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St. Louis, MO - HDTV - Page 14

post #391 of 12787
1/30/07 at 10:00am
We finally got our DVR box from Charter installed this morning. My wife tells me it's the Moto 3416, but I've not spent any time with it yet. I had a HDMI cable waiting for the installer and he used it to hook up the box, but then it took 45 min for charter to activate it. He and my wife apparently watched a movie while waiting. The guy did not have much good to say about Charter, and apparently knows the tech that's setting up HD boxes and not setting them to output HD. He said he's never had a HDMI cable waitng for him before.
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post #392 of 12787
1/30/07 at 12:18pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by TSuellentrop View Post

It seems like everybody can get all their channels in with high signal strengths. I picked up this
antenna last night hand brought it up to the attic. I live in the Carrington Place subdivision in St. Peters. I don't have it mounted anywhere, but resting on a beam and I am getting not so good results. The main reason I got it was to get 4.1 in for Sunday but I can only get 2 of the 10 signal strength bars and it looses signal about every 30 seconds on my Samsung DLP. The most other channels get is around 4-5 out of 10 bars. Would mounting it really help? I had a hard enough time finding a place to even get 4.1 in. I ran the cable straight down to the tv. What about an amplifier? It seems everybody else in my area get most channels in with high signals. It seems like I've rambled but I could really use some help. THANKS!

I would think that antenna would work for you. It sounds as it it is not mounted or pointed in the correct direction. I wouldn't worry about the cable length too much as I doubt that is the issue. Try mounting it in the attic as high up as possible and make sure it is pointed correctly.

Scott
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post #393 of 12787
1/30/07 at 1:14pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by GlendaleHDTV View Post

Isn't the HR10-250 the one with Tivo (sorry, I'm stuck with Charter - tree issues)?... That wouldn't explain the price jump on new ones, but that's the only reason I can think of.

The jump is, as wmschultz points out, is because the HR10-250 is the ONLY D* HD DVR with Tivo software. The new D* HD DVR is NOT Tivo based & has many bugs in it, & many folks simply will NOT accept this new box, even though it will NOT work on any of the new MPEG4 D* HD channels. Right now this is limited to the HD local channels through the dish, but eventually, D* will be adding more national HD ONLY in MPEG4, so these boxes will NOT work with them, either.

BUT, these boxes WILL continue to work on the OTA digital locals (HD & SD) & since many folks ONLY care about the networks in HD, these boxes will continue to fill the bill for that as well.
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post #394 of 12787
1/30/07 at 1:29pm
I just switched out my hr10-250 for the new hr-20 from d* even after reading all the horror stories on dbstalk. So far so good (I've had it up and running with the latest update since Saturday). I had brief breakups on Fox last night as well (about 1-2 sec) which sounds like everyone regardless of the box they were using. Either way it is still way better than the 10 sec problem that the 6.3a Tivo software was having.

It kills me that D* got rid of Tivo, but the fact that I can get about $400 for the old unit on ebay takes away some of the pain
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post #395 of 12787
1/30/07 at 1:51pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jacobms1 View Post

I just switched out my hr10-250 for the new hr-20 from d* even after reading all the horror stories on dbstalk. So far so good (I've had it up and running with the latest update since Saturday). I had brief breakups on Fox last night as well (about 1-2 sec) which sounds like everyone regardless of the box they were using. Either way it is still way better than the 10 sec problem that the 6.3a Tivo software was having.

It kills me that D* got rid of Tivo, but the fact that I can get about $400 for the old unit on ebay takes away some of the pain


Dbstalk put the fear in me on pulling the trigger from some of the threads over there the problems seemed massive.The more I got to reading about the hr 20 it seems to have gotten a lot better so I should be in business soon with D*.
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post #396 of 12787
1/30/07 at 3:20pm
Those of you with E*...has your OTA info populated on the sub channels yet? (9.1, 9.2, 9.3, 9.4)
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post #397 of 12787
1/30/07 at 4:04pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joseph Clark View Post

These breakups occur with Fox all the time, and they're getting worse. They're at about the same level as they were before. For a while they seem to have minimized the problems, but they're back. D*, E*, OTA, it's all bad.

Ditto, ditto, ditto. We have a KTVI engineer who drops in from time to time but it seems to be an uphill battle for him too.
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post #398 of 12787
1/30/07 at 4:09pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by SHADO 1 View Post

Those of you with E*...has your OTA info populated on the sub channels yet? (9.1, 9.2, 9.3, 9.4)

As of yesterday, 9.3, the analog Channel 9 mirror, has full guide info in my 622. I noticed it appear a week or two ago. Now if only 9.1, the "HD" national feed, would populate in the guide. I miss good stuff all the time on that channel. While it's true that it's very bit-starved, a Nova episode on 9.1 still looks great when compared with the same show on 9.3 in SD.
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post #399 of 12787
1/30/07 at 4:46pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by TSuellentrop View Post

It seems like everybody can get all their channels in with high signal strengths. I picked up this
antenna last night hand brought it up to the attic. I live in the Carrington Place subdivision in St. Peters. I don't have it mounted anywhere, but resting on a beam and I am getting not so good results. The main reason I got it was to get 4.1 in for Sunday but I can only get 2 of the 10 signal strength bars and it looses signal about every 30 seconds on my Samsung DLP. The most other channels get is around 4-5 out of 10 bars. Would mounting it really help? I had a hard enough time finding a place to even get 4.1 in. I ran the cable straight down to the tv. What about an amplifier? It seems everybody else in my area get most channels in with high signals. It seems like I've rambled but I could really use some help. THANKS!

Take it back and get a ChannelMaster 4221:

http://www.hdtvprimer.com/ANTENNAS/cm4221.html

You can buy it locally for $20-22 at Skywalker in O'Fallon.

I struggled for years with yagi-style UHF antenna's before switching to the 4-bay style of the CM4221. With this thing, it's point it and forget it. I've installed 5 of them for friends, relatives, neighbors and everyone gets locked signals with no issues (O'Fallon/St. Peters area). Some have them in the attic, others have them even in the basement!
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post #400 of 12787
1/30/07 at 5:58pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by djearl81 View Post

FinRx -

I looked up the specs to your TV:

It says that the TV has a "Quick Start Seamless HDTV (ATSC) and NTSC tuner." So yes, you should be able to connect an antenna to the tuner on the television and receive OTA HD signals. You'll probably need to switch inputs to go from the cable card to the Antenna...

If the TV only has one input for an RG6 (standard cable wire,) then you may need to purchase a combiner/splitter like this:

The TV should allow you to manually add the OTA channels and the cable channels that you want. I don't have any experience with the cable card on which to draw. Here's a picture of the inputs:

It looks like a nice television.

Thanks for the info. It is a great TV, if only I could get charter to make it work. They called me today at work to see if there was something they could do over the phone instead of making a service call...cheap b#%#s.
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post #401 of 12787
1/30/07 at 6:08pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by moman19 View Post

Ditto, ditto, ditto. We have a KTVI engineer who drops in from time to time but it seems to be an uphill battle for him too.

The battle is making progress I have a member of management informed of the issue and he seems very interested to find the cause. Sooo.....

Attention Everyone with KTVI Problems:


Ways you can help:

Wednesday night during primetime and the 9:00 news....

Write down the times you see any breakup and how long the breakup lasts. If you have a dvr, frame counting is a plus. Screenshots are great too. If it's during a commercial, please note who the advertiser is.

It would also be helpfull if you include the following information:
Your location (wentzville, edwardsville, etc)
What you recieve on (OTA, DirTV, Charter, etc)

Please email your results to ktvihd@gmail.com so I can look for similarities or patterns.

I'm doing this just as a fellow HD lover, but hopefully we can make some progress.

Thanks Folks..
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post #402 of 12787
1/30/07 at 7:21pm
So are you all not seeing it at the station?
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post #403 of 12787
1/30/07 at 7:30pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by wmschultz View Post

So are you all not seeing it at the station?

not possible, Bill...either they're not monitoring it via conventional terrestrial reception, or no one is watching the monitor.

I think every station should have a OTA antenna, a Charter, DISH, and DTV hookup, and monitor what their customers are viewing. They could call it Quality Control, or QC, for short. Betchya other companies would adopt the idea
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post #404 of 12787
1/30/07 at 7:35pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by wmschultz View Post

So are you all not seeing it at the station?

We have three monitors to view our HD signal. One in master control, one in the engineering shop, and one in the lobby. The lobby is the only monitor that doesn't have closed captioning. Most of the things I've seen at home would fall below that captioning. Is it ideal? No. But it's what we have to work with. It's something that will hopefully change with time.
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post #405 of 12787
1/30/07 at 7:35pm
I think KSDK monitors their's. At least that is what the dude told me last year when I called about DD not being ON.
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post #406 of 12787
1/30/07 at 7:36pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by kdg454 View Post

not possible, Bill...either they're not monitoring it via conventional terrestrial reception, or no one is watching the monitor.

I think every station should have a OTA antenna, a Charter, DISH, and DTV hookup, and monitor what their customers are viewing. They could call it Quality Control, or QC, for short. Betchya other companies would adopt the idea


Yeah, they all do..... but only OTA for HD.
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post #407 of 12787
1/30/07 at 7:38pm
So, is KTVI not seeing the problem at the station?
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post #408 of 12787
1/30/07 at 7:41pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by wmschultz View Post

So, is KTVI not seeing the problem at the station?

Good question. I haven't seen it in house OTA yet..... but, I've seen it at home.

(working on it)


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post #409 of 12787
1/30/07 at 7:43pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ktviengineering View Post

Yeah, they all do..... but only OTA for HD.

Yeah, I guess they have no reception issues...finding the towers and all

Does anyone know how the signal actually gets from the studios to the towers...is it via a direct connected fiber or cable, or is it sent over the air, or??
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post #410 of 12787
1/30/07 at 7:46pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by kdg454 View Post

Yeah, I guess they have no reception issues...finding the towers and all

Does anyone know how the signal actually gets from the studios to the towers...is it via a direct connected fiber or cable, or is it sent over the air, or??

Yes, fiber and OTA on other freq. of course.
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post #411 of 12787
1/30/07 at 7:55pm
So is KTVI monitoring the source going out before it hits the tower or are they actually watching the feed from the tower?
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post #412 of 12787
1/30/07 at 7:59pm
"banding" or "artifacts" or whatever we are calling it was happening during tonight's American Idol.

Its on both my HR10-250 (DirectTV HD TiVo) and my series 3 TiVo. Both are OTA HD.
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post #413 of 12787
1/30/07 at 8:02pm
I'm going to schedule recordings on my PC so I can just send them a DVD of the problem.

They should be able to figure out the time based upon the time the show started.
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post #414 of 12787
1/30/07 at 8:05pm
I suggest someone at the station just sit down and watch. It happens all the time and seems to be increasing in frequency lately. Most of the time it is nothing more than occasional, very brief, pixelizing of a few frames. At other times, audio is momentarily muted as well. This is OTA via my Dish 622 in Creve Coeur with signal strength pegged at 100. It's quite common. so you shouldn't need to "trap" this for proof.

kdg454 posted a few great screen shots a few pages ago.
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post #415 of 12787
1/30/07 at 8:07pm
Excuse my dumbness but what is a 6 by 8 switch and what does it have to do with the 5nlb.
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post #416 of 12787
1/30/07 at 8:09pm
Believe it or not, noone monitors the "on-air" signal for their HD. This is something that will eventually change once analog tv goes away (I hope)

And it may seem helpful to say what the stations should do, but lets focus more on what we're doing here and how we can be as helpful as possible in providing a variety of samples from different sources, locations and monitors to prove that the issue is, in fact, a real problem that needs fixing. And maybe if all goes well, a diagnosis will result.

Lets keep this productive
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post #417 of 12787
1/30/07 at 8:13pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chazb View Post

Excuse my dumbness but what is a 6 by 8 switch and what does it have to do with the 5nlb.

The 6x8 Multiswitch takes the 4 feeds from the 5LNB dish and then is able to
distribute the signal to 8 recievers or 8 tuners (as in 2 per DVR).

So why are there 6 inputs if there are only 4 outputs from the 5LNB Dish, well..they are flex ports which are used for the 95 degree satellite for international programming and the 70ish degree satellite ( I think it is 70ish)..

Feel free to ask more.
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post #418 of 12787
1/30/07 at 8:19pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ktviengineering View Post

Believe it or not, noone monitors the "on-air" signal for their HD. This is something that will eventually change once analog tv goes away (I hope)

And it may seem helpful to say what the stations should do, but lets focus more on what we're doing here and how we can be as helpful as possible in providing a variety of samples from different sources, locations and monitors to prove that the issue is, in fact, a real problem that needs fixing. And maybe if all goes well, a diagnosis will result.

Lets keep this productive

Believe me, I'm not bashing the process. I am just trying to understand what each station is doing.
It makes sense to me that the station wouldn't know about the OTA digital problem if they aren't monitoring
it. But I also understand why they don't. They really aren't doing anything in HD at the station like KSDK is.

I just don't understand why no one ever answers the emails that are sent to the KTVITech inbox. I wish I had the GM's email address.

I appreciate the investigative work you are doing. Let me know if you need any other info.
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post #419 of 12787
1/30/07 at 8:25pm
Thank you wmshultz I might be getting a install tomorrow of the hr 20.I was at the dbs forum and someone posted about the 6 by 8 switch.Directstart tv should be doing the install is there anything I should ask for or look far.I also live in a slab home and it seems the other people that have had the dish have the dish lines covering a long way on the roof to get to a certain point.
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post #420 of 12787
1/30/07 at 8:32pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by wmschultz View Post

The 6x8 Multiswitch takes the 4 feeds from the 5LNB dish and then is able to
distribute the signal to 8 recievers or 8 tuners (as in 2 per DVR).

So why are there 6 inputs if there are only 4 outputs from the 5LNB Dish, well..they are flex ports which are used for the 95 degree satellite for international programming and the 70ish degree satellite ( I think it is 70ish)..

Feel free to ask more.

Is not one of the ports for an OTA antenna?

Scott
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