IMO: The JVC RS-1 is the Best 1080P at CES - Page 3

Originally Posted by Bob Sorel

No 3 panels can ever be aligned PERFECTLY, so a single panel design will always be sharper. How much sharper? That part is debatable...

Originally Posted by Bob Sorel

I don't think you quoted him quite right. I think what he said was more along the lines of (and I am NOT quoting him verbatim):


That statement, though close to yours, is absolutely correct. No 3 panels can ever be aligned PERFECTLY, so a single panel design will always be sharper. How much sharper? That part is debatable...

Originally Posted by Chris Dallas

Right & Somewhat Wrong..


"No 3 panels can ever be aligned PERFECTLY"... <-------- Right

"so a single panel design will always be sharper." <------------ Somewhat Wrong


If a 3 panel design is done well to very well the human "Eye" CANNOT detect the difference.

"An 3-chip Lcos design will NEVER be remotely as sharp as a 1-chip DLP with good optics - simple physics."

Screenshots. PLEASE!

Originally Posted by Cam Man

I got the vibe that the HD-1 was targeted to places like BB and CC, but I think that is what CES is about; they have to sell it to these retailers, and I got no vibe that this was a done deal with respect to the HD-1 (not that I would hear anything like this). The RS1 has a different marketing path, and there was plenty of meeting going on to find strong commitments for wholesale purchases. Occasionally, I had to leave the room so that such discussions could be made in private.

Technically, the final differences will be minimal it appears, but there is room for some uncertainty about the final bells and whistles. JVC is definately looking into a "calibration feature (application?)." I didn't press for more info, as it seemed the idea was not fully developed yet. I did infer that this was a feature that would only be available or could only be used with the RS1. Could this be a venture with William Phelps? Don't know. They were quite emphatic that the RS1 would be a product receiving a lot more care than the HD-1...or at least that is what I inferred.

I don't think the price will be much different. They specifically told me that they have gotten burned by doing this in the past, and don't want it to happen again. That said, I think the HD-1 might be a reasonable choice for pure DIYers that do not want significant tech or installation support from the seller, and can live with the one year warranty. For stronger enthusiasts, DIYers who need/want defintive, proactive design and installation support, then the RS1 is the better choice it would seem.

Originally Posted by Cam Man

I was told this pre-production model was at 99% of production model performance, but the implication was that the extra 1% would be worth it.

Production elements and components are in place at the factory awaiting the final go-ahead to begin production.

Originally Posted by Bob Sorel

I don't think you quoted him quite right. I think what he said was more along the lines of (and I am NOT quoting him verbatim):


That statement, though close to yours, is absolutely correct. No 3 panels can ever be aligned PERFECTLY, so a single panel design will always be sharper. How much sharper? That part is debatable...

Originally Posted by lovingdvd

Any ideas at all what area this extra 1% relates to? Contrast improvement, brightness improvement, fan noise improvement etc?



OK. On your mark...get set... GO!

Originally Posted by vigga

I don't want to break forum rules about pricing. Give a call to AVS - that's where I do all of my projector business. And as not to break any rules I'll just give %'s... the pre-order price of the Sony Pearl that I had for about two weeks (before deciding to wait and see how things shook out) was 11% less than the pre-order price for the RS1 (which I have ordered...much like everyone else ). Now I'm not sure if those deals are all still around - just give AVS a call.

Originally Posted by bluedevils

Thanks...for some strange reason I thought you were talking about the price diff between an hd1 and rs1. I'm already on rs1 pre order.

Originally Posted by maxleung

I seriously doubt that production units will have convergence as good as the one you saw, Cam Man! I bet they tweaked the convergence on that unit just for the show.

Good review.

Originally Posted by tlllava

Unlike many here, I am not an expert (real or imagined ) at front projection and am looking for my first projector for my first theater. I came to CES to find out what the best projector for me is without all the hype and flame wars. The RS-1 floored me.

Taking a step back, I spent quite a long time on day one of CES looking at the Panasonic 1000U and the BenQ W1000 (shown at the DLP booth). I was somewhat torn between these projectors as the BenQ popped a little more but was $2000 more (MAP). Also, the screens and rooms that I saw them in were different enough that they could have been the difference I was perceiving.

I then saw a Pearl in the SV Sound suite while listening to subs. (I ignored the picture at first as I was there for the sound.) The Pearl had a really nice picture and the demo benefited from much better light control over what I saw on the floor.

Then I went over to Ceasars to see the RS-1. It was on a (110" ?) ST130 screen in a dark room but with white walls. The picture blew me away. A scene from Too Fast Too Furious was outside at a mansion and was mostly bright with vivid colors. However, you could still see details in the dark areas of the foliage. Amazing. We then moved on to U571 to the screen when they take over the U2. The black level was stunning.

As if I hadn't already been sold, I then sneaked into the invitation only area down stairs where they were showing an HD1 (consumer version) vs. the Pearl. This was in a totally dark room with black velvet "walls" on two 120" ST 130 screens. The black level advantage of the JVC was obvious, especially when showing the clip title which was white letters on a black background. The Sony background was grey compared to the almost black background of the JVC. Also, the white text was not as white on the Pearl. One scene had the WB company logo on a CGI door knocker as part of a very dark brown door. The JVC showed very good detail on the knocker with brighter whites and more dark detail. The total effect made the knocker much more 3D compared to the flatter, less detailed look of the Pearl. The longer I stayed, the more I could see how the JVC trashed the Pearl. (And I think the Pearl looks dammed good.)

A few more details... The RS-1 upstairs was running in low lamp mode and was set to "normal". We changed this to (cinema?) and saw very little difference in the brightness or contrast but a small shift in color temp. The projector was quite! JVC claims 25db but I can tell you that the thing was three feet behind me at ear level and I had to pay attention to hear the fan. The volum on the clips was down low so as not to take away from the picture. A rep there measured the picture at 18 ftlb which he thought was too bright but I enjoyed. He said that the bulb had around 25 hours on it. Jim Faiman, JVC VP for Buisness Development, also demonstrated the response time of the LCD using the WinXP "Star Field" screen saver. He pointed out that just as the stars are about to leave the screen, they speed up. XP does this by skipping pixels. On the JVC, this was clear. Mr. Faiman explained that on projectors with slow refresh rates (slower LCD pannels), the stars will look like a blur rather than as a sequence of pixels. You kind of had to see it.

So, I'm no expert and I'm not going to get into a debate over this technology vs. that one. I'm just a guy who found the perfect projector. Well, except for the fact that I'll have to wait until March or so to get it since I didn't pre-order it.

-Tom

Oh no....that was verbatim. Can never be "REMOTELY" as sharp. As was this other "definitive" statement:

"so a single panel design will always be sharper." <------------ Somewhat Wrong

Originally Posted by Alex512

Do you or anyone know how many of these can they pump out in one day?

Originally Posted by Bob Sorel

Sorry, Chris, but that part of the statement is not "somewhat wrong". A single panel is in absolute fact sharper than ANY 3 panel design precisely because of the simple physics involved. No matter how well 3 panels are aligned, they can NEVER be perfectly aligned. I will agree that it might not be perceptible to the human eye, but it is still there.

Originally Posted by Cam Man

P.S.-Strangest thing seen at JVC was a 2.35 RPTV prototype.

Originally Posted by Bob Sorel

Ok, Ron, if your quote was verbatim, then there is plenty of subjectivity in it. The word "remotely" is highly debatable.

Sorry, Chris, but that part of the statement is not "somewhat wrong". A single panel is in absolute fact sharper than ANY 3 panel design precisely because of the simple physics involved. No matter how well 3 panels are aligned, they can NEVER be perfectly aligned. I will agree that it might not be perceptible to the human eye, but it is still there.

By the same token you can also argue that no single chip design ever displays all three primary colors at the same time. It is physically impossible using a color wheel, but to what degree it can be seen by the human eye varies from one person to the next.

(I'm off. My girlfriend wants to have a word with me about this "ignorant" comment...)

Originally Posted by Cam Man

I don't doubt that the statements by The Lion and others are true regarding this, but...after seeing these projectors I would forward two things; one objective, and one subjective. First, I think that the difference in resolution between that delivered by panel alignment at the level that is demonstrated by JVC with the RS1/HD-1 at CES and single panel DMD may be moot based on 20/20 visual acuity and the screen sizes in question. (edit: I see Chris just made the same point above). At IMAX size/subtended viewing angles, maybe it is a significant factor. But the differences are so minute at to render them inconsequential unless you have incredible vision...which may be a curse in this case, a blessing if you are a fighter pilot. Yesterday, we could find zero panel misalignment on the RS1 with our MK II eyeballs at any distance from the screen.