or Connect
AVS › AVS Forum › Audio › Subwoofers, Bass, and Transducers › OFFICIAL Hsu MBM-12 thread
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

OFFICIAL Hsu MBM-12 thread - Page 10

post #271 of 466
Quote:
Originally Posted by bsoko2 View Post

cyberbri haven't heard from you in awhile, as for the rest of you on this thread, cyberbri knows his stuff so pay attention!

Bill


Hey! Yes, been very busy with work, to say the least. Plus, hanging around here too much makes me want to upgrade my system (or my subs at least).
post #272 of 466
Quote:
Originally Posted by cyberbri View Post

Hey! Yes, been very busy with work, to say the least. Plus, hanging around here too much makes me want to upgrade my system (or my subs at least).

Yes, now what you mean. I went mad and got a set of Polk SDA's. Love em for 2-channel music and HT. I plan on stopping for now and save some green for the next upgrade (whatever that is).

Bill
post #273 of 466
just wondering...how inert is the mbm's cabinet?


used in a nearfield setup, could i place rubber discs on it's top, place a glass top on it, and use it as an end table...?
post #274 of 466
Quote:
Originally Posted by cyberbri View Post

REW, running tones through the receiver, measuring with the meter (on a tripod) and reading out on the screen, is much more accurate than Avia. When you use REW and measure with the meter, you get very accurate readings. With Avia and reading the meter manually, you get a much less accurate picture of what is going on.


im still messing around with it a little bit...i did have it calibrated correctly with the XO on the HO turned all the way up when i was using avia...so sounds like i did everything right...like u said i think ill just stick to REW since im getting the feeling from what you and people at hometheatershack are saying...sounds like its more accurate
post #275 of 466
my bad...lol...i DIDNT have the x-over set all the way up on the HO when i calibrated it with avia...that was where my problem area was...i could have sworn i did but i didnt...now that i recalibrated that way my levels on avia are perfect when i do the speaker and subwoofer level matching tests...well actually about 1db "hot"...not to hot though if u ask me...hehe...my levels on REW are good now as well in conunction with my speakers level...and the test tones on my receiver match my mains and my subs just like avia, 1db hot...so looks like i finally got it...FINALLY!
post #276 of 466
I have had my VTF2.3 for almost 2 years. I've been happy with it, but I'm not getting that hit in the chest feeling others talk about. Considering adding MBM-12, though it's an expensive "add-on". Also considering selling the 2.3 & switching to MFW-15 or new SVS PC12-nsd. Any suggestions? Is there anyone out the in D/FW land with an MBM that can do a demo for me?
I've been to a couple of homes with a dedicated home theater, & was blown away at how hard they hit. Both large rooms, 1 had dual MFW's the other dual Epik Towers. When WOTW played and the road split open B4 the Pod emerged, I thought the floor of the HT room was going to split with it

My room is 11 x 19 x 9 and has an openeing in the rear right corner to the kitchen. I have older Polk Monitor 10's as my mains. Pioneer VSX-816 receiver with Xover set at 80. Is the VTF2.3 not enough sub? I've tried 1 port & 2. Single port starts to chuff with deep effects, so I have both open for max output. Would putting a door between the Den & kitchen help the room to pressurize & get the hit in the chest feeling I am lacking? Open to all suggestions.
post #277 of 466
Quote:


Would putting a door between the Den & kitchen help the room to pressurize & get the hit in the chest feeling I am lacking? Open to all suggestions.

If you're able to reduce the total volume to which your HT room is connected by adding a door, by all means do so... and try that change first before changing your sub. I have a VTF3.3 (in max extension mode) that does that WOTW scene quite well, but I have not heard a 2.3... I dunno if that's enough sub to give you the impact that you're looking for, even in a smaller volume room.
post #278 of 466
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scottfox View Post

I have had my VTF2.3 for almost 2 years. I've been happy with it, but I'm not getting that hit in the chest feeling others talk about. Considering adding MBM-12, though it's an expensive "add-on". Also considering selling the 2.3 & switching to MFW-15 or new SVS PC12-nsd. Any suggestions? Is there anyone out the in D/FW land with an MBM that can do a demo for me?
I've been to a couple of homes with a dedicated home theater, & was blown away at how hard they hit. Both large rooms, 1 had dual MFW's the other dual Epik Towers. When WOTW played and the road split open B4 the Pod emerged, I thought the floor of the HT room was going to split with it

My room is 11 x 19 x 9 and has an openeing in the rear right corner to the kitchen. I have older Polk Monitor 10's as my mains. Pioneer VSX-816 receiver with Xover set at 80. Is the VTF2.3 not enough sub? I've tried 1 port & 2. Single port starts to chuff with deep effects, so I have both open for max output. Would putting a door between the Den & kitchen help the room to pressurize & get the hit in the chest feeling I am lacking? Open to all suggestions.

See my post here: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...postcount=2120
post #279 of 466
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scottfox View Post

I have had my VTF2.3 for almost 2 years. I've been happy with it, but I'm not getting that hit in the chest feeling others talk about. Considering adding MBM-12, though it's an expensive "add-on". Also considering selling the 2.3 & switching to MFW-15 or new SVS PC12-nsd. Any suggestions? Is there anyone out the in D/FW land with an MBM that can do a demo for me?
I've been to a couple of homes with a dedicated home theater, & was blown away at how hard they hit. Both large rooms, 1 had dual MFW's the other dual Epik Towers. When WOTW played and the road split open B4 the Pod emerged, I thought the floor of the HT room was going to split with it

My room is 11 x 19 x 9 and has an openeing in the rear right corner to the kitchen. I have older Polk Monitor 10's as my mains. Pioneer VSX-816 receiver with Xover set at 80. Is the VTF2.3 not enough sub? I've tried 1 port & 2. Single port starts to chuff with deep effects, so I have both open for max output. Would putting a door between the Den & kitchen help the room to pressurize & get the hit in the chest feeling I am lacking? Open to all suggestions.

A in room frequency response graph of your subwoofer at your main listening position would be helpful to see what you need more of to get that feeling. A graph of your sub alone and then your mains and subs together would be very helpful to you and the people wanting to help you.
post #280 of 466
well...just ordered one mbm-12

i've been following this thread for a while with much interest...

looking forward to experimenting with this sub...no doubt i'll be asking for advice
post #281 of 466
Quote:
Originally Posted by lefthandluke View Post

well...just ordered one mbm-12

i've been following this thread for a while with much interest...

looking forward to experimenting with this sub...no doubt i'll be asking for advice

Here is some info on how to calibrate a MBM with a true sub: http://forum.hsuresearch.com/showpos...9&postcount=33.

Bill
post #282 of 466
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryan W View Post

I ordered mine today sealed. It was a $50 charge. I think that overall the sealed is more flexible for placement. The retool it apparently to adjust for the difference from sealed vs ported. The rep I spoke said I would be one of the very few people to have a sealed model. So I will share my thoughts when I get it.

Ryan W,

Have you received your sealed MBM-12 yet?

John
post #283 of 466
I have a Question regarding hook up of my 2 MBM's.

I'm using my sub out(LFE) and have it running 50-160hz (w/receiver). I tried using my Output on my true sub, which is high passed at 80hz so I'd get >80hz to 160hz
felt a little boomy.. when I allowed it to play all of the 50 or <50 up to 160hz it was better. I also tried 200hz LFE out. affected dialog a bit too much.. I'm still experimenting.
New room set up, so a Lot of calibrating to do. (14speakers) 11.5 x 20 room. 7.5' ceiling.

Q.
What IF.. I run my LFE to one input.. and my Front Right (pre out) to the MBM by the front right speaker.
+ I run my LFE to one input.. and my Left Front (pre out) to the MBM by my Left front speaker.

This way.. when in a movie the producer has a 63hz? sound effect running on the left side... missed by right or LFE ? I pick it up on the right side and add realism to the scene as I'd be getting enhanced effect of what was shown in the theatre...sorta?



http://photobucket.com/steveshometheatre

Still under reno's... new stage front to come this weekend.
post #284 of 466
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevegamble66 View Post

I have a Question regarding hook up of my 2 MBM's.

I'm using my sub out(LFE) and have it running 50-160hz (w/receiver). I tried using my Output on my true sub, which is high passed at 80hz so I'd get >80hz to 160hz
felt a little boomy.. when I allowed it to play all of the 50 or <50 up to 160hz it was better. I also tried 200hz LFE out. affected dialog a bit too much.. I'm still experimenting.
New room set up, so a Lot of calibrating to do. (14speakers) 11.5 x 20 room. 7.5' ceiling.

Q.
What IF.. I run my LFE to one input.. and my Front Right (pre out) to the MBM by the front right speaker.
+ I run my LFE to one input.. and my Left Front (pre out) to the MBM by my Left front speaker.

This way.. when in a movie the producer has a 63hz? sound effect running on the left side... missed by right or LFE ? I pick it up on the right side and add realism to the scene as I'd be getting enhanced effect of what was shown in the theatre...sorta?



http://photobucket.com/steveshometheatre

Still under reno's... new stage front to come this weekend.


I wouldn't run the pre-outs for the left/rights to the MBMs because the main speakers will still be playing that range of bass.

Here are your 2 options:

--Set the receiver xo to 160Hz or whatever you want, and then run the sub out to the MBM(s) and the sub. Engage main sub XO where it crosses with the MBM (ie. 50Hz) - but only after calibrating / setting the level with the XO disabled and the sub running by itself.

--Set the receiver xo to 40~60Hz and run the sub out to the main sub. Run the speaker outputs (speaker wire) to the MBM for either side, then back out to the speakers. Use the xo in the MBM(s) to blend the sound with the speakers, say at 120~160Hz. Calibrate the main sub with the above method - must calibrate with the sub running regular range (up to 80~100Hz) to get correct level setting - then enable whatever crossover setting you want to use.

You shouldn't have as much a problem with localization of higher frequencies from the MBM(s) as long as they are up front, preferably as close to the actual speakers as possible. Even at an 80Hz crossover, if the sub is behind you, you may get too much localization (in music, deep voice in movie dialog, etc.).
post #285 of 466
Sounds good.. I had to read that twice.. but I got it.

Now if I were to switch my fronts to small and use pre out R / L receiver XO @160hz.
Would that give me the same thing?
Or ,the receiver would pass the the <160hz ALL to the LFE ?
None to pre out R/L.

Anyone try high level input (speaker wire) back out to speakers.. and LFE in combonation as well.
Can this blend and sound better than LFE Mono alone?
post #286 of 466
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevegamble66 View Post

Sounds good.. I had to read that twice.. but I got it.

Now if I were to switch my fronts to small and use pre out R / L receiver XO @160hz.
Would that give me the same thing?
Or ,the receiver would pass the the <160hz ALL to the LFE ?
None to pre out R/L.


If you set the receiver XO to 160Hz, you will need the MBMs hooked to the LFE out. Otherwise, if you have them hooked to the mains, they will only get bass down to 160Hz since they would be part of the chain for the main speakers.

If you have the MBMs as part of the LFE chain, then you are good to raise the XO in the receiver up to 150~200Hz (make sure the MBMs are up front, close to the speakers, the higher you go). If the MBMs are hooked to the main speakers, then the receiver XO should be 50Hz or wherever you want to crossover between the MBM and the main sub.

But if you hook the MBMs to the mains, don't use the analog pre-outs, for the reason I mentioned - if you do use the pre-outs, you'll have the speakers playing that same bass as the MBMs, which could possibly cause cancellation and phase effects. You want the MBMs to be the only ones playing that range.


As to your other question, about which would sound better... There are trade-offs.

If you have an MBM hooked to the left/right mains, then you can get added benefit of the stereo / directional bass. There's often bass sent to the main channels, not just LFE. So you could get more of the effect of it coming from the speaker it was intended to come from.

On the other hand, having the MBMs hooked to the mains means that the MBMs don't play any of the 50Hz+ bass present in the LFE track (which can go up to 120Hz). So in this case the main sub would be playing 50Hz and below from the signal re-routed from the rest of the speakers, plus the full LFE signal (don't engage the main sub's internal XO in this setup case, because you'll filter out this LFE-only bass above 50Hz).

Hope that makes sense.
post #287 of 466
Quote:
Originally Posted by John H View Post

Ryan W,

Have you received your sealed MBM-12 yet?

John

I have it, but I really haven't had much time to play with it. It's nice and punchy, but I feel like the sound can be localized (xo as 110hz). I am trying to blend it all, my Galaxy CM-140 should be in this week so I can play withe the level and REW and all that stuff, but I probably won't get to that for a month or so. Also my true sub can only be set to a 40hz or 60hz XO, so I need to figure out what is the best way to blend that.
post #288 of 466
Quote:
Originally Posted by cyberbri View Post

If you set the receiver XO to 160Hz, you will need the MBMs hooked to the LFE out. Otherwise, if you have them hooked to the mains, they will only get bass down to 160Hz since they would be part of the chain for the main speakers.

If you have the MBMs as part of the LFE chain, then you are good to raise the XO in the receiver up to 150~200Hz (make sure the MBMs are up front, close to the speakers, the higher you go). If the MBMs are hooked to the main speakers, then the receiver XO should be 50Hz or wherever you want to crossover between the MBM and the main sub.

But if you hook the MBMs to the mains, don't use the analog pre-outs, for the reason I mentioned - if you do use the pre-outs, you'll have the speakers playing that same bass as the MBMs, which could possibly cause cancellation and phase effects. You want the MBMs to be the only ones playing that range.


As to your other question, about which would sound better... There are trade-offs.

If you have an MBM hooked to the left/right mains, then you can get added benefit of the stereo / directional bass. There's often bass sent to the main channels, not just LFE. So you could get more of the effect of it coming from the speaker it was intended to come from.

On the other hand, having the MBMs hooked to the mains means that the MBMs don't play any of the 50Hz+ bass present in the LFE track (which can go up to 120Hz). So in this case the main sub would be playing 50Hz and below from the signal re-routed from the rest of the speakers, plus the full LFE signal (don't engage the main sub's internal XO in this setup case, because you'll filter out this LFE-only bass above 50Hz).

Hope that makes sense.

I have Bass out to Both sub(LFE) and Mains, XO 200hz is for the others CTR was set large as well, until the MBM's arrived.
This sends 0-200hz to mains as well as LFE content under 200 to sub.
I use the EQ to try to balance the sound, but prefer bass to both.
this "Bass to both" setting is automatically cancelled if I set Mains to small.
as per manual Yamaha HTR6190.
It also says any speakers with 6.5" driver/woofers be set to large ?
Including surround speakers. ?
That applies to all my speakers... But if I set ctr to large my Buttkickers drop in output by half.
anyway..
I think I'll stick with LFE fed material for now.
post #289 of 466
If I hook up speaker r/l to high level input on MBM...I get a loud hummm..
I get Very low, almost inaudible hum regardless.. the higher the frq. the louder the hum.
I tried a ground loop isolator and got a Loud Hum, 100X worse.?

All brand New Monster 450 to 850 series Subwoofer and Y Cables.
post #290 of 466
Looks like a redesign is in store, according to Pete in the Hsu Forums:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete - Hsu View Post

Hi everyone,

I just wanted to give you some advance notice about an exciting new product announcement regarding MBM-12. To start, I would like to mention that we only have extremely low quantity of vinyl black MBM-12's in stock right now, and it will be several months before the MBM-12 is back in stock.

So you may be wondering, why will it take several months to re-stock MBM-12?

The answer to this question is that we have decided to re-design the MBM-12 and release a newer version later this year.

The new MBM-12 will have the following features:

1) Variable tuning capability! One can simply add or remove a supplied 4" foam port plug and flip a bass extension switch on the amp to switch between 'Sealed' or 'Ported' Mode

2) Wireless connectivity option will be available! This will make it much easier to position the MBM in the nearfield without running subwoofer cables across the room.

3) New finishes will be available! Standard finish will be Satin Black, and several luxury finishes will be available as well


So this unit will be perfect to use with the ULS-15, or any of our other true subwoofers. Price is still to be determined, and will have to go up a bit, but hopefully not too much. The size and shape and orientation of woofer/port will still be the same as the current MBM-12, but with all the changes mentioned above.

I am really excited about this unit, and hope you will be too in the months ahead!

Looks pretty exciting. Too bad about the price increase, though. Maybe they'll offer some kind of introductory pricing.

Scott
post #291 of 466
What will the difference be when using the port plug in the new MBM-12, sound wise?
post #292 of 466
If I have all of my speakers calibrated to 75 on the spl meter, with corrections, all of my frequencies are very close to 75-77. When you guys say running the sub hot, what exactly does that mean. If I calibrate to 75 I have to jack my master volume to 0 sometimes into the plus region of my Onkyo 804 to get the bass I desire. Is this damaging my sub? I can keep the volume at -10 but i turn up the bass +4 dbs in the receiver's sub output. Is this considered running too hot?
post #293 of 466
Quote:
Originally Posted by ccarzoo View Post

If I have all of my speakers calibrated to 75 on the spl meter, with corrections, all of my frequencies are very close to 75-77. When you guys say running the sub hot, what exactly does that mean. If I calibrate to 75 I have to jack my master volume to 0 sometimes into the plus region of my Onkyo 804 to get the bass I desire. Is this damaging my sub? I can keep the volume at -10 but i turn up the bass +4 dbs in the receiver's sub output. Is this considered running too hot?


If you calibrate the speakers and sub to 75dB, then the sub is already 2dB or so "hot" (above the level of the speakers) because the meter is less sensitive in the bass region.

What equipment do you have, and how are you calibrating? Are you running a disc through the player you normally use? You may have to set the receiver up to add 10dB to the LFE signal, sometimes tricky with new players and HDMI.

Most people cannot turn up the receiver to "0" or higher without it being uncomfortable to listen. So you either have a 10dB setting issue, or the sub is just in a really bad location so you're getting a big peak or two that throw off the whole calibration and make it sound like there's not much bass. You can certainly turn up the sub 4 notches in the receiver, but I recommend to you try to get to the bottom of the issue before you just turn up the sub volume.
post #294 of 466
Quote:
Originally Posted by gnocchi View Post

What will the difference be when using the port plug in the new MBM-12, sound wise?

There's a thread about it on the HSU forum. Here's what Pete says:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete - Hsu Research View Post

The situation where I can see the sealed MBM being more advantageous than the ported MBM is when the MBM is located very close to the true sub. The low frequency rolloff of the sealed MBM will match perfectly with the high frequency rolloff on our true subwoofers (when using the built-in low pass crossover network on the true subs), so they would theoretically blend better.

It's nice that they'll be giving customers the option, at least for those that love to tweak.

Scott
post #295 of 466
Quote:


Originally Posted by Pete - Hsu
Hi everyone,

I just wanted to give you some advance notice about an exciting new product announcement regarding MBM-12. To start, I would like to mention that we only have extremely low quantity of vinyl black MBM-12's in stock right now, and it will be several months before the MBM-12 is back in stock.

So you may be wondering, why will it take several months to re-stock MBM-12?

The answer to this question is that we have decided to re-design the MBM-12 and release a newer version later this year.

The new MBM-12 will have the following features:

1) Variable tuning capability! One can simply add or remove a supplied 4" foam port plug and flip a bass extension switch on the amp to switch between 'Sealed' or 'Ported' Mode

2) Wireless connectivity option will be available! This will make it much easier to position the MBM in the nearfield without running subwoofer cables across the room.


3) New finishes will be available! Standard finish will be Satin Black, and several luxury finishes will be available as well


So this unit will be perfect to use with the ULS-15, or any of our other true subwoofers. Price is still to be determined, and will have to go up a bit, but hopefully not too much. The size and shape and orientation of woofer/port will still be the same as the current MBM-12, but with all the changes mentioned above.

I am really excited about this unit, and hope you will be too in the months ahead!

WOW.
post #296 of 466
Quote:
Originally Posted by cyberbri View Post

If you calibrate the speakers and sub to 75dB, then the sub is already 2dB or so "hot" (above the level of the speakers) because the meter is less sensitive in the bass region.

What equipment do you have, and how are you calibrating? Are you running a disc through the player you normally use? You may have to set the receiver up to add 10dB to the LFE signal, sometimes tricky with new players and HDMI.

Most people cannot turn up the receiver to "0" or higher without it being uncomfortable to listen. So you either have a 10dB setting issue, or the sub is just in a really bad location so you're getting a big peak or two that throw off the whole calibration and make it sound like there's not much bass. You can certainly turn up the sub 4 notches in the receiver, but I recommend to you try to get to the bottom of the issue before you just turn up the sub volume.

Sonance in wall thx select 7.1 speakers, Onkyo 804, Sony BDP 550 using analog outs to receiver. HSU 3.3 with turbo farfield in 5000 cubic foot soundproofed basement, mbm nearfield behind couch.
post #297 of 466
Quote:
Originally Posted by ccarzoo View Post

Sonance in wall thx select 7.1 speakers, Onkyo 804, Sony BDP 550 using analog outs to receiver. HSU 3.3 with turbo farfield in 5000 cubic foot soundproofed basement, mbm nearfield behind couch.


Definitely run a test disc like Avia or DVE through the player, to check the decoding and LFE signal. You may need to boost the LFE +10 in the receiver (or the player if it has that option) since you are using 6-chan analogs.
post #298 of 466
Quote:
Originally Posted by cyberbri View Post

Definitely run a test disc like Avia or DVE through the player, to check the decoding and LFE signal. You may need to boost the LFE +10 in the receiver (or the player if it has that option) since you are using 6-chan analogs.


cool, any idea where I can get either of these disks???
post #299 of 466
anyone???
post #300 of 466
I got my copy of DVE through Barnes & Noble? Should be a bunch of online vendors with one or the other or both, might try newegg?

Edit:

http://video.barnesandnoble.com/DVD/...3000004/?itm=1

http://video.barnesandnoble.com/DVD/...5071224/?itm=5
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
AVS › AVS Forum › Audio › Subwoofers, Bass, and Transducers › OFFICIAL Hsu MBM-12 thread