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Denver, CO - OTA - Page 6

post #151 of 8269
1/31/07 at 4:42pm
I guess I read NE as NW PA. Anyway, interesting situation in Erie PA anyway.
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post #152 of 8269
1/31/07 at 4:59pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by milehighmike View Post

I guess I read NE as NW PA. Anyway, interesting situation in Erie PA anyway.

Erie is about as far from me as one can go and still be in PA. Anyway, I believe it's true that low power TV stations can continue transmitting NTSC.

Concerning the transmission range from lookout:

Lookout 7374 feet AMSL
Tower + 800 feet
----------
Antenna 8174
Denver - 5280
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2894 feet above service area (h)

Distance to horizon (mi) = 1.34 * sqrt(h) = 1.34 * 54.6 =

about 73 miles

Receiving antenna at 25 feet

Distance to Horizon = 1.34 * 5 = 6.7 miles

Total distance is about 80 miles


Perhaps a bit less since the prairie land east of Denver is falling off in altitude.
Anyway, its just an estimate.


--- CHAS
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post #153 of 8269
1/31/07 at 7:13pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by milehighmike View Post

I did read somewhere that one station, WSEE, stated that it will not make the transition to digital and will continue its analog broadcast after analog shutdown.

How will they do that, via cable?

The whole reason for the analog shutdown is that the government is going to sell off the NTSC frequencies for other uses. That means WSEE's analog broadcast license goes bye-bye.
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post #154 of 8269
1/31/07 at 7:42pm
Looks like KWGN-DT's still having issues; the first half of Gilmore Girls last night was in 4:3, and when they did switch to the HD feed, there were more than a few glitches.

I just don't understand why the CW still can't get this right; you still see all kinds of glitches in their network programming, even on their SD feed, that just don't seem to occur with other networks. (e.g. it's not just KWGN; the glitches seem to originate at the head end as I've seen them occur on WPIX and KTLA as well.)
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post #155 of 8269
1/31/07 at 8:06pm
Did anybody else watch 'Bones' on Fox tonight? Throughout the last half of the show, they kept cutting from HD to SD to run an insipid crawl at the bottom promoting some web thing about American Idol.

Talk about taking you completely out of the show. (And it was one of the most intense Bones episodes ever - very Silence of the Lambs)

Unacceptable!
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post #156 of 8269
1/31/07 at 8:59pm
If any of you are interested in how bad the Erie PA DTV situation is compared to what we've endured in Denver, check out this blog:
http://eriemediablog.com/

On the right side of the page, click on HDTV. Apparently, only the PBS station, WQLN, can pass HD. The other three network stations, WICU, WJET, and WSEE, are all low power and cannot pass HD, even from network feeds.

I don't follow local situations all over the country, but I grew up in western NY state so I follow what's going on in Buffalo, Erie, and Toronto.
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post #157 of 8269
1/31/07 at 11:58pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by santellavision View Post

Did anybody else watch 'Bones' on Fox tonight? Throughout the last half of the show, they kept cutting from HD to SD to run an insipid crawl at the bottom promoting some web thing about American Idol.

Talk about taking you completely out of the show. (And it was one of the most intense Bones episodes ever - very Silence of the Lambs)

Unacceptable!

I saw that.

If I was the producer of Bones, I'd be in someones office at Fox first thing tomorrow morning raising holy hell.
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post #158 of 8269
2/1/07 at 4:53am
Quote:
Originally Posted by milehighmike View Post

...... I grew up in western NY state so I follow what's going on in Buffalo, Erie, and Toronto.

Good place to be from huh ..... err....wait.....
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post #159 of 8269
2/1/07 at 1:35pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by santellavision View Post

Did anybody else watch 'Bones' on Fox tonight? Throughout the last half of the show, they kept cutting from HD to SD to run an insipid crawl at the bottom promoting some web thing about American Idol.

Talk about taking you completely out of the show. (And it was one of the most intense Bones episodes ever - very Silence of the Lambs)

Unacceptable!

The whole on-air promotion thing has gotten out of hand. It is as if whatever you are currently watching isn't as good or important as the coming program they want to promote. TNTHD is the worst with their race car pit crew and flashlight flashing Closer. Somewhere along the line the networks decided that since the viewers didn't mind a scores crawl at the bottom of their game broadcast or a news crawl at the bottom of their newscast, they wouldn't mind having any of their viewing interrupted by some important (to the networks) message.

I don't see a way to make them stop and I can only see the situation continuing to deteriorate. It does make DVDs more attractive.
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post #160 of 8269
2/1/07 at 2:24pm
I know its OT, but I sure agree. I am sick of all the adds scrolled during shows and games. It is really most annoying for me during a hockey game when they show advertising characters on the bottom of the screen that half the time cover up the player or players with the puck. I think we are condemned to watch this from now on. You are right, at least movies you can go to the DVD and skip the show, but with live sports, the options are limited, watch or don't watch.

Can't say I have seen many issues on switching HD/SD, but I don't watch very much network (Heroes, Smallville, & Friday Night Lights are about it this year). I haven't seen too many issues on those shows, so maybe I am lucky.
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post #161 of 8269
2/1/07 at 2:36pm
I totally agree. It's gotten out-of-control with the animated graphical teasers. Logos are bad enough and they are never going away. That was started by networks who didn't want their footage stolen and used for free, not for promotion. Now, its both. And yeah, TNT is the worst!!!

It's just on the Fox thing, it wasn't the network, it was KDVR harshly dropping from HD to SD to insert it. Total BS!
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post #162 of 8269
2/1/07 at 2:47pm
In this age of TiVo and other DVR's, where people regularly skip commercials, I think we should expect to see more of this.

Just wait till Google figures out how to insert targeted ads in the scroll bar into digital TV. "Adsense for Broadcasters" will shoot their valuation up over $500B But don't worry, we'll eventually become ad-blind, just like we are now with web pages. Of course, then they'll figure something else out.
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post #163 of 8269
2/1/07 at 4:08pm
Oh, it happening. On Dish, during certain commercials, they have this box that pops up and says click the info button on your remote to learn more about this ad. Oh yeah, it's gonna' get even worse.
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post #164 of 8269
2/1/07 at 5:33pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by santellavision View Post

Oh, it happening. On Dish, during certain commercials, they have this box that pops up and says click the info button on your remote to learn more about this ad. Oh yeah, it's gonna' get even worse.

Comcast just added 'commercials' at the bottom of their guide and when you're scrolling down it actually scrolls to it like it were a channel so each section (6 maybe) that you scroll down you have to scroll through an ad instead of all channels. I was pretty upset by this. It was almost as bad as the onslaught of messages I get telling me to buy the HD package at a discount rate or buy the HBO package at a discount rate. Man, when you pay the kind of money I do the least they should do is note that you've already purchased ALL of those and not send you messages bi-weekly asking you to subscribe. VERY disorganized and unprofessional.
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post #165 of 8269
2/1/07 at 5:33pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by weldon View Post

In this age of TiVo and other DVR's, where people regularly skip commercials, I think we should expect to see more of this................

You hit the nail on the head. The reason we see all of this and will see more is the fact that so many people now DVR the shows to watch later when they can skip the commercials. It also has the added benefit of encouraging you to buy the DVD version of the show at a later date so you can see it 'the way it was meant to be seen', or the way they should have shown it in the first place.
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post #166 of 8269
2/1/07 at 8:51pm
Yea Ernie

Put me down for 8/7/08. My birthday.
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post #167 of 8269
2/2/07 at 6:54am
PAW,

You're down. Damn, I have to keep this list for 2 years or 742 days until Analog shut-off - aaaaaah!
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post #168 of 8269
2/2/07 at 7:33am
Quote:
Originally Posted by santellavision View Post

PAW,

You're down. Damn, I have to keep this list for 2 years or 742 days until Analog shut-off - aaaaaah!

So you SERIOUSLY think we will have a winner by then????
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post #169 of 8269
2/2/07 at 7:37am
Quote:
Originally Posted by JMartinko View Post

So you SERIOUSLY think we will have a winner by then????

It's dragged on so long that none of us are "winners"
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post #170 of 8269
2/2/07 at 10:16am
Quote:
Originally Posted by santellavision View Post

PAW,

You're down. Damn, I have to keep this list for 2 years or 742 days until Analog shut-off - aaaaaah!


I really hate to be a killjoy, but it's 746 days.
....jc
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post #171 of 8269
2/2/07 at 11:16am
Quote:
Originally Posted by santellavision View Post

Did anybody else watch 'Bones' on Fox tonight? Throughout the last half of the show, they kept cutting from HD to SD to run an insipid crawl at the bottom promoting some web thing about American Idol.

Talk about taking you completely out of the show. (And it was one of the most intense Bones episodes ever - very Silence of the Lambs)

Unacceptable!

Absolutely agreed. That was the most piss-poor reason I've ever seen to cut away from HD. Oh, we need to run a crawl in the space reserved for emergency announcements to inform you that we will have our chat room open during American Idol.

Not only unacceptable...Unf*ckingAcceptable!
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post #172 of 8269
2/2/07 at 12:20pm
Oooops, I stuck in the the wrong date by mistake. (It's now 746, must be a leap year thing) Check here again with the new date programmed in. (This based on it being midnight on Feb 17.)

http://www.santellaproductions.com/dtv/Onairdate.htm
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post #173 of 8269
2/2/07 at 1:33pm
My contact at Jeffco sent me this.

Quote:
The Jefferson County Board of Commissioners will hold a special meeting Monday afternoon to discuss a potential solution with the Lake Cedar Group regarding digital television towers on Lookout Mountain.

The federal government recently passed legislation that allows Lake Cedar, a group of Denver television stations, to build high definition television towers on Lookout Mountain, where the stations currently broadcast their television signals. The new federal law may preempt certain county government land use and zoning authority in this instance.

In light of the new legislation, Jefferson County is considering possible solutions with the Lake Cedar Group to ensure the health and safety of county residents.

The meeting will be held from 1:00 p.m. to 3:00 p.m. on Monday, February 5 in Hearing Room One of the Jefferson County Administration and Courts Facility, 100 Jefferson County Parkway, Golden. The meeting will open with a presentation of the proposed solution. Brief comments from the public are welcome but must be specific to the proposed solution.

This meeting may be cancelled if a potentially acceptable solution is not proposed prior to the meeting. Please check the county's Web site, www.jeffco.us, for last minute information.

Additionally, the Board of County Commissioners is scheduling a meeting on the rezoning issue for early March at the latest.

Just thought you guys would like to know....

-Wabisabi
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post #174 of 8269
2/2/07 at 1:55pm
Quote:
....................The meeting will open with a presentation of the proposed solution............This meeting may be cancelled if a potentially acceptable solution is not proposed prior to the meeting.

wabisabi
Thanks for the information, it is very valuable as are all of your posts.


Just curious as to who they assume will make the proposal, Jeffco, or the LCG. Since the LCG is in the drivers seat, I wonder why they would propose anything unless it is to change their previously 'approved' tower to add channel 6 or others to the new tower. I don't see the LCG proposing many changes since they would have to go back for FCC approval again. As far as Jeffco goes, it is not clear to me what they could propose other than what the LCG has presented. It would seem the LCG would be under no obligation to consider any other proposal.
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post #175 of 8269
2/2/07 at 2:35pm
I'm not surprised. As we all know, the county is screwed and this is a nice easy way for them to save some political face. They hold a public meeting, discuss the new tower, listen to a couple of whining sCARE followers, and say they did something. Maybe both sides even present some give and take so they both look like they compromised. But in the end, LCG gets what they want and the commissioners know it.

Edit: I like the way the Commish's announced this (cough) "Special meeting" on their website Friday for Monday! Would that be considered as sCARE boasts... "Under the Cover of Darkness"

http://co.jefferson.co.us/bcc/agenda.htm
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post #176 of 8269
2/2/07 at 4:14pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by santellavision View Post

..........
Edit: I like the way the Commish's announced this (cough) "Special meeting" on their website Friday for Monday! Would that be considered as sCARE boasts... "Under the Cover of Darkness"

http://co.jefferson.co.us/bcc/agenda.htm

Not just hiding it on any weekend, it is under cover of the Super Bowl weekend just to provide even more distraction. I assume (S)CARE will take them to court to delay the meeting six months to a year and a half until they can come prepared. With any luck, construction would be well underway by that time.
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post #177 of 8269
2/2/07 at 4:23pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by JMartinko View Post

Just curious as to who they assume will make the proposal, Jeffco, or the LCG. Since the LCG is in the drivers seat, I wonder why they would propose anything unless it is to change their previously 'approved' tower to add channel 6 or others to the new tower. I don't see the LCG proposing many changes since they would have to go back for FCC approval again. As far as Jeffco goes, it is not clear to me what they could propose other than what the LCG has presented. It would seem the LCG would be under no obligation to consider any other proposal.

I suspect if LCG and BCC agree on something, the BCC has their vote, it goes back to Judge Jackson who dismisses the Golden/(s)CARE case based on that. Then Deb files a Notice of Appeal within 40 days, and so on and so forth. Without an injunction from the trial court, however, construction can proceed. Otherwise the legal case proceeds in US District Court.
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post #178 of 8269
2/2/07 at 4:26pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by santellavision View Post

I'm not surprised. As we all know, the county is screwed and this is a nice easy way for them to save some political face.

Indeed, I've been predicting as much ever since S.4092 passed. And I won't be surprised if LCG adds some spoonful of sugar to help the medicine go down, even though they aren't obligated to do so.

And as HDJello noted, at that point Judge Jackson either dismissed based on the new vote or dismissed based on the LCG motion (which Jeffco no longer bothers to contest). Once construction starts in earnest the game is REALLY over - no court is going to make them tear it down.
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post #179 of 8269
2/3/07 at 7:46am
Quote:
Originally Posted by santellavision View Post

Edit: I like the way the Commish's announced this (cough) "Special meeting" on their website Friday for Monday! Would that be considered as sCARE boasts... "Under the Cover of Darkness"

Quote:
Originally Posted by JMartinko View Post

under cover of the Super Bowl weekend just to provide even more distraction

That's exactly what I was thinking as well. Will the Mayor of Golden also find this reprehensible?

I thought this sentence was interesting:

Quote:


The new federal law MAY preempt certain county government land use and zoning authority in this instance

May? I thought it pretty much stomped them.

I'm thinking we should show up in force wearing t-shirts that say "Waa Waa Waa" on the front and "Nyah Nyah Nyah" on the back! *

* = Please don't interpret this as seeming somewhat vindictive or vengeful, instead it should be interpreted as being entirely vindictive and vengeful!
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post #180 of 8269
2/3/07 at 7:52am
Is it just me or is everyone experiencing a very slow AVSForum with server timeouts today?
Maybe AVS and all of us DTV geeks are finally mainstream and every 'Joe Sixpack" is out there scrambling to figure out how to get the game in HD Sunday.

Does this mean we are trendsetters? I think that sounds far cooler than "early-adopters".
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