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post #14971 of 16068
10/4/12 at 11:29pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by MUDCAT45 View Post

You are also lucky. Many claim they had a fan or fans on their Onkyo and it still failed. Popping and clicking has been a problem with Onkyo as well. I had to have an Integra repaired for clicking. Resetting Onkyos also seems to be necessary.
There is one thread about Emotiva. This site is overflowing with unhappy Onkyo owners.
Most UMC problems did not disable the unit to a point that it could not be used. When the heat fries a unit it has to be repaired or replaced.
You are lucky, lucky.


My Onkyo is cold after 12 hours of heavy use. Do I believe it will hold up like my 10 year old Marantz? No, but I am hoping.

Is an Onkyo today diff than an Integra? Is a Denon diff than a Marantz today? Is Onkyo today better reliability wise than they were? Do you know the improvements?

Is my 818 perfect? no.

It's better than a UMC though by FAR. Luvn my EMO amp. Hope they figure the processor market out, broken shwit ain't gunna work; missed deadlines need to be backed up with working stough. Go XMC go!! but even if you don't do it, still luvn the amp. XMC you are sorta like Sarah Palin in a debate, as long as you don't completely face flop, you will win due to expectations.
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post #14972 of 16068
10/5/12 at 5:31am
Are you bypassing the 24p issue on the 818 by not using HDMI output #1?
Or you just don't do 24p?

I was looking at this avr seriously for early next year, but the video issues will keep me away if they are not fixed soon.
The reported hdmi sync issues are pretty much universal on anything nowadays.
We all should have stayed with hdmi 1.2 AVRs and dual output bluray players.
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post #14973 of 16068
10/5/12 at 5:38am
Quote:
Originally Posted by runnin' View Post

That's good because I feel lucky!

So did he fire six shots or only five?  In all this excitement, I've kinda lost track myself.... smile.gif

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post #14974 of 16068
10/5/12 at 5:41am
Quote:
Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post

So did he fire six shots or only five?  In all this excitement, I've kinda lost track myself.... smile.gif

I figured you were keeping count?
After all you started. tongue.gif
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post #14975 of 16068
10/5/12 at 5:58am
Quote:
Originally Posted by bootman_head_fi View Post

Are you bypassing the 24p issue on the 818 by not using HDMI output #1?
Or you just don't do 24p?
I was looking at this avr seriously for early next year, but the video issues will keep me away if they are not fixed soon.
The reported hdmi sync issues are pretty much universal on anything nowadays.
We all should have stayed with hdmi 1.2 AVRs and dual output bluray players.

It's kinda like if you have never heard good bass. I've never seen or noticed the issue and I'm not really trying to find it. My connections and settings are pretty standard. I believe the folks that have taken the time and tested it and know it is real.

I know, pathetic.
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post #14976 of 16068
10/5/12 at 7:04am
You know, it's kind of funny how many times Onkyo's issues keep gettting brought up on this thread as if that justifies the UMC'S issues. If an Onkyo avr sucks, don't buy it, and by the same token, if an Emotiva processor sucks then don't buy it.
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post #14977 of 16068
10/5/12 at 8:34am
Quote:
Originally Posted by runnin' View Post

You know, it's kind of funny how many times Onkyo's issues keep gettting brought up on this thread as if that justifies the UMC'S issues. If an Onkyo avr sucks, don't buy it, and by the same token, if an Emotiva processor sucks then don't buy it.

 

Yes, good point. One also needs to remember that Onkyo is one of the biggest (AVR) manufacturers in the world and Emotiva one of the smallest. Onkyo have over 34% of the UK market where they are No 1. They are No 1 in France and No 2 in Germany and sales exceed 7,000,000 units worldwide in total since they entered this sector of the AV business. I don't have stats for their position in the USA but they will be No1 or No2 there for sure, with sales in the hundreds of thousands of units a year. Onkyo probable sell more units every week than Emo sell in a year. So, one would logically expect that there would be far, far more people having various issues with an Onkyo unit than would be having issues with an Emo unit, even if their percentage failure rate was identical. And this would obviously be reflected in the relative numbers of posts on a site like this.

 

But, as you say, it's totally irrelevant to the UMC-1 issues - no matter what issues Onkyo may or may not be having is entirely irrelevant to those that Emo are having with the UMC-1 and I am guessing that this is only brought up time after time to deflect the argument away from Emo. It makes no sense of course to say "Well my UMC-1 had numerous faults, but hey, so do Onkyos and Denons, so it's not as bad as you think!" ;)

 

I will declare my vested interest here: I have owned 4 Onkyo units (3 AVRs and my current 5509 prepro) and have had no issues or faults of any sort with any of them. I also own 4 Emotiva amps and have had no issues or faults with any of those either. I have never owned a UMC-1 because I read the reports of the numerous issues in the first 12 months of its life (after the 2 year delay to make sure it was "working beautifully") and came to the conclusion that it was just too flawed to even consider. It also lacked Audyssey which, to me, is essential (or any other electronic room correction that works as well).

 

As you rightly say, if Onkyo had let me down time after time, I would switch to a different brand. But that hasn't been my experience.

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post #14978 of 16068
10/5/12 at 10:36am
Quote:
Originally Posted by runnin' View Post

You know, it's kind of funny how many times Onkyo's issues keep gettting brought up on this thread as if that justifies the UMC'S issues. If an Onkyo avr sucks, don't buy it, and by the same token, if an Emotiva processor sucks then don't buy it.

Maybe because that is who some new Emotiva customers are looking to upgrade from?
But I agree 100% with your obvious statement.
It is just people take that to mean 100% of Onkyos are bad (not true) and 100% of Emotivas are bad( also not 100% true).

Stick with what works and help others who have the same gear vs what usually happens which is just comment on other gear you don't own or have no intention of owning.
(doesn't apply if you actually owned said gear and currently do not)

We are ALL guilty of that here at one time or another. I know I am. rolleyes.gif
Edited by bootman_head_fi - 10/5/12 at 10:44am
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post #14979 of 16068
10/5/12 at 11:34am
Quote:
Originally Posted by bootman_head_fi View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by runnin' View Post

You know, it's kind of funny how many times Onkyo's issues keep gettting brought up on this thread as if that justifies the UMC'S issues. If an Onkyo avr sucks, don't buy it, and by the same token, if an Emotiva processor sucks then don't buy it.


Stick with what works and help others who have the same gear vs what usually happens which is just comment on other gear you don't own or have no intention of owning.
(doesn't apply if you actually owned said gear and currently do not)

We are ALL guilty of that here at one time or another. I know I am. rolleyes.gif


Why is it important to have owned a unit in order to be able to comment on it?  As Max ably pointed out a few posts back, if he reads article after article saying that XXXX brand of tyres have a very bad record for tread separation, causing numerous vehicles to turn over, does he need to go out and buy those tyres and risk his life before he has the right to comment on whether tyres should behave that way, or whether the manufacturer should take this step or that step to correct the situation or whether other people should or should not consider buying that brand of tyres? Indeed, does he not even have a duty to point out the issues with tread separation and rollovers to prospective buyers, to save them from making the same mistake as the others who have bought brand XXXX?

 

I realise that you were making a slightly different point (and I do agree with the sentiment of your post) but very often in this thread one will see someone lambast another member because he actually dared comment on the UMC-1 even though he doesn't own it. It's as if ownership of the unit will suddenly shed all manner of light on the numerous faults and problems with the unit - problems which have been reported on by numerous people who do actually own it. 

 

Amusingly, the main culprits who say "if you don't own a UMC-1 you shouldn’t be commenting on it" are usually the very same people who then go on to comment and point out faults and problems on Onkyo units that they don't actually own either ;)  Which, I think, brings me back to the point you were making...

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post #14980 of 16068
10/6/12 at 9:00am
anyone using the new xpr 5 channel amp ?, I am thinking of upgrading from my xp 5, my speakers are aerials and and are very ineficient, so I am cosidering giving them a more powerull amp, thanks
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post #14981 of 16068
10/6/12 at 10:30am
Quote:
Originally Posted by panzer View Post

anyone using the new xpr 5 channel amp ?, I am thinking of upgrading from my xp 5, my speakers are aerials and and are very ineficient, so I am cosidering giving them a more powerull amp, thanks

Not using the XPR-5, but it does look like a very competent amp. And it is rated at twice the power of the XPA-5, so it meets the requirements of a significant power upgrade in my book - which is at least double the power or it's not really worth having. Before I upgraded and spent the cash though I'd use one of the many online SPL calculators to see if you will really benefit from the extra 3dB that the XPR-5 will give you over the XPA-5. 3dB more headroom is certainly worth having, but if you listen at low-ish SPLs, sit fairly close to your speakers etc etc, then you may not notice the difference. HST, if you have the cash, you can never have too much power IMO, so go for it! One final point - inefficient speakers do often seem to 'come alive' with a big powerful amp driving them, so this could be the answer for you - get the XPR-5 on Emo's 30 day home trial and audition it in your room with your speakers. It looks like a terrific amp and if I was in the market for a new amp it would definitely be on my list (I have an XPA-3 and three UPA-2s).

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post #14982 of 16068
10/6/12 at 12:58pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post


Why is it important to have owned a unit in order to be able to comment on it?  As Max ably pointed out a few posts back, if he reads article after article saying that XXXX brand of tyres have a very bad record for tread separation, causing numerous vehicles to turn over, does he need to go out and buy those tyres and risk his life before he has the right to comment on whether tyres should behave that way, or whether the manufacturer should take this step or that step to correct the situation or whether other people should or should not consider buying that brand of tyres? Indeed, does he not even have a duty to point out the issues with tread separation and rollovers to prospective buyers, to save them from making the same mistake as the others who have bought brand XXXX?

I realise that you were making a slightly different point (and I do agree with the sentiment of your post) but very often in this thread one will see someone lambast another member because he actually dared comment on the UMC-1 even though he doesn't own it. It's as if ownership of the unit will suddenly shed all manner of light on the numerous faults and problems with the unit - problems which have been reported on by numerous people who do actually own it. 

Amusingly, the main culprits who say "if you don't own a UMC-1 you shouldn’t be commenting on it" are usually the very same people who then go on to comment and point out faults and problems on Onkyo units that they don't actually own either wink.gif  Which, I think, brings me back to the point you were making...

For me, (I can't really speak for anyone else after all) previously or currently owning a product adds credibility to his or her opinion.
It helps sort out those with a shall we say "negative" agenda that only want to add trolling like comments when someone is genuinely looking for help in a technical thread like this.

Is that really helping the poor soul looking for advice?

This thread isn't the only place where this happens.
unfortunately it is a problem rampant here at AVS on certain threads.

However, depending on the particular section, mods sometimes do (and at times very quickly) intervene.
Just try and say something troll like (quick negative snippet just to chime in) in the audessey section for example.
Since that thread is visited by the good folks at Audessey themselves, AVS just won't put up with it. wink.gif

Can you or anyone else honestly say the same has happened in this long thread for example?
And if so, where is the mod cleanup?rolleyes.gif
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post #14983 of 16068
10/6/12 at 1:00pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post

Not using the XPR-5, but it does look like a very competent amp. And it is rated at twice the power of the XPA-5, so it meets the requirements of a significant power upgrade in my book - which is at least double the power or it's not really worth having. Before I upgraded and spent the cash though I'd use one of the many online SPL calculators to see if you will really benefit from the extra 3dB that the XPR-5 will give you over the XPA-5. 3dB more headroom is certainly worth having, but if you listen at low-ish SPLs, sit fairly close to your speakers etc etc, then you may not notice the difference. HST, if you have the cash, you can never have too much power IMO, so go for it! One final point - inefficient speakers do often seem to 'come alive' with a big powerful amp driving them, so this could be the answer for you - get the XPR-5 on Emo's 30 day home trial and audition it in your room with your speakers. It looks like a terrific amp and if I was in the market for a new amp it would definitely be on my list (I have an XPA-3 and three UPA-2s).

Sometimes amp design, say for example class A or a tube design, at the same or even less power output can be considered an upgrade by some here.
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post #14984 of 16068
10/6/12 at 1:10pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by bootman_head_fi View Post

Can you or anyone else honestly say the same has happened in this long thread for example?
And if so, where is the mod cleanup?rolleyes.gif

I can recall a number of times in this thread when the Mods stepped in to warn members and have deleted off topic argumentive posts. It is kind of hard to point out where the Mods cleaned up if specific posts have been deleted. If you look back through this thread you might find posts where the Mods have issued warnings.

Bill
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post #14985 of 16068
10/6/12 at 3:11pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by bootman_head_fi View Post

For me, (I can't really speak for anyone else after all) previously or currently owning a product adds credibility to his or her opinion.
It helps sort out those with a shall we say "negative" agenda that only want to add trolling like comments when someone is genuinely looking for help in a technical thread like this.
Is that really helping the poor soul looking for advice?
This thread isn't the only place where this happens.
unfortunately it is a problem rampant here at AVS on certain threads.
However, depending on the particular section, mods sometimes do (and at times very quickly) intervene.
Just try and say something troll like (quick negative snippet just to chime in) in the audessey section for example.
Since that thread is visited by the good folks at Audessey themselves, AVS just won't put up with it. wink.gif
Can you or anyone else honestly say the same has happened in this long thread for example?
And if so, where is the mod cleanup?rolleyes.gif

And by the same token, there are many examples of non-owners with an Emotiva fanboy agenda clogging up threads when "some poor soul" needs help. Fact of the matter is, the UMC as a model is dead. I don't know why people with other Emo gear post questions here(like the above XPR-5, no offense intended) when they have Emo model threads to post in or start their own, but there you go.

I would say this place is far more objective about Emo gear than the Emotiva forum, and don't give me that song and dance about all brand forums doing it. Because it isn't helpful the the "poor soul" when he gets pushed into buying an Emo amp before they even know any details about his room or gear. That's why people actually come here. I've had posts delected on the Emo forum that were completely on topic but didn't jive with the pro Emotiva agenda there.
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post #14986 of 16068
10/6/12 at 5:23pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by panzer View Post

anyone using the new xpr 5 channel amp ?, I am thinking of upgrading from my xp 5, my speakers are aerials and and are very ineficient, so I am cosidering giving them a more powerull amp, thanks

I've had the XPR-5 since Labor Day but that was my first Emotiva gear purchase. I had intended to get an XPA-5 but I saw the monster and decided to get it instead. I'm driving DefTech BP7000SC, CLR 3000, and JBL L7's, which are all rated above 400 watts amp power. Can't say there is much real-world difference at normal listening levels between the XPR-5 and the Denon rated at 150 WPC 7 channels driven. I DO get more punch on the peaks at higher volume levels but that may be due to being able to give the JBL's a lot of power and the 11.2 setup. 2-channel listening is definitely better since the 7000's are getting 3 times the power.

At any rate, I wouldn't pay full price for the XPR-5. Emotiva traditionally has a "Black Friday" type sale around Thanksgiving that usually lasts a week. They just had a 10% off sale.
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post #14987 of 16068
10/6/12 at 8:29pm
hi all,i'm thinking of adding amplifier to my ht setup,my current setup are onkyo 3009 with paradigm studio speaker and 2 subwoofer ( 5.2 system).I need advice which amp should i go for? xpa 5 or xpa 3 and let my 3009 do the surrounds?is the emotiva xpa series on par in terms of sound quality with anthem pva series?any feedback will much appreciated..thanks.
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post #14988 of 16068
10/7/12 at 3:35am
Quote:
Originally Posted by sherr127 View Post

hi all,i'm thinking of adding amplifier to my ht setup,my current setup are onkyo 3009 with paradigm studio speaker and 2 subwoofer ( 5.2 system).I need advice which amp should i go for? xpa 5 or xpa 3 and let my 3009 do the surrounds?is the emotiva xpa series on par in terms of sound quality with anthem pva series?any feedback will much appreciated..thanks.

 

What are you hoping to achieve with external amplification? How far do you sit from your speakers, what SPLs do you want to achieve, what is the efficiency of your speakers in dB/watts? 

 

Do you currently hear any audible distortion or clipping when using the 3009's very competent amps?

 

Sound quality between the Emo XPA series and the Anthem PVA series is more than likely going to be totally indistinguishable. It's the room and the speakers that has the most influence on sound quality, not the electronics. If you are looking for a step up in SQ, then the first thing to address is the room, and then the speakers.

 

If you can answer the questions above it will enable people to make an informed comment on your decision process.

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post #14989 of 16068
10/7/12 at 5:04am
Quote:
Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post

What are you hoping to achieve with external amplification? How far do you sit from your speakers, what SPLs do you want to achieve, what is the efficiency of your speakers in dB/watts? 

Do you currently hear any audible distortion or clipping when using the 3009's very competent amps?

Sound quality between the Emo XPA series and the Anthem PVA series is more than likely going to be totally indistinguishable. It's the room and the speakers that has the most influence on sound quality, not the electronics. If you are looking for a step up in SQ, then the first thing to address is the room, and then the speakers.

If you can answer the questions above it will enable people to make an informed comment on your decision process.

hi kbarnes,thanks for the honest explanation..
i just finished build up my ht room with the size of 12 x 16,i've done the room acoustic with auralex from the expert here,my listening position is 12' from main speaker.
Actually i'm pretty happy with the sound from my current set up until one of my friends lend his rotel rmb 1565 for me to test out.I test all type of movie and concert that i used to watch before and gosh..the sounds now more detail and more headroom but i think the rotel is a bit bright for me,so after googled around i'm thinking of adding amplifier that sounds a bit warm and between my budget and it comes to either emotiva xpa 5 or anthem pva 5.Now,what i want to know is should i go for three channel and let my onkyo do the surrounds or just go for 5 channel?thanks..
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post #14990 of 16068
10/7/12 at 8:00am
Quote:
Originally Posted by runnin' View Post

I don't know why people with other Emo gear post questions here(like the above XPR-5, no offense intended) when they have Emo model threads to post in or start their own, but there you go.

Ok i'll bite. what should we be posting in the EMOTIVA Thread Q&A (TECHNICAL TALK ONLY) thread?
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post #14991 of 16068
10/7/12 at 8:03am
Quote:
Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post

What are you hoping to achieve with external amplification? How far do you sit from your speakers, what SPLs do you want to achieve, what is the efficiency of your speakers in dB/watts? 

Do you currently hear any audible distortion or clipping when using the 3009's very competent amps?

Sound quality between the Emo XPA series and the Anthem PVA series is more than likely going to be totally indistinguishable.It's the room and the speakers that has the most influence on sound quality, not the electronics. If you are looking for a step up in SQ, then the first thing to address is the room, and then the speakers.

If you can answer the questions above it will enable people to make an informed comment on your decision process.

from what i believe,you are telling that amplifier only makes speaker sounds louder,not wider and more detail,no?so why does a ton of manufactures out there make amplifier that cost a bomb if not for sound quality?
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post #14992 of 16068
10/7/12 at 8:21am
Quote:
Originally Posted by sherr127 View Post

so why does a ton of manufactures out there make amplifier that cost a bomb if not for sound quality?

Maybe because there are people that actually believe "more expensive" would equal "better"? And then there are people that simply love status symbols.
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post #14993 of 16068
10/7/12 at 8:22am
Quote:
Originally Posted by sherr127 View Post

hi kbarnes,thanks for the honest explanation..
i just finished build up my ht room with the size of 12 x 16,i've done the room acoustic with auralex from the expert here,my listening position is 12' from main speaker.
Actually i'm pretty happy with the sound from my current set up until one of my friends lend his rotel rmb 1565 for me to test out.I test all type of movie and concert that i used to watch before and gosh..the sounds now more detail and more headroom but i think the rotel is a bit bright for me,so after googled around i'm thinking of adding amplifier that sounds a bit warm and between my budget and it comes to either emotiva xpa 5 or anthem pva 5.Now,what i want to know is should i go for three channel and let my onkyo do the surrounds or just go for 5 channel?thanks..

sherrr127,
First let me say…. Paradigm Studio’s… nice speakers. I almost bought the Studio 60's for my room.

What you have to realize is that everyone’s experience varies on this site. You need to do your own re-search. Just read thru the last 10 or so pages in this thread and you'll get the idea. wink.gif When one person adds a comment... it is generally their OPINION… just like mine is that I am stating to you right now. Just sayin’… wink.gif

Having said the above... based on your below comments, I don’t think anyone has to tell you that you were impressed with the power a separate amp gives your set-up.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sherr127 View Post

…i'm pretty happy with the sound from my current set up until one of my friends lend his rotel rmb 1565 for me to test out.I test all type of movie and concert that i used to watch before and gosh..the sounds now more detail…

The advice I would give you goes beyond whether you need an amp.
As I said, I think you have answered your own question...
If/when you decide to purchase a separate amp, if possible, add a dedicated circuit for your amp… or find a circuit where the outlets are NOT used at the same time as your home theater. Avoid circuits that are shared with lighting.
Having a single, dedicated circuit for your amp is best and minimizes the chance for noise in the system.
Good luck…
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post #14994 of 16068
10/7/12 at 8:26am
Quote:
Originally Posted by bootman_head_fi View Post

Ok i'll bite. what should we be posting in the EMOTIVA Thread Q&A (TECHNICAL TALK ONLY) thread?

+1000...!
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post #14995 of 16068
10/7/12 at 8:28am
Trolls will be removed from the thread. Blanket statements will not be tolerated.

Carry on.

K
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post #14996 of 16068
10/7/12 at 8:36am
Quote:
Originally Posted by sherr127 View Post

from what i believe,you are telling that amplifier only makes speaker sounds louder,not wider and more detail,no?so why does a ton of manufactures out there make amplifier that cost a bomb if not for sound quality?

Sheri, your question is a good one and WAS asked in an appropriate forum. The problem is that this thread has drifted away from its intended purposes of answering questions just like the one you asked.
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post #14997 of 16068
10/7/12 at 8:37am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kysersose View Post

Trolls will be removed from the thread. Blanket statements will not be tolerated.
Carry on.
K

THANK YOU...!!! cool.gif
You have your work cut out for you...
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post #14998 of 16068
10/7/12 at 8:48am
Amplifier technology was perfected decades ago. Appropriate to their name, amplifiers just make things louder. This is what makes Emotiva successful, they build amplifiers that do what they're intended without excessive cost. They cannot add detail (unless it's otherwise masked by clipping) nor can they broaden the soundstage. If stating what should be common knowledge is being a troll than so be it.
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post #14999 of 16068
10/7/12 at 9:01am
Quote:
Originally Posted by suffolk112000 View Post

sherrr127,
First let me say…. Paradigm Studio’s… nice speakers. I almost bought the Studio 60's for my room.
What you have to realize is that everyone’s experience varies on this site. You need to do your own re-search. Just read thru the last 10 or so pages in this thread and you'll get the idea. wink.gif When one person adds a comment... it is generally their OPINION… just like mine is that I am stating to you right now. Just sayin’… wink.gif
Having said the above... based on your below comments, I don’t think anyone has to tell you that you were impressed with the power a separate amp gives your set-up.
The advice I would give you goes beyond whether you need an amp.
As I said, I think you have answered your own question...
If/when you decide to purchase a separate amp, if possible, add a dedicated circuit for your amp… or find a circuit where the outlets are NOT used at the same time as your home theater. Avoid circuits that are shared with lighting.
Having a single, dedicated circuit for your amp is best and minimizes the chance for noise in the system.
Good luck…

hey,thanks suffolk..you really make my day,now should i get 5 channel or 3 channel and let my onkyo 3009 push the surrounds( emotiva xpa 3 or xpa 5)?wink.gif
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post #15000 of 16068
10/7/12 at 9:07am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Theresa View Post

Amplifier technology was perfected decades ago. Appropriate to their name, amplifiers just make things louder. This is what makes Emotiva successful, they build amplifiers that do what they're intended without excessive cost. They cannot add detail (unless it's otherwise masked by clipping) nor can they broaden the soundstage. If stating what should be common knowledge is being a troll than so be it.

err..have you done a real test before?i mean a full test with your own ht or hifi set up..or you just love to read and make conclusion?cool.gif
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