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Anyone else think that Batman Begins is a REALLY underwhelming HD-DVD?

post #1 of 97
12/21/06 at 2:32pm
Thread Starter 
I don't know what it is. Here's my system setup.

Samsung 46" 1080p LCD LN-S4965D
Toshiba A2-HD-DVD player

Calibrated with AVIA.

Here's an example of why I think this HD movie isn't that great.

Chapter 37, 2 hours 4 minutes, right at the start: When Earle (Rutger Hauer) walks towards the woman, his left side of his face (our right) features nasty swimming pixels. I haven't seen this in a while, but it reminds me of 24 season 1 on DVD. Plain ugly. The image of the movie, as a whole, just doesn't seem very crisp. I don't see the extreme details of clothes or faces like I did in Kingdom of Heaven on Blu-ray, for example.

The thing that bugs me is that people cite Batman Begins as a reference quality HD movie, but I'm just not seeing it. Again, this opinion is based on just the one movie that is getting mad props.

Anyone want to chime in on this?
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post #2 of 97
12/21/06 at 2:34pm
I agree with you. The quality on the Batman HD-DVD is not that great. Serenity HD-DVD looks much better to me.
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post #3 of 97
12/21/06 at 2:39pm
I totally agree with your assessment...after reading the advance reviews on BB I was expecting perfection and was underwhelmed by the finished product. I watched it on an A-1 with a Sony SXRD 60" XBR1. King Kong on the other hand was awesome just as I had anticipated.
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post #4 of 97
12/21/06 at 2:42pm
from what I gather,
Most consider it a reference audio disk for HD DVD.

If you can play it PCM over HDMI.


I have it, haven't watched it, waiting till xmass to get my denon 987 then going to gear up for the audio.
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post #5 of 97
12/21/06 at 3:42pm
I have watched it many times, and to me it looks fantastic. I have a 46 inch Samsung DLP in my HT and dont see that "swimming pixels" thing you mention. I even just checked it on my smaller LCD, and do not see it either. Odd
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post #6 of 97
12/21/06 at 4:01pm
60 xbr1 here and it looks good not the best ive seen but its not bad. me out of my whole collection house of wax is the worst.

oh yah superman returns looks worst to me
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post #7 of 97
12/21/06 at 4:04pm
Question: "Anyone else think that Batman Begins is a REALLY underwhelming HD-DVD?"

Answer: Nope.. I think it's lovely!
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post #8 of 97
12/21/06 at 4:11pm
saw it last night for the 1st time and i was blown away. picture really popped on sony 60xbr2. of course it was the first hd-dvd i ever watched as i got my a2 yesterday.
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post #9 of 97
12/21/06 at 4:17pm
It got a 5 out of 5 for Picture in this month's Widescreen Review, they don't give out those fives too often, usually a 4.5 for a great video picture, a five means no flaws at all.
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post #10 of 97
12/21/06 at 4:21pm
Batman Begins is excellent on my system. It is reference quality for both audio and video for the vast bulk of the movie.

Bill
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post #11 of 97
12/21/06 at 4:23pm
Greetings

Don't see that on any of my ISF calibrated sets ...

Regards
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post #12 of 97
12/21/06 at 4:36pm
I think the picture looks fantastic.
Samsung 46" DLP 720P
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post #13 of 97
12/21/06 at 4:50pm
I thought it was top notch, I went to the book mark(on my A2) you gave and saw no defect you described, BUT I am viewing in on a 720P DLP projector thats calibrated. My screen is a 110" diag bright white screen and my seating distance is 1.5 times the screen width.

Sorry but I am no expert as to why it was less than stellar on you 1080 46" should have been perfect

The entire movie was razor Sharp with Stunning colors............I will be watching King kong tonight can't wait.

All I can say is HD rocks no matter what brand you are watching.
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post #14 of 97
12/21/06 at 4:52pm
I vote fantastic
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post #15 of 97
12/21/06 at 4:53pm
"Batman Begins" looks fantastic on my set, via component (professionally calibrated 65" widescreen Mitsubishi CRT).
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post #16 of 97
12/21/06 at 4:56pm
LCDs introduce artifacts more than any other display. Also, while AVIA is nice, it can never be substituted for a calibration from a professional (like MichaelTLV).

That being said, Batman Begins wasn't exactly pure video reference material on my setup (CRT) but it was good to great. The audio was fantastic and really, really gets people to jump (bats flying around, shrieking). I'd give the pq a 4.5 and from my eyes was better than KoH.
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post #17 of 97
12/21/06 at 4:56pm
Fantastic, flawless on my Pearl
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post #18 of 97
12/21/06 at 5:10pm
Thread Starter 
I just find it interesting that I had zero issues on Kingdom of Heaven or Black Hawk Down, yet Batman Begins just didn't wow me at all. There just isn't the level of detail in Batman Begins as there is in Kingdom of Heaven. King Kong was MUCH more impressive to me. I think the excuse of LCDs introducing artifacts more than any other display is simply not true. Again, Kingdom of Heaven is utterly astonishing, and despite not having viewed every HD-DVD or Blu-ray movie, Kingdom of Heaven is the best I've seen.

That highdefdigest gave Kingdom of Heaven 4.5/5 for video, and also Batman Begins 4.5/5 is beyond me.. KoH is light-years better looking.

http://bluray.highdefdigest.com/kingdomofheavendc.html

http://hddvd.highdefdigest.com/batmanbegins.html
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post #19 of 97
12/21/06 at 5:26pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by WilliamG View Post

I just find it interesting that I had zero issues on Kingdom of Heaven or Black Hawk Down, yet Batman Begins just didn't wow me at all. There just isn't the level of detail in Batman Begins as there is in Kingdom of Heaven. King Kong was MUCH more impressive to me. I think the excuse of LCDs introducing artifacts more than any other display is simply not true. Again, Kingdom of Heaven is utterly astonishing, and despite not having viewed every HD-DVD or Blu-ray movie, Kingdom of Heaven is the best I've seen.

That highdefdigest gave Kingdom of Heaven 4.5/5 for video, and also Batman Begins 4.5/5 is beyond me.. KoH is light-years better looking.

http://bluray.highdefdigest.com/kingdomofheavendc.html

http://hddvd.highdefdigest.com/batmanbegins.html


Hmmm... I had the chance to watch the HD-DVD version of BMB on a 9 foot screen a few weeks ago and let me tell ya, it looked (and sounded) fabulous.
On the other hand, I watched parts of KOH (about 15 min) on BD and there was grain everywhere in every scene. Now from what I have read, KOH is one of BD reference movies at this stage in the format war.
I question the legitimacy of this thread.

Craig
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post #20 of 97
12/21/06 at 5:26pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by WilliamG View Post

I don't see the extreme details of clothes or faces like I did in Kingdom of Heaven on Blu-ray, for example.

I agree with that and I am using a 51" RP CRT. I thought it was overly clean and overly 3-D. I thought the actors faces looked more like CGI renderings in many shots than images of real people on film. I thought it was a bit artificial looking. I suppose it could be my setup, but I don't see that type of look with most other titles. IMO, Seabiscuit is much more impressive. All the detail are there and there is nothing artificial about it at all. Very natural looking. Seabiscuit is what I consider reference. BB is not in the same league as Seabiscuit. JMO.
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post #21 of 97
12/21/06 at 5:36pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by WilliamG View Post

Anyone else think that Batman Begins is a REALLY underwhelming HD-DVD? Anyone want to chime in on this?

Just sell the HD DVD & get the SD DVD!

Yeah, RIGHT!!!

Rent or borrow the SD DVD, watch the HD DVD, then play the SD DVD.
And post what you see.

Why in the world are you comparing the HD DVD of BR to 24 on SD DVD???
What does the look of BR on HD DVD have to do w/KoH on BD???
I guess you don't know the answer is: nothing at all, as far as the look of BR on HD DVD is concerned.
If you think 24 on SD DVD & KoH on BD look better to you than BR on HD DVD, then they do. However, BR does not look like 24 or KoH, never has & never will!
Did you think all movies would look the same?

Really, try the SD vs. HD DVD test. It might open your eyes (& ears) to BR on HD disc.

And the disc, BR on HD DVD, is a reference for a HD transfer. In other words; it looks like what the director intended.

Happy viewing & holidays!
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post #22 of 97
12/21/06 at 5:39pm
Fantastic on my Pearl and Ruby.
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post #23 of 97
12/21/06 at 5:44pm
Thread Starter 
Good grief, people! I never once said that Batman Begins looks bad! And I DO own the SD DVD of it, so nya!

I will compare my feelings on it thus:

I can see the difference between 60hz and 75hz on a CRT
I can see the difference between 480i and 480p
I can see the difference between VGA and DVI
I can spot bad CGI a mile away (King...cough....Kong)
The 360 is LOUD, and therefore unusable for HD-DVD.

Now, there are people who do not see/hear these things. Does that make them wrong and me right? No! Does that make them right and me wrong? No! It just is. And clearly my thoughts on Batman Begins are the same here.
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post #24 of 97
12/21/06 at 6:39pm
I think it was great on HD-DVD. I can't wait to get it on Blu-ray for the lossless audio track, then it will be amazing!!

~Josh
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post #25 of 97
12/21/06 at 6:55pm
It is lossless on the HD DVD version currently.
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post #26 of 97
12/21/06 at 7:07pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by beatboy77 View Post

I think it was great on HD-DVD. I can't wait to get it on Blu-ray for the lossless audio track, then it will be amazing!!

~Josh

Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew P View Post

It is lossless on the HD DVD version currently.


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post #27 of 97
12/21/06 at 7:10pm
Threads like this are EXACTLY the reason I only trust a few people who post their impressions of PQ on this forum.
Why? Because they know their stuff, have systems that accurately reproduce the source and because I generally agree with them.
Call me a curmudgeon but Batman Begins is a "reference" disc both technically and as a work of film making.
So to answer the OPs question, no I don't agree with you and have seen no swimming pixels in Batman Begins.
There is something in your video chain that is causing this brief artifact.
BTW, MichaelTLV calibrates my displays
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post #28 of 97
12/21/06 at 7:12pm
I think it is definitely one of the better transfers.

When I first saw the title of this thread, I had to check to see if it was started by Gary Murrell...
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post #29 of 97
12/21/06 at 7:13pm
No.
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post #30 of 97
12/21/06 at 7:23pm
A+++++++++++
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