"Official" Audyssey thread (FAQ in post #1) - Page 2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by kbarnes701 

FAQ UPDATE!

 

Got your LPF of LFE set to 120Hz and not 80Hz because if you don't 'all the content between 80Hz and 120Hz is lost/discarded?' That's the usual advice.

 

Read the amended FAQ answer below and discover why both Roger Dressler and Mark Seaton think you may be wrong, with evidence from Roger to support their view.  FWIW, my LPF of LFE is currently set to 80Hz after reading their exchange.

 

c)5.   What is the LPF of LFE and what should it be set to?

Of course, a number of us have followed this discussion from Roger and Mark, and it makes a lot of sense.  What would be icing on the cake, IMO, is a short list of demo material that supports this view.  One could play the material with all speakers off and listen to the LFE track.  Back when Roger first brought this up, I played some music disks like this, and several had "funky" content in the LFE track that was reduced or eliminated by selecting LFE=80.  This seems to have confirmed what Roger was saying.  Unfortunately, I don't recall the titles, but the difference is more likely audible for music content than movie content.

Really, "Legendary"?  Have you no shame....

Quote:

Originally Posted by mogorf 


That's an interesting suggestion Kal. Let's assume SBIR is the real problem in case of CheYC's setup and measurements would also prove it. What would be the next step to do?

Move the speakers.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Seaton 


Listening tests aren't what you need. What is needed is some simple subtraction of response curves to show the difference between the 120, 100 and 80Hz 4th order low pass filters. I don't presently have the time to tinker with the graphs, and I already know the result, but if someone else has the time it would probably help. Remember most such ideals get thrown out the window as soon as you don't have ruler flat frequency response. Once you get into the real world and take a few measurements, you realize small adjustments are simply tools to get the preferred behavior.

Thanks, Mark.  BTW, I meant no disrespect when I called out Keith for using the term "legendary Seaton Submersives".  Just a little friendly jealousy.... 

Quote:

Originally Posted by CheYC 


Seems like my options are fairly limited as to where to put them unfortunately.

I understand.  Another option is to see if such a dip can be corrected with a parametric EQ  before running Audyssey.

Quote:

Originally Posted by AustinJerry 

Quote:

Originally Posted by kbarnes701 

FAQ UPDATE!

 

Got your LPF of LFE set to 120Hz and not 80Hz because if you don't 'all the content between 80Hz and 120Hz is lost/discarded?' That's the usual advice.

 

Read the amended FAQ answer below and discover why both Roger Dressler and Mark Seaton think you may be wrong, with evidence from Roger to support their view.  FWIW, my LPF of LFE is currently set to 80Hz after reading their exchange.

 

c)5.   What is the LPF of LFE and what should it be set to?

 

Of course, a number of us have followed this discussion from Roger and Mark, and it makes a lot of sense.  What would be icing on the cake, IMO, is a short list of demo material that supports this view.  One could play the material with all speakers off and listen to the LFE track.  Back when Roger first brought this up, I played some music disks like this, and several had "funky" content in the LFE track that was reduced or eliminated by selecting LFE=80.  This seems to have confirmed what Roger was saying.  Unfortunately, I don't recall the titles, but the difference is more likely audible for music content than movie content.

 

Really, "Legendary"?  Have you no shame....

I noticed an immediate difference when I played part of Total Recall (2012). But it seems to vary according to the movie - I guess some mixers put more content between 80 and 120 Hz than others.

Legendary Submersives?  Yes, I'm sure you remember that I own not one but two :)  I'm fairly confident they will be the last subwoofers I ever buy :)

Quote:

Originally Posted by CheYC 

I pushed my speakers as far back to the wall as they would go and spread them out a little more and the xover dropped to 120 hz in my front L/R, I imagine this will be the best I'll do given my current room setup. I also dropped the LPF to 80 hz and have noticed a pretty profound difference in my bass, it seems much tighter.

I doubt that lowering the sub LPF for LFE to 80Hz would account for a "profound" difference in your bass response.  Remember, all this does is filter out unintended noise in the LFE track, and doesn't affect the normal bass content that is being redirected from the speakers set to Small.  In other words, it is unlikely that this setting in normal circumstances would cause an audible difference, let alone a profound improvement.  I suspect some expectation bias here.

Quote:

Originally Posted by pepar 

I suspect your suspicions are correct. Beyond that, I don't plan on changing this setting to counteract poor engineering practices, especially when it is rare ... or unnoticeable.

I'm not sure I understand your response, Jeff.  I have my LPF set to 80Hz, essentially agreeing with Mark's and Craig's recommendations.  Do you as well, or are you saying you are sticking with the 120H setting?

Quote:

Originally Posted by pepar 


Ummm, yes, I keep it at the 120Hz setting as is recommended for cinema. I've never noticed anything odd when listening to 5.1 music. I missed the context, I guess, WRT the recommendations by some to set it to 80Hz and was agreeing with you that it seemed unlikely that someone's system would sound different by changing the LPF on LFE.

Jeff

OK, I understand what you meant now, and there is nothing wrong with keeping the LPF at 120Hz.  And I think we both agree that whether set to 80Hz or 120Hz, the difference in not likely to be significant, and in only rare cases would there even be an audible difference.  IMO, this is a setting whose importance is way down at the bottom of the importance scale.

Quote:

Originally Posted by pepar 

I suspect your suspicions are correct. Beyond that, I don't plan on changing this setting to counteract poor engineering practices, especially when it is rare ... or unnoticeable.

There is a definite improvement in bass tightness on some movie tracks. We argue with the likes of Roger and Mark at our peril ;)

Quote:

Originally Posted by AustinJerry 

Quote:

Originally Posted by pepar 

I suspect your suspicions are correct. Beyond that, I don't plan on changing this setting to counteract poor engineering practices, especially when it is rare ... or unnoticeable.

 

I'm not sure I understand your response, Jeff.  I have my LPF set to 80Hz, essentially agreeing with Mark's and Craig's recommendations.  Do you as well, or are you saying you are sticking with the 120H setting?

I have mine set at 80Hz too, at least for now. The difference is not 'profound' as you said earlier, but it is there for sure (at least on some movie tracks - I have played a few where there seems to be no audible difference. That could be because the mixer put nothing in the track above 80Hz I am guessing).

Quote:

Originally Posted by AustinJerry 

Quote:

Originally Posted by pepar 


Ummm, yes, I keep it at the 120Hz setting as is recommended for cinema. I've never noticed anything odd when listening to 5.1 music. I missed the context, I guess, WRT the recommendations by some to set it to 80Hz and was agreeing with you that it seemed unlikely that someone's system would sound different by changing the LPF on LFE.

Jeff

 

OK, I understand what you meant now, and there is nothing wrong with keeping the LPF at 120Hz.  And I think we both agree that whether set to 80Hz or 120Hz, the difference in not likely to be significant, and in only rare cases would there even be an audible difference.  IMO, this is a setting whose importance is way down at the bottom of the importance scale.

Yes - Roger does say in the posts I linked to that this is a refining tweak for those who have more or less done everything else. I am sort of of the view that what is good for Roger and Mark is good enough for me. Especially as I own two of Mark's legendary subs and, so far, all his advice to me has been beneficial. 

I only added the information and links to the FAQ to show that not everyone agrees with the official Audyssey position (Chris's view is that the choice of LPF for LFE shouldn't even be offered at all).

Quote:

Originally Posted by stefuel 

Way to many pages to sift through. Quick question. My reciever is further away then the microphone cord allows. Does using a extension work OK with
this? I don't know how long the oem cable is but it's about 20-25 feet short.

No need to wade through 60,000+ posts. I have done all the hard work for you, and it is revealed in the FAQ ;)

d)7.   Can I extend the Audyssey mic cable?

Quote:

Originally Posted by pepar 

Quote:

Originally Posted by AustinJerry 

OK, I understand what you meant now, and there is nothing wrong with keeping the LPF at 120Hz.  And I think we both agree that whether set to 80Hz or 120Hz, the difference in not likely to be significant, and in only rare cases would there even be an audible difference.  IMO, this is a setting whose importance is way down at the bottom of the importance scale.

lol, this wouldn't even be on my list of things that would make me *think* my system sounded different.

:)  If you have the Total Recall (2012) Bluray, give it a try. The difference is quite noticeable here. 

Incidentally, although that movie was panned by every critic on the planet, I really enjoyed it. One has to get over comparing it with the original - it bears no comparison (and yes, the original is better - but that was then and this is now).  I feel somewhat similar about Bourne Legacy too. I saw it at an actual cinema and wasn't much impressed but since getting it anyway on BD, I have grown to like it).