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B&W Owner's Thread - Page 531

post #15901 of 17966
Quote:
Originally Posted by AcuDefTechGuy View Post

One thing I don't get about McIntosh amps (although I love their aesthetic) is that the power output does NOT increase with decreasing impedance.

So it's like 250W into 8 ohms, 250W into 4 ohms, 250W into 2 ohms, instead of 400-500W into 4 ohms and 600-700W into 2 ohms. It seems like a "handicap" to me. I don't get it.

I thought the main point of getting external amps is for higher power output, especially for 2-4 ohms?

This is actually not quite true. If you plug an 2 ohm speaker in the 8 ohm tap you will get more watts than what the amp is rated for. If you plug an 8 ohm speaker into the 2 ohm taps then you will get less.

The rating for the power where you get the same output assumes you impedance match the speakers to the taps. So if you plugged a 2 ohm speaker into the 2 ohm taps you will get the same power output as an 8 ohm speaker into the 8 ohm taps.

I’ve seen a bench test on the MC452 (which I own)and if you plug a 4 ohm load into the 8 ohm tap it produces approximately 1.5 times as much power. I believe the test produced 730W from a 4 ohm load and something like 950W from a 2 ohm load into the 8 ohm taps (and approx 490W into 8 ohm load).
Edited by BVLDARI - 1/8/14 at 10:20am
post #15902 of 17966
I have a new DB1 sub but can't connect to the SubApp on my laptop running windows 7. Anybody with the DB1 that can help?
post #15903 of 17966
Anybody have an idea of what model the two floorstanding units in this photo are? Age? What they might be worth? Quality? I know the center channel up top is a Polk, but am lost on the B&W's for now.. Any help is greatly appreciated!! Someone is offering them to me with a package of other items, and I'm wondering if they're worth taking...

post #15904 of 17966
They are DM 620. I have them and use them now as rear channel speakers. I bought them about 20 years ago in London for 300 pounds. No idea what they would be worth now. They were best buys then and top floorstanders of the 600 series at that time. Wonderfull speakers, still work and sound amazing!
post #15905 of 17966
Quote:
Originally Posted by vvuuren View Post

I have a new DB1 sub but can't connect to the SubApp on my laptop running windows 7. Anybody with the DB1 that can help?

What are your USB inputs, 2.0 or 3.0? I have a Harmony remote that will not work over USB 3.0, perhaps a similar thing is happening?
post #15906 of 17966

What do you guys think about using the HTM2 NAUTILUS (not diamond) with the CM9's. What I have been told people don't recommend the HTM2/4 diamond because of it's diamond tweeter. 

But the HTM2 Nautilus is using the same aluminium tweeter. Is the HTM2N better than the CMC2? Or would you guys still buy the CMC2?

post #15907 of 17966
Quote:
Originally Posted by X1XNobleX1X View Post

What do you guys think about using the HTM2 NAUTILUS (not diamond) with the CM9's. What I have been told people don't recommend the HTM2/4 diamond because of it's diamond tweeter. 
But the HTM2 Nautilus is using the same aluminium tweeter. Is the HTM2N better than the CMC2? Or would you guys still buy the CMC2?
I have the HTM2 diamond and love it! Don't know why people would complain about the diamond tweeter because it sounds amazing. Very clean and balanced. No complaints in my system! Highly recommended.
post #15908 of 17966
Quote:
Originally Posted by vvuuren View Post

I have the HTM2 diamond and love it! Don't know why people would complain about the diamond tweeter because it sounds amazing. Very clean and balanced. No complaints in my system! Highly recommended.

I'm not saying the diamond tweeter is bad, it just doesn't match the tone of the cm9s
post #15909 of 17966
Quote:
Originally Posted by X1XNobleX1X View Post

I'm not saying the diamond tweeter is bad, it just doesn't match the tone of the cm9s
Ohh! My bad. Didn't take that in consideration. I agree the aluminium tweeter would probably fit in better with the CMC2's. Sorry for my ignorance.
post #15910 of 17966

How is your experience with the HTM2D? How is the clarity for movies/music? I can't seem to find any reviews on it. 

post #15911 of 17966
I love my HTM2D. Had a B&W 600 series centre before (can't remember the model) and it was like raising the curtain changing to the HTM2D. Drove it previously with a Harmon Kardon AVR 7000 which sounded good but recently changed to a Krell EV3250. Now the HTM2D just sings!!! It does make a difference what you drive it with but was already good before. I love the diamond tweeter. There is no better. The clarity is exceptional with movies but I just acquired a new surround processor and the HTM2 now blends in with surround music so well. I was listening to some of my SACD's today and could not stop smiling. Sorry, that is not just the HTM2 but I'm trying to say that now I get the value from a very good centre speaker. Sorry if I went on a little!
post #15912 of 17966
The HTM2 Diamond is a phenomenal center, as is the entire Diamond line. Very natural for movies and music, voices are especially realistic. Has no issues playing big and in your face, or as delicately and nuanced as the material dictates.

But you should really be sure and try and listen if mixing drivers for the front soundstage (HTM2 Diamond with CM 9's) sounds right. Generally, you want to keep the front soundstage tonally matched by using the same family of speakers/drivers. You may be happy, and that's all that matters however.
post #15913 of 17966
Quote:
Originally Posted by vvuuren View Post

I love my HTM2D. Had a B&W 600 series centre before (can't remember the model) and it was like raising the curtain changing to the HTM2D. Drove it previously with a Harmon Kardon AVR 7000 which sounded good but recently changed to a Krell EV3250. Now the HTM2D just sings!!! It does make a difference what you drive it with but was already good before. I love the diamond tweeter. There is no better. The clarity is exceptional with movies but I just acquired a new surround processor and the HTM2 now blends in with surround music so well. I was listening to some of my SACD's today and could not stop smiling. Sorry, that is not just the HTM2 but I'm trying to say that now I get the value from a very good centre speaker. Sorry if I went on a little!

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by thrang View Post

The HTM2 Diamond is a phenomenal center, as is the entire Diamond line. Very natural for movies and music, voices are especially realistic. Has no issues playing big and in your face, or as delicately and nuanced as the material dictates.

But you should really be sure and try and listen if mixing drivers for the front soundstage (HTM2 Diamond with CM 9's) sounds right. Generally, you want to keep the front soundstage tonally matched by using the same family of speakers/drivers. You may be happy, and that's all that matters however.

Have you two heard the HTM4? What would be the difference between the CMC2 and the HTM4 due to it being only a 2 way speaker. 

post #15914 of 17966
Quote:
Originally Posted by vvuuren View Post

I love my HTM2D. Had a B&W 600 series centre before (can't remember the model) and it was like raising the curtain changing to the HTM2D. Drove it previously with a Harmon Kardon AVR 7000 which sounded good but recently changed to a Krell EV3250. Now the HTM2D just sings!!! It does make a difference what you drive it with but was already good before. I love the diamond tweeter. There is no better. The clarity is exceptional with movies but I just acquired a new surround processor and the HTM2 now blends in with surround music so well. I was listening to some of my SACD's today and could not stop smiling. Sorry, that is not just the HTM2 but I'm trying to say that now I get the value from a very good centre speaker. Sorry if I went on a little!

I agree also love my htm2 diamond and think bigger centers are better but for anyone getting it keep in mind its a BIG center (depth mostly), It kinda looks small on pictures but in reality its somewhere between a 804D/803D on its side. Only consider it if you can place it correctly.

I would have loved to get the old 'monster' HTM1D since i like centers that can move air but the htm2d2 is very good...

Daniel.
post #15915 of 17966
Quote:
Originally Posted by danielo View Post


I agree also love my htm2 diamond and think bigger centers are better but for anyone getting it keep in mind its a BIG center (depth mostly), It kinda looks small on pictures but in reality its somewhere between a 804D/803D on its side. Only consider it if you can place it correctly.

I would have loved to get the old 'monster' HTM1D since i like centers that can move air but the htm2d2 is very good...

Daniel.

Have you two heard the HTM4? What would be the difference between the CMC2 and the HTM4 due to it being only a 2 way speaker. 

Also how tall is the HTM2 without the tweeter?

post #15916 of 17966
Quote:
Originally Posted by X1XNobleX1X View Post

Have you two heard the HTM4? What would be the difference between the CMC2 and the HTM4 due to it being only a 2 way speaker. 
Also how tall is the HTM2 without the tweeter?

Ehmm without the tweeter ? B&W is very open you can find all the parts on their support site :

http://bwgroupsupport.com/downloads/drawings/bw/pdf/HTM2D2.pdf

I have not heard the htm4, the problem is most dealers don't stock it and on demos where they show the 800 line they will almost always use the htm2.

I found over the years hearing centers is the most tricky part you almost always have to buy them blind and hope for the best, so i was happy when the htm2d turned out ok.

Daniel.
post #15917 of 17966
Quote:
Originally Posted by danielo View Post


Ehmm without the tweeter ? B&W is very open you can find all the parts on their support site :

http://bwgroupsupport.com/downloads/drawings/bw/pdf/HTM2D2.pdf

I have not heard the htm4, the problem is most dealers don't stock it and on demos where they show the 800 line they will almost always use the htm2.

I found over the years hearing centers is the most tricky part you almost always have to buy them blind and hope for the best, so i was happy when the htm2d turned out ok.

Daniel.

I'm in the predicament of either getting the HTM2/4 to pair with my CM9's. Many, many people say that I should get the CMC2. But I do want the best center I can, since it is my main speaker. 

 

I also think that the HTM2 is too big. 


Edited by X1XNobleX1X - 1/10/14 at 4:27am
post #15918 of 17966
Quote:
Originally Posted by X1XNobleX1X View Post

I'm in the predicament of either getting the HTM2/4 to pair with my CM9's. Many, many people say that I should get the CMC2. But I do want the best center I can, since it is my main speaker. 

I also think that the HTM2 is too big. 

There is no doubt that the HTM2 is better in all areas but its also bigger and about 5 times the price of the cmc2. So the only real compare would be between the HTM4 and CMC2 and i would also pick the CMC2 because its the 'big' center (in the line) compared to the HMT4 that lost many of the features that make the htm2 great. looking at the cmc2 vs htm4 seems given that the price difference is 2.5 times i would pick the cmc2. It has the fst driver, can move air, is bigger the only downside is no diamond tweeter but given the rest of the set that might be a plus not a negative.

Daniel.
post #15919 of 17966
Quote:
Originally Posted by danielo View Post

There is no doubt that the HTM2 is better in all areas but its also bigger and about 5 times the price of the cmc2. So the only real compare would be between the HTM4 and CMC2 and i would also pick the CMC2 because its the 'big' center (in the line) compared to the HMT4 that lost many of the features that make the htm2 great. looking at the cmc2 vs htm4 seems given that the price difference is 2.5 times i would pick the cmc2. It has the fst driver, can move air, is bigger the only downside is no diamond tweeter but given the rest of the set that might be a plus not a negative.

Daniel.
Totally agree! The CMC2 is a pretty well regarded speaker for its price point from what I've read.
post #15920 of 17966
Quote:
Originally Posted by jima4a View Post

Totally agree! The CMC2 is a pretty well regarded speaker for its price point from what I've read.

Thank you guys.
I have made my discussion and I'm going with the cmc2.
Thanks
post #15921 of 17966
Quote:
Originally Posted by X1XNobleX1X View Post

Have you two heard the HTM4? What would be the difference between the CMC2 and the HTM4 due to it being only a 2 way speaker. 
Also how tall is the HTM2 without the tweeter?

No.
post #15922 of 17966
Quote:
Originally Posted by X1XNobleX1X View Post

I'm in the predicament of either getting the HTM2/4 to pair with my CM9's. Many, many people say that I should get the CMC2. But I do want the best center I can, since it is my main speaker. 

I also think that the HTM2 is too big. 
For what tower speakers you have go with CMC2 center..
post #15923 of 17966
Quote:
Originally Posted by BVLDARI View Post

This is actually not quite true. If you plug an 2 ohm speaker in the 8 ohm tap you will get more watts than what the amp is rated for. If you plug an 8 ohm speaker into the 2 ohm taps then you will get less.

The rating for the power where you get the same output assumes you impedance match the speakers to the taps. So if you plugged a 2 ohm speaker into the 2 ohm taps you will get the same power output as an 8 ohm speaker into the 8 ohm taps.

I’ve seen a bench test on the MC452 (which I own)and if you plug a 4 ohm load into the 8 ohm tap it produces approximately 1.5 times as much power. I believe the test produced 730W from a 4 ohm load and something like 950W from a 2 ohm load into the 8 ohm taps (and approx 490W into 8 ohm load).

Oh, wow, I stand corrected. biggrin.gif

That's why we have forums, right? biggrin.gif

A lot of times I try to "think" out loud and hope someone corrects me. biggrin.gif

But then why wouldn't you plug all speakers into the 8 ohm tap?

What's the advantage of plugging a 4 ohm speaker into a 4 ohm tap?

That's confusing to me.
post #15924 of 17966
You can plug a 4 ohm speaker into an 8 ohm tap and get roughly double the wattage IF the amp can handle it. Otherwise the amp will go into a protect mode or damage itself. If an amp is not rated for a 4 ohm load, your rolling the dice presenting it one. I had a miserable experience trying to get a home built sub to work with 2-12" drivers. I thought the Parasound amp I was using was bad since it would power itself off randomly. Spent money to replace it with a Dayton sub amp only to have it do the same thing. Turns out the friend who built it didn't really pay attention to the driver rating of 4 ohm with 2 ohm dips. Wired the drivers in series and all is well. Too bad he didn't find that out until after I had shelled out money for amp #2.
Edited by jeahrens - 1/10/14 at 8:43am
post #15925 of 17966
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeahrens View Post

You can plug a 4 ohm speaker into an 8 ohm tap and get roughly double the wattage IF the amp can handle it. Otherwise the amp will go into a protect mode or damage itself. If an amp is not rated for a 4 ohm load, your rolling the dice presenting it one. I had a miserable experience trying to get a home built sub to work with 2-12" drivers. I thought the Parasound amp I was using was bad since it would power itself off randomly. Spent money to replace it with a Dayton sub amp only to have it do the same thing. Turns out the friend who built it didn't really pay attention to the driver rating or 4 ohm with 2 ohm dips. Wired the drivers in series and all is well. Too bad he didn't find that out until after I had shelled out money for amp #2.

Wow.

So I suppose the question is, if the McIntosh amp is a "450WPC" amp, can it handle 900WPC into 4 ohms or 2 ohms?

What is the "official" stand as far as warranty goes? biggrin.gif

If you plug a 2 ohms speaker into the 8 ohms tap and your McIntosh dies, will that void the warranty?
post #15926 of 17966
If they can prove you plugged in an out of spec load, I would imagine it would void the warranty.
post #15927 of 17966
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeahrens View Post

If they can prove you plugged in an out of spec load, I would imagine it would void the warranty.

True. biggrin.gif

I do think McIntosh amps look very pretty. biggrin.gif
Edited by AcuDefTechGuy - 1/10/14 at 9:56am
post #15928 of 17966
Quote:
Originally Posted by abedirov View Post

They are DM 620. I have them and use them now as rear channel speakers. I bought them about 20 years ago in London for 300 pounds. No idea what they would be worth now. They were best buys then and top floorstanders of the 600 series at that time. Wonderfull speakers, still work and sound amazing!
Hey! Thanks for that input!! I actually ended up getting them for free with all the other stuff I bought, so I'm going to try them out for fun.
post #15929 of 17966
Quote:
Originally Posted by AcuDefTechGuy View Post

Wow.

So I suppose the question is, if the McIntosh amp is a "450WPC" amp, can it handle 900WPC into 4 ohms or 2 ohms?

What is the "official" stand as far as warranty goes? biggrin.gif

If you plug a 2 ohms speaker into the 8 ohms tap and your McIntosh dies, will that void the warranty?

not sure what the official McIntosh response to this is but I do know that people are always encouraged to experiment with different taps and their speakers. I also know people who drive two sets of speakers at the same time from one amp by plugging into two different taps. My understanding is that McIntosh amps are probably about as stable as one can buy so they can handle a lot of "abuse" so to speak... If weight is any indication, my MC452 is approximately 110 pounds...
post #15930 of 17966
Was B&W at CES 2014?
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