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Samsung 81 Series anticipation thread - Page 9  

post #241 of 4495
Can anyone confirm - is the 81 series the only one that will have the 120 refresh rate? Will the 65 series be 120 as well or just 60?
post #242 of 4495
I believe the 71 series will also offer 120hz, just no leds.
post #243 of 4495
Quote:
Originally Posted by avarga1974 View Post

Can anyone confirm - is the 81 series the only one that will have the 120 refresh rate? Will the 65 series be 120 as well or just 60?

81 series is not 120Hz, it is local dimming LED BL @ 60Hz. The 71s will be 120Hz but using CCFL BL. 61/65/66 series are regular CCFL BL @ 60Hz.

KO
post #244 of 4495
Anyone have any info about the 71s? I'm specifically looking for size and price. Hoping they have a 57" or larger.
post #245 of 4495
I'm only interested in the 71. I really want some concrete info as well.

The main issue for me is: does the 71 accept a 120 Hz input over DVI or HDMI at 1920x1080p? (in other words, can I set my resolution in Windows to 1920x1080 and set the refresh rate to 120 Hz, and output it to the 71)
post #246 of 4495
1920x1080@120hz, not likely anytime soon. Current HDMI chips do not support that, and no reason for them to work on that. For example SiI9133:
Digital Video Input/Output

Dual integrated HDMI 1.3 cores
Supports DTV resolutions up to 1080p @ 60Hz or 720p/1080i @ 120Hz with 36-bit color depth
Flexible digital video interface:
- 24/30/36-bit RGB/YCbCr 4:4:4
- 16/20/24-bit YCbCr 4:2:2
- 8/10/12-bit YCbCr 4:2:2 (ITU-R BT.656)
- 12-bit digital media interface
Integrated RGB to YCbCr color space conversion with 12-bit accuracy
4:2:2ÃÃ* 4:4:4 converter with 12-bit accuracy
post #247 of 4495
Quote:
Originally Posted by komari View Post

81 series is not 120Hz, it is local dimming LED BL @ 60Hz. The 71s will be 120Hz but using CCFL BL. 61/65/66 series are regular CCFL BL @ 60Hz.

KO

81s are 120Hz.

From the first post of this thread:
Sizes - 40,46,52,57 inches
1080p
120Hz
LED BLU
Contrast - 100 000:1
Local Dimming
HDMI 1.3 (3 ports)
Color Gamut - 105% NTSC
MSRPs - unknown
Availability - July 2007
post #248 of 4495
Curious, any idea of the density of LED's on the panel? Surely it's not per-pixel right?
Everything I read suggestions region, which kinda makes me wonder a bit. Thanks.
post #249 of 4495
Quote:
Originally Posted by wtr_wkr View Post

81s are 120Hz.

From the first post of this thread:
Sizes - 40,46,52,57 inches
1080p
120Hz
LED BLU
Contrast - 100 000:1
Local Dimming
HDMI 1.3 (3 ports)
Color Gamut - 105% NTSC
MSRPs - unknown
Availability - July 2007

And the posts below it were questioning whether the info was correct. See this http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...6&page=7&pp=30 where I asked about the 71 series and got a response from OreoJoe. No one has all the details about the new sets yet, but he had two sources where he got his info from which says the 81 are not 120Hz. It looks like Samsung is keeping the two separate this year...unless you know otherwise.

KO
post #250 of 4495
man this tv has sort of derailed my plans, lol. Guess we will see. Tvs are starting to be like computers. At what point do you get in?
post #251 of 4495
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nambit View Post

Curious, any idea of the density of LED's on the panel? Surely it's not per-pixel right?

No, there are millions of pixels but probably only a few thousand LEDs. Still, I anticipate an improvement over whole-screen backlights.
post #252 of 4495
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nambit View Post

Curious, any idea of the density of LED's on the panel? Surely it's not per-pixel right?
Everything I read suggestions region, which kinda makes me wonder a bit. Thanks.

I'm trying to imagine two million LED's and what it would cost let alone fit into a panel. Don't know that such a thing would be possible or affordable. I believe it's the pureness of the white light and it's deployment not how many.

I imagine it may be close cousin to the Sony 70" though Samsung may call it something different.

"TRILUMINOS LED Backlight
The TRILUMINOS LED backlight is used to create a pure white light by emitting pure red, green and blue light allowing for the creation of a wider spectrum of color (102% of the NTSC color gamut) and produces colors like you see them in the real world."

post #253 of 4495
Quote:
Originally Posted by westa6969 View Post

I'm trying to imagine two million LED's and what it would cost let alone fit into a panel. Don't know that such a thing would be possible or affordable. I believe it's the pureness of the white light and it's deployment not how many. [/indent]

Before fantasizing let's check the reality. Reality is that the 40" LED BL Sammy panel sold in Europe has 2160 LEDs. These LEDs are arranged in groups of four (2 green+1 red+1 blue) giving 540 groups.

There are outdoor panels composed of discrete LEDs but they are huge. Thinking about 2 milion LED TV is just reinventing the OLED display . There is however one critical difference: OLEDs are made of organic materials which makes the technology suitable for making milions of densly packed LEDs (in a process similar to printing).
post #254 of 4495
So if someone could find a way to print inorganic LED we could just have a bare LED panel with <1 msec response time, 1M hour life, 1M:1 CR, etc?

Why not ILED ???
post #255 of 4495
Not sure if there is anything new here:

http://www.i4u.com/article8304.html
post #256 of 4495
^^ Those aren't the LED ones. For some reason, Samsung's 81-series abroad is totally
different. The Korean 81-series seems comparable to the NA 65-series.
post #257 of 4495
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark_1080p View Post

So if someone could find a way to print inorganic LED we could just have a bare LED panel with <1 msec response time, 1M hour life, 1M:1 CR, etc? Why not ILED ???

Cost and technology reasons as usual. Even if somebody would create technology to put milions of LEDs on glass panels there would be still a huge problem with light uniformity. LEDs have quite big light output variation and it also depends on temperature and aging. So not only milions of LEDs would have to be put on glass, each would have to be monitored and adjusted individually.

As said before, there are LED displays for huge outdoor applications. They are made of discrete LEDs and cost gazilions.

The only viable LED technology for displays is OLED.
post #258 of 4495
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nambit View Post

^^ Those aren't the LED ones. For some reason, Samsung's 81-series abroad is totally
different. The Korean 81-series seems comparable to the NA 65-series.

There is also M86 series announced for UK/EU:

http://www.samsung.com/uk/products/t...Specifications

While in the specs there is no mention of LED BL, the M86 series sets have HDMI 1.3 and 127% normal TV color gamut. This indicates LED BL is actually used. Also, these sets do not have frame
rate upconversion.
post #259 of 4495
Are there any pictures of the sets out yet?
post #260 of 4495
I went and watched the 65 series. Wow, it was nice to see an LCD again without visible defects. It is nice to have a backup monitor if the 81 series is too expensive. I am going to have trouble holding out much longer for the 81... It would be nice if they could at least get something up on the web site soon.
post #261 of 4495
No kidding Mike! I just wish they had something on he 81 or 71-series. It's a pain
to deal with vapourware with no details, no pics, nothing, and have a nice set as
the 65-series sitting in front of you. I kinda expect the 81 to be too expensive for
me (at least, the 52 inch model). Then again, I was looking at the Pioneer FHD1
Plasma (which I have to tell myself each day is not worth $7K+, especially if I fear
image retention).

Hope some stuff on the 81/71's come out in the next couple weeks.

(sigh, seems Firefox keeps failing when I'm editing posts here)
post #262 of 4495
On the New Samsung LCD panel thread (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...&page=23&pp=30) someone posted a link to the German Samsung website describing what would be the closest to the 81s, but with 100Hz (their equivalent to our 120Hz). The price on the 40" was Euro 4299 and apparently that is not even a 1080p set

Here's the link to the translated link also provided in the thread:
http://translate.google.com/translat...2d911743E9EA78
post #263 of 4495
led backlight will be for next spring for me...
post #264 of 4495
Quote:
Originally Posted by komari View Post

On the New Samsung LCD panel thread (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...&page=23&pp=30) someone posted a link to the German Samsung website describing what would be the closest to the 81s, but with 100Hz (their equivalent to our 120Hz). The price on the 40" was Euro 4299 and apparently that is not even a 1080p set

Here's the link to the translated link also provided in the thread:
http://translate.google.com/translat...2d911743E9EA78

that's the old LED-BL set that came here out around september last year and yes, it is only 1366x768 and the MSRP of samsung in europe are never a serious indicator of street prices. these sets sell for like 2500 now which is almost 50% off MSRP.

this sets have nothing to do with the announced 81series

on a side note i have to say that they perform amazing when fed with bluray or HD-DVD. amazing colours and very bright.
post #265 of 4495
Quote:
Originally Posted by Schwarzenegger View Post

that's the old LED-BL set that came here out around september last year and yes, it is only 1366x768 and the MSRP of samsung in europe are never a serious indicator of street prices. these sets sell for like 2500 now which is almost 50% off MSRP.

this sets have nothing to do with the announced 81series

on a side note i have to say that they perform amazing when fed with bluray or HD-DVD. amazing colours and very bright.

I must have missed the LED BL from last year - what are the model numbers? I'm surprized that I didn't catch any buzz over such sets if they were already in production and in peoples homes.
post #266 of 4495
Quote:
Originally Posted by komari View Post

I must have missed the LED BL from last year - what are the model numbers? I'm surprized that I didn't catch any buzz over such sets if they were already in production and in peoples homes.

they are called the "M91"-series
http://av.samsung.de/article.asp?art...8-911743E9EA78

like said, they can be purchased in almost every electronics-store here and IMO look very nice but they don't offer local dimming
post #267 of 4495
Quote:
Originally Posted by Schwarzenegger View Post

they are called the "M91"-series
http://av.samsung.de/article.asp?art...8-911743E9EA78

like said, they can be purchased in almost every electronics-store here and IMO look very nice but they don't offer local dimming

Now I know why I missed them - I assumed you ment they were out here in the US. Just realized that you're actually in Austria! I don't think we've had any LED BL panels in the US consumer electronics market yet, maybe some commercial? I'm sure you're right that the prices will be lower, but probably not low enough for a lot of people.

KO
post #268 of 4495
Quote:
Originally Posted by mike123abc View Post

I went and watched the 65 series. Wow, it was nice to see an LCD again without visible defects. It is nice to have a backup monitor if the 81 series is too expensive. I am going to have trouble holding out much longer for the 81... It would be nice if they could at least get something up on the web site soon.


Are the 81's worth waiting for over the 61-6's? I was planning on getting a 4066f soon, but Im wondering now if I should hold out?
post #269 of 4495
as much as I love CR and colours, My biggest concern is how smooth my xbox 360 runs and the hockey games I ocassionaly watch are. If the 120hz sets smooth things out, then thats what I must buy. I got so much money buring a giant hole n my pocket right now, and the only thing keeping me from running to the store this minute and buying the 65 or 66f series is knowing that my xbox wont run 100% smooth unless I have 120hz (or so im lead to believe)
post #270 of 4495
Quote:
Originally Posted by komari View Post

Now I know why I missed them - I assumed you ment they were out here in the US. Just realized that you're actually in Austria! I don't think we've had any LED BL panels in the US consumer electronics market yet, maybe some commercial? I'm sure you're right that the prices will be lower, but probably not low enough for a lot of people.

KO

haha, sorry forgot to mention this

you're right, AFAIK they're exclusively available in the european market for now. but for sure the 81series will be a global product and has potential to become the best thing out there. if they will perform on colours like the M91 does plus deliver amazing contrastlevels through local dimming i'm having a hard time to imagine any other display(-technology) that will be able to compete with samsung.
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