*** The Official APERION Thread *** - Page 186

Originally Posted by ser_renely

Ever seen any different colour finishes on the V.Grand?

Originally Posted by WhereToStart

When they did the finish change I asked about the Verus line and was told there was no planned changes to their finish choices.

Originally Posted by brian6751

I would imagine the 5 series is probably not going to stick around.

Originally Posted by alphaiii

While I'm glad to see the prices go down in the Intimus 4 series speakers, I honestly feel Aperion had to lower the pricing given the cutbacks in the products themselves.

With that savings, the customer loses the real wood veneer or gloss black, loses 5 years off the warranty, and gets thinner 15mm MDF cabinets... So gone are the nice finishes, 10 year warranty, and 3/4" HDF cabinets... I'm especially disappointed to see them switch to thinner, less dense cabinets - which actually makes me wonder, are the current website specs correct? The weights are the same as before... but no way the cabinets didn't get lighter going from 3/4" HDF to 15mm MDF.

Shame that manufacturing costs are going up the way they are, since on the consumer end, we either pay more for equivalent product, or get a lesser quality product.

Originally Posted by ser_renely

I Actually worded my last question wrong, but meant do they ever expect to have a couple of other colour selections for the grand? a dark mahogany or light coloured maple?

Originally Posted by dcg44s

I doubt it because they seem to be cutting back and simplifying on other products such as the subs and the Intimus 4 series.To add more finish options would add cost and complicate the manufacturing,inventory,ordering,etc.
They are a business though so if there were enough demand anything is possible.

Originally Posted by Hicks

The five series speakers will be released in the vinyl finishes in November, there are no plans to phase the five series out.

As for the thinner cabinets, I would mention that the four series has always been a 3/4" MDF, it was the 5 and 6 series that were HDF.

In any event we did revoice these speakers to take that into account and I think our speaker designer Ken did a great job, they sound nearly identical to their old Intimus counterparts to my ears and the measurements look great too. One advantage that they do have is that they are slightly more sensitive than the previous Intimus speakers.

Finally yes we did have to increase the cost of the VFTs recently, but I still think they offer a great value at $1090/pair and there are definitely no plans to raise any of the other Verus prices in the immediate future. !

Originally Posted by Hicks

Hey guys,

Sorry I wasn't around to address questions, I am working a new schedule where I'm doing 8am-7pm Pacific Mon-Thurs with Fridays off to try and help folks out that can't call us during our normal hours.

In any event, yes new Intimus is here although the quantity we got of the black finish was unfortunately quite limited and the 4Ts and 4Bs sold out over the weekend, but we do have a good amount in the cherry.

They are indeed a vinyl wrap, but I think the cherry in particular looks pretty convincing myself.

As alphaiii noted it was either raise prices or go this route due to increasing production costs. On top of that, I think that this will help differentiate the Verus and Intimus lines a bit better than before and help folks make their decision as to which are the right speakers for them.

For folks like dcg44s that were hoping to round a system I have good news, we will be getting one last shipment of all the four and five series speakers in the original high gloss black, except for the 5DBs, around 11/15. Those should be up on the site for pre-order in the next couple of weeks.

The five series speakers will be released in the vinyl finishes in November, there are no plans to phase the five series out.

As for the thinner cabinets, I would mention that the four series has always been a 3/4" MDF, it was the 5 and 6 series that were HDF.

In any event we did revoice these speakers to take that into account and I think our speaker designer Ken did a great job, they sound nearly identical to their old Intimus counterparts to my ears and the measurements look great too. One advantage that they do have is that they are slightly more sensitive than the previous Intimus speakers.

Finally yes we did have to increase the cost of the VFTs recently, but I still think they offer a great value at $1090/pair and there are definitely no plans to raise any of the other Verus prices in the immediate future.

Please let me know if you have any other questions and thanks for being a great group of people, I really appreciate those of you that reach out to help your fellow Aperions, that is what it is all about!

Originally Posted by zoetmb

That's all well and good, but IMO, if you change the design of a product, it should be given a new product name or number so that there is no confusion.

Originally Posted by alphaiii

So in going from 3/4" to 15mm MDF, you don't feel it compromised performance of the 4T in any way? Can you get into how they were voiced differently at all?

From measurements I've seen of the Intimus line, they generally have a shelved up treble... and my guess is that with thinner cabinets = more resonance, you'd get some more low midrange/upper bass coloration... so, again guessing, but I'd think the tweeter would be padded down a bit less to compensate, which would explain the slight increase in sensitivity... Or am I way off here? I'm by no means a speaker designer, but I do tend to read the DIY stuff, so maybe (or maybe not) I've learned a little...

Will there be a change in the 5 series as well, from 1" HDF to a thinner MDF?


Glad to hear there are no plans for price raises on the other Verus speakers... as mentioned, I want to go after those Grand Bookshelves at some point, and price raise certainly wouldn't be friendly to my budget.

Coloration from the cabinet panels is very low because they are so stiff due to their small depth dimension -- changing thickness from 18mm to 15mm did not measurably change the freq response. The slight increase in air volume actually made for a greater change, which we compensated for by changing the dimensions of the port.

Originally Posted by zoetmb

That's all well and good, but IMO, if you change the design of a product, it should be given a new product name or number so that there is no confusion.

"The Hsu Research surround system of HB-1 Mk.2, HC-1 Mk.2, and VTF-3 Mk4 is outstanding by any measure."

Originally Posted by Hicks

Here's what Ken had to say on the topic:

Originally Posted by Hicks


For folks like dcg44s that were hoping to round a system I have good news, we will be getting one last shipment of all the four and five series speakers in the original high gloss black, except for the 5DBs, around 11/15. Those should be up on the site for pre-order in the next couple of weeks.

Originally Posted by blackzarg

The 4T is essentially still the same product. I'm fine with the name. It would have been nice to have it called a MKII or something that noted the changes, along with the more affordable price tag, while ensuring customers that the product is/should be acoustically the same.

I have more of a problem when a company changes other people's words..
http://www.hsuresearch.com/products/enthusiast3.html



While I am sure the VTF-3 Mk4 (recently came out) is no doubt a great sub...that version was not the one tested. The changes Hsu made from MK3 to MK4 are much different than the old 4T and the new 4T.

Originally Posted by alphaiii

But the Intimus line has an established reputation, and the 4 series, especially at the lower pricing, appeals to many potential buyers because of the small footprint. So why not use that well established/well reviewed name to market the revised Intimus product? And that's really what it is, a revised version of an existing product, not something new altogether.

While I don't necessarily like that they're playing on the reputation/reviews of the original, better built version, and not this (IMO) lesser quality version (regardless of whether sound is almost the same, build quality isn't)...

...The average buyer likely won't notice, or if they do, won't care, that they lowered cabinet build quality and revoiced to speakers to compensate... since the price has dropped, and according to Aperion (Jason), they've maintained almost the same sound. They might wish the Intimus speakers still had the nice veneer or gloss finish, but the price drop is likely to speak louder to those potential buyers than anything else.

It's easy to criticize Aperion with this move, but they're a business and need to make profits... so it's just the way they chose to handle the increased costs. Again, as the consumer, you either pay more for equivalent product these days, or pay the same (or in this case a little less) for a lesser product. While it may steer buyers like you or I away... I don't think it's going to hurt their sales much, since they were able to lower the prices... and for the average buyer, that's a much bigger bonus than thicker/heavier cabinets...

Originally Posted by zoetmb

Because it's misleading. They can call it the 4n (new) or the 4s (special) or the 4x (xtra cheap) or the 2012 4 or whatever. I don't have any problem with what they're doing in terms of building a cheaper speaker as long as it's properly named/labeled. Specs should not change on an existing model, especially if it's not for the better. If I go to a friend's house and audition a "4" and order it, I expect the same speaker. I shouldn't be getting a radically different design (and this is a radically different design.)

What you have to ask is why didn't they change the model designation? I guarantee you they would have changed the designation had they made the speaker better regardless of whether they changed the selling price. They didn't change the designation because while they might want people to notice the lower price, they don't want people to notice that the specs are inferior.

End of story. Don't make excuses for them just because we like the company and their products.