B&W Owner's Thread - Page 440

Thank you for your reply and help.

Left and right speakers are at 2.5 db , center is at 3.5 and sub is 3 Distances are 12 ft. Crossovers at 80hz SW YES, SPEAKERS SMALL. Anyone else have any ideas would be greatly appreciated.

I am in Virginia Beach. I, as an amateur, do run REW and calibrate my own gear. If you don't have measurement gear I highly recommend it. I mean I'd be happy to do this best I can but it's fun to learn it and understand what's happening. Honestly, it terrifies me now that I measure when I look back to the kinds of investments I made without measuring. The new USB mics are about 100bux and can work with many a laptop or desktop setup without the whole external soundcard and mic pre amp stuff. Great help at home theater shack and the new REW thread here has a good getting started guide and some regular helpers with graphs and such.

I was more kidding because I want to hear your system and it would be kewl to set up an AMP ABX. Between the two of us I think we could do a pretty good one and I'm sure we'd have a good time. If you haven't had a good calibrator there though I'd be really surprised if we did not come up with some measurable improvements but you are much better off being able to do it yourself. If you get into treatments that's not something we can order and measure in a day or two. If you already have treatments we could optimize their placement though.

If you are looking for pro calibration I'd suggest looking around here for someone reputable. Definitely stay away from any of the best buy type folks. I'd be leery of an installer until someone reputable on AVS can verify their skills. You may be able to get him to describe his process, post here, and get some feedback if it is reasonable. If they are not using Omnimic, XTZ, REW or something very similar I wouldn't let them near my system.

As much as you've bought from your dealer though (assuming its all from the same folks) it seems like they'd be taking measurements for you at no charge though.

Where are U?

Are the speakers really 12 feet away? It's OK if the sub distance is a little off as there may be processing changing the distance (that is really a measured delay setting). It's great to be able to measure sub to mains transition to optimize that distance setting. Yes + is louder and - is softer in your AVR trim settings. Those settings appear reasonable, crossover good, SW and speaker small settings correct.

Some pics of your setup helps with getting suggestions.

Don't bury the center back on a shelf (make sure the tweeter is out front of whatever it is on). Give the speakers some distance (12in or a bit more) off the wall. Experiment with "toe in" pointing the tweets to MLP or a couple feet behind MLP (some folks even prefer tow out BTW). tilt the center channel toward MLP ear height (use a laser). Use an SPL meter to double check MCAC level settings. Try to see if an SPL meter app on a smart phone behaves reasonably (louder gets louder, softer gets softer) and you may be able to check levels with that held very still without any movement at ear height pointed at the ceiling at MLP. Get a USB mic and use REW if you like tweaking. Rerun MCAC after any speaker movement.

Nice system you scored there.

Is there an MCAC best practices thread like there is an audyssey thread around here? Use that if so. Otherwise the audyssey principles may be very applicable.

^^^ some more
keep the speakers away from side wall as well. Use speaker placement guide (equilateral triangle between mains and MLP or a little less between mains)...I'm sure I will think of more.

EDIT: get all this placement, tilting, off wall tweaks sounding as best as possible with MCAC off then rerun MCAC.

Take a look at dstew's comments and suggestions. The parameters you posted don't sound half bad for the CM5s with a subwoofer. Also, there is a MCACC thread here on the forums for more specific suggestions. I'm an Audyssey and YPAO user and I know that MCACC has some unique settings that I'm not familiar with. The goal for all of these programs is to produce a flat response. Occasionally, this can sound unsatisfying to the uninitiated.

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1112470/official-pioneer-mcacc-thread

Thanks!

I was trying to do a listening comparison between my pair of B&W 683 tower's and a pair of high quality bookshelf speakers that I recently acquired. I initially liked the bookshelf speakers quite a lot. But after extensive listening to the 683's the bookshelves started to sound totally crappy in comparison... (part of me wishes that I had not done the test and continued to live in ignorance.)

I can't believe I'm saying this, but right now I actually have zero desire to buy any audio gears!

My HT "allowance" is $5000 per year. So the HT piggy bank is up to $15K now. But I have absolutely no desire to buy anything right now. Maybe when my piggy bank reaches $25K in another 2 years, I may just buy something. But just no desire right now.

Then send the money my way, I can spend it all on speakers with one phone call

I'm certain you can do that without even making a single phone call.

True

What I have found is that for home theater (any 5.1) uses, and gaming a bookshelf is mighty fine. When it is time to listen to music in stereo, tower speakers sound so much nicer. I may not have enough power behind my towers and this could be why I don't hear the same drastic difference.

I have to imagine that 800 series Bookshelves would sound better than my CM9s, but I refuse to be tempted to find out.

Go for it it's only money :)

I think it depends on bookshelf speaker. For example, the 805D2 or KEF 201/2 bookshelf vs a CM tower or most $3K towers, as long as you use subs.

I think my TAD 2201 bookshelf sounds better than a lot of $3K towers as long as I use subwoofers.

But as far as CM vs Diamond, just remind yourself of the law of diminishing returns. A 100% price increase does not mean a 100% or even 40% improvement. More like 20%, which may or may not be WORTH it.

Agreed law of diminishing return!

It is a massive illness and its growth is exponential jajajajaja.

I bought the 805Di to match with my system but I'm thinking that I would be more happy with a 802Di in my front that with the sorround, yes the sound it's timbral matched now but it's a few sound that I can get for the surround in my music so I thougt that you wil not need a 805Di in your sorround; BTW your room have been my dreams system forever! jajaja funny not?

WSE just MHO.

Additional it's funny that we are reading constantly messages of amplifiers that have better or the same sound, we need to be real! it's equipment who was created for a designer and how he think that should be its sound so not exist such thing like this sound better or worst, it's a personal choice and taste of audio nothing else; if you like it well that it's your personal taste if not it's the taste of someone else.

krell, mcintosh, classe, emotiva was created with one objective: satisfy an audio necessity so you need to find what it's yours sound and let people be happy.
Edited by leo2498 - 3/14/13 at 11:15am

Thank you Leo,  

 

Yes we all have different perspective after a certain level it comes down to personal preferences like wine, and music.

You are certainly correct in some aspects.

With such a niche market and so very many products out there to choose from the statement disregards what draws us all here to a forum. What if that statement was applied to audio cables or speaker wire. What if everyone was convinced "you get what you pay for" There would be a lot of cash tied up in magic tricks rather than something that makes real difference (speakers and room acoustics).

I can't go anywhere to hear Emotiva, apart from their home base, and I certainly can't have a Mac amp sent to my house to AB against an Emo with my income. Therefore, I must put some faith in other users to steer some of my audio decisions. That's how this debate gets spurned over and over. Human nature is to buy what they have "heard of before" so companies like Bose, Beats, Apple will dominate sales easily. The silly debates we have hear do all but help those companies.

I'm enjoying a new pair of B&W 804 Diamonds. I had the CM9's, but after an A-B demonstration of the 804s and the CM9s at Magnolia, I decided to upgrade. The manager let me return the CM9s for full credit. I kept the CMC2 center, for now anyway. I'll see (hear) how it sounds with the 804s on surround sound when I can bring myself to stop listening to two-channel stereo music for long enough to give it a try. I just love the sound of the 804s playing unprocessed stereo.

I'm using a McIntosh MX121 pre-pro and an MC8207 (7 x 200W) amp, but have just been playing analog direct two-channel stereo since I got the 804s hooked up.

My local BB Magnolia showroom didn't have any 800 series B&W gear... Not sure why...

it has to be a Mag Design Center.

None of those within 75 miles of me... Only 15 of them nationwide so far.

yeah, none anywhere near me either, and I am happy about that.

The Magnolia store (inside of BB) is just not the same. Their highest B&W line seems to be CM9. No 800 series speakers of any type.

Happy to not have the temptation?

The new Oppo BDP-105 with 7 800D & 802D is a great combo :)

Edited by wse - 3/16/13 at 1:17pm

I thought you had 3 800D and 4 802D?

So, I should probably assume that no one listens to modern music or no one "buys" modern music because I got zero responses on this?

iTunes songs are mostly 256 kbps these days... I guess if you are the kind of person who wants to listen to FLAC or ALAC quality audio, and you notice a big difference between that and 256 kbps, then you probably have expensive audio gear and you can probably afford to shell out $10-$20 for CDs even if you only want to listen to one song. I am unaware of anyplace which sells FLAC or ALAC quality single MP3 files for download. If they did it would probably not be worth it in comparison to buying the whole CD IMO.

Recently, when you order certain CDs from Amazon they also allow you to download 256 kbps MP3 files instantly. I like that.

Yes typing to fast

Someone is selling 804s for $2k. Sounds too good to be true, right?