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The OFFICIAL Pioneer PRO-FHD1 Elite 50'' 1080p Plasma - OWNERS THREAD - Page 3

post #61 of 2023
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by redspectral View Post

Any of you thinking of ordering the player? I think I am leaning towards getting it. It is hard as I was also considering the Toshiba XA2. What do you guys think?

Hi Red,
I am considering the Pio Blu-Ray also. I was able to get an HD-DVD player (add-on) for my Xbox 360 for $149 and have been using that so far.
post #62 of 2023
Quote:
Originally Posted by umr View Post

Here is the data for that display. They all vary to some extent.

wow, thanks umr for providing those results...
post #63 of 2023
Quote:
Originally Posted by JFR0317 View Post

BenDover - all of the adjustments to my set were made from the user-accessible menu. The service menu was not accessed.

I don't have any problem with sharing my parameter settings if Jeff Meier is OK with that, but since he gets paid for his services, I think that should be up to him whether or not they should be posted. Hope you understand.

Glad to answer any other questions anyone may have.

i agree wholeheartedly...i tried to be clear that even if you were to post your settings, or even D-Nice's settings for that matter, each set is different/unique and the chance that the settings can be used on a number of sets to provide the same results are very slim...

what umr provided was great...i was mostly interested in the pre/post results to see how good the set was right from the factory.
post #64 of 2023
Quote:
Originally Posted by BenDover View Post

i agree wholeheartedly...i tried to be clear that even if you were to post your settings, or even D-Nice's settings for that matter, each set is different/unique and the chance that the settings can be used on a number of sets to provide the same results are very slim...

what umr provided was great...i was mostly interested in the pre/post results to see how good the set was right from the factory.

Those pre settings are from my posted settings. They are not OOTB settings. Also the only major contributor between calibrated sets is room ambient lighting. You will never get a ISF calibrator who makes a living off of calibrations to admit that, but it's the truth.

Also keep in mind that I never posted exact ISF settings....only a "visual" variance of them. If you really look at the pre numbers, they are really close to the post calibration numbers. Not bad for "not exactly ISF" settings.
post #65 of 2023
D-nice is correct. The initial measurements were not those of an "out-of-the-box" set. I've had the set since September and initially used D-nice's seetings as a starting point for my own tweakings, which only involved some minor playing with Contrast, Brightness, Sharpness, and Color.
post #66 of 2023
hmm, ok, i just presumed that when umr calibrated the set he started by selecting one of the ootb presets...

yes, the results pre and post were drastic but then i wouldn't have expected them to be that far off if starting from say the pro preset and some reasonable color temp.

i'm loving the picture right now ootb i'm very happy that at my seating distance(s) i cannot see any pixel structure...that had always concerned me about flat panels.

btw, re buzzing, at my seating distance i cannot discern any buzz over any other noise that might already be present (e.g., my SA8300HD DVR's hard drive). if i get up very close and put my ear over the top right i can hear the buzzing, but imo and in my setup, it is really minimal.
post #67 of 2023
Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post

Those pre settings are from my posted settings. They are not OOTB settings. Also the only major contributor between calibrated sets is room ambient lighting. You will never get a ISF calibrator who makes a living off of calibrations to admit that, but it's the truth.

Also keep in mind that I never posted exact ISF settings....only a "visual" variance of them. If you really look at the pre numbers, they are really close to the post calibration numbers. Not bad for "not exactly ISF" settings.

You are totally wrong, but that is not something you would believe from me anyway. If what you are saying was true your values would have been much more correct. A delta E error of 9 is not that good.

The pre calibration measurements were not all that close either. The gamma and contrast ratio were pretty horrible. The gray scale was also messed up by poor gamut and secondary calibration. The OTB picture was not horrible, but it was not that close either.
post #68 of 2023
Jeff Meier, in your professional opinion, can an ISF calibrator of your abilty, calibrate a Blue Ray Player like the Pioneer Elite and blend it with the FHD1 for MAXIMUM results of accrate picture reproduction??
post #69 of 2023
Quote:


but that is not something you would believe from me anyway.

From you, hell no. Any reputable calibrator, that's another story.

Quote:


You are totally wrong, but that is not something you would believe from me anyway. If what you are saying was true your values would have been much more correct. A delta E error of 9 is not that good.

The pre calibration measurements were not all that close either. The gamma and contrast ratio were pretty horrible. The gray scale was also messed up by poor gamut and secondary calibration. The OTB picture was not horrible, but it was not that close either.

What exactly am I wrong about? I know you do not disagree that ambient light affects calibration. If you do, then I have truly lost all respect for you and your personal business (well.....what little respect I do have for you....personally).

You can ridicule my settings if you want. However I suggest you reread my post. It specifically says that my settings are a visual reconstruction of my actual ISF settings. I challenge you to sit in front of 2 Pioneer Elite plasmas (one with your post calibration settings and one with my posted settings) and tell me you can see a visual difference. Also, your client changed some of the values from my original posted settings (of which I encourage as one should make their panel pleasing to their eyes). I guess you did not see that post.

Just an FYI....

I created my settings to give owners the feel of ISF calibration without having to fork out $$$ for a full blown calibration. I have never said that my settings are better or exactly what you can achieve with ISF calibration.

U...MR
I have no intention on taking this thread off course of it's objective. I will be more than happy to discuss our differences and your practices offline. If you are game, let me know.
post #70 of 2023
Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post

From you, hell no. Any reputable calibrator, that's another story.


What exactly am I wrong about? I know you do not disagree that ambient light affects calibration. If you do, then I have truly lost all respect for you and your personal business (well.....what little respect I do have for you....personally).

You can ridicule my settings if you want. However I suggest you reread my post. It specifically says that my settings are a visual reconstruction of my actual ISF settings. I challenge you to sit in front of 2 Pioneer Elite plasmas (one with your post calibration settings and one with my posted settings) and tell me you can see a visual difference. Also, your client changed some of the values from my original posted settings (of which I encourage as one should make their panel pleasing to their eyes). I guess you did not see that post.

Just an FYI....

I created my settings to give owners the feel of ISF calibration without having to fork out $$$ for a full blown calibration. I have never said that my settings are better or exactly what you can achieve with ISF calibration.

U...MR
I have no intention on taking this thread off course of it's objective. I will be more than happy to discuss our differences and your practices offline. If you are game, let me know.

D-nice and Jeff keep on talking on this fourm, dont go offline, this concerns the FHD1 calibaration that all of us owners and potential owners will need.

The issue here is "to Calibarate or not to Calibarate using ISF on the FHD1". Guys we are owners of the "Best of the Best" and this set deserves to be Tuned up to its fullest capablities. Lets not foget one thing: if have use it .

I dont know a damm thing about calibration and thanks to D-Nice and fellow fourm members we have a chance. But I believe that there is a new player in the deck and that is the upcoming hd-dvd hi-def calibration disc coming from Gatry Reber on Jan 30,2007 for something like 25 bucks on Amazon etc.

I can get a "Free" hd-dvd player and hd-def disc for the price of a ISF calibartor.
One advantage is that I will also be able to calibarate and recalbreate my FHD1
over and over again thru time. When ISF LEAVES it OVER unless you want to get him back at a "reduced Price". I do not like that. Hell if you power goes out and all the setting are lost what the @#@# are you going to do.
I am waiting for the disc which will be here in less than 60 days...and I will be pissed off if I pay a calibartor and I cannot see a difference.

Guys, you know I am not a "cheapo" but I am very very suspious on this issue
and am I justifed given the above discussion to wait??
post #71 of 2023
Quote:


D-nice and Jeff keep on talking on this fourm, dont go offline, this concerns the FHD1 calibaration that all of us owners and potential owners will need.

The issue here is "to Calibarate or not to Calibarate using ISF on the FHD1". Guys we are owners of the "Best of the Best" and this set deserves to be Tuned up to its fullest capablities. Lets not foget one thing: if have use it .

I dont know a damm thing about calibration and thanks to D-Nice and fellow fourm members we have a chance. But I believe that there is a new player in the deck and that is the upcoming hd-dvd hi-def calibration disc coming from Gatry Reber on Jan 30,2007 for something like 25 bucks on Amazon etc.

I can get a "Free" hd-dvd player and hd-def disc for the price of a ISF calibartor.
One advantage is that I will also be able to calibarate and recalbreate my FHD1
over and over again thru time. When ISF LEAVES it OVER unless you want to get him back at a "reduced Price". I do not like that. Hell if you power goes out and all the setting are lost what the @#@# are you going to do.
I am waiting for the disc which will be here in less than 60 days...and I will be pissed off if I pay a calibartor and I cannot see a difference.

Guys, you know I am not a "cheapo" but I am very very suspious on this issue
and am I justifed given the above discussion to wait??

The challenges Jeff and I have have nothing to do with your "to Calibrate or not to Calibrate using ISF on the FHD1" quote. Our apparent challenges are things that should be dealt with offline. If you want the absolute best out of your FHD-1, go for ISF calibration. If you want the next best thing, you have other options.

I am also ecstatic over the HD DVD DVE release. However you will need more than just the disc and the provided color lense to get the absolute best from your FHD-1. That's where ISF calibration comes in. And you will have to have ISF calibration done at least once a year to keep it looking it's absolute best.
post #72 of 2023
D-Nice based upon your experience is it WORTH the bucks for the ISF or should I wait till the DVE release comes out...this is digitial hi-def so should not the calibaration disc be better than the last one(which was pretty good) .
post #73 of 2023
Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post

The challenges Jeff and I have have nothing to do with your "to Calibrate or not to Calibrate using ISF on the FHD1" quote. Our apparent challenges are things that should be dealt with offline. If you want the absolute best out of your FHD-1, go for ISF calibration. If you want the next best thing, you have other options.

I am also ecstatic over the HD DVD DVE release. However you will need more than just the disc and the provided color lense to get the absolute best from your FHD-1. That's where ISF calibration comes in. And you will have to have ISF calibration done at least once a year to keep it looking it's absolute best.

Once a year to keep it looking its absolute best ? Well, I guess I will have to live with second best. As per Tweeter, they have an ISF calibrator that can calibrate the set for $200. For $200, I can personally live with having the set calibrated once every two - three years.
post #74 of 2023
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pinkus View Post

Once a year to keep it looking its absolute best ? Well, I guess I will have to live with second best. As per Tweeter, they have an ISF calibrator that can calibrate the set for $200. For $200, I can personally live with having the set calibrated once every two - three years.

200 bucks I can live with, are you located in SOCAL..where is the$200 ISF calibarator
post #75 of 2023
For what it's worth (i.e., nothing), I believe that the money I spent for my calibration was worth it. I had a pleasing image with straight "D-Nice settings," also with my only very slightly tweaked version of that, and as well with my calibrated settings. I prefer the image I now get. Obviously, it's somewhat personal and subjective what looks good to a given individual. If nothing else, it was well worth it to me to be able to see the effects of subtle setting changes and how they impacted the image as well as to be able to witness exactly what an almost flat 6500K gray scale looks like.

To everyone, thanks for your participation. Let's remember that the reason we're here is that we all want to achieve the best image and to help others do so. There doesn't have to be just one path to that goal.
post #76 of 2023
IMPORTANT ANNOUNCEMENT

HDMI 1.3 UPGRADE FOR THE FHD1

Please go blueray players section of this fourm. Go to the thread "Pioneer BDP-HD1-just bought one. Go to posts #155 "I just called Pioneer...they said the pro-fhd1 has HDMi 1.2 but there will be a firmware upgrade next year next year which will be installed thru rs-232 port next year"

WOW!!!!!
post #77 of 2023
JFR0317,

Thanks for your incite and review of your ISF calibration. Now go watch the jaw-dropping image
post #78 of 2023
Thanks, D-Nice. That's just what I'm doing (well, somewhat multitasking, obviously).

bladerunner7, I saw that post, but I thought you need a specific chip to provide HDMI 1.3 functionality. Hope the Pioneer rep who provided the info was right, but I'm not optimistic. Without any "True Color" sources on the immediate horizon, lack of 1.3 may not be a great loss from a video-only perspective, at least for a while.
post #79 of 2023
Quote:
Originally Posted by bladerunner7 View Post

IMPORTANT ANNOUNCEMENT

HDMI 1.3 UPGRADE FOR THE FHD1

Please go blueray players section of this fourm. Go to the thread "Pioneer BDP-HD1-just bought one. Go to posts #155 "I just called Pioneer...they said the pro-fhd1 has HDMi 1.2 but there will be a firmware upgrade next year next year which will be installed thru rs-232 port next year"

WOW!!!!!

As per my user's manual, the PROFHD-1 has HDMI 1.1. Where are you getting the 1.2 from ?

Also as for the $200 calibrator, I live in Tampa, Fl. The salesman was trying to sell me the FHD-1, and any comments he made about the $200 calibration might be motivated by him wanting to make the sale.
post #80 of 2023
I have a quick question. I'm considering buying this set, but I have some reservations about hooking my Xbox 360, PS3 and Wii up to it. It's been a while since I've been in the market for a TV and last time I looked at plasmas, gaming consoles were a no-no. Please advise how appropriate this TV would be for gaming (I'm not worried about the Blu-Ray or HD-DVD playback). I just wasn't sure about 'burn in' and I looked through all the posts on this thread, but didn't see anything along these lines regarding gaming.

THANKS in advance!

Also, am I correct in assuming that this is just a monitor (i.e. no TV speakers included in the unit)? From reading a description off an online store, that's the impression I got.
post #81 of 2023
Quote:
Originally Posted by Irunnoft View Post

I have a quick question. I'm considering buying this set, but I have some reservations about hooking my Xbox 360, PS3 and Wii up to it. It's been a while since I've been in the market for a TV and last time I looked at plasmas, gaming consoles were a no-no. Please advise how appropriate this TV would be for gaming (I'm not worried about the Blu-Ray or HD-DVD playback). I just wasn't sure about 'burn in' and I looked through all the posts on this thread, but didn't see anything along these lines regarding gaming.

THANKS in advance!

Also, am I correct in assuming that this is just a monitor (i.e. no TV speakers included in the unit)? From reading a description off an online store, that's the impression I got.

it has bulit in plugs for speakers and outputs 15 watts each, you need to get the speakers to plug into the fhd1. After 200 hours of inital burn in or 100 hours "safe and sane" game use should not be a problem, espeically hi-defwhich uses the whole screen
post #82 of 2023
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pinkus View Post

As per my user's manual, the PROFHD-1 has HDMI 1.1. Where are you getting the 1.2 from ?

Also as for the $200 calibrator, I live in Tampa, Fl. The salesman was trying to sell me the FHD-1, and any comments he made about the $200 calibration might be motivated by him wanting to make the sale.

I am just relating what post #155 had said in his conversation with the pioneer rep on the br players fourm. I hope its true. As you know I am still renting(not buying) hd-dvd untill the pioneer player comes out..for "dead format" the Mummy just plan kicks ass...I will buy it the day it comes out in BR next year. Some movies really shine on HD-DVD, and this one does especially try it, you will like it.
post #83 of 2023
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pinkus View Post

...as for the $200 calibrator, I live in Tampa, Fl. The salesman was trying to sell me the FHD-1, and any comments he made about the $200 calibration might be motivated by him wanting to make the sale.

HI Pinkus,
I was told by a calibrator that because the PRO FHD1 has built-in ISF CCC Video Calibration that with the proper equipment an ISF calibrator can plug in to the rear serial port and the system and software can perform the calibration completely automated in about a 5 minute visit. Of course, a good calibrator would probably make adjustments beyond that...but I would not expect much additional beyond the automated calibration for the $200 price.
post #84 of 2023
You may want to do a search on "ISF CCC" to get further pros and cons. Not making any sort of value judgement - just encouraging you to do some further research.
post #85 of 2023
Afeter reading bladerunner's comment on another post re: HDMI 1.2 to 1.3 upgarde. I just called Pioneer and flat out asked them what version of HDMI the FHD1 has, he told me 1.2. When asked about the upgrade, he didn't know.
post #86 of 2023
Quote:
Originally Posted by ckelly33 View Post

Afeter reading bladerunner's comment on another post re: HDMI 1.2 to 1.3 upgarde. I just called Pioneer and flat out asked them what version of HDMI the FHD1 has, he told me 1.2. When asked about the upgrade, he didn't know.

If you read the thread its confusing, according to other fourm members the manuel says it accepts 1.1 and now they say 1.2 with an software upgrade to 1.3 on the fhd1 next year. WHO knows but some of 1.2 might be upgreadeable to 1.3.
Thanks for call pioneer as there is a lot of misinformation, especially on the upcoming pioneer player. If anybody has any sources could you please find out if the FHD1 can be updated in any way and if there any plans to do so in the future.
Look we have the "best of the best" right now and I am looking forward to the brother-sister hookup of the FHd1 and the Pioneer BR player, Since the beginning at CES these two have been teamed up. Get ready for the ride of our hometheater lifetime
post #87 of 2023
Just read the review of the "hulk" on hd-dvd on hidefdigest.com. Seems like they gave it 5 stars so if you have a hd-dvd player this might be the "one to get" to demo out the FHD1 to your friends. A minor victory for HDead-DVd according to the digitialbits as Universal is still going hd exclusive as of now, prediction it wont by June of next year. Still have not heard from anybody on updates for the FHd1 so let me know.
post #88 of 2023
Quote:
Originally Posted by bladerunner7 View Post

Just read the review of the "hulk" on hd-dvd on hidefdigest.com. Seems like they gave it 5 stars so if you have a hd-dvd player this might be the "one to get" to demo out the FHD1 to your friends. A minor victory for HDead-DVd according to the digitialbits as Universal is still going hd exclusive as of now, prediction it wont by June of next year. Still have not heard from anybody on updates for the FHd1 so let me know.

can we keep the format war out of this owner's thread as there are no doubt going to be owners on either side of that battlefield and that will not foster an "owner" community...that coupled with your repeated "best of the best" makes for a tense environment

as for hdmi, the manual says 1.1; i've scoured pio's site and there is no mention of 1.2 for the fhd1...short of seeing the innards of the set, i tend to believe the panel simply employs 1.1...which is perfectly fine...i don't need anything more than that.

TIA
post #89 of 2023
Quote:
Originally Posted by BenDover View Post

can we keep the format war out of this owner's thread as there are no doubt going to be owners on either side of that battlefield and that will not foster an "owner" community...that coupled with your repeated "best of the best" makes for a tense environment

as for hdmi, the manual says 1.1; i've scoured pio's site and there is no mention of 1.2 for the fhd1...short of seeing the innards of the set, i tend to believe the panel simply employs 1.1...which is perfectly fine...i don't need anything more than that.

TIA

2 things: no format war here as the war was over last month with the release of the PS3 and the list of hi-def releases to 2007, it will become apparent to everybody after CES with the lack of hardware support and software for HDead-Dvd. The material we play on the FHD1 becasue of the "high quality nature" of our monitor is fair game on this thead. The major purpose I bought the FHD1 was to see KILLER hi-def movies at it finest and there are times when "credit " is due to a superior release. I tip my hat to hd-dvd and the "hulk" for a great job done. In fact after reading this review I will order it on my "rental" list from Blockbuster.
In reality Hi-Def DVD is going to be the best we are going to get for the near future until cable catchs up. It ok with me as I love to have my "Jaw Dropped" on the FHD1...we did Pay so expect to Play.
I have not once mentioned the work KIN..... on this fourm. If my opinion is that the FHD1 is the finest available today...I will so speak that...whether or not it creates a "Tense Enviorment". If I cannot take the heat then I will get out of the kitchen. A fourm is for statements of fact/opinion, but remember what I said in a prior post " If you Own it, then you KNOW it....you get my drift
post #90 of 2023
Quote:
Originally Posted by bladerunner7 View Post

2 things: no format war here as the war was over last month with the release of the PS3 and the list of hi-def releases to 2007, it will become apparent to everybody after CES with the lack of hardware support and software for HDead-Dvd. The material we play on the FHD1 becasue of the "high quality nature" of our monitor is fair game on this thead. The major purpose I bought the FHD1 was to see KILLER hi-def movies at it finest and there are times when "credit " is due to a superior release. I tip my hat to hd-dvd and the "hulk" for a great job done. In fact after reading this review I will order it on my "rental" list from Blockbuster.
In reality Hi-Def DVD is going to be the best we are going to get for the near future until cable catchs up. It ok with me as I love to have my "Jaw Dropped" on the FHD1...we did Pay so expect to Play.
I have not once mentioned the work KIN..... on this fourm. If my opinion is that the FHD1 is the finest available today...I will so speak that...whether or not it creates a "Tense Enviorment". If I cannot take the heat then I will get out of the kitchen. A fourm is for statements of fact/opinion, but remember what I said in a prior post " If you Own it, then you Know it....you get my drift

*sigh*
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