EMOTIVA Thread Q&A [TECHNICAL TALK ONLY] - Page 508

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Originally Posted by MUDCAT45 

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Originally Posted by kbarnes701 



Yes, good supplementaries there - in addition, I'll ask Eric if he has tried it with the Yamaha room correction on and off, and if it made any difference?

WTF needs room correction?

LOL. I just wondered if he had tried it on and off and if there was an audible effect. I wasn't recommending it :)

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Originally Posted by Eric_Connelly 

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Originally Posted by kbarnes701 

OK - that is good info - thanks for that. Your room isn't helping, and you are sitting a long way from the speakers, so you will need  fair bit of amp power, even though they are pretty sensitive and 8 ohms nominally. I still doubt if another amp will solve the problem as it doesn't seem to me to related to a lack of power. HST, if you were going to buy an amp anyway it can’t do any harm, and the Emo amp is a good one. Usually a lack of amp power will manifest itself as extremely harsh distortion caused by driving the amp into, or to the edge of, clipping.

Before you try anything else, I wonder if you can temporarily relocate the speakers into a more benign position in the room? And sit closer to them - say 12 feet or even less. This will at least give you an indication of what effect the placement is having on the FR.

Theresa, and others, have said that the Focal usually sound on the bright side rather then the dull or recessed side, so what you are hearing is odd. Your speaker cable is a decent gauge I assume?  If you are able to temporarily relocate the speakers, report back and we’ll see if we can get any further with it.

Speaker wire I believe is either 12 or 14 gauge from Monoprice.

I could move the speakers forward.

Here is the room the day after we moved in, but close enough, there are some more things in the room, blinds, tables, etc but the speakers are siting just outside of the cubby in the rear of the room. Moving closer is not really an option as you will see:



I'll have to take some more pics today with how I have it laid out.

Speaker wire is OK then.

Please try temporarily locating the speakers - it will eliminate one or two things if nothing else. I'd be interested in what they sound like if you get them away from the walls and corners and sit a lot closer. Might be the same, but worth trying if it is not too much trouble.

Your home looks terrific - but unless you have changed things much, it is a very 'hard' and reflective room and that won't be helping your SQ. If you experiment with sitting much closer, you will be getting more of the direct sound and less of the reflected sound and that may tell us something. I am starting to come to the view that it may be speaker placement that is the issue - you mentioned the sound was "muddy" and that is a classic description of sound that is badly influenced by reflections. 

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Originally Posted by Eric_Connelly 

As I mentioned that was the day we moved in, I setup the TV, hooked up DTV and sat down to watch the F1 race

Now the TV is normally back against that wall instead of sitting out 4' from it. I have it sitting out again because Panasonic is coming by on Monday to replace a board in my VT30 to get rid of a buss.

I could move the left and right speaker inside that cubby so they are both next to walls.

Room treatments are fine too, I just need to know where to start and how much they would help.

I did not try with YPAO on and off, in fact I'm trying to think where you turn it off, or set it back to the defaults.

Room treatments are one of the very best upgrades you can make and the difference in SQ that you will achieve is astonishing. Bass will be tighter and cleaner, imaging will be vastly improved, the room will sound bigger than it really is (because you have made the walls 'disappear') and so on. And treatments don't have to cost the earth either. I would suggest you start by checking out the RealTraps website and the GIK website. Both have a lot of information especially designed for the newcomer to treatments. I use GIK treatments simply because they are about the only company in the UK offering them. There is also info on those sites for anyone who wants to DIY treatments - they are fairly easy to make. And there are several good acoustics/treatment threads here at AVS too.

WAF etc permitting I would say that the biggest improvement anyone will ever make to their SQ will be by treating their room. Then come good speakers and proper placement. And a long way after that comes electronics - amps, prepros etc, which make the least difference.  The room is the most important component in the system and the one that has the biggest impact on SQ, so get that right and all your other equipment will perform better too and deliver the best it is capable of. OTOH, you could put $100,000 of speakers into a bad room and they will sound like cr^p.

Here you go:

http://www.gikacoustics.com/

http://www.realtraps.com/

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Originally Posted by Theresa 

You have a very difficult space to work with. You really don't want to put your system in the cubby hole. I don't know what your situation is re. your partner's acceptance of the need for space for your system. I agree with Keith that room treatments make the greatest improvement but even room treatments cannot fix the cubby.

Absolutely. He isn't doing that is he?  I missed that if he is. @ERIC - if you are, don't, as Theresa says.

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Originally Posted by alan_ct 

I am in the market for a new processor....I know there have been alot of bugs with these units when they first came out...Have they sorted out most of the problems with them yet? I just cant sift through 500 pages of this thread! Soooo can I get a " In A Nutshell" opinion on the unit? Thanks!

There are some very polarised views of the UMC-1 processor in this thread, with some saying they have experienced no problems at all and others saying they have had nothing but problems. Some of the many early bugs in the unit's software have been fixed but some remain. For example, the bass management in the unit cannot work properly due to bad implementation. Similarly the room EQ (Emo-Q) is fatally flawed. Even those who are happy with the UMC-1 will not contest those last two issues and Emo have stated they will not be addressed. So if either of those things are important to you, then you will want to look elsewhere.

As things stand, Emo are offering the UMC-1 on closeout and "all sales are final" so if you buy the unit and then don't like it, you cannot exchange it under Emotiva's normal 30 day money-back warranty. This may in itself be enough to put you off the unit.

You cannot currently buy the replacement UMC-200 or the more costly XMC-1. The former has already missed two promised delivery dates and is currently on 'pending status' with a possible release on 13th December (next week) but this is unconfirmed - there may also be a backlog of pre-orders so even if you order now it is unlikely that yours will be despatched on 13th December. The XMC-1 currently does not have a scheduled release date and Emo have already stated that the unit will be released minus its TacT room EQ. If you are in a hurry for a new processor therefore, neither of the new units may be suitable for you.

If you are looking for a processor in the price bracket of the UMC-1, then you might also want to consider the Outlaw 975 7.1 AV processor which is currently being shipped within 3 days of order according to the Outlaw website. The 975 is reasonably well featured but does not include any form of room EQ, so if that is important to you, then it too is a non-starter for you. 

Other than the UMC-1 and the Outlaw 975, there are no processors in that price category and you would have to spend much, much more to get a prepro from Onkyo or Denon. An alternative would be to choose a fully featured AVR which has preouts and then use that as a processor. A unit such as the Onkyo 818 comes with Audyssey's top of the line consumer electronic EQ - Audyssey MultEQ XT32 (which many believe is the finest of such EQs available) and costs about $1,000.

Without knowing more of what you are looking for, that's the best I can do. Hope it helps.

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Originally Posted by Eric_Connelly 

We will continue to make a significant investment in all of this and want it to sound to our liking. The wife has the same attitude. I almost bought a set of LS6's off of audiogon but I was the one who thought they would be too big, not her.

Eric, whatever happens, she's a keeper!!  :)

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Originally Posted by bootman_head_fi 

I thought the UMC base management was addressed in the last (and probably final) firmware release?
Those that complained about it (it affected subs that were not placed with the front speakers) got rid of their units before the "fix" came out.
No one else bothered to verify or deny the fix.

I have seen no reliable information that the bass management problem has been fixed. I did see some posts with unconfirmed reports that the bass management had been fixed but when asked to verify the reports, there was no answer IIRC. And in any event, weren't Emo (Lonnie specifically) saying for a long time that the bass management was meant to work that way (incredible though that seems) and so the UMC-1 was working "as designed"?  Why would they 'fix' something that they never saw as a problem anyway?

Markus767 proposed a series of tests that proved the efficacy of the bass management - when someone reports back having performed the tests and documented it, I'll believe the bass management has been fixed. Until then, call me old fashioned....

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You can buy a 200 (different unit from the original UMC) today, those who ordered got their shipping delayed by the US west cost shipping strike.
They should start getting them next week.
No one can catch a break.

XMC is still MIA.

You can *order* a UMC-200 today, as I said. When you will receive it is still unclear. Their site says that they will be shipping next on this Thursday (13th) but I am not sure if that means if I order one today, it will be shipped Thursday. Could be I guess. We'll soon find out...

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Originally Posted by bootman_head_fi 

Still doesn't change the fact no one has bothered to verify either way. (Not very AVS of us in a technical talk thread, )

Quite so. Was anyone assuming that? I hope that the UMC-200 does work properly and all the issues and problems of the past have now been fixed, especially wrt to Emo-Q Gen2. If they have fixed everything, it will be a decent unit for the money. I wonder why Outlaw decided to leave out any room EQ in their comparably priced processor?

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Originally Posted by sargeant 

Emotiva XPA 5

I just bought one of these and hooked it up, I always double check and triple check when ever I buy something new. I was setting up a 3rd theatre room ( last one)
Ive never used an amplifier on other setups before, thought Id give this a try. Made a deal with the wife that I wouldnt buy any more components unless it was the money coming in from
me working overtime. So I worked hard for this unit and it kept me going at work imagining me buying this unit, needless to say I was looking forward to this unit.

Being disappointed its an under statement, this definately goes to the top of my list as wish I hadnt bought this.

Went to Emotiva's website trying to check their return policy that section is down. Does anyone know 100 %, what is their return policy on this amplifier.


Just a brief description it has dedicated power coming directly from the panel. It isnt blown fuses. When ever a scene comes on
that has some thunder to it , this EMO immediately goes into protection mode and shuts down, for no apparent reason at all.

If I use it at between -45- 55 db volume (barely audible) it continues to function as soon as I raise it or some thunder comes on the movie it goes
into protection mode channel 1 flashing. If I reboot it will work again if volume is slightly raised slightly when watching blu rays
boom into protection mode.

I know about the 5 year warranty its not a lot of fun hauling this unit in and out of your home and taking it out for shipping.
Wish I had listened to my neighbor he went through the same thing with this unit, he finally sold it.

Am I on the Hook for shipping both ways and re-stocking fees.

Emo will give you a full refund within 30 days of purchase but you have to pay shipping costs back to Emo.

That assumes the amp isn’t faulty, which it sounds as though it is. If they have sent you faulty goods then they should pay return carriage for an exchange.

I wouldn't give up on Emo amps though. They really are superb pieces of gear for the money and the XPA-5 is a great amp (I have 4 Emo amps and all are 100%). Maybe you got a lemon this time but chances are you won't get another.

I would call Emo and discuss the issue with their tech support people first - Emo have a reputation for excellent customer service.

Edit: just read that you say it is just one channel that is going into protection - you might just try temporarily connecting a different speaker to that channel (swap your elft and centre say) and see if the problem stays on that channel or moves. If it moves to follow the speaker, then the problem is in the speaker. Unlikely but good troubleshooting practice and it gives you more ammo when you speak to Emotiva.