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EMOTIVA Thread Q&A [TECHNICAL TALK ONLY] - Page 514

post #15391 of 17194
Quote:
Originally Posted by bootman_head_fi View Post

What features are important to you?

A $600 AVR with preouts may be a better choice based on your needs.

Very good advice IMO.

Bill
post #15392 of 17194
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post

Very good advice IMO.

Bill

It all comes down to what the customer needs.
I totally get the low to no frills approach.
Not everyone wants or needs Internet streaming or air play especially if he already have something that does that well and usually better than most avrs.

I also get those that want those things and more.

It is good to have choices.cool.gif
post #15393 of 17194
Quote:
Originally Posted by bootman_head_fi View Post

Was the headphone amp you tried previously a Tube design?
If not, would you consider one?
I had a MG-Head with Senn 580s years ago and with the right tubes, it just sounded warm and wonderful. No harshness at all.
I know it wasn't "flat out accurate", but I didn't care since I could listen for hours and just enjoy the music.

Yes, it was a tube design. I've thought of getting a "Schiitt." (sp?)
Edited by Theresa - 1/22/13 at 2:32am
post #15394 of 17194
Quote:
Originally Posted by VINYLFREAK4 View Post

Wow!
Thanks to everyone for all the great advice.
It looks like I will definitely be looking at the XPA 5 rather than the UPA 700.
I am currently not at a position to upgrade just yet. I need to save some more pennies. smile.gif
From what I've read here in the forums and on other sites , Emotiva looks like it gives you a great bang for your buck.
I know a few of you have commented that the UMC-200 is a bare bones Pre-Pro , would anyone have any recommendations for
a Pre-Pro that might have more features at the same price point??

IMHO a receiver with pre-outs is a better deal than the UMC-200.
post #15395 of 17194
Quote:
Originally Posted by Theresa View Post

Yes, it was a tube design. I've thought of getting a "Schiitt." (sp?)

Are you joining the Schiit head club?smile.gif
post #15396 of 17194
Yes, I have thought of getting a Schiit headphone amp. Possibly the Valhalla.
post #15397 of 17194
Quote:
Originally Posted by MUDCAT45 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Theresa View Post

Yes, it was a tube design. I've thought of getting a "Schiitt." (sp?)

Are you joining the Schiit head club?smile.gif

Theresa, I think that was a joke. Say that sentence out loud phonetically.



Max
post #15398 of 17194
Quote:
Originally Posted by djbluemax1 View Post

Theresa, I think that was a joke. Say that sentence out loud phonetically.



Max

It was a bad joke so I ignored it.
post #15399 of 17194
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by bootman_head_fi View Post

A $600 AVR with preouts may be a better choice based on your needs.

Very good advice IMO.

Bill

 

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Theresa View Post

IMHO a receiver with pre-outs is a better deal than the UMC-200.

 

+1

post #15400 of 17194
that's a great idea . can you show me a receiver for 600.00 with pre -outs?
post #15401 of 17194
Quote:
Originally Posted by bootman_head_fi View Post

What features are important to you?

A $600 AVR with preouts may be a better choice based on your needs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post

Very good advice IMO.

Bill

Quote:
Originally Posted by Theresa View Post

IMHO a receiver with pre-outs is a better deal than the UMC-200.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post



+1

Ok
So it looks like an XPA 500 with a $600.00 AVR with Pre Outs is a better road to go down.
Any AVR recommendations. I currently have an Onkyo TX-SR608 , but I am open to other brands.
Thanks again for the input. smile.gif
post #15402 of 17194
Quote:
Originally Posted by Theresa View Post

IMHO a receiver with pre-outs is a better deal than the UMC-200.

I think this is true for some but it would also depend on the AVR. If someone is looking for a processor with a good auto EQ system then the UMC-200 is not a good choice IMO.

Bill
post #15403 of 17194
Quote:
Originally Posted by jt3066 View Post

that's a great idea . can you show me a receiver for 600.00 with pre -outs?

You can search the product pages of the many AVR manufacturers such as Denon, Marantz, Onkyo, Pioneer and Yamaha. This will give you an idea which AVRs have preouts then search for the best possible prices. The one big positive of using an AVR as a prepro is if your amp craps out you can use the amps in the AVR till you get the amp repaired. The other positive is many AVRs are less expensive then comparable prepros (features and build quality).

Bill
post #15404 of 17194
Quote:
Originally Posted by VINYLFREAK4 View Post




Ok
So it looks like an XPA 500 with a $600.00 AVR with Pre Outs is a better road to go down.
Any AVR recommendations. I currently have an Onkyo TX-SR608 , but I am open to other brands.
Thanks again for the input. smile.gif

It depends. Like I stated before, what features are important to you?
If you want say ipad/itunes integration, the UMC-200 doesn't do that.
If all you want is basic audio/video because all other needs are taken care of externally, the UMC-200 or the outlaw 975 would fit the bill.
You will have to decide what is important to YOU. smile.gif
post #15405 of 17194
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post

You can search the product pages of the many AVR manufacturers such as Denon, Marantz, Onkyo, Pioneer and Yamaha. This will give you an idea which AVRs have preouts then search for the best possible prices. The one big positive of using an AVR as a prepro is if your amp craps out you can use the amps in the AVR till you get the amp repaired. The other positive is many AVRs are less expensive then comparable prepros (features and build quality).

Bill
I agree you do get more features in an AVR for the price point. I've looked at AVR's with pre outs my self, they are hard to find under $700., and than I wonder if the quality will be there for sound quality,(what DAC processors are being used and so on) or if the money is being put in to the seven amps that I wont need. A bare bones processor would work for me since I don't have the Sony play station or other gaming systems. just a Tv, DVD, turntable, Tuner, and some day a blue ray player. And sorting through the reviews to figure out which ones are done for advertising money, and which ones aren't....It can be confusing some days.
Another item to point out here would be room treatments. As with Vinylfreak, I don't think Im getting the full sound stage from my system.rolleyes.gif And after reading through so many comments from others, I have come to relize just how important room treatments can be. Getting great sound out of a pro pro, or an AVR is #1 on my list out of an up grade.
post #15406 of 17194
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZOOM ZOOM View Post

I agree you do get more features in an AVR for the price point. I've looked at AVR's with pre outs my self, they are hard to find under $700., and than I wonder if the quality will be there for sound quality,(what DAC processors are being used and so on) or if the money is being put in to the seven amps that I wont need.

DACs are a commodity item these days. They cost a couple of dollars and the technology is now good enough that there are no differences in SQ between them. You make a good point that you are paying for amps you won't use but because receiver sales vastly outnumber pre-pro sales, the economies of scale still make them better value.

 

 

 

Quote:
Another item to point out here would be room treatments. As with Vinylfreak, I don't think Im getting the full sound stage from my system.rolleyes.gif And after reading through so many comments from others, I have come to relize just how important room treatments can be. Getting great sound out of a pro pro, or an AVR is #1 on my list out of an up grade.

 

 
Treating your room will give you more benefits to the dollar than any amp change or prepro change can give you. Take a look at the Realtraps website for lots of information on how to get started etc,
 
One of the main issues for me with the UMC-200 is Emotiva's very poor track record with processors. It has put me off their processors in a big way. The UMC-200 may have fixed many of the issues that plagued its predecessor, the UMC-1, but I wouldn't be willing to take the risk personally.
post #15407 of 17194
Quote:
Originally Posted by jt3066 View Post

that's a great idea . can you show me a receiver for 600.00 with pre -outs?

i bought the onkyo 809 for 429$ on amazon. also before xmas they had the 818 for 649$ they have pre-outs and multi XT and XT32 respectivly

it can be done wink.gif
post #15408 of 17194
Quote:
Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post

Treating your room will give you more benefits to the dollar than any amp change or prepro change can give you. Take a look at the Realtraps website for lots of information on how to get started etc,

Thanks for the info on room treatments.

Bruce
post #15409 of 17194
post #15410 of 17194
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZOOM ZOOM View Post

I agree you do get more features in an AVR for the price point. I've looked at AVR's with pre outs my self, they are hard to find under $700., and than I wonder if the quality will be there for sound quality,(what DAC processors are being used and so on) or if the money is being put in to the seven amps that I wont need.

I think you need to realize that just about every mainstream AVR puts out 80-120 wpc and that this is only a few dB less than the 200 wpc basic amp that many seem to be totally fascinated with.

It takes 10 dB (10x the power) to create the perception of twice as loud.

Unless you have very inefficient speakers 100 wpc is more than enough.

You will be able to get around 110 clean dB SPL out of L & R speakers with average efficiency and 100 wpc.

If you make a reasonable investment in subwoofer(s) you will be able to get room shaking sound without the extra size, weight, and expense of the outboard power amps.
post #15411 of 17194
Quote:
Originally Posted by bootman_head_fi View Post

It depends. Like I stated before, what features are important to you?
If you want say ipad/itunes integration, the UMC-200 doesn't do that.
If all you want is basic audio/video because all other needs are taken care of externally, the UMC-200 or the outlaw 975 would fit the bill.
You will have to decide what is important to YOU. smile.gif

I just picked up a "refurbished" (that is brand new as far as I can tell) on Ebay from OneCall for $650.
It has Preamps out and they even mangaed to implement max volume and power volume settings. rolleyes.gif

It sounds very good and has Preamp outs.
Do not buy it for AirPlay though, it sounds like it is playing through my couch pillow.
DLNA Rendering is a nice feature though, I can use J River to play music.

- Rich
post #15412 of 17194
Quote:
Originally Posted by RichB View Post

I just picked up a "refurbished" (that is brand new as far as I can tell) on Ebay from OneCall for $650.
It has Preamps out and they even mangaed to implement max volume and power volume settings. rolleyes.gif

It sounds very good and has Preamp outs.
Do not buy it for AirPlay though, it sounds like it is playing through my couch pillow.
DLNA Rendering is a nice feature though, I can use J River to play music.

- Rich

Rich,

Which AVR did you buy from OneCall? Are you still getting the 8801?

Bill
post #15413 of 17194
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post

Rich,

Which AVR did you buy from OneCall? Are you still getting the 8801?

Bill

I bought an Yamaha Aventage TX-A820 for my game room from the *bay/Onecall.

I bought a Marantz AV8801 processor for my main system that should arrive on Friday.

- Rich
post #15414 of 17194
Quote:
Originally Posted by arnyk View Post

I think you need to realize that just about every mainstream AVR puts out 80-120 wpc and that this is only a few dB less than the 200 wpc basic amp that many seem to be totally fascinated with.

It takes 10 dB (10x the power) to create the perception of twice as loud.

Unless you have very inefficient speakers 100 wpc is more than enough.

You will be able to get around 110 clean dB SPL out of L & R speakers with average efficiency and 100 wpc.

I beg to differ.

110 dB? At 1 meter, maybe. You loose 7-10 dB at average listening distance. And clean? A $600 AVR just doesn't do 100 Watts even it the specs claim otherwise. And if it does, distortion will be an issue at that level.

Now if the speakers are high efficiency, say 95 dB/Watt, then 80 real Watts would be plenty. The speakers of the OP are 91 dB, so 200 Watt would make up for that difference 100%.
post #15415 of 17194
Quote:
Originally Posted by arnyk View Post

I think you need to realize that just about every mainstream AVR puts out 80-120 wpc and that this is only a few dB less than the 200 wpc basic amp that many seem to be totally fascinated with.

It takes 10 dB (10x the power) to create the perception of twice as loud.

Unless you have very inefficient speakers 100 wpc is more than enough.

You will be able to get around 110 clean dB SPL out of L & R speakers with average efficiency and 100 wpc.

If you make a reasonable investment in subwoofer(s) you will be able to get room shaking sound without the extra size, weight, and expense of the outboard power amps.

Pick one and lets see how close they get to rated power with all channels driven.

...and I assume you only listen to music or movies with less than 10db of dynamic range?wink.gif
post #15416 of 17194
Quote:
Originally Posted by bootman_head_fi View Post

Pick one and lets see how close they get to rated power with all channels driven.

...and I assume you only listen to music or movies with less than 10db of dynamic range?wink.gif

+1
post #15417 of 17194
Quote:
Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post

One of the main issues for me with the UMC-200 is Emotiva's very poor track record with processors. It has put me off their processors in a big way. The UMC-200 may have fixed many of the issues that plagued its predecessor, the UMC-1, but I wouldn't be willing to take the risk personally.

So how many good prepros do they have to make until you are comfortable?
(and what was the issue with yours when you had it again?)
But then again, does it really matter since you are not buying one anyway and those that have (200s) apparently are happy with them?

I had a UMC-1 and now I don't. But I do not automatically count them out as an option.
(If I did that with every gear I owned that had an issue I think I would run out of manufacturers and just give up on this hobby. tongue.gif)
If someone wants UMC-1 advice, I feel I can honestly give them some.
Sometimes my advice gets them by, sometime I flat out tell them to try something else.
It all depends on the situation because everyone's setups/tastes/situations are so different.

Sorry to single your post out, no personal attack intended, just a point I'm trying to make.

Al
post #15418 of 17194
I agree with Keith. I only need to have been burned once and if someone learns from others experiences and there by avoids getting burned more power to them.
post #15419 of 17194
The track record of the UMC-1 can be traced by its original MSRP of $699 - last selling price of $499 - and current used prices which are all over the place. I've seen used prices (without upgrade card) from $265 shipped on the Emo Emporium about a week ago to $400-425 on ebay without upgrade card. There are probably 6-7 on ebay at any one time. I bought two of them - and sold them both. I also sold the upgrade cards that came with them. The NR818 I have now works.

Thats the 'editorial' of the UMC-1...
post #15420 of 17194
Quote:
Originally Posted by bootman_head_fi View Post

So how many good prepros do they have to make until you are comfortable?
For me, let's start with one.
Quote:
But then again, does it really matter since you are not buying one anyway and those that have (200s) apparently are happy with them?
There are plenty of people who have issues with their 200. Pop noises, motorboating, loss of surround preferences, etc., that you have seen for yourself at their forum. These may all be normal teething issues we see with new prepros. If these sorts of issues are all buttoned up in, say, 6 months, that would be then be a solid product IMHO. I'm willing to give them time to see how it plays out.
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