***Official HTIB Alternatives Thread*** - Page 107

Hi, I'm a bit of a novice here. I'm looking to build a budget 3/3.1 system for my parents. I don't really want to spend more than $500 including blu-ray player, receiver, and speakers (not even sure if this is possible). The room is 12x16. The video source is a 40" LCD which has terrible speakers (for some DVD's I've had to max out the TV's volume and I still could barely understand the voices on the soundtrack). The setup will mainly be used for blu-ray, dvd, and regular tv.

1) Speakers
My last personal setup was an HTPC with z-5300 5.1 speakers that I purchased many years ago for only $50 after rebates. I was thinking of simply going with a 3 speaker setup (instead of 3.1) because regardless of how low I put the bass, subwoofers tend to be really audible in the floors above or below the entertainment room. I've previously owned an old 100-150w Optimus sub (radio shack brand) and of course the z-5300 sub. So unless the majority are really against the idea of omitting the sub, I might spend the money on better front/center speakers.

2) Receiver
I don't really know anything about the various receivers other than the fact that some may be able to decode dolby digital, dts, etc. while others may not (?). I'm not sure how the 3/3.1 setup affects things as I've only owned 5.1 in the past.

3) Speaker wire
Yeah I'm a novice. The last time I ran "real" speaker wire was when I was 12 years old I have no idea what gauge wire to use - I just remember I did a really terrible job cutting and twisting the wire... it probably really affected the audio. Do any of these speakers have simple plug-in jobs?

4) Blu-ray player
I know this isn't the proper forum, but if you can also recommend a good (but cheap) blu-ray player that would make great. I don't really know much about blu-ray. I can't imagine there's much difference quality-wise between different models other than additional features. After all, the content is on the discs and they don't have to "upscale" to fake a higher resolution...

5) Setup questions
Finally, I've been out of the scene for a while. My z-5300 htpc setup simply used a DVI connection directly from the computer to a projector. I've never used HDMI, but from what I understand it's simply DVI + audio. I don't really understand how this works. If I have a blu-ray player, do I have to run two HDMI cables from the blu-ray player (one to the TV, second to the receiver)? Or do I run one HDMI connection from the blu-ray player to the audio receiver and the second from the audio receiver to the TV? I've never used the video input/output jacks on an audio receiver - it never really made sense to me... What's the point of HDMI if 90% of the time audio and video are fed to different hardware?

Thanks.. Sorry for the dumb questions.

I've been browsing these forums for a long time just like I did in the LCD TV section before getting my 46" Samsung A650 and am very happy with that. Now I've been trying to wrap my head around sound to get. I'd have it in a bedroom with that TV and at first was looking at some Onkyo packages but am not leaning towards the Onkyo 607 receiver and perhaps the Energy Take Classic to go with it. I've also been impressed with the price from world wide stereo on the Jamo speakers there although they are rather large for a bedroom.

Also, one thing I'm thinking already is that I'll need to move my TV out of the corner of my room in order to get the most out of surround sound. I have a PS3 and wouldn't mind going 7.1 as well for a speaker set up. How hard would it be to add 2 speakers to the Energy Take series? My budget is probably less than $1000 but I may be able to go over, it is more self control than anything.

You should head over to the Energy owners forum. http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=630450 I started out looking at the takes and ended up with a Energy CC-100 center with 4 C-100 surround. Very happy so far..

BTW completed system with a Yamaha 665 and A Bic F12 sub for $930.00 total system cost

Can anyone provide advice on the following..

Room 17' by 13', 8'h. 60/40 HT music. 5.1 is fine, 7.1 is bonus for future.

Take Classic 5.0 $199 (would love Energy RC mini set but seems to $$ at $99 per speaker, need WAF factor)

Sub ? considering TSC T250, $225 with coupon, HSU STF 1, ED A-250 $325, X-sub 159 open box. (need this to be fairly small and cover the higher frequencies the Take classic won't cover. Also would like a decent musical sub but with lowest extention possible.

AVR? HK 254 refurb about $260 shipped, or Denon 1909 refurb, 325 +ship when in stock, Denon 590 at $285, or pioneer 819 at $250. (I like the idea of Audussy or or similar functions but not really sure if it matters at my deployment level) Need 3 HDMI, but not upconversion, my 52 Samsung does an incredible job scaling.

Thanks in advance for any advice & experience on the above.

wwstereo.com has a good price on an Energy C-50 set for $400: http://www.wwstereo.com/#/ecommerce/..._84__0_0_0_-1/
...better than the Takes and not much more expensive.

I've been told that a good receiver with just decent L and R channel speakers will sound better than any HTIB setup. How true is that?

Listening to music is a million times more enjoyable with good speakers starting @ about $400 pair and up. You won't get a surround effect, though, if that's important to you.

Posted this message as a new thread and it was suggested I post here.

Just finishing up a basement renovation and need some advice. The space is not very large. 12 x 30 but the TV area is at one end so more like 12 x 15. I was going to go with a 2.1 HTIB such as bose cinemate but after browsing on this site I think I can do better with a receiver, 2 speakers and subwoofer. I plan to get most of the components and TV at BB because I can trade in my air miles which gives me around $1800. Will likely get a Samsung 40 inch 120hz TV which takes up about 1200. Went with 40 inch because the TV stand will only accommodate 42 inch max. The rest is for speakers and blue ray player so not much of a budget. Maybe I should get the 60 hz TV but it seems like 120 is the way to go for spotrs, blue ray and HD TV. So I am thinking about the Pioneer VSX-519 for a receiver (199), 2 Polk T15 bookshelf speakers for front Left and Right (105/pr). I read a lot of good things about the Dayton sub-100 HT and thought I would get that from Amazon. I went with bookshelf speakers because the space is not too big and my wife would prefer that. I think they will fit nicely on top of the end towers of the TV unit which are 48 inches high. Am I selling myself short with the polk speakers or will they do the job? Sorry for such a long post and hope this is the right area for it.

Every step up makes a difference at that price. Check out the Monitor series available from Newegg – they’re an older version of the TSi series at the same price as the T15. Or go with the TSi (from Newegg)….
Newegg: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...n=polk+monitor

I'm looking at the Pioneer, too. I have an older model, pre-HDMI which sounds fine in my room which is a bit larger than yours. The speaker set is also Pioneer. I bought a Sony STR-DH700 and the HDMI out stopped sending video after a day. Whatever caused it I sent it back, and I plan on getting that Pioneer. I doubt I'll spend as much on speakers as you, as my volume rarely gets above a certain level (kids on one side, a very touchy neighbor on the other).

I don't know about the flexibility of the EQ on that model, though, so if you're concerned abt music maybe give that a consideration.

Ickysmits,

I was originally going to buy a HTIB 7.1 set up, but based on the postings you've made here, I went with a Denon AVR 790 receiver, and a 7.1 speaker set comprised of the 5.1 C-50 Energy set you mentioned, plus an additional pair of C-50s.

I know it won't make audiophile hearts soar and sing. However I tend to buy Audiovisual equipment every /ten/ to fifteen years or so. This set up will be replacing an ancient JVC receiver and set of 5.1 speakers. The only reason I'm replacing those is because the reciever itself is starting to flake out. Heck, I only bought a new television a year and a half back, because my 11 year old CRT died on me.

I know, I know... go for 2.1 set up first, etc etc. However I /hate/ shopping for AV stuff. I hate it. Did I mention I hate it? I hate it so. So I do it once, then go on with my life until something breaks. I also have grown fond of surround sound, so it was all at once or nothing.

So far I'm really pleased! Thought I'd chime in from the stand point of someone who merely wants to get everthing done and move on with their life. If any of you are lurking, I hope this helps: it really /is/ okay to throw together a complete system, if you aren't obsessed with the best and greatest.

That’s a nice choice of equipment, I’m sure you’ll be happy for a while. The C-50 is such a cool little speaker; it’s small enough that it can be placed easily around a room and not stick out – and it’s big enough that the crossover to the subwoofer can be set at 80Hz for an overall fuller sound than most small satellite speakers. They’re a bargain at the price right now. I hope you enjoy them!

General question here:

I've been wavering between buying separate components, or getting an HTIB or just a soundbar.

My decision might be easier if I understood how much I could or could not just add-on to whatever I initially get.

For example, if I start with a 2.1 setup, I assume that I can always add 2-4 speakers later. But does the potential of adding speakers later affect what the first set of speakers should be?

Similarly, can I get an HTIB with 5 speakers, with an option to get 2 others later?

And would it be silly to get a soundbar (like the Sony CT-100), expecting that I could add speakers to that as well later?

edit: I suppose I should note that the main purpose of the audio equipment, for me, is to watch movies on blue-ray and tv; I don't envision using this room that much for music, though I suppose it's possible. I would like to get the surround sound effect eventually. I'm also not sure how the wife will feel about wires, which is why the soundbar is a consideration.

For my basement, I went with

yamaha v661 receiver
panasonic bluray player
yambeka 5.1 speaker system
Tad Subwoofer

That's a good system for me, enough to make the wife complain.

But, I've just ordered two more BIC F-12 subwoofers because I need more....

With the front three, yes. The center channel speaker should match the front left and right speakers. Ideally, they should be the same, but you may have to go with a center channel from the same maker and series if a regular front speaker will interfere with your display. It's a compromise there, but most go ahead with it (I did.)

Surround speakers should at least match each other. Again, it is best if all match, but not critical. The fronts are more critical in terms of matching.


Yes. Again, best they match, if possible.


I don't think it has outputs for speakers. It's really a one-unit solution, including "receiver." Might check its thread.

A coworker has asked me to build him a system with a $2000 budget. He wants a 5.1 setup with Receiver and Blu-Ray player and I was wanting some opinions. Any assistance would be greatly appreciated.

I have been browsing the site and have come up with some very useful info. I originally planned to get the Onkyo HTIB 9100THX but like many have become convinced I can put something better together for around the same price. I want something that I can hook up a 7.1 system to in the living room and run 2 separate speakers to my porch for outdoor listening. This would be a separate listening area and these 2 could be purchased later. I like movies but I want this for primarily music. Rockin' music. I know I'm not going to get a crazy system for the $800-1000 but I want to spend my money wisely and purchase the speakers I want the 1st time.

I'm alright with towers and have plenty of nice area to mount speakers near the ceiling. I don't have much of a preference on what type of speakers they are but more of what I can afford.

I'm terrible at deciphering what the numbers mean on all these things and I've never dealt with them before. I can set-up a system but am not the greatest at tweaking.

Room: It is setup up a little weird as the house is an open floor plan. The living room area is 25ft X 13ft (9ft ceilings)but it opens into the dining room area.

So Far:
PS3
42 in Panasonic Plasma

I like Onkyo AVRs and have seen some great deals on the energy speakers.
These are some that peaked my interest.
Speakers:
Energy C300 $119 a piece ($240)
[ (4)C-50 5.0 Speaker Package with C-C50 Center Channel - $250

subwoofer PA-120 $230 ebay


AVR:
onkyo 606 or 607 I believe??I think I've seen this/these for $330 or so but I don't know what would match up well.

I would not be upgrading the system later. Instead I would like to purchase the Energy and AVR now and maybe wait a bit for a deal on a sub. I'm more than open to suggestions. I'm not sure how much the Energy C300 towers would make much difference with the C-50's or not. From the numbers I'm reading it looks like a lot.

From what I can tell guys like me are a dime a dozen on this forum, but I was hoping that some of you audio graybeards on here will be able to help a newbie out.

I've got a budget of between $1,000 and $1500 for a solid system that will last me a good long while. My previous setup just went to goodwill and was a Sony HTIB that I bought back in 1996.

My current equipment is a Sony 60A3000 TV with a Direct TV HD DVR and a Sony BluRay player. (thinking about getting an XBox too) Pretty simple setup, they're all just hooked together via HDMI and I'm using the speakers in the TV since I gave away my old HTIB.

I want to get a receiver that can do solid HDMI switching for video and audio, I don't have a lot of patience when it comes to troubleshooting these things and if it gets more complicated than plugging some HDMI cables in and following the simple in-out logic I'll go play in traffic. I want nice full solid sound. I know that everyone has their own preferences, but I really am a newbie and probably couldn't hear the differences that you guys can.

I was checking out a Yamaha RX-V665 and Two Klipsch RF-52's or 62's. I also would like to get a nice solid sub and center channel.

By no means assume I'm stuck on any of these items, I just went to BB and a local stereo store and was looking around. The sad truth is that I'll probably go out and buy what you guys suggest since I don't know a whole lot about the topic, so please any advice you have would be much appreciated. (I will do some followup research so I can compare your suggestions, but beyond that I wouldn't know what I'm looking at)

First off, welcome!

It sounds like you're on the right track with a reasonable budget to get some nice speakers that will sound great and last a good long time. You should be posting this in the speaker section, however, so you can get more input on the speakers - the most important part of the system. To keep them from going on wild tangents you should give them some basic information:

1. Budget
2. Room size
3. Preference of speaker type (satellite, bookshelf, floorstanding, etc)
4. Listening preferences. (what % movies, music, tv)
5. Where you live (just in case someone is familiar with your area and can advise some audio shops to visit)

The receiver should be easier as there are a lot fewer choices whithin certain price ranges. The V665 is a fine receiver but I really like Audyssey features, but that's just me.

In the meantime, here are just a few of many ideas to chew on -

SVS
http://www.svsound.com/products-sys-sbs_black.cfm

Aperion (they'll let you listen in home and will pay return shipping if you're not happy)
http://www.aperionaudio.com/catalog/...ystems,33.aspx

Mirage
http://www.vanns.com/shop/servlet/it...ge-omni-550-ch
http://www.vanns.com/shop/servlet/it...rage-omni-150c
http://www.vanns.com/shop/servlet/it...e-omni-c150-ch

Warfedale
http://www.tsto.com/cgi-bin/TSTO.sto...duct/View/2987
http://www.tsto.com/cgi-bin/TSTO.sto...ation/2829&2D3
http://www.tsto.com/cgi-bin/TSTO.sto.../View/2620&2D2
http://www.tsto.com/cgi-bin/TSTO.sto.../View/2614&2D2

The downside to my list is that they won't be available locally for you to listen. That will always be my first recommendation but I understand that it's not always possible.

That's some good info. I wondered if I might be stretching the thread a little because of the $$$ amount I'm looking to spend. I'll break my question into two parts and post in different threads. I'm a little concerned with picking out the receiver, just want to make sure I don't get something that introduces any delay in the audio/video sync or any other video related issues in the switching.

Thanks for the links to the speakers on the other sites. What the heck is up with the price breaks on the Mirage speakers? Looks like some good deals.

You shouldn't have those kinds of problems with new receivers, but definitely take the time to learn about the different features. The Mirage Omni series is older but they' come new from Vanns - probably they have an arrangement to get rid of old new stock, but I don't really know. There isn't a lot of information about them but several have reported they are very happy with them. You can get an idea of how Mirage speakers in general are unique with the omni thing and listen to some (newer models) at Best Buy. I like Mirage speakers a lot.

I´m helping my brother pick out parts for his home theater system, since we are both new to these kind of things i´d like to get your opinion on the items we have selected:

1. Logitech Harmony One Advanced Universal Remote
   
2. Klipsch HD 500 5.1 Speakers with Sanus Systems Wms5-B Wall Or Ceiling Speaker Mounts
   
3. Denon AVR1910
   
4. Logitech Harmony Adapter for Playstation 3
   
5. PlayStation 3 80GB
   

If you have any comments or suggestions i´d really appreciate it
P.S. His budget is like $1500-$1800

I had my eye on the Energy Classic 5.0 set, but I see that they are no longer selling it at vanns.com So what is the best replacement for the Energy Classic

Been lurking here for a while and have now come up with some ideas for an AVR, based on posts from everyone. At first, I was considering one of the Samsung HTIB's, but I seem to remember reading somewhere that the Samsung receiver THD specs were pretty bad, and that the Yamaha line, watt for watt, had the better THD specs. So, I began looking at the Yamaha--first, the YHT-591, then I began thinking more about choosing my own speakers. THEN, someone posted something about Pioneer. I have long had a love for Pioneer components, as I am STILL using my TANK of a laser disc player, the Elite CLD-97.

So, here are the two receivers currently under consideration: I would appreciate your opinions and recommendations.

Yamaha RX-V465 and the Pioneer VSX-819H-K.

I lean toward the Yamaha, because of the larger number of HDMI and other A/V inputs. (This unit will be replacing my OLD separates.) I have as inputs a Toshiba HD-3 HD DVD player (yeah, I know, but I'm not interested in paying $10 more per disc for Blu-Ray; and, the Toshiba up-converts VERY nicely), an old Mits editing VCR, Philips DVD recorder, the Pioneer CLD 97, and a DISH SD receiver. Output is to a Mitsubishi HC-4900 projector (1080p).

As I understand, both the Yamaha and Pioneer AVR's decode audio from the HDMI input.

I have neither the interest nor the space for a 7.1 system.

Thanks for your input, gentlemen (ladies, too!).

Its there now.....
http://www.vanns.com/shop/servlet/it..._c=site_search

and other places too.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16882269004
http://www.wwstereo.com/#/ecommerce/..._84__0_0_0_-1/

Short question:

Infinity TSS-800 + Denon 1709 vs. Onkyo 3200 / 5200. Cost would be the same (cheaper with the 3200). Is there a clear winner?

Now the details:

Setting up a home theater / hang out room. The room is 11x17 with an 8 foot ceiling. It all walls on all four sides (but with three doors!), as it is somewhat of an extension off the back of the house. The viewing distance to the TV is about 13 feet.

Like most people here I'd like a nice system that will be fun without spending a ton of money. I have a firm size requirement on the front and center speakers. I am building the entertainment center the shell of an old fireplace. I only have 7.5 inches on each size of the TV. Mounting the speakers outside of this shell is not going to be okay. I have slightly less clearance beneath the TV for the center.

I already have a Panny TC-P46G10 and their 60-series Blu-Ray player. Also attached will be a Wii and a Mac Mini.

I had been looking at HTIB, originally an Onkyo 3200 or 5200. But I decided to complicate my life a little bit.

While at today I picked up an Infinity TSS-800 floor model set that was on clearance for $250. These speakers seem to get mixed reviews, and they are returnable. I hooked two of them to a shelf system and put in a CD. They sound a little thin, although the sub is not hooked up.

This leaves me needing a receiver. To me the correct approach would be to wire everything to the TV:

Blu-Ray -> HDMI -> TV
Wii -> component -> TV
Mac Mini -> HDMI + Toslink -> TV
TV -> Toslink -> Receiver

This allows me to input select on the TV, adjust video settings to each source, and run the TV without needing the receiver on. I realize I wouldn't get the TrueHD from the Blu-Ray player, but to get that I would need a receiver with pass-through anyway (I think).

I would actually try to split the Toslink off of the Mac to send it to both the TV and the receiver. That would allow my to listen to music without needing the TV on.

With this approach I could get a fairly basic receiver (no up conversion, pass thru, etc) and still keep the wire count down. Is there something flawed with the logic?

The store I picked up the speakers had some Denon 1709s left over for the same price as the speaker. I realized I can get them a little cheaper online. They also had a 1908 for even less.

Considering my modest goals, is the TSS-800 paired with a basic receiver such as the 1709 a good approach? Should I keep things simple and save a little bit with the Onkyo 3200?

Thanks,
Dave

The Denon 1709 receiver is better than the 3200's receiver as it has some good Audyssey features that might be useful to you. Without looking, I think it has better connectivity too. Any small satellite system like the Infinity TSS-800 is going to sound thin through only two speakers without a sub. At least the TSS-800 comes with a powered sub, which is necessary for these small systems. Out of all of your choices, I'd stick with the Denon/Infinity.

JMO but the flaw I see in your proposed set-up involves running a digital audio cable from the TV back to the receiver. The output will be two channels only (except for multichannel audio coming into the TV via an antenna if you're getting your TV OTA). All multichannel audio being input to the TV via HDMI connections is downconverted to stereo. Having said that, you could simply connect the digital audio output from the Bluray player, Wii and Mac Mini to the receiver. That will still allow you to "tweak" video settings from each source. Like I said, JMO.

Thanks for the tip on the audio out from the TV.

I picked up a Denon 1709 today and will give it a shot tonight. I also picked up a set of Quintet SL speakers new in the box for $240. I will compare those with the TSS-800s, with a mind towards adding a sub to the Quintet SL if necessary.

-Dave