or Connect
AVS › AVS Forum › Audio › Receivers, Amps, and Processors › "Official" Audyssey thread (FAQ in post #51779)
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

"Official" Audyssey thread (FAQ in post #51779) - Page 2016

post #60451 of 70911
Quote:
Originally Posted by pepar View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post

Has 'post' become a preposition without anyone telling me? Damn!

He grabbed that post of mine, but was referencing my reply Roger to.

 

Right on! Er...
post #60452 of 70911
Geek fights rule.
post #60453 of 70911
My Marantz AVR has independent settings for 'Large' and 'LFE+Main'. I read in the FAQ what happens if both settings are used together, but didn't see anything if only 'LFE+Main' is used. Will this result in a main/sub frequency overlap starting at the BM XO going up to the sub's low-pass cut-off? Does Audyssey correctly eq this overlap if enabled?

Thanks,
Darrell
post #60454 of 70911
If speakers are set to small then the LFE+MAIN setting is irrelevant.
post #60455 of 70911
ok, thanks. I guess I'm also wondering if 'Large' and 'LFE+Main' are used together, if Audyssey will correctly eq this overlap.
post #60456 of 70911
Quote:
Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post

So you missed this part of the FAQ amendment then:"I should emphasise that the generally accepted setting for the LPF of LFE is 120Hz. However, this is one of those 'preference' issues which members may want to experiment with and come to their own conclusions."

At the begininig of a movie I listen for SQ first then adjust the LPF crossover. If the voices come across as heavy, I will adjust it down. Sometimes it is set at 80 but most of the time at 100.
post #60457 of 70911
Quote:
Originally Posted by bsoko2 View Post

At the begininig of a movie I listen for SQ first then adjust the LPF crossover. If the voices come across as heavy, I will adjust it down. Sometimes it is set at 80 but most of the time at 100.

I don't think there are "voices" in the LFE channel. eek.gifcool.gif
post #60458 of 70911
Quote:
Originally Posted by dheflin83 View Post

ok, thanks. I guess I'm also wondering if 'Large' and 'LFE+Main' are used together, if Audyssey will correctly eq this overlap.

Audyssey only corrects the response of individual speaker channels, not combinations of them. If you set speakers to "Large" and enable "LFE+Main", frequencies below the crossover are copied from those speakers' channels to the subwoofer. You will hear an increased (inaccurate) sound level in the frequency range where the subwoofer and the "Large" speakers overlap. Some people like hearing that extra bass, but it isn't what the person doing the audio mixing intended.
post #60459 of 70911
Quote:
Originally Posted by Selden Ball View Post

Audyssey only corrects the response of individual speaker channels, not combinations of them. If you set speakers to "Large" and enable "LFE+Main", frequencies below the crossover are copied from those speakers' channels to the subwoofer. You will hear an increased (inaccurate) sound level in the frequency range where the subwoofer and the "Large" speakers overlap. Some people like hearing that extra bass, but it isn't what the person doing the audio mixing intended.

Thanks, that 's what I had assumed. I'm trying to do flanking subs as suggested by Parham which blends the subs and mains in a small range above the BM XO.
post #60460 of 70911
Quote:
Originally Posted by bsoko2 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post

So you missed this part of the FAQ amendment then:"I should emphasise that the generally accepted setting for the LPF of LFE is 120Hz. However, this is one of those 'preference' issues which members may want to experiment with and come to their own conclusions."

At the begininig of a movie I listen for SQ first then adjust the LPF crossover. If the voices come across as heavy, I will adjust it down. Sometimes it is set at 80 but most of the time at 100.

Why would any mixer mix voices into the LFE channel???

post #60461 of 70911
bsoko2,

Can you mention some of the titles where changing the LFE low pass filter value made a difference in the voices?

While voices shouldn't be mixed into the LFE channel, I wouldn't be a bit surprised if it happens accidentally. In those cases, I'd be interested in trying to find out just how much was included.
post #60462 of 70911
Quote:
Originally Posted by Selden Ball View Post

bsoko2,

Can you mention some of the titles where changing the LFE low pass filter value made a difference in the voices?

While voices shouldn't be mixed into the LFE channel, I wouldn't be a bit surprised if it happens accidentally. In those cases, I'd be interested in trying to find out just how much was included.

I have no measurements to back up this assumption, but some movies might have character voices (like evil wizards, or terrible monsters) that speak with a low rumble, where some component of that deep growl might make it into the LFE frequency range. Other than that possibility, regular human voices are seldom found that low in the frequency range.
post #60463 of 70911
Quote:
Originally Posted by raaj View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Selden Ball View Post

bsoko2,

Can you mention some of the titles where changing the LFE low pass filter value made a difference in the voices?

While voices shouldn't be mixed into the LFE channel, I wouldn't be a bit surprised if it happens accidentally. In those cases, I'd be interested in trying to find out just how much was included.

I have no measurements to back up this assumption, but some movies might have character voices (like evil wizards, or terrible monsters) that speak with a low rumble, where some component of that deep growl might make it into the LFE frequency range. Other than that possibility, regular human voices are seldom found that low in the frequency range.

 

Optimus Prime is a good example of this. 

post #60464 of 70911
Quote:
Originally Posted by mogorf View Post

I don't think there are "voices" in the LFE channel. eek.gifcool.gif

I bet he adjusts a single malt with water. eek.gif
post #60465 of 70911
Quote:
Originally Posted by pepar View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffrey Teuber View Post

I appreciate the content of the discussion but have one small complaint. If you folks are going to write small novels back and forth to each other, could you please put some effort into grammar and punctuation? It takes a little time and effort, but it shows respect for both the subject matter and your audience. It also makes for better reading. Thanks.

Congratulations on your second post!

Jeff, I for one appreciate your post. Not sure why these guys are being so hard on your post count since you did join less than a month ago smile.gif Welcome to AVS!

Quote:
Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post

Why would any mixer mix voices into the LFE channel???

Not intentionally as some have stated, but the male voice has fundamental frequencies that can dip well into the "Subwoofer" range. If you are running your mains as small, there certainly will be SOME content in vocals that could get sent to your subs. I cross my mains at 100hz, so this is quite possible in my system.

Quote:
Originally Posted by raaj View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Selden Ball View Post

bsoko2,

Can you mention some of the titles where changing the LFE low pass filter value made a difference in the voices?

While voices shouldn't be mixed into the LFE channel, I wouldn't be a bit surprised if it happens accidentally. In those cases, I'd be interested in trying to find out just how much was included.

I have no measurements to back up this assumption, but some movies might have character voices (like evil wizards, or terrible monsters) that speak with a low rumble, where some component of that deep growl might make it into the LFE frequency range. Other than that possibility, regular human voices are seldom found that low in the frequency range.

As stated above, it is more often than you think where male voices can be in this range.

Optimus is a good one, but the worst offender (due to the mix IMO) is Bane. I know it was for dramatic effect, but they really hit the low range of his voice hard with the boosting. Not so much to my liking.
post #60466 of 70911
Quote:
Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post

Not intentionally as some have stated, but the male voice has fundamental frequencies that can dip well into the "Subwoofer" range. If you are running your mains as small, there certainly will be SOME content in vocals that could get sent to your subs. I cross my mains at 100hz, so this is quite possible in my system.
As stated above, it is more often than you think where male voices can be in this range.

Optimus is a good one, but the worst offender (due to the mix IMO) is Bane. I know it was for dramatic effect, but they really hit the low range of his voice hard with the boosting. Not so much to my liking.

beastaudio, please don't confuse deep male voice fundamentals (which can of course go down as low as 80 - 85 Hz) crossed over from satellites with a 100 Hz c/o (mainly from center speaker) to the sub with same contents recorded (or not recorded) into the LFE (aka: 0.1) channel. They are two different animals, eh? cool.gif
Edited by mogorf - 3/7/13 at 1:18pm
post #60467 of 70911
Quote:
Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post

Jeff, I for one appreciate your post. Not sure why these guys are being so hard on your post count since you did join less than a month ago smile.gif Welcome to AVS!
Not intentionally as some have stated, but the male voice has fundamental frequencies that can dip well into the "Subwoofer" range. If you are running your mains as small, there certainly will be SOME content in vocals that could get sent to your subs. I cross my mains at 100hz, so this is quite possible in my system.
As stated above, it is more often than you think where male voices can be in this range.

I think you are confusing content mixed into the LFE channel with content on a main channel that extends below the crossover frequency and is REPRODUCED by the SUBWOOFER channel.

In a bass managed system, all LFE channel (.1) content is reproduced by the subwoofer(s), but not everything reproduced by the sub is in the LFE.

As for his post, we know when we are being trolled, and by a drive-by troll at that..

Jeff
post #60468 of 70911
I believe we are talking about the lpf for the lfe channel and not the lpf of the sub
post #60469 of 70911
Quote:
Originally Posted by pepar View Post

I think you are confusing content mixed into the LFE channel with content on a main channel that extends below the crossover frequency and is REPRODUCED by the SUBWOOFER channel.

In a bass managed system, all LFE channel (.1) content is reproduced by the subwoofer(s), but not everything reproduced by the sub is in the LFE.

Jeff

+1 Jeff! Can you give me a +1 as well? cool.gifsmile.gif
post #60470 of 70911
Quote:
Originally Posted by pokekevin View Post

I believe we are talking about the lpf for the lfe channel and not the lpf of the sub

There is no LPF on the sub channel.
post #60471 of 70911
Quote:
Originally Posted by mogorf View Post

+1 Jeff! Can you give me a +1 as well? cool.gifsmile.gif

+10 ! tongue.gifwink.gif
post #60472 of 70911
Quote:
Originally Posted by pokekevin View Post

I believe we are talking about the lpf for the lfe channel and not the lpf of the sub

If you mean "LPF for the LFE channel" is the one that is inside the AVR and not the "LPF of the Sub" which is inside the plate amp found inside the subwoofer box, then: Yes! smile.gif
Edited by mogorf - 3/7/13 at 2:04pm
post #60473 of 70911
Quote:
Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post

Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post

Why would any mixer mix voices into the LFE channel???

Not intentionally as some have stated, but the male voice has fundamental frequencies that can dip well into the "Subwoofer" range. If you are running your mains as small, there certainly will be SOME content in vocals that could get sent to your subs. I cross my mains at 100hz, so this is quite possible in my system.

As others have already said, we're discussing the LFE channel (the only channel affected by the LPF of LFE) not the bass in general or that which is redirected to the subwoofer. There will be zero  voice content in the LFE channel, unless the mixer dozed off during the session etc. 

post #60474 of 70911
Quote:
Originally Posted by mogorf View Post

If you mean "LPF for the LFE channel" is the one that is inside the AVR and not the "LPF of the Sub" which is inside the plate amp found inside the subwoofer box, then: Yes! smile.gif

Yeap.
post #60475 of 70911
I wasn't saying that the mixer puts voice content into the LFE, I was simply pointing out that in many systems, voice info could end up coming from your subs in general.
post #60476 of 70911
Posted this in its own thread, but perhaps this is a better place for the question:

I've had a Onkyo TX-NR708 for a couple years. I ran Audyssey successfully when I first got the receiver. However, I just bought a completely new set of speakers (JBL ES series) and I'm having trouble re-running the Audyssey set-up. My first few attempts failed with Audyssey failing to detect a speaker--but it was not always the same speaker. Sometimes it failed on the FL, sometimes center, sometimes FR.

So I did a full reset on the receiver. Now, when I run Audyssey, only a single chirp will sound for FL (rather than the usual series of chirps), and the system goes silent. Then, a few seconds later, I get the speaker detect error screen. This happens every single time now. I cannot get last that first, single chirp.

Any ideas? Does this sound like it is likely an issue with the microphone?

I'm getting sound just fine from all speakers, and the test tones in manual set-up play just fine.
post #60477 of 70911
Quote:
Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post

I wasn't saying that the mixer puts voice content into the LFE, I was simply pointing out that in many systems, voice info could end up coming from your subs in general.
ANd people were simply pointing out that redirected bass from bass management that goes to the crossovers is not in the LFE channel and therefore is not affected by the LPF of the LFE. In other words, the LFE channel is low passed by that filter before the LFE channel is combined with the redirected bass resulting from bass management crossovers and it all goes to the sub(s).
post #60478 of 70911
Quote:
Originally Posted by andrewcoffin View Post

Posted this in its own thread, but perhaps this is a better place for the question:

I've had a Onkyo TX-NR708 for a couple years. I ran Audyssey successfully when I first got the receiver. However, I just bought a completely new set of speakers (JBL ES series) and I'm having trouble re-running the Audyssey set-up. My first few attempts failed with Audyssey failing to detect a speaker--but it was not always the same speaker. Sometimes it failed on the FL, sometimes center, sometimes FR.

So I did a full reset on the receiver. Now, when I run Audyssey, only a single chirp will sound for FL (rather than the usual series of chirps), and the system goes silent. Then, a few seconds later, I get the speaker detect error screen. This happens every single time now. I cannot get last that first, single chirp.

Any ideas? Does this sound like it is likely an issue with the microphone?

I'm getting sound just fine from all speakers, and the test tones in manual set-up play just fine.

You might try plugging the mic in and out a few times. Input could have gotten dirty and is sticking.
post #60479 of 70911
Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick Murphy View Post

You might try plugging the mic in and out a few times. Input could have gotten dirty and is sticking.

I've tried that, without success. I tried blowing in the input to dislodge any dust too. Has anyone had success cleaning the input? It has definitely been a couple of years since it's been used.
post #60480 of 70911
Quote:
Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post

I wasn't saying that the mixer puts voice content into the LFE, I was simply pointing out that in many systems, voice info could end up coming from your subs in general.

That may or may not be so, but it has no bearing on the issue under discussion, which was whether an LPF of LFE works better at 80Hz or 120Hz.

New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Receivers, Amps, and Processors
AVS › AVS Forum › Audio › Receivers, Amps, and Processors › "Official" Audyssey thread (FAQ in post #51779)