Purple Snakes, Magenta Banding on Panasonic Plasmas - Page 23

I just want to reiterate that staring at some color tinges in test patterns is not going to reveal the problem nor is it indication that every Panny plasma has this problem. I don't think any plasma or LCD will show a graduated grayscale ramp without some color leakage. But we don't watch test patterns.

The problem is the "purple-ization" on the edges of "false contours" in actual program material. Almost any plasma will show some posterizing / false contouring in color gradiations, especially with bad source material like SD DVD or compressed cable. It's when this posterizing becomes obvious, distracting "purple snakes" or "fizzing purple ants" obviously visible from your seating position that it is a problem worthy of replacement/repair.

Again, minor color leakage in a grayscale ramp when you are staring at the screen from 1-2 ft away, dithering/dancing pixels in dark areas, false contouring / banding... these are all "normal" artifacts of these digital displays.

For the most part I would tend to agree with you. Where I disagree is that, at least in my situation, I can see definite purple from 10'-15' away when transitioning on color gradients. This is directly due to the gray scale issue and is separate from the SD/HD and content discussion.

If I watch B/W SD content that is transmitted w/o purple in it then I should expect it to not have massive amounts of purple added by the set. Again, when new my set did not show a problem anywhere near this severe and that, at least to me, is the real issue. Likewise, watching HD content and having a wrong color displayed is not a content issue - it's an issue with the set. Spending $3K on a set that can't remain somewhat calibrated after 1500-2000 hours of use is ridiculous. If the set could be calibrated via the service menus to virtually eliminate the problem that would be fine with me. However I don't think I should have to shell out another chunk of change to have it resolved.

All that said, 99.9% of the time my set has a gorgeous image on it. But once you know the problem is there it severely detracts from the experience.

Oh yeah, the other way to get rid of the problem is pretty much to return the set to any of the factory settings. Needless to say, that's a less than ideal solution.

I would say approximately 300 hours on them each.

Witnessing the problem on 2 other sets is enough to convince me that they all suffer this problem.


What exactly do you mean by this? I get the problem in all of the default picture modes. Or do you mean performing a factory reset in the menu fixes the problem?

I don't think that Panasonic is the only one with this issue, I've seen LG's and Pioneers show the purple snakes to a lesser degree. Maybe it's a plasma thing?

That's what I was trying to say above. In part -- color leakage, dithering, false contouring -- these types of problems are just endemic to plasma displays to a certain degree

However, the extreme "purple snake" issue is not normal behavior. That's why I was trying to clarify...

There is no question about it for me, either, because my experience between the two is opposite yours. My PZ85U must just be defective out-of-box, or I just happened to have an unusually good PX77U. I am glad you are pleased with your PZ85U.

If only it were that black and white! It starts non-existent, then pops up after maybe less than 1000 hours of use (and maybe just out of warranty), then just gets more and more severe. Panasonic claimed the issue was resolved with a firmware tweek in the latter 6-series, but it is clear now that is bogus. Firmware programming doesn't "drift" with age! My guess is that any firmware tweek simply masks or delays the more grossly visible manifestations of the problem to more safely (for Panasonic) fall outside of their one year warranty.

I'm going to take a look at my "fixed" tv before I take it home tomorrow. I'm willing to bet a grand that it's not fixed at all.

so I went to the shop and seen mine today, and it was a mess. They installed a P board...whatever that is, and it's horrible. Major noise, even in the tv menu's, and purple snakes everywhere.

I have no idea what they are going to do next.

Sorry, but not surprised, to hear the "fix" didn't work. Glad I didn't bet you, then! I'm a little gun shy on betting big lately, as I bet $1800 on a Panasonic plasma, and lost. A time ago, to try to resolve customers purple snakes, Panasonic began replacing certain boards with updated firmware. People reported various levels of success in reducing the purple snakes, but they also noted increased noise and poorer overall picture quality. I can't help but think this new firmware "solution" has found it's way into my PZ85U, because the PQ on SD material is much grainier and noisier than my PX77U that developed the purple snakes. You won't notice it on HD source. I guess Panasonic thinks everyone watches Blu-ray and other HD 100% of the time now, so no need to engineer decent SD reproduction any longer. God forbid one might actually own SD DVD's. Unfortunately, it seems this is Panasonic's solution, for both new plasmas and "older" plasmas beginning to exhibit purple snakes.

are you sure the difference you are seeing between your old 720p set, and now the 1080p set is not just simply the resolution showing more of the artifacts and noise that SD has?

I ask because before I had my 50pz80, my 42" Panny, also 720p was my primary set. It was technically only 1024x720 res though. It looked great for SD content , and sure enough my newer 50pz80 looks worse then my old 42" did with SD content. But that's exactly how it should be. I also have a LCD 1080p and it looks bad bad bad with SD, almost unwatchable really.

A 1080p set just has to scale the SD content too much for it too look great. Whereas a 720p set doesn't have to much at all and you don't see as much artifacting and noise on it.

Even on my new 50pz80, I can see noise on HD content from TV sources, but you know what, I see it on my LCD as well also at 1080p. Some stuff just has some noise to it.

Regardless, none of this has anything to do with purple snakes though.

I'm not sure how a software update is supposed to fix this either. Like you said, software doesn't change or degrade with age. They are obviously masking the issue somehow, or tweaking voltages and such so it's not so obvious.

Although I don't claim to be an expert, I'm afraid that just doesn't make sense to me. It's not noise inherent on the SD DVD. It's bad enough that if it were, it would be visible even on a 480i TV! It's noise inherent on flat panel TV's. Some do better, some do worse. I don't think it has anything to do with upscaling, or 720p vs. 1080p. A 6 megapixel digital camera can yield clearer pictures than a 10 megapixel camera, because so much more goes into image quality than a pixel/line count, processing being a big one. Same with a flat panel TV. The online reviews nailed it on the head, too, about the PX85U being below average at SD reproduction.

You mention that your 50" 1080p TV looks worse on SD material than your 42" 1080i TV. Rather than blaming the inferior SD reproduction on it being 1080p, blame it instead on the fact that the screen is 8" bigger. Any material will look worse on a larger screen and/or sitting closer, as opposed to looking better on a smaller screen and/or further away.

I believe the reason SD looks better on the PX models is because they upscale 480i to 1080p first, then downscale to 768p. This extra step of scaling is supposed to smooth the image out more, due to all the extra averaging going on between adjacent pixels.

Personally I do notice SD looks better on the PX models than the PZ.

Also, the banding on my 50PX80A has gotten a little bit worse in the last week or so. On one test pattern in particular I am getting a band which I am 100% sure wasn't there a couple of weeks ago.

I'm apparently getting my TH-58PZ750U replaced under warranty due to the magenta color issues in the grayscale. I was asked to review what's available on the Panny web site and of course the only other set that's comparable and available is the 850U. All the new 58" product, including the TC-P58V10, will apparently be out sometime mid summer (August?) and feel I should wait for that if possible. My concern over getting the 850U is that it may be more likely to suffer the same malady whereas a 12G panel would seem less so.

I'd really like to avoid another warranty issue as I had with my 60U and now the 750U so I'm looking for other alternatives and suggestions. I know this might not be the best place to post this but I got no responses in the 12G thread.

you could ask for a refund and then wait it out.... when they offered to replace my 600U with a 700U I asked for a refund instead and bought myself an 11UK.

Thanks. That is one thing I've thought of but don't want to be w/o a set for that long. I also am trying to avoid buying a "temporary" one and then selling it. I thought I might get by with keeping the 750U until the V10 comes available.

One thing I have kicked around is getting a projector since I set up my media room to support the dual combo (plasma/projector) when I built it out. Though I'm not sure I could convince the wife that that's the way to go.

What a depressing thread. I got my 42" two years ago and noticed the problem right away. I figured it would go away once I calibrated. There weren't a ton of scenes where it was an issue, and I do most of my gaming and all my movie watching on a projector anyway, so time went by...

Finally calibrated and the problem was still there. These days I notice it more and more often; I was showing a friend the underground river area in Gears of War 2 the other day, which blew my mind on the projector, and it was ruined by the ridiculous purple ants/snakes/whatever you call them all over the background.

Decided to finally dig in and research and found this thread. Read the first ten pages (getting a good laugh out of that Elemental1 guy and his bizarre opposition to the idea that there could be a problem), then jumped to the end to see if there was a happy ending and see here we still are, three years later, with no fix.

Guess the TV will just have to be used solely for news and stuff in the background while I'm doing other things, until I can afford to buy a new (non-Panasonic) TV.

i highly advise anyone with this issue, with a warranty or not to pressure Panasonic into helping, call the concierge hotline asap. Most of us are getting screwed as they meaning Panasonic are trying to first get away with the excuses that it's not a widespread problem, or that the snakes are only during rare scenes and are "normal"

The issue effects Canada, USA, Europe/UK and Australia made TV's. Anyone with the ability to search using Google can find hundreds of threads on it, from all over the world, and on various forums.

I've been down this road before with another product, and a company that wouldn't stand behind a fault/defect, and once I threatened to sue, and got enough people together to show how serious the problem was, it was taken care of and we were all taken care of.

I'm serious, call Panasonic, complain asap. I'm suppose to hear more about my situation any day now.

any word on if the 2009 models are displaying these issues?

well, it took 24 months for my 42px60 to start doing it

My pz80 is only 3 months old, and besides a horrible buzz that irritates me to no end, no snakes....yet.

If anyone is reading this and doesn't have an extended warranty...get it. Although, I'm afraid in my case, I don't think it would have made a difference, as they are basically wanting to wash their hands of the issue and ignore me.

This has been going on now for 3 months for me. They have installed countless boards, most of which were either not the updated D boards, dead on arrival boards, then there was a P board ( Power supply maybe?). Anyways, get the call today, and the tech says it's no better with the updated D board, and Panasonic is saying, their done, not trying no more, end of story as far as they are concerned.

So, I went from a tv with purple snakes to them installing a few boards, made it worse, far worse ( even the tv's own menu's wouldn't display right), and then corrected the menu issue but the purple snakes remain, and now they want me to pay for a repair...but the tv looks like it did before when I called them on day one. So what exactly is it that I'm paying for? I even had to arrange the tv to be brought to their repair shop, and get it picked up.


3 months and still going and x amount of dollars later. Pathetic. Read between the lines, the problem can't be fixed and they know it. there's only one real solution, replace the tv.

Unless they somehow remedy my situation, I'm never buying Panasonic again. Never recommending it to anyone. I had my heart set on replacing my aging infocus with a newer panny front projector too....oh well, guess I'll get a Epson or something now. I have panasonic appliances, telephones, 2 plasma's, laptop (toughbook)......never again. My folks had a 50pz ordered for them to, I called today told them whats going on, and they cancelled the order.

I'm currently trying to find a way to get a hold of someone at Panasonic Corporate, or head of North American division that I can have a discussion with. I'm digging for info now but if someone knows of this info, please PM me.

I'm bored, pissed off - and have too much time on my hands as of late.



Ah yes, the infamous Panasonic purple snake. A strange and often shy creature. If you have bought a Plasma PDP, you can't expect to see this annoying little critter right away. No no no of course not. Due to its shyness, it often has to hide in your home for some time before showing it's face. Strangely, usually, right around when your Tv's warranty is up, they start appearing. they are funny like that. They seem to like dark area's, and can be seen on your tv dancing around those dark scenes. Once it appears, it quickly gets over it's shyness, and it'll mate with others, and you can see this glorious event expand before your very eyes and before you know it, you'll have more and more of the purple snakes in your home. Are you a victim of this infestation? What do you do? Who do you call? How do you get back that wonderful panny picture your supposed to have?

Honestly, You toss your overpriced Plasma TV in the garbage, because there is no fix.

Yes, I'm bitter. When I have a tech start BS'ing me and saying this is normal, it's insulting and I get pissed off.

Mine were visible right out of the box, and aren't so much prevalent in dark areas as gray-ish areas.

I feel your pain, and I'm right with you on never buying anything Panasonic again. Like I said before, I wouldn't even buy so much as a Panasonic toothpick, after my 50PX75U snaked out and they stuck me with a newer model with inferior picture quality, which in all likelihood will snake out too, since they claimed the problem was solved in the 6-series with a software tweek, but obviously it wasn't. Now I am faced with either selling my replacement TV before the snakes appear, or forever buying additional expensive extended warranty at $300 a year so Panasonic can keep replacing the TV when the snakes reappear. Pure BS.

I'm currently waiting on a replacement for my 58PZ750U. Panasonic has agreed to let me wait until the 58" V10 is available instead of taking an 850U but I'm now having second thoughts. I'd consider going to a Kuro but because of the killer deal I got on my Panny I'd still have to shell out a chunk of change to o to the Pioneer.

Custom mode is where you can set the settings to anything you desire. That is the sole mode I ever used on my 75U, and the purple snakes showed up in custom mode just fine. I guess it depends on what settings you use within custom mode. I had mine set pretty conservative and dim, for viewing films in a dark room.

Are you saying Panasonic has given you the option of taking a refund? The Panasonic concierge, Anthony, literally laughed in my face on the phone and halted further discussion when I told him I wanted a refund. Panasonic deemed the 75U irrepairable and sent a replacement TV to the shop without even consulting with me regarding what size or model I might like them to replace it with. You are lucky, in that respect.

The concierge people won't be making any refund decisions. For that you need to speak with people that have the power to carry it out. In my specific case they haven't said as such but I'm pretty sure I could get a refund as I've been dealing with some pretty senior individuals and my problem, like many others, has dragged on for quite some time. The longer it drags out the worse it looks on their statistics so a refund is another way to close the books on the problem. I'll probably wait until first reviews of the V10s show up before deciding what to do.

The only real issue for me at this point is how much of a gamble would I be taking if I were to get a V10 and the problem were to still show up down the road? One would hope that Panny has finally figured out what is going on here yet it seems they may not do sufficient life testing - which is a bit hard to believe. I'm a bit old school and don't think a $3K display should be considered "disposable" after only 1-2 years so that's where my dilemma comes from.

Yes, the concierge people don't have the power to do anything really, they are just 1st-level customer support and are (depending on the individual) only partially informed on any given issue.

The key is to get a field service rep to personally come visit and witness the problem. For me, he was the guy who walked in, took one look, and then had the authority to sign off on the replace/refund process.

If you read back through this thread and see the experiences of those of us 60/600 series owners who ended getting replacements or refunds, you will see this as a common theme.