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Pro Calibration - Is it worth it?

post #1 of 20
Thread Starter 
Hello fellow AVS members,

My question is simply this ... is a professional calibration worth the money? I've heard of some folks stating that their picture quality, both geometry and picture quality wise, became much better after they had their set calibrated. However, I've also heard that a calibration voids the warranty.

I'm just curious about how the whole process takes place. Do they only use the functions in the service menu to make calibrations? Or do they actually open the set up and adjust the ray tube, screen, magnets, yolk, and other parts physically?

Now, the big question. The set I own is a Sanyo HT30746 30 inch Widescreen CRT HDTV. I've read posts about this television on this forum and elsewhere, and while most people seem to like the overall picture quality, the two complaints that I've heard most are about two things ... the geometry and the overscanning. I've noticed both these issues. The overscanning doesn't bother me much, but I've found myself playing my games and watching my movies in 480p mode in a 4:3 letter box to avoid the "paper roller" effect present on the sides of the screen. This effect is also present to a lesser extent on the top and bottom of the screen. My question is, would a professional calibration fix this? Or is it simply a flaw in the design of the TV itself that can't be fixed at all?

The reason I'm asking this is I really like the TV. I've always been a fan of CRT televisions. I don't like the ghosting affects that take place on cheaper model LCDs, and I simply can't afford an LCD with a fast response time. The picture on my current TV is clear, large, and easy for me to see, and the progressive scanning is much easier on the eyes than my old TV was. But I didn't buy a Widescreen TV just so I could use it in Letterbox mode to avoid funky geometry effects. I like the set a lot, and it was a great value, but if the problems can't be fixed, I might just return it and look for set without such issues.

Any comments or thoughts from you guys would be greatly appreciated, since I'm not very knowledgable about display calibration and I'm too afraid to adjust the set myself (I don't want to screw it up more, LOL).

Thanks for reading, and I hope to hear from you guys soon!

-Colin
post #2 of 20
There are several threads where these questions regarding calibration have been discussed and discussed more. You need to address the specific questions about what is going to be done and the results that can be expected to specific calibration specialists that you might be dealing with. Go to the horses mouth and discuss you set and your case. Read the other threads to get a varied perspective on the relative value of calibration.

Gather the info, then learn everything you can about what you can do yourself with the consumer controls, perform the best user level calibration you can then decide for yourself how to proceed.
post #3 of 20
You should always start with basic user calibration. ALWAYS.


As for going beyond that, that's an economic decision that you sort of have to answer on your own., i.e. how picky are you about quality images, and how much is that worth to you, and what is the opportunity cost or whatever they call that.
post #4 of 20
when I first set up my system I (and everyone else) thought it looked great. I spent a solid week-end tweaking that thing. After about a year of use, I brought in someone to calibrate and the results were stunning.

it helps when you know what you are doing; I didn't, he did
post #5 of 20
Thread Starter 
LOL, well, at least you tried doing it. As long as you didn't damage or mess up your display, no one can fault you.

The reason I'm considering a professional calibration is because they use special calibration tools that I couldn't possibly get my hands on.

The geometry issues with my TV are what annoy me the most. I exaggerate because they don't aggravate me to the point of wanting to return the set, but if a professional calibration can clean up the geometry and color/contrast balance of the TV, I figure, why not?

Now all I need to do is find someone in the Boston, MA area who can do the job!

-Colin
post #6 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by Haukness View Post

LOL, well, at least you tried doing it. As long as you didn't damage or mess up your display, no one can fault you.

The reason I'm considering a professional calibration is because they use special calibration tools that I couldn't possibly get my hands on.

The geometry issues with my TV are what annoy me the most. I exaggerate because they don't aggravate me to the point of wanting to return the set, but if a professional calibration can clean up the geometry and color/contrast balance of the TV, I figure, why not?

Now all I need to do is find someone in the Boston, MA area who can do the job!

-Colin

Contact Gregg Loewen at lionav.com. He is from Farmington, Maine but covers a lot of regions.
post #7 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by Haukness View Post

Now all I need to do is find someone in the Boston, MA area who can do the job!

-Colin

Colin,

Avical also regularly services your area. You can read more about the services provided and scheduling here!

Regards,

Dave
post #8 of 20
does anyone use the datacolor units? i have.. well my employer has the $600 datacolor spyder tv pro which i use religiously for calibration.. it takes a lot of the guessing out of teh avia disk.. but there are plenty of cheaper ones which work well.. im just trying to figure out why noone seems to use them....
post #9 of 20
buckneri,

The Spyder TV units are not accurate on all types of display technologies. Professional calibrators need to ensure that the equipment they are using is accurate for the displays that they service. The Spyder TV does not fit that bill for most of us.

Regards,

Dave
post #10 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by Haukness View Post

LOL, well, at least you tried doing it. As long as you didn't damage or mess up your display, no one can fault you.

The reason I'm considering a professional calibration is because they use special calibration tools that I couldn't possibly get my hands on.

The geometry issues with my TV are what annoy me the most. I exaggerate because they don't aggravate me to the point of wanting to return the set, but if a professional calibration can clean up the geometry and color/contrast balance of the TV, I figure, why not?

Now all I need to do is find someone in the Boston, MA area who can do the job!

-Colin

Try Jim Doolittle with the ISF - he is in Waltham. You can google his name for info.
post #11 of 20
Are there any ISF Calibration professionals in the Plymouth, MA area? Plymouth is about 40 minutes south of Boston along Route 3 (along the coast).

I'm looking at having a 65" 1080p DLP calibrated. I just ordered it today and it will be delivered on Sunday.

Thanks for any info.
post #12 of 20
hi Pete

I regularly service the entire New England region. I consider NE to be my back yard. Feel free to email me for more information.

Regards

Gregg
gregg@lionav.com
post #13 of 20
Hi:
First post. I have a new KDL-40XBR2 that I'm thinking I'd like to have calibrated. I'm in the Madison, WI area, and have tried contacting Video Tweak. No response. Anyone else in the area? Thanks.
post #14 of 20
Hello sid_farkus,

Avical will be servicing the Wisconsin area in April. Please feel free to visit our website at www.avical.com for more information regarding the tour and our services.

Regards,

Dave
post #15 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by David Abrams View Post

buckneri,

The Spyder TV units are not accurate on all types of display technologies. Professional calibrators need to ensure that the equipment they are using is accurate for the displays that they service. The Spyder TV does not fit that bill for most of us.

Regards,

Dave

It actually does a pretty good job for most displays maybe not all. And is very easy to use. We have used the spyder and then calibrated with sencore and the spyder was almost right on. So, again for the price and for the dyi/hobbist great tool.
post #16 of 20
and yes it is worth getting your set calibrated.
post #17 of 20
hdtvpros,

Both the Spyder and the Sencore are filter based tri-stimulus color analyzers that should yield similar results due to their design. That said, the meter should be tested and traceable to NIST standards for the application it is being used for. As an example, a tri-stimulus colorimeter is designed to measure display systems with phosphor based spectral characteristics, as well as, three colors - red, green, and blue, hence 'tri-stimulus'. If a meter is used on a display that does not have the same spectral characteristics, or is based on more than the three primary colors, the meter will yield inaccurate results.

A good way to quickly evaluate if the meter is worth looking into is to measure the colors of the display and see if their cumulative luminance values add up to white. For example, if you have a display that is using RGB to create the image, measure red's luminance value, green, and blue. Add them together and compare the total luminance value to what you achieve at white. If the meter is operating properly it should be nearly identical.

Regards,

Dave
post #18 of 20
Quote:


We have used the spyder and then calibrated with sencore and the spyder was almost right on. So, again for the price and for the dyi/hobbist great tool.

This is where some of you are wrong....the Spyder device has 6, color and electronically corrected, sensors inside. It is very accurate for most applications. The Sencore product only has 3.
post #19 of 20
A tri-stimulus sensor is not hard coded to specific phosphor response.

http://www.datacolor.com/index.php?n...icle&artid=334

Rather it uses filters to approximate the eye response - tri-stimulus really means what the eye sees (XYZ) as opposed to how a display works (RGB). There are no displays that have the same spectral response as the eye that I am aware of - but that does not matter because the eye sees RGB display that result in the same XYZ response as the same. Your eye is a filter - not a frequency analyzer like the ear.

The more filters it uses the more accurate the eye response curve fit can be. Spyder has more sensors than Sencore - and the KM-CS200 has more sensors than either

http://se.konicaminolta.us/products/...200/index.html

The KM is not a spectroradiometer that directly samples the spectrum - but rather is the same fundamental tristimulus design using filters and tables to approx the eye response - and it is rated for many display types and sold as a faster portable instrument than a spendier lab spectroradiometer.

All of these sensors are required to be calibrated - and that is where the inaccuracies come in - if it was hand tuned against a lab spectroradiometer on the same lamps/screens you use it will be very accurate. If it was churned out by the millions with a default calibration table same in all the sensor - it will be very inaccurate. Often they have multiple calibration tables depending on usage - use it wrong and it will be innaccurate.

All sensors also lose their accuracy as RGBW light levels are lowered - even the spendy ones. They are also sensitive to drift and need checked and recalibrated.
post #20 of 20
R+G+B=W does not work on displays with dynamic color decoding issues - for example DLP with BrilliantColor or LCD with DynamicIRIS.

You could try to go around it with a static color bars pattern - but that requires moving the sensor so uniformity/measurement issues will make the equation not work.

So unless you know your display has no such issues - you cannot use it to quick check your sensor.
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