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*** The Official APERION Thread *** - Page 180

post #5371 of 6860
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post #5372 of 6860
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hicks View Post

I've seen it happen before with the 5C and Denons, there's a little dip around 150 that makes Audyssey think it's rolling off. So yeah there's nothing really wrong, just go in there and change the crossover back to 80 Hz.

My only hesitation in manually dropping the xover is that the Audyssey folks recommend against doing so because Audyssey will only implement filters down to the measured -3dB point...

So basically, I'd have no correction applied for the 5C between 80Hz and the "measured" -3dB point... which is somewhere in the 120Hz-150Hz range...

Still... that option seems alot better than leaving it at 150Hz.
post #5373 of 6860
Jason,

Thanks for posting on the Aperion site!
post #5374 of 6860
Quote:
Originally Posted by alphaiii View Post

My only hesitation in manually dropping the xover is that the Audyssey folks recommend against doing so because Audyssey will only implement filters down to the measured -3dB point...

So basically, I'd have no correction applied for the 5C between 80Hz and the "measured" -3dB point... which is somewhere in the 120Hz-150Hz range...

Still... that option seems alot better than leaving it at 150Hz.

Try both and see which you like better.
post #5375 of 6860
Quote:
Originally Posted by lad578 View Post

I see a few new owners of VGT and I am really interested in your opinions. What would be helpfully especially for me are:

What speaker did you upgrade from?
How do they compare to your previous speaker(s)?
How much auditioning did you do (and what speakers) before jumping on VGT and what swayed you?

In essence, I am looking for good and close comparables for VGT.

I am quite impressed with the looks, build quality and what I really liked about the Verus series is the metal grille. I have little kids and like that protection from little pokey fingers. I currently have Infinity Beta 40 and it also has metal grille and sounds decent. But I am yearning for that next level of upgrade and hoping it will significant enough considering the price jump.

I know the best way to compare is to take them up on the 30 day risk free audition, but your opinions matters as well; I will eventually do this.

Sorry for the long post, and I appreciate your input .

Thanks all!

Bump...

Slow traffic days, Comments from new VGT owners is much appreciated
post #5376 of 6860
Well, I'm expecting the FedEx guy with my VGTx 2 and VGC on Tuesday, to replace part of an old SVS 5.1 S1 speaker set. I'll let you know. Keeping the rear S1s and the old SVS subwoofer for now.
post #5377 of 6860
Quote:
Originally Posted by lad578 View Post

Bump...

Slow traffic days, Comments from new VGT owners is much appreciated

I upgraded from Mirage OM9 & OMC2. I considered Paradigm studio, B&W ( the one in the magnolia shelves@best buy, monitor audio Rx6 etc). I was waiting for a Swan speaker ( M6005 series) , but they didn't release the center channel

Comparing my older mirages with the aperions, I'd say aperion has got much better details in the midrange . Although OMC2 is a very good center, but VGCs shows their class when you run them in low volume - you won't miss any dialogue . Both the fronts & center are a little forward sounding than the mirages , but not much - nothing close to the paradigm monitors.

I was also surprised how the center , being less sensitive than the fronts, held up on its own against the fronts ( without any bump in volume)

Mirage soundstage is much bigger though - but that's what they are famous for.

I am driving them with emo xpa-3s with denon 3311 acting as pre-amp. I didn't notice any listening fatigues so far.

Also, the speakers got may be 10 hours on them now. So, my observation may change after it gets 40+ hours on it
post #5378 of 6860
Quote:
Originally Posted by jaymalya View Post

I upgraded from Mirage OM9 & OMC2. I considered Paradigm studio, B&W ( the one in the magnolia shelves@best buy, monitor audio Rx6 etc). I was waiting for a Swan speaker ( M6005 series) , but they didn't release the center channel

Comparing my older mirages with the aperions, I'd say aperion has got much better details in the midrange . Although OMC2 is a very good center, but VGCs shows their class when you run them in low volume - you won't miss any dialogue . Both the fronts & center are a little forward sounding than the mirages , but not much - nothing close to the paradigm monitors.

I was also surprised how the center , being less sensitive than the fronts, held up on its own against the fronts ( without any bump in volume)

Mirage soundstage is much bigger though - but that's what they are famous for.

I am driving them with emo xpa-3s with denon 3311 acting as pre-amp. I didn't notice any listening fatigues so far.

Also, the speakers got may be 10 hours on them now. So, my observation may change after it gets 40+ hours on it

Thank you for your quick take; I am on the fence myself with regards to upgrade, kind of scared to do the 30 days trial, because I may love it so much to let them go

It is a big jump from my current 5.1 setup, the entire 5 speakers(Infinity Beta 40s, and Beta 10 series) is less than the cost of 1 VGT.
post #5379 of 6860
Jason,

Any upcoming/expected reviews of the Verus Forte/Grand lines in the works?
post #5380 of 6860
Quote:
Originally Posted by USAFChief View Post

Jason,

Any upcoming/expected reviews of the Verus Forte/Grand lines in the works?

Yes, the Sound + Vision review of a Forte system should be dropping in September.

And I think Home Theater Mag might be doing the Grand Tower too in addition to the Verus Grand Bookshelf and Verus Forte Satellite reviews that published recently.
post #5381 of 6860
Quote:
Originally Posted by lad578
I see a few new owners of VGT and I am really interested in your opinions. What would be helpfully especially for me are:

What speaker did you upgrade from?
How do they compare to your previous speaker(s)?
How much auditioning did you do (and what speakers) before jumping on VGT and what swayed you?

In essence, I am looking for good and close comparables for VGT.

I am quite impressed with the looks, build quality and what I really liked about the Verus series is the metal grille. I have little kids and like that protection from little pokey fingers. I currently have Infinity Beta 40 and it also has metal grille and sounds decent. But I am yearning for that next level of upgrade and hoping it will significant enough considering the price jump.

I know the best way to compare is to take them up on the 30 day risk free audition, but your opinions matters as well; I will eventually do this.

Sorry for the long post, and I appreciate your input .

Thanks all!




Well, partially in response to Lad578

I did not audition any other speakers.

I "upgraded" from an old SVS SV-01 5.1 system; the front and surrounds were "bookshelf" sized and mounted on the wall fairly high up. I kept the surrounds and the old subwoofer (somewhat on the advice of Aperion tech support believe it or not). I also spent some of the money I saved not upgrading completely by buying a Marantz 6005 (on sale now) to replace an old Yamaha 663 (I think), again on the advice partly of Aperion gurus. Everything just hooked up tonight, Audessey run and engaged with dynamic EQ on.

Popped in Bluray of 25th anniversary R&R Hall of Fame Concert at MSG; listened to Gimme Shelter, Pretty Woman, Legend of Tom Joad, and Fortunate Son. Even with zero/minimal breakin on the speakers, they sound much better. I also listened with the Yamaha receiver prior to hooking up the Marantz--I have to say that with limited listening the Marantz powered speakers really sounded better (regardless of DSP field, etc).

I am not an audiophile in any way, shape or form (I still need to figure out hot to set crossovers and gains I think to get more ooomph out of my subwoofer) but I really like what I hear so far.

Oh, as an aside, I tend to find the wife's disapproval correlates with how good/loud the music sounds/is played, and right now, she is righteously pissed. In fact, she has threatened no more birthday presents for me until I am 90. . . I am waiting until everybody else is at the neighborhood pool prior to popping in "Inception" Bluray.

Not sure if this is at all helpful, but there you have it. I would tend to go ahead and take the plunge, at least for the center and fronts. . .
post #5382 of 6860
Quote:
Originally Posted by rcoyne View Post

I tend to find the wife's disapproval correlates with how good/loud the music sounds/is played, and right now, she is righteously pissed.

This is an epic quote! Welcome to the Aperion family.
post #5383 of 6860
Aperion Verus Grands and the B&W 600 series (683s in the front and HTM61 for the center) are my finalists. What I'm wondering is how much of the $$ in the Aperion line is because of the nicer finish? My speakers are going to be in a dedicated HT room so frankly I don't care how they look. When I'm using them, the lights are out. If I'm going to get the same sound quality from either but save money because of the finish, then that's the way for me.

Your thoughts or opinions are welcome so I can make the plunge.
post #5384 of 6860
Quote:
Originally Posted by rick1969 View Post

Aperion Verus Grands and the B&W 600 series (683s in the front and HTM61 for the center) are my finalists. What I'm wondering is how much of the $$ in the Aperion line is because of the nicer finish? My speakers are going to be in a dedicated HT room so frankly I don't care how they look. When I'm using them, the lights are out. If I'm going to get the same sound quality from either but save money because of the finish, then that's the way for me.

Your thoughts or opinions are welcome so I can make the plunge.

Honestly if the finish has nothing to do with your decision, I would not look at Aperion or B&W.

In a dedicated room I would check out Chase Home Theater. Mark Seaton, JTR, Triad, etc.
post #5385 of 6860
Quote:
Originally Posted by rick1969 View Post

What I'm wondering is how much of the $$ in the Aperion line is because of the nicer finish?

Or you can ask yourself how much $$ you save in buying direct from Aperion, with no advertisement fee, dealer markup and show room cost.

Also, even if a nice finish does not contribute to the sound quality, it still matters in resale value.
post #5386 of 6860
Quote:
Originally Posted by brian6751 View Post

Honestly if the finish has nothing to do with your decision, I would not look at Aperion or B&W.

In a dedicated room I would check out Chase Home Theater. Mark Seaton, JTR, Triad, etc.

oh good grief. Now more research.

I do have a budget to maintain. Off I go.
post #5387 of 6860
Quote:
Originally Posted by rick1969 View Post


oh good grief. Now more research.

I do have a budget to maintain. Off I go.

Yeah sorry. I would also check out Klipsch's reference series and above. Chase is very reasonable too.
post #5388 of 6860
Quote:
Originally Posted by rcoyne View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by lad578
I see a few new owners of VGT and I am really interested in your opinions. What would be helpfully especially for me are:

What speaker did you upgrade from?
How do they compare to your previous speaker(s)?
How much auditioning did you do (and what speakers) before jumping on VGT and what swayed you?

In essence, I am looking for good and close comparables for VGT.

I am quite impressed with the looks, build quality and what I really liked about the Verus series is the metal grille. I have little kids and like that protection from little pokey fingers. I currently have Infinity Beta 40 and it also has metal grille and sounds decent. But I am yearning for that next level of upgrade and hoping it will significant enough considering the price jump.

I know the best way to compare is to take them up on the 30 day risk free audition, but your opinions matters as well; I will eventually do this.

Sorry for the long post, and I appreciate your input .

Thanks all!




Well, partially in response to Lad578

I did not audition any other speakers.

I "upgraded" from an old SVS SV-01 5.1 system; the front and surrounds were "bookshelf" sized and mounted on the wall fairly high up. I kept the surrounds and the old subwoofer (somewhat on the advice of Aperion tech support believe it or not). I also spent some of the money I saved not upgrading completely by buying a Marantz 6005 (on sale now) to replace an old Yamaha 663 (I think), again on the advice partly of Aperion gurus. Everything just hooked up tonight, Audessey run and engaged with dynamic EQ on.

Popped in Bluray of 25th anniversary R&R Hall of Fame Concert at MSG; listened to Gimme Shelter, Pretty Woman, Legend of Tom Joad, and Fortunate Son. Even with zero/minimal breakin on the speakers, they sound much better. I also listened with the Yamaha receiver prior to hooking up the Marantz--I have to say that with limited listening the Marantz powered speakers really sounded better (regardless of DSP field, etc).

I am not an audiophile in any way, shape or form (I still need to figure out hot to set crossovers and gains I think to get more ooomph out of my subwoofer) but I really like what I hear so far.

Oh, as an aside, I tend to find the wife's disapproval correlates with how good/loud the music sounds/is played, and right now, she is righteously pissed. In fact, she has threatened no more birthday presents for me until I am 90. . . I am waiting until everybody else is at the neighborhood pool prior to popping in "Inception" Bluray.

Not sure if this is at all helpful, but there you have it. I would tend to go ahead and take the plunge, at least for the center and fronts. . .

That's hilarious on the wife - my wife doesn't get my obsession with speakers either - she hates bass or and would be perfectly happy with the noise coming out of a tv speaker

Thanks for your mini-review, looks like you're looking forward to some alone time with the speaker to see what they are made of.

Good luck and I appreciate your review.
post #5389 of 6860
Quote:
Originally Posted by kinmanc View Post

Or you can ask yourself how much $$ you save in buying direct from Aperion, with no advertisement fee, dealer markup and show room cost.

Aperion isn't the only ID company around... Others offer the same type of savings to the customer...

Quote:
Originally Posted by kinmanc View Post

Also, even if a nice finish does not contribute to the sound quality, it still matters in resale value.

Not necessarily...
post #5390 of 6860
Quote:
Originally Posted by alphaiii View Post

Aperion isn't the only ID company around... Others offer the same type of savings to the customer...



Not necessarily...



But it may matter if the speakers end up back in the family room when the HT gets the inevitable case of upgrade-itis. . .
post #5391 of 6860
Any 6T owners find that they sound better crossed over with a sub? Sounds boomy when I'm playing the full range so I cross them over at 80 with my sub. Am I missing something?
post #5392 of 6860
Quote:
Originally Posted by brian6751 View Post

Any 6T owners find that they sound better crossed over with a sub? Sounds boomy when I'm playing the full range so I cross them over at 80 with my sub. Am I missing something?

I can't speak for the 6T, but I do think that my Verus Grand towers sound a little better with the sub in play rather than making the towers do all the work. I think that may depend on how you're using the speakers though. Some styles of music may sound better with just the towers than others depending on how much they use the low end, and personal opinion is always a factor...
post #5393 of 6860
^^
My VGTs are crossed at 80 as well--seems to be the standard configuration for setups mostly dedicated to movies. But I like the sound of music this way as well especially since I have a nice sub (SVS PC13-Ultra, tuned to 16 hz). One other advantage is that you can probably get away with moving the towers a bit closer to the wall without adding a lot of boom. I had mine almost 2 feet out but have recently moved them closer and are now about 11 inches from the back wall. As you said, in the end it all comes down to personal preference--that all that really counts
post #5394 of 6860
Quote:
Originally Posted by disarm78 View Post

I can't speak for the 6T, but I do think that my Verus Grand towers sound a little better with the sub in play rather than making the towers do all the work. I think that may depend on how you're using the speakers though. Some styles of music may sound better with just the towers than others depending on how much they use the low end, and personal opinion is always a factor...

After playing around for the last few days, I agree. I am powering the speakers with a Marantz 6005 and have settled on the following personal observations, which obviously should be taken with a shakerful of salt:

1. Audessey on (dynamic eq.) uniformly seems to improve things
2. Crossover 60-80 hz to old SVS subwoofer seems to work nicely
3. Still undecided on stereo direct or various Dolby/THX modes--Music via the Ipod seems to sound best "pure direct" while rock (Pink Floyd, DSOTM, Wish You Were Here) and classical music (Bach Toccata and Fugue) via CDs (not SACD) played on an OPPO BDP 83 sound a little "weak" and tinny in pure direct (I don't know why) and sound better in the enhanced modes. Jazz/fusion (eg Mark O'Connor, "Heroes") sounds unbelievably good on the other hand as "pure direct"
4. For movies, How to Train Your Dragon was awesome, set Dolby PXII, with crossover 80 Hz!

I do note, as others have, that the speakers sound better at anything louder than -20dB reference. I only have about 10 hrs on the speakers so far, so probably too early to tell anything long-term
post #5395 of 6860
Quote:
Originally Posted by rcoyne View Post

But it may matter if the speakers end up back in the family room when the HT gets the inevitable case of upgrade-itis. . .

Very true...

No doubt Aperion's products have always been among the top in the WAF department...
post #5396 of 6860
Quote:
Originally Posted by rcoyne View Post


After playing around for the last few days, I agree. I am powering the speakers with a Marantz 6005 and have settled on the following personal observations, which obviously should be taken with a shakerful of salt:

1. Audessey on (dynamic eq.) uniformly seems to improve things
2. Crossover 60-80 hz to old SVS subwoofer seems to work nicely
3. Still undecided on stereo direct or various Dolby/THX modes--Music via the Ipod seems to sound best "pure direct" while rock (Pink Floyd, DSOTM, Wish You Were Here) and classical music (Bach Toccata and Fugue) via CDs (not SACD) played on an OPPO BDP 83 sound a little "weak" and tinny in pure direct (I don't know why) and sound better in the enhanced modes. Jazz/fusion (eg Mark O'Connor, "Heroes") sounds unbelievably good on the other hand as "pure direct"
4. For movies, How to Train Your Dragon was awesome, set Dolby PXII, with crossover 80 Hz!

I do note, as others have, that the speakers sound better at anything louder than -20dB reference. I only have about 10 hrs on the speakers so far, so probably too early to tell anything long-term

I have a marantz sr5005 and that is basically the same observation I have. Pure direct sounds thin and the bass is too low. Also, when there is bass the 6t can sound a bit boomy and one noted where as crossed over to the sub sounds much better. I'm wondering if maybe my room is the culprit an the sub is just in a better location to handle those frequencies. Although I have heard the same songs on pandora and on cd and it's the cd version that is boomy. Very strange.
post #5397 of 6860
Quote:
Originally Posted by brian6751 View Post

I have a marantz sr5005 and that is basically the same observation I have. Pure direct sounds thin and the bass is too low. Also, when there is bass the 6t can sound a bit boomy and one noted where as crossed over to the sub sounds much better. I'm wondering if maybe my room is the culprit an the sub is just in a better location to handle those frequencies. Although I have heard the same songs on pandora and on cd and it's the cd version that is boomy. Very strange.

I have the same observation with my previous & present speakers & receivers. pure direct mode seems to be thin . Also, using BDP-83 or my previous yamaha CDP's analog output, the volume seems to be lower than digital out. So, I am assuming these behaviors have nothing to do with speakers or AVRs.

One more thing , if you are using pure direct mode in stereo material , it won't use the sub, so any reduction in volume/boominess/bass may be natural
post #5398 of 6860
Hi,

I am looking to replace my Paradigm CC-290v5 center because it is rear ported and the performance is really bad since I placed it in a Furnitech cabinet that encloses it on three sides. I have it sitting on the floor now which isn't going to cut it long term.



My mains are a pair of vintage Paradigm Studio Monitors (bi-amped) hooked to an Onkyo TX-SR608 receiver.

I was looking to replace the center with a sealed or front ported center that can be in a cabinet and still perform well. I read other threads on here that pointed me to the Aperion 634-VAC but it is no longer for sale. I liked the idea of the voiceright crossover because of my need for in-cabinet placement.

Can anyone recommend the Aperion center that is going to perform in-cabinet well? I was hoping to spend $450 or less but am willing to move up a little higher if it will solve my problems. It also sounds like long term I will need to replace my mains to maintain a consistent and quality soundstage up front so you can see the cost can add up quickly.

Thanks!
Chad
post #5399 of 6860
Quote:
Originally Posted by shatter71 View Post

Hi,

I am looking to replace my Paradigm CC-290v5 center because it is rear ported and the performance is really bad since I placed it in a Furnitech cabinet that encloses it on three sides. I have it sitting on the floor now which isn't going to cut it long term.



My mains are a pair of vintage Paradigm Studio Monitors (bi-amped) hooked to an Onkyo TX-SR608 receiver.

I was looking to replace the center with a sealed or front ported center that can be in a cabinet and still perform well. I read other threads on here that pointed me to the Aperion 634-VAC but it is no longer for sale. I liked the idea of the voiceright crossover because of my need for in-cabinet placement.

Can anyone recommend the Aperion center that is going to perform in-cabinet well? I was hoping to spend $450 or less but am willing to move up a little higher if it will solve my problems. It also sounds like long term I will need to replace my mains to maintain a consistent and quality soundstage up front so you can see the cost can add up quickly.

Thanks!
Chad

The two I would recommend would be the Verus Forte or Grand Center...they are both sealed/enclosed. The Grand has a voice right phase correction switch to optimize bass response but also is very large and runs $700. The Forte comes in at $350, but being enclosed it does give you some additional placement options (i.e. in a cabinet). All the Verus line speakers are timbre matched.

The other thought would be to look for used on AudiogoN, etc. To be honest thought, the Aperion stuff does not show up much and when it does, it usually doesn' last long.
post #5400 of 6860
Quote:
Originally Posted by USAFChief View Post

The two I would recommend would be the Verus Forte or Grand Center...they are both sealed/enclosed. The Grand has a voice right phase correction switch to optimize bass response but also is very large and runs $700. The Forte comes in at $350, but being enclosed it does give you some additional placement options (i.e. in a cabinet). All the Verus line speakers are timbre matched.

The other thought would be to look for used on AudiogoN, etc. To be honest thought, the Aperion stuff does not show up much and when it does, it usually doesn' last long.

Just measure twice, buy once if trying to fit in your cabinet--the Aperion VGC is BIG!!
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