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B&W Owner's Thread - Page 434

post #12991 of 17809
Quote:
Originally Posted by AcuDefTechGuy View Post

I don't know about that. But he sold his B&W speakers. biggrin.gif

He sold his B&W speakers for the Tekton Pendragons, which he is now using as his reference speaker. eek.gif Jokes aside, I haven't seen any measurements for his new reference speakers.
post #12992 of 17809
Quote:
Originally Posted by wse View Post

Ok I have a question, I am thinking to potentially sell my four 802D1 to upgrade to 802D2 for surround R/L and get a pair of 805D?

What do you think should I, is it worth it?

What's the 805's for, rear surrounds? I personally don't see a need to upgrade from 802 D1's to D2's for either of the surrounds and if you are considering replacing your rear 802D1's with 805D's then you may as well ditch the surround 802's as well because 805's are all that's really necessary for movies and for music well replacing a 802 with a 805, even in the rear will just destroy the ultra realistic and 3 dimensional soundstage generated by the marlan head and also break the consistency in timbre in the back half of the system. My opinion of course biggrin.gif
post #12993 of 17809
Quote:
Originally Posted by skidawgz View Post

I thought I heard a rumor that more speakers will be soon released in the CM line featuring the "Tweeter on top" design. Has anyone heard/seen the same?

I have not heard that. B&W did that with the old 700 series, but then discontinued the series after sales of the 700 series started to cannibalize sales of the 800 series. The problem really for B&W is that are struggling in sales in their home country, (both KEF and Monitor Audio) outsell them in the UK. Part of this is the large chasm in pricing from each line. B&W really only has three lines of what most consider hi-fi stereo loudspeakers, the 600 series, CM and 800 series. Most other companies have wider ranges with more aggressive pricing as you go up the line. KEF has the C, Q, R and Reference lines. The new R series gets you closer to the Reference line, in terms of performance. That makes it easy for somebody who is trying to build up to the flagship range, They can purchase the R series and then in a year or two they can trade up to the flagship line for a lot less money. With B&W series you have the CM series that ranges in price from anywhere from &1500 to $3000. Then the next series up starts out at $7500 for the cheapest floor stander. That is huge jump. Don't get me wrong I think that all the B&W lines sound good and obviously I own B&W speakers and consider them some of the best sounding speakers at any price. But to the more value oriented consumer it's tough to make the jump in the B&W lines.

I would like to see B&W get more aggressive with the pricing. You have the 600 and CM series that are fairly aggressively priced. The jump from the 600 series to the CM series is in line with most other manufactures, but the jump from the CM to the 800 is drastic. I think that either another line, positioned between the CM and 800, or a complete retooling of all line would be in order. The problem really started when B&W added the Diamond tweeter to al models in the 800 series, rather than just the top two models. When that happened the lower three models 805, 804 and 803 nearly doubled in price, and there was nothing introduced to fill that gap.

If history is any indication it could be next year and then 2015 before we see revisions to the CM and 800 lines.
post #12994 of 17809
I agree, B&W should introduce a new 700 series that is closer to the 800 series in SQ at a price between CM and 800.
post #12995 of 17809
Quote:
Originally Posted by jima4a View Post

I agree, B&W should introduce a new 700 series that is closer to the 800 series in SQ at a price between CM and 800.

depending on how successful the PM1 is, I would expand on that... more expensive than CM, half off 800 series, great sound...
post #12996 of 17809
Sorry yes I forgot about the PM1. Problem with the Prestige Monitor line is that it started out at a limited production run. Then B&W stated that they would continue the line with full production. Only issue with the PM1 at the moment appears to be whether it will begin to cannibalize sales of the the newish remodeled 805di. I suspect not, since the 805di has a better tweeter, marketing spec and all - very subjective, and of course the 805di can be used in so many different applications; either as mains in a 2.1 stereo rig or as surrounds in a multi-channel rig. But yes it would seem that expanding on the PM1 as a distinct possibility.
post #12997 of 17809
I know this is a b&w forum... but i read that some of you have other brand of speakers as well.

i like my 804S hometheater, i have been looking for 802 or 800 nautilus speakers to change out the front two...

i am growing ever so tired of looking for good 802 speakers in my area...

so now i am thinking of jumping ship... what other brands do you have and how do they compare?

thanks,
Bill
post #12998 of 17809
Quote:
Originally Posted by baranowski View Post

I know this is a b&w forum... but i read that some of you have other brand of speakers as well.

i like my 804S hometheater, i have been looking for 802 or 800 nautilus speakers to change out the front two...

i am growing ever so tired of looking for good 802 speakers in my area...

so now i am thinking of jumping ship... what other brands do you have and how do they compare?

thanks,
Bill

KEF Reference & Revel Ultima. These 2 brands will measure a lot more accurate & much better off-axis than B&W. Some people think these speakers are better than B&W. I say all 3 brands are equally good stuff regardless of what the on-axis & off-axis measurements say.
post #12999 of 17809
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matts View Post

I have not heard that. B&W did that with the old 700 series, but then discontinued the series after sales of the 700 series started to cannibalize sales of the 800 series.

Are you sure that's true? There was a huge price gap between the 700 series and the 800 series, and a big jump in sound quality, too (and I say this as a happy 700-series owner).
post #13000 of 17809
Quote:
Originally Posted by pbarach View Post

Are you sure that's true? There was a huge price gap between the 700 series and the 800 series, and a big jump in sound quality, too (and I say this as a happy 700-series owner).

Price gap was high compared to the higher end 800 models, or at least the top two models in the 800 series, but the 703 floorstanders were priced where the CM9 are at now, but that almost 7 or 8 years ago when the 703's came out, if my memory is right, not sure exactly the year. By comparison the older 804 and 803N were price much lower back then of course to where they are now. Now performance wise the 703 held it's own against the older 804S, and was closer in price then where the CM9 is compared to the 804di today, as the 804Di saw it's price increase substantially when it got the Diamond tweeter back in 2010. But yes the top two models in the new 800 line are still a large step up over even the older 700 series in both performance and price.
post #13001 of 17809
can someone comment on the sq difference between 802D and 800D relative to the price difference?
post #13002 of 17809
Quote:
Originally Posted by mominayal View Post

can someone comment on the sq difference between 802D and 800D relative to the price difference?

Are you talking about D1 or D2? I've heard the 800D2 and 802D2 in the same room at the dealer run off the same exact equipment down to the same exact wires. In my opinion, to my ears, the difference was fairly small. Certainly not $9k worth. Again, in my opinion. I am sure you will find more than one person in this thread that will tell you that the difference is big and certainly justified, and I can't disagree with them. The best thing you can do is go listen to each preferably in the same room off the same equipment. Be sure to take your time and figure out what's important to you.
post #13003 of 17809
Quote:
Originally Posted by BVLDARI View Post

Are you talking about D1 or D2? I've heard the 800D2 and 802D2 in the same room at the dealer run off the same exact equipment down to the same exact wires. In my opinion, to my ears, the difference was fairly small. Certainly not $9k worth. Again, in my opinion. I am sure you will find more than one person in this thread that will tell you that the difference is big and certainly justified, and I can't disagree with them. The best thing you can do is go listen to each preferably in the same room off the same equipment. Be sure to take your time and figure out what's important to you.

Well I know $9k is important to me smile.gif!!

Im referring to the current D series which I guess is D2? I didnt really know there was a D1, whats the difference, im just a bottom feeder who has to settle for CM series smile.gif
post #13004 of 17809
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matts View Post

Price gap was high compared to the higher end 800 models, or at least the top two models in the 800 series, but the 703 floorstanders were priced where the CM9 are at now, but that almost 7 or 8 years ago when the 703's came out, if my memory is right, not sure exactly the year. By comparison the older 804 and 803N were price much lower back then of course to where they are now. Now performance wise the 703 held it's own against the older 804S, and was closer in price then where the CM9 is compared to the 804di today, as the 804Di saw it's price increase substantially when it got the Diamond tweeter back in 2010. But yes the top two models in the new 800 line are still a large step up over even the older 700 series in both performance and price.

It was a similar story with the older CDM line. At about 1500 bucks for a CDM 9NT you got quite a decent amount of bang for the buck with that Nautilus tweeter up on top, and I believe that was cannibalizing sales of the higher end speakers right around the turn of the millennium.
post #13005 of 17809
Quote:
Originally Posted by mominayal View Post

can someone comment on the sq difference between 802D and 800D relative to the price difference?

If you want to know which speaker has the better objective frequency response measurement, it would be the 802D2, which is +/-2.9dB from 200Hz-10kHz, while the 800D2 is +/-5.0dB from 200Hz-10kHz. Because of this +5.0dB @ 9-10kHz, some people say the 800D2 tend to sound a little "bright" in the treble. The 802D1 also has a little smoother off-axis response than the 800D2. The spectral decay also looks a little better on the 802D1 than the 800D2.

But measurements are not everything. If you want a purely subjective opinion, some will say the 800 is better and some will say the 802 is better.

I think they both sound great regardless of on-axis & off-axis measurements. If you have the money and you don't have to ask about the price, then get the 800D2, unless the measurements bother you. wink.gif
Edited by AcuDefTechGuy - 3/6/13 at 12:51pm
post #13006 of 17809
Quote:
Originally Posted by AcuDefTechGuy View Post



I think they both sound great regardless of on-axis & off-axis measurements.

amen. I think all of the 800 series speakers sound great!
post #13007 of 17809
Hello guys! I just bought a pair of my dream speakers - the Nautilus 802. They sound faboulous but I noticed that someone tried to pull the FST mid out of the nautilus head as the rubber seal between the driver and the head looks slightly damaged. There is also a very small chip on the Nautilus head. mad.gif
The speaker works perfectly but it just doesn't look good. frown.gif

Do someone have an idea how can I safely remove the FST midrange to place the rubber seal correctly?
post #13008 of 17809
Quote:
Originally Posted by Martin2395 View Post

Hello guys! I just bought a pair of my dream speakers - the Nautilus 802. They sound faboulous but I noticed that someone tried to pull the FST mid out of the nautilus head as the rubber seal between the driver and the head looks slightly damaged. There is also a very small chip on the Nautilus head. mad.gif
The speaker works perfectly but it just doesn't look good. frown.gif

Do someone have an idea how can I safely remove the FST midrange to place the rubber seal correctly?

The service manual is here
http://bwgroupsupport.com/manuals/bw-service
if you are good at that sort of thing.

Welcome to AVS and congrats on the nice speakers
post #13009 of 17809
Hi guys
i,m new here. and could use some advice from you. i currently own 585 fronts htm62 center and 686 rear speakers. i wanted to upgrade and was thinking 683 for front and 2x 610xp subs and maybe htm 61 for center. but this week i found two second hand asw 750s and bought them.so now i need 683 but.i have heard people saying thar they are boomy? i listen to them once and i noticed it the boomynis my self. what i like about them is they play really deep,and the fst is a reel pleasure to listen to. but once and a while wenn playing loud the boomunis is there. not much but it is there.

i have owned 604s1 and with a 2x 200 watt preamp the bass was nice deep and tight. i listened to the 683 with a 2x 200 watt preamp. do they need more power to get all clean, and tight in the bass?? i can't afford cm9 so im thinking CM5 with my two asw 750.what would you do? go for 683 or cm5?confused.gif
post #13010 of 17809
Thank you dstew100,
I really like the 802's! They sound much better than all the speakers I had before and there were many: Tannoy Arden, Infinity Omega and so on. Even my loved Yamaha's NS1000M can't touch the 802 smile.gif

My biggest concern is that if I loosen up the metal bar going from the back of the nautilus head to the unit it will fall inside the cabinet and eventually damage the midrange and the woofers frown.gif
post #13011 of 17809
I have never taken one of these apart but here is a "cutout" image of what it sorta looks like inside:


Edited by BVLDARI - 3/7/13 at 7:17am
post #13012 of 17809
I would question why one would loosen it in the first place.
post #13013 of 17809
I have no idea either! It looks like somebody tried to pull out the midrange with a screwdriver or a knife (yikes!). Thankfully the cone itself looks untouched.
The speaker works fine but it doesn't look good.
post #13014 of 17809
Quote:
Originally Posted by yoda dk View Post

Hi guys
i,m new here. and could use some advice from you. i currently own 585 fronts htm62 center and 686 rear speakers. i wanted to upgrade and was thinking 683 for front and 2x 610xp subs and maybe htm 61 for center. but this week i found two second hand asw 750s and bought them.so now i need 683 but.i have heard people saying thar they are boomy? i listen to them once and i noticed it the boomynis my self. what i like about them is they play really deep,and the fst is a reel pleasure to listen to. but once and a while wenn playing loud the boomunis is there. not much but it is there.

i have owned 604s1 and with a 2x 200 watt preamp the bass was nice deep and tight. i listened to the 683 with a 2x 200 watt preamp. do they need more power to get all clean, and tight in the bass?? i can't afford cm9 so im thinking CM5 with my two asw 750.what would you do? go for 683 or cm5?confused.gif

If you are doing 5.2, then your subwoofers are handling all the power-hungry bass and so your towers will not be needing that much power. Thus, increasing the amp beyond 200WPC will not improve the sound of the towers.

Try placing the towers away from the walls. If you are using Room Correction, try bypassing that and see if it helps.
post #13015 of 17809
I have a non B&W specific question: where do you buy your "modern" music? There are a lot of new songs that I like but I do not want to own the entire CD or album. For example, I want a particular single from Carrie Underwood. You can easily find it on Amazon or iTunes but if you search for a flac file all you get is torrent sites. Any ideas where I can go find good quality "new" stuff?
post #13016 of 17809
Quote:
Originally Posted by AcuDefTechGuy View Post

If you are doing 5.2, then your subwoofers are handling all the power-hungry bass and so your towers will not be needing that much power. Thus, increasing the amp beyond 200WPC will not improve the sound of the towers.

Try placing the towers away from the walls. If you are using Room Correction, try bypassing that and see if it helps.
hi tech guy. i don't own the 683s yet i heard them at the dealer. so i haven't tried to move them around.my av doesn't have audessey so i can't bypass them at home.. i have read treads here and other places were people mention the boomynis in them. so i'm a litle worried because i really like them and i can't afford to go higher like cm9s i thought it was a matter of putting more power in to them. i think buying them i might regret it in the end,cause i like a clean deep and tight bass
post #13017 of 17809
Quote:
Originally Posted by yoda dk View Post

hi tech guy. i don't own the 683s yet i heard them at the dealer. so i haven't tried to move them around.my av doesn't have audessey so i can't bypass them at home.. i have read treads here and other places were people mention the boomynis in them. so i'm a litle worried because i really like them and i can't afford to go higher like cm9s i thought it was a matter of putting more power in to them. i think buying them i might regret it in the end,cause i like a clean deep and tight bass

Deep tight bass won't be coming from any amps or most of these towers, including the CM9 or B&W 800D2. Deep tight bass should come from subwoofers.

Instead, focus on the clarity of the midrange, smoothness of the tweeter, and overall soundstage.
post #13018 of 17809
Quote:
Originally Posted by AcuDefTechGuy View Post

Deep tight bass won't be coming from any amps or most of these towers, including the CM9 or B&W 800D2. Deep tight bass should come from subwoofers.

Instead, focus on the clarity of the midrange, smoothness of the tweeter, and overall soundstage.
ok thanks for your advice. what would be the best cross over for the 683s and the 750s how low should i set the hz?
post #13019 of 17809
Quote:
Originally Posted by yoda dk View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by AcuDefTechGuy View Post

Deep tight bass won't be coming from any amps or most of these towers, including the CM9 or B&W 800D2. Deep tight bass should come from subwoofers.

Instead, focus on the clarity of the midrange, smoothness of the tweeter, and overall soundstage.
ok thanks for your advice. what would be the best cross over for the 683s and the 750s how low should i set the hz?

For 683 - 60 Hz, and you may decide to plug bass reflex ports in them with supplied foam.
post #13020 of 17809
Hehe
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matts View Post

I have not heard that. B&W did that with the old 700 series, but then discontinued the series after sales of the 700 series started to cannibalize sales of the 800 series. The problem really for B&W is that are struggling in sales in their home country, (both KEF and Monitor Audio) outsell them in the UK. Part of this is the large chasm in pricing from each line. B&W really only has three lines of what most consider hi-fi stereo loudspeakers, the 600 series, CM and 800 series. Most other companies have wider ranges with more aggressive pricing as you go up the line. KEF has the C, Q, R and Reference lines. The new R series gets you closer to the Reference line, in terms of performance. That makes it easy for somebody who is trying to build up to the flagship range, They can purchase the R series and then in a year or two they can trade up to the flagship line for a lot less money. With B&W series you have the CM series that ranges in price from anywhere from &1500 to $3000. Then the next series up starts out at $7500 for the cheapest floor stander. That is huge jump. Don't get me wrong I think that all the B&W lines sound good and obviously I own B&W speakers and consider them some of the best sounding speakers at any price. But to the more value oriented consumer it's tough to make the jump in the B&W lines.

I would like to see B&W get more aggressive with the pricing. You have the 600 and CM series that are fairly aggressively priced. The jump from the 600 series to the CM series is in line with most other manufactures, but the jump from the CM to the 800 is drastic. I think that either another line, positioned between the CM and 800, or a complete retooling of all line would be in order. The problem really started when B&W added the Diamond tweeter to al models in the 800 series, rather than just the top two models. When that happened the lower three models 805, 804 and 803 nearly doubled in price, and there was nothing introduced to fill that gap.

If history is any indication it could be next year and then 2015 before we see revisions to the CM and 800 lines.
long post! They are releasing the cm10 which will have the tweeter similar to the 700 series
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