and then set contrast to Max, I definitely see a spot where the white turns bluish, indicating I've run out of red and green.

But, there are lots of controls that overlap here. Contrast/brightness/Iris/Powersaving probably all have an impact. The Auto Iris settings, in particular, will dynamically adjust contrast/brightness. Of course, some of Sony's other auto settings will also probably play a part here, if you don't have them turned off.

So, you've probably found a combination of all of those, where max contrast doesn't end up color shifting. Or you just got a great set that doesn't run out of any of one or two of the primaries!

eric

Some owners I know are running their 70"s at max, but in doing so are already running some service menu changes to iris level as well. Owen is one such owner who does this. My set is professionally calibrated and runs nicely at 90, which is still very bright.
post #917 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyFunBoater View Post


Most people that have posted their settings on this forum use Contrast around 85-90. Is anyone using Max? Does anyone have a real reason why Max is not good on this TV?

Are you viewing the set in a dark (no lights) room, or in a room with some light? The darker the room, the less likely it is you need max on Picture/Contrast.

Blooming doesn't apply to anything but CRTs, it's impossible with fixed pixel displays that use lamps or backlighting. Plasmas won't bloom either.

There is a danger you can lose detail in bright scenes with pic/contrast up too high. Each brand/model should be checked with a gray scale step pattern that has above white (and below black) to make sure steps are not 'lost' when pic/contrast is set high.

The 60" XBR2 sets are VERY bright, powersave mode is pretty much mandatory as is using a small iris setting or Auto2 mode for the iris. These settings reduce max light output and bringing the pic/contrast control down below 90 also knocks the edge off the high light levels. Even at that, if there's a completely white screen displayed... holy crap, it is REALLY BRIGHT in a dark room - like squint-to-prevent-discomfort bright.

The 70" set spreads the same amount of light over a larger area so the peak brightness levels are not as high as with the 60" XBR2s. But the 70" sets are STILL pretty darn bright. If you're not bothered by really high brightness levels when a completely white screen is displayed, there's probably no reason you have to turn down pic/contrast since these Sony sets don't wipe out any of the steps in the gray scale when you use high settings for pic/contrast.

All that said... over its useful life, the lamp will lose as much as 50% of its brightness so compensating over time by jacking up pic/contrast and perhaps turning off powersave mode or changing to a larger iris opening would compensate for the loss of lamp output. So depending on where you are within the lifespan of your lamp, you could have pretty different settings controlling screen brightness.
post #918 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by EricBergan View Post

On my set, if I put up a gray scale ramp, and then set contrast to Max, I definitely see a spot where the white turns bluish, indicating I've run out of red and green.

Here's how I determined (I think) that I'm not running out of any color: I ran RGB and Luminance graphs with HCFR and expected to see one of the colors drop off at the high IRE measurements. I've seen other people's graphs where a color, often red, drops off, but I didn't see that on my TV. Does this seem like the right approach? Thanks!

(Graphs attached.)
LL
LL
post #919 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by strutter View Post

when i used avia to calibrate my oppo981 input i ended up with picture at max. this seemed to be correct acording to the test supplied on the disc. for the TV input i have at 85. i guestamate aproximately 2500 hour on the bulb. mine is a 60"

Isn't there a "total bulb hours" in the service menu? I tried to find it but couldn't. And then I tried to search this forum and couldn't find the instuctions there either. Any ideas?
post #920 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by maxdb View Post

Are you viewing the set in a dark (no lights) room, or in a room with some light? The darker the room, the less likely it is you need max on Picture/Contrast.

The room typically has lights on and a few windows open, but nothing horribly bright.

Quote:
Originally Posted by maxdb View Post

There is a danger you can lose detail in bright scenes with pic/contrast up too high. Each brand/model should be checked with a gray scale step pattern that has above white (and below black) to make sure steps are not 'lost' when pic/contrast is set high.

I checked this with a few different tools that showed white and whiter-than-white bars. Regardless of where I had the Contrast I could still see the WTW bars clearly. I also tried a few calibration pictures where everyone is wearing white, eating white food, etc. (you've probably seen that one), and I was still able to see detail. So I "guess" I'm ok.

Quote:
Originally Posted by maxdb View Post

The 60" XBR2 sets are VERY bright, powersave mode is pretty much mandatory as is using a small iris setting or Auto2 mode for the iris. These settings reduce max light output and bringing the pic/contrast control down below 90 also knocks the edge off the high light levels. Even at that, if there's a completely white screen displayed... holy crap, it is REALLY BRIGHT in a dark room - like squint-to-prevent-discomfort bright.

I'm using Auto1 since it seems brighter than Auto2. And I also have PowerSave set to auto.

Quote:
Originally Posted by maxdb View Post

The 70" set spreads the same amount of light over a larger area so the peak brightness levels are not as high as with the 60" XBR2s. But the 70" sets are STILL pretty darn bright.

See, it's comments like that which make me think that something is wrong - eitiher with my eyes or TV. At Max and even in the dark, this TV never gets to the point where it looks too bright.

Thanks!
post #921 of 1290
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyFunBoater View Post

Here's how I determined (I think) that I'm not running out of any color: I ran RGB and Luminance graphs with HCFR and expected to see one of the colors drop off at the high IRE measurements. I've seen other people's graphs where a color, often red, drops off, but I didn't see that on my TV. Does this seem like the right approach? Thanks!

(Graphs attached.)

For brightness and contrast, I find it better to use a gray scale ramp - black on one side, ranging to white on the other. Then you adjust for as smooth a ramp as you can from black to white. On my set, when the contrast is max, I will see the white suddenly turn to a bar of uniform color, a blue-ish white.

Unless you've got commercial grade signal generator and color sensor, I think I'd trust my eye for this one more then Spyder or the like. I'm not sure how accurate a consumer sensor is with a 100% white signal.

But, again, its possible depending on your other settings, that max IS the right setting for your set, and you are not getting one of the primaries dropping off.

eric
post #922 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyFunBoater View Post

Isn't there a "total bulb hours" in the service menu? I tried to find it but couldn't. And then I tried to search this forum and couldn't find the instuctions there either. Any ideas?

in the SM its like Panel sub menu 21.
post #923 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by strutter View Post

in the SM its like Panel sub menu 21.

Cool. Found it. It says:

21 Timer
0 LMP 2733

So I assume that's 2733 hours. Wow. Looks like I'm on track to use about 4000 hours per year, which I believe the average life of the bulb.

Thanks for the help.
post #924 of 1290
yep. it sort of sucks knowing we'll have to purchase a new bulb every year. but i try to look at it like WOW it's going to be like having a new TV every year
post #925 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by strutter View Post

yep. it sort of sucks knowing we'll have to purchase a new bulb every year. but i try to look at it like WOW it's going to be like having a new TV every year

A new bulb is about $200, right? I guess that's not too bad.

BTW, I bought the Best Buy extended warranty and the sales guy told me that it covered bulb replacement. That seemed kind of odd, but since I was buying the warranty regardless I didn't question it. I guess I'll find out in a few months.
post #926 of 1290
let me know how it goes with BB. i had heard before that people were told that by the sales men but that in the actual terms of service it says otherwise. i dont know for sure either way. i got EW from sonystyle and it definately doesnt cover the bulb.

The XL-5300 replacement lamp is 299.99 + S&H at sonystyle. probably can be found for less though. i havent looked yet.
post #927 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyFunBoater View Post

... See, it's comments like that which make me think that something is wrong - eitiher with my eyes or TV. At Max and even in the dark, this TV never gets to the point where it looks too bright.

Thanks!


I don't think it's too bright either
post #928 of 1290
Does anyone have a PS3 and uses it for Blu Ray and wouldn't mind posting there video settings?
post #929 of 1290
I would also be interested in the PS3 settings. I am playing around with Blu-Ray on input 3 but have not come to anything close to what I am happy with. Any other folk using PSA for movies - namely BD movies? and have made changes to this input for picture?
post #930 of 1290
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnaussie View Post

I would also be interested in the PS3 settings. I am playing around with Blu-Ray on input 3 but have not come to anything close to what I am happy with. Any other folk using PSA for movies - namely BD movies? and have made changes to this input for picture?

I use mine all the time for BR playback. In fact I share HDMI input #2 with my HD-DVD player. It looks brilliant, very hard to pick the 2 HD devices, but I would give the dedicated XA2 a slight edge. By input, what do you mean exactly? I seriously hope you are not contemplating running anything other than HDMI from the PS3 into the XBR 2?
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