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What's with the Wii's save file nonsense?

post #1 of 10
2/10/07 at 10:36am
Thread Starter 
I'm preparing to send my Wii away for repair. Again. So I'm copying my Wii's save files and VC games to a pair of SD card. For some reason I encounter a heaping pile of BS when I try to copy my Elebits data and my Zelda: Link to the Past VC title.


When I try to copy Elebits I see:
"This file cannot be copied" and then I have to click the OK button.

When I try to copy Zelda: LttP I see:
"Data has been copied. There was some data that could not be copied to an SD Card. Refer to the Operations Guide for details"
That text appears on the screen for maybe an entire second before automatically returning to the memory contents window. The only reason I was able to grab the text was that I caught it with my digital camera.


I have plenty of space on these cards. On the one I'm staring at now I have 2606 open blocks and Elebits only takes 109 and Zelda takes 4. On that card I verified on my PC that I have hundreds of free MBs. On the other card I didn't check. Both cards have read/write access because I was able to copy other saves to them.

This is clearly an intentional design. There's no reason Nintendo should be blocking me from copying these titles. They're my damn save file and if I want to back them up to a SD card that's my business. Not theirs. The VC content is already protected against illegal transfers, so why the hell can't I save the file for return on my own system?


My Wii is about to go away for a 3 week repair process and I can honestly say that I'm not going to miss it at all. This machine has been nothing but one source of aggravation after another, and when I sit down to play it anymore all I think about are the bugs, defects, and annoying and unnecessary limitations that accompany it. I've barely used the evil little thing in the past 2 weeks. This file copying stupidity is yet another example of why I've lost most of my interest with this machine.
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post #2 of 10
2/10/07 at 10:54am
Elebits save data can only be transferred on the wii controllers...try reading your manual before complaining about a Nintendo design flaw...Konami is responsible for that decision.

I just looked into the VC data copy prob....it appears (at least for some vc games) you can only save the game ROM data, not saved game data.
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post #3 of 10
2/10/07 at 6:10pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wii View Post

Elebits save data can only be transferred on the wii controllers...try reading your manual before complaining about a Nintendo design flaw...Konami is responsible for that decision.

Konami was only able to do it because Nintendo allowed that behavior in the API. It's bad design because:

1) It's just data and the user ought to be permitted to copy their save files to the SD card. This activity in no way will result in Konami losing money to piracy.

2) There's no proper feedback on why the data cannot be copied. Was the card's read-only switch set? Was the card full? Did I encounter an internal error? Was the file not permitted for copying? The Wii didn't report it.


Quote:


I just looked into the VC data copy prob....it appears (at least for some vc games) you can only save the game ROM data, not saved game data.

Ridiculous.
I'm going to be furious if Nintendo screws up my Wii's memory again like they did the last time it needed repaired.
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post #4 of 10
2/10/07 at 6:46pm
your Wii has broken twice??
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post #5 of 10
2/10/07 at 6:54pm
Wow if my wii broke twice too, Id hate it and everything it stands for lol...that suuuuucks.

I dont think Konami has any kind of piracy issues, Id bet it has more to do with the saved in game 'pics' you can take...they were likely too hesitant to allow data copying with those files (and your friends pics etc), and too lazy to figure out a good way around it.

I agree with you about the non-specific errors..I was a bit miffed too when I tried copying my Elebits data too, and I got the same error code.

It does suck about no being able to save VC saved data (if that is the case for all VC games), but to be honest- Id rather be happy they let us back up the game itself (at all)...although it makes sense, its not like they had to give us even that.

Its a new process, and for sure its not perfect- but its only been a few months. They can fix this kind of stuff thru future firmware upgrades....if you want a better thought out machine, maybe you should pickup a PS3
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post #6 of 10
2/10/07 at 11:23pm
I have a PS3 and copy-protected save files cannot be transferred from PS2 card to the PS3. How is that better thinking than what Konami and Nintendo chose to do? IT's the same damn thing. I can't play TImesplitters on PS3 without totally starting over. The PS3 is as well thought-out as a Democrat's political views. Nyah!
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post #7 of 10
2/11/07 at 11:08am
Xbox 1 had the same problem, some games (like DOA) would not allow their saves to be transfered from the hard drive to the memory cards so when my launch Xbox died after two months i lost a bunch of saved games that would not copy. This is a common problem with developers making it hard to copy and transfer saved games.
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post #8 of 10
2/11/07 at 1:47pm
Ok since this has been brought up again, I'll throw out this simple question:

My Wii needs to be replaced. I have been very hesitant to do so because of the many hours I have put into my games (the savegames being on the wii memory itself)

SO

CAN I save the data out to either a controller or a flash card and then restore them to a replacement wii? I of course do own the games themselves.

I have read that this is not possible
I have read that it IS possible as long as the game has been played once on the 'new' system
And I've seen issues as stated by the OP....

So what's the scoop?

-Trouble
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post #9 of 10
2/12/07 at 9:01am
Quote:
Originally Posted by scs0 View Post

When I try to copy Zelda: LttP I see:
"Data has been copied. There was some data that could not be copied to an SD Card. Refer to the Operations Guide for details"

There seem to be three types of save data for virtual console games.
1- The game itself (in the channels data section)
2- The state of the game when exiting to the menu (in the save data section)
3- The traditional save file data of a game that supports it (also in the save data section)
#2 and #3 are combined into one set of blocks.

When you copy virtual console save data from the Wii to an SD card, it WILL copy your save file data from your game if the game creates save files. It WILL NOT copy the state of the game when you last exited to the Wii menu. That's the "eternal pause" which is basically a system dump of the emulator, or something similar.

For instance, when I copy data from Super Mario World, I start off with 4 blocks in Wii memory but the SD card ends up with only 1 block, and I get the same message as you posted above. I then delete the 4 blocks from the Wii memory. I transfer the one block back from the SD card to the Wii. When I start the VC game, it starts as though the game was reset (since the data for the STATE of the game is no longer there) but the GAME SAVES are still there.

If your classic game never supported a save file, you can't copy the data. It's like turning that particular virtual console off. I personally don't see the big issue with that. Any other game that has save files (that I tried) all allow you to store and restore your save data. That goes for N64 games, SNES games, and the one game on the TG16 that I tried (Bomberman '93).

Of course, discovering this took me all of about 3 minutes. I actually, you know, tried it.
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post #10 of 10
2/12/07 at 10:02am
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShawnPeters View Post

If your classic game never supported a save file, you can't copy the data. It's like turning that particular virtual console off. I personally don't see the big issue with that.

Perhaps not a 'big issue,' but it would be great convenience to be able to copy this data. Creating an incremental save state where a game does not normally allow could be very useful. For example, I've been playing Super Star Soldier for TG16. It doesn't allow any saves, but allows endless continues, so I've slowly worked my way to the final level. Now, I'd love to show people the game when they visit and let them play, but I'd lose my save point and have to replay from the start.

Since they can encrypt the game data, I don't see why they can't just encrypt the memory dump save state and let it be saved to SD card. It's a great feature that's been in emulators forever, and it would greatly enhance the Virtual Console, IMO.
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