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Have I been HD-DVD brainwashed? - Page 2

post #31 of 191
Quote:
Originally Posted by DTV TiVo Dealer View Post


And regarding up-converting, I can tell you SD DVDs played in the XA2 with a little tweaking of the color and image enhancement tools you can get most BD exclusive titles in SD DVD to look just like the best BD player with the BD title playing.

-Robert

I'm sorry, Robert. I've had a lot of respect for you in the past but I'm calling BS on that one. Yes, 'Hitch' looks about the same, but that is an extreme example. There is a substantial difference on most titles.
post #32 of 191
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheLoveone View Post

Ridiculous and we all know it. Upconverted SD DVDs looking just like BDs? Of course it all must be done on a Toshiba HD DVD player to accomplish such a feat, eh?

I expect posts like this from fanboys not from dealers who advertise on this site and want my money. I mean seriously who would buy a Blu-ray player from you.

I ask any member(s) to visit my store and see the XA2 playing a SD DVD with any BD player playing the same title on the same HDTV.

If you see any difference it would be limited select scenes and difficult to see any difference. The XA2 SD up-converting is unbelievable when set-up properly.

Sorry I wish it was different.

-Robert
post #33 of 191
Quote:
Originally Posted by Assayer View Post

I'm sorry, Robert. I've had a lot of respect for you in the past but I'm calling BS on that one. Yes, 'Hitch' looks about the same, but that is an extreme example. There is a substantial difference on most titles.

Ultraviolet and Fifth Element are similar, but they are exceptions.
post #34 of 191
Quote:
Originally Posted by blainehamilton View Post

And as for Crank and Casino Royale *yawn*

Oh, c'mon. Crank may not be much, but anyone who casually dismisses the impact of the James Bond franchise is missing the point of the question.

Here's the real deal: Both formats have great PQ. Both formats also have great AQ (BD has a slight advantage in the number of actual lossless releases, but the vast majority of non-audiophile buyers don't have a system good enough to tell the difference). The majority of the HD releases currently available are from neutral studios.

If you can only buy one player today, look over the catalog of each format. Whichever one has more titles that you feel are worth paying for is the format you should choose. Everything else is BS.
post #35 of 191
I have a xbox 360 and I have been thinking of getting the HD-DVD add on. I also have been looking at Blu-ray and it looks like the Ps3 is the best choice for the money for Blu-ray. I have a xbr2 and 7.1 Keff sound so I am leaning towards the PS3 to watch movies. Blockbuster and netflix both carry a good selection of HD stuff. So which way should I go? The money difference is not going to kill me and it looks like the PS3 will be around for a while. I would appreciate anyones 2 cents here. I just want to pull the trigger now and not play the chase technology game.
post #36 of 191
Quote:
Originally Posted by DTV TiVo Dealer View Post

I ask any member(s) to visit my store and see the XA2 playing a SD DVD with any BD player playing the same title on the same HDTV.

If you see any difference it would be limited select scenes and difficult to see any difference. The XA2 SD up-converting is unbelievable when set-up properly.

Why not compare to HD DVD titles rather than BD? Are they noticably better? What kind of display are you talking about?
post #37 of 191
Quote:
Originally Posted by DTV TiVo Dealer View Post

No dealer would ever buy from NewEgg.

And regarding up-converting, I can tell you SD DVDs played in the XA2 with a little tweaking of the color and image enhancement tools you can get most BD exclusive titles in SD DVD to look just like the best BD player with the BD title playing.

And though not quite as great all other G1 and G2 HD DVD players do an excellent job of up-converting all SD DVD as well.

-Robert

I know HD DVD and AVS is your bread and butter Robert, but come on... dont commit reputation suicide. Whats gonna happen if BD wins(which its looking that way)??? What are you gonna sell then?
post #38 of 191
Quote:
Originally Posted by DTV TiVo Dealer View Post

I ask any member(s) to visit my store and see the XA2 playing a SD DVD with any BD player playing the same title on the same HDTV.

Easy... I would say the one stuttering and freezing up is the one playing in the XA2 player.
post #39 of 191
What's wrong with going both ways?

What do we have a bunch of food stamp recipients here? They both have their distinct selling points and admittedly the content has gotten lean on HD DVD library side but it's hard to resist or deny the upconverting capability of the REON HQV VP for those with SD Libraries or anyone that's bothered to actually read the consumer and professional reviews of this XA2 player. My Gen1 player beats my Oppo at upconverting as well. I'm not trashing BD in any way as I will eventually have both as content will force my hand but what's the big deal it's not like their selling for the price of a VP50 or Crystallio II.

Videophiles don't let a little money get in the way do they? Aren't we a nation of competition and CHOICE? Choose both!
post #40 of 191
FWIW the forthcoming Samsung BD-P1200 will have Reon HQV processing as well.

Quote:


What do we have a bunch of food stamp recipients here?

No, we light our cigars with $100 bills.
post #41 of 191
FWIW, the upcoming Tosh A20 will have the Reon as well.

I'll be keen to see the review of the Samsung player. Last go around (G1) not sure if Samsung used the same processors for upconversion as the Toshiba, but it was clearly not in the same league in it's implementation.

As for upconversion on the XA2, on a 50 inch plasma, many recent DVDs, including titles like Click, Taledega Nights, Cars, Pirates of the C, The Guardian etc. look close to HD (not quite), and often better than the HD movie channels (we get Cox here).

I had rented Taledega Nights BD version a while ago but never got around to watching it fully. I then bought the DVD version to watch on a flight, but then ended up watching it at home upconverted on the XA2. My wife pretty much could not tell it was the SD version and not the BD! On a bigger and perhaps more precise set up the differences would have been great, but sitting 9 ft away from the Pio FHD1 plasma, the XA2 does a damn good job as an upconverting DVD Player. And yes it does approach the general HD movie quality - at least Cable TV in my case.

The biggest problem with HD adoption for the general public is that DVD seems to be getting better! However, I do like the menu system and the audio of HD disks, which are far superior to DVD.....you can't fix that with upconversion
post #42 of 191
Couldn't it really be affected on how well the DVD transfer is? Watching an SD DVD of Gaurdian and Superman Returns I really was left thinking man this looks bad. But I also watched Invincible on SD DVD and was constantly saying "wow this could almost be HD".
post #43 of 191
For Jeffnebraska. Both formats require SMPTE 421M, ITU-T H.262 and ITU-T H.264 video codecs. Blu-ray does have a large advantage in the max video data rate and storage size departments. As with any other format some movies will be standouts, others will be good and some will be lousy in the PQ department. Just compare your SD DVD's to each other.

As for up-converting you did not state what video display device you are using. Some HD displays do a great job of IVTC and deinterlacing negating the need for a up-converting DVD player. In fact there can be a slight loss in resolution when up-converting. Regardless of method used a SD DVD is still a SD DVD.

But the most important aspect is content, right? Click HERE to see a list of BD movies for the current year. Please note the ones in blue are exclusive to Blu-ray.

I am a tech person, if you want to know my background just click the RED & GREEN in my signature line.

Edit to add: Amazon has just kicked off a great sale on select Blu-ray Movie Titles.
post #44 of 191
Quote:
Originally Posted by plazman View Post

FWIW, the upcoming Tosh A20 will have the Reon as well.

No it won't.
post #45 of 191
Quote:
Originally Posted by DTV TiVo Dealer View Post

I ask any member(s) to visit my store and see the XA2 playing a SD DVD with any BD player playing the same title on the same HDTV.

If you see any difference it would be limited select scenes and difficult to see any difference. The XA2 SD up-converting is unbelievable when set-up properly.
-Robert

I'm running an Optoma HD81 and I can say the Gennum scalar makes SD-DVD's look very good, but there is no way I would confuse them with BluRay. I even took Corpse Bride (which is not only an excellent transfer but it is animated and upscales very well) - and there was still a noticeable difference, but more subtle.

I then took my BluRay player and hooked it up to a 32" LG LCD (720p) and couldn't see the difference between BluRay and SD-DVD.

I do come down your way once in a while, but before I do, what kind of display are you talking about? If it's a 32" LCD, you're probably right - but then the same can be said of HD-DVD as well.
post #46 of 191
Quote:
Originally Posted by FatiusJeebs View Post

im not even going to begin about content and that other crap. You asked about PQ...the answer is....HD-DVD has, from the beginning, had excellent picture quality. BR started off a bit rough but is definitely improving. I still feel the edge goes slightly to HD-DVD.


who cares about PQ when you're watching the same damn movies? HD-DVD = NO CONTENT
post #47 of 191
Quote:
Originally Posted by ottscay View Post

I also own both that A1 and the Panny Blu Ray player, and there is no question that they are equal in PQ; you have to be delusional to think that HD DVD is "more dimensional 95% of the time". Also, the high end audio support is better on Blu Ray right now. Beyond that they are fairly comprable (HD DVD has a bit better menus implimented, IMO, but Blu Ray has more and better movies, also IMO).

So yes, you have been somewhat influenced ("brainwashed is probably too strong a word) by the HD DVD forums.

I also own both as above. And if you don't want to own both, I would make my choice based on content. Blu-Ray can look every bit as good as HD DVD. And, while I only own two BRD at this point, they both do just that ("Eight Below" and "Invincible").

How good something looks is always going to be a very subjective observation. So this is all just my opinion. But I'm very happy with Blu-Ray. And I've always been very happy with HD DVD. They both look great at this point.

If you have to decide, do it with content in mind.
post #48 of 191
Quote:
Originally Posted by DTV TiVo Dealer View Post

And regarding up-converting, I can tell you SD DVDs played in the XA2 with a little tweaking of the color and image enhancement tools you can get most BD exclusive titles in SD DVD to look just like the best BD player with the BD title playing.

Man, I hate to say this to you....But You should really be ashamed of yourself for spreading misinformation like this. Your customers come to you for advice,and this is the type of information you give to them to make their decisions?

Upconverted SD-DVD is as good as Blu-ray... but HD-DVD is somehow superior? Set up a real comparison on a 1080p TV, use the best content and let your consumers decide on their own. Your consumers are buying for the future. And its not just 1 or 2 players... its an entire library of content.

If you push your customers to one format or another, using highly suspect tactics(like telling them BD is similar to Upconverted SD, while HD-DVD is superior)... what will you do for them, if the format you pushed fails? You are spreading mis-information, and setting your consumers up for a fall.

If you truly believe that SD upconverted looks as good as BD or HD-DVD... then point your consumers to a decent Denon SD-upconverter. That way your consumers will at least save on the media, as HD-Media is usually $10-15 more per disc. That way your consumers are not wasting their hard earned dollars on a Next Gen media.
post #49 of 191
I think if you are a home theater enthusiast its wise to go both ways if you can afford it. With the way prices are dropping you can get a hd dvd player and a blu-ray player for under a grand. That way you always have more than enough content.

FWIW I started out with the 360 addon, but there literally wasn't enough content for me. So I took a shot on a new Samsung BD-P1000 (on ebay for less than $400), which has worked great for me. I honestly don't see a difference in PQ between the 22 HD DVD titles I have and the 12 Blu-ray titles I have. I also use the 360 addon for upconversion of my SD DVD's and it does a fine job.
post #50 of 191
Bd looks as good or better than hd dvd.
Every single BD player functions better than all hd dvd players with far less playback problems.

BD is here to stay and absolutely rules in the audio department....and hd dvd will probably not be here for the long haul.

Now you have the truth.
post #51 of 191
HD DVD = No content, is a stupid generalization. If you are interested, make a list of titles that you would like to watch and see which format has more for you.

The total number of HD disks that will play in any given HD DVD or BD player is very close. Those who believe HD DVD = no content are being brainwashed for sure. Just like those believing the war is over!

They best cure for brain washing is check out both for yourself and make up your own mind. The truth when it comes to AV is what you prefer. It is a personal taste.

The BDA is resorting to 2 primary tactics - 1. Spreading FUD that the format war is over and that BDA has won - not true! 2. All the content is on BD and HD DVD is far behind when it comes to content - again not true. The conent gap isn't as great as many believe. Take out the filler titles and see what you end up with.

Also, as far as whether SD upconvertion is acceptable or not. Check it out for yourself. You be the judge of whether it is something that works for you. Remember, you'll need a good SD player for a long time since HD formats have less than 1% of DVD.

As for should you pick an HD DVD player like the XA2 that does great SD upconversion, comparable to a similarly priced Denon SD Player only, that again is something for you to judge. I believe that the XA2 as a standalone SD DVD player would be worth it's price, the added ability to play HD DVD is an excellent bonus. So, for me the XA2 is really a risk free purchase in terms of the format war.

I don't believe Robert is misleading anybody. All he is doing is inviting people to his shop to judge for themselves. If you prefer, check it out on your own set up or somewhere else. But the fact remains, before you believe any hype from anyone, try and verify the results for yourself. We have different standards and requirements and that dictates acceptable price -value.

Believe in yourself. Trust your own judgment and you'll be fine
post #52 of 191
Plazman,
I can get a Denon 1730 HDMI SD upconverter brand new for $160. Where can I find an XA2 for the same price?

What I am saying is that the XA2 is not worth it as an SD-upconverter alone. The HD-DVD part is not a "Bonus". You pay for it.

To say that SD is similar to BD... yet HD-DVD is superior to both is misinformation. You and I both know it.
post #53 of 191
Quote:
Originally Posted by ihyln View Post

who cares about PQ when you're watching the same damn movies? HD-DVD = NO CONTENT

C'mon - that's an overstatement at best. As of today, there are 186 titles shipping on BD, 175 shipping on HD DVD.

Yes, BD is in front in available titles, but the lead is pretty darned small.

It really comes down to which assortment of titles appeals to an individual. Neither has a huge catalog of available discs today, and the planned/announced/rumored releases for the rest of 2007 won't go very far in moving towards parity with SD DVD.
post #54 of 191
Quote:
Originally Posted by ihyln View Post

who cares about PQ when you're watching the same damn movies? HD-DVD = NO CONTENT

If content were the deciding factor, I never would have bought a BluRay player. SD-DVD is the KING of Content.
post #55 of 191
Quote:


Have I been HD-DVD brainwashed?

If you listen to this, pure, unadulterated, horse manure...

Quote:


No dealer would ever buy from NewEgg.

And regarding up-converting, I can tell you SD DVDs played in the XA2 with a little tweaking of the color and image enhancement tools you can get most BD exclusive titles in SD DVD to look just like the best BD player with the BD title playing.

Then the answer is a resounding, YES!
post #56 of 191
Quote:
Originally Posted by tqlla View Post

Plazman,
I can get a Denon 1730 HDMI SD upconverter brand new for $160. Where can I find an XA2 for the same price?

What I am saying is that the XA2 is not worth it as an SD-upconverter alone. The HD-DVD part is not a "Bonus". You pay for it.

To say that SD is similar to BD... yet HD-DVD is superior to both is misinformation. You and I both know it.


The Denon that would be comparable is the 2930CI which lists for $850
post #57 of 191
Quote:
Originally Posted by DTV TiVo Dealer View Post

I ask any member(s) to visit my store and see the XA2 playing a SD DVD with any BD player playing the same title on the same HDTV.

If you see any difference it would be limited select scenes and difficult to see any difference. The XA2 SD up-converting is unbelievable when set-up properly.

Sorry I wish it was different.

-Robert

Providing we're watching from across the street with binoculars pointing the wrong way.

Please, stop talking complete crap. Nothing changes the fact that there are over one million more pixels per frame on the Blu-ray disc.
post #58 of 191
Quote:
Originally Posted by thebland View Post

HD DVD owners will not be watching Casino Royale next week.

I have BR and I will not be watching Casino Royale next week.
post #59 of 191
Quote:
Originally Posted by DTV TiVo Dealer View Post

No dealer would ever buy from NewEgg.

And regarding up-converting, I can tell you SD DVDs played in the XA2 with a little tweaking of the color and image enhancement tools you can get most BD exclusive titles in SD DVD to look just like the best BD player with the BD title playing.

And though not quite as great all other G1 and G2 HD DVD players do an excellent job of up-converting all SD DVD as well.

-Robert

After the HD-Tivo fiasco I was still willing to give you the benefit of the doubt. Then you kept saying the Tosh A20 had the Reon chip even after every other reputable source said it didn't. Now you are finally admitting it won't. Now this. I almost preordered the A20 from you but now I'm so glad I didn't. You have zero credibility left and just made sure I will never purchase anything from you or recommend you to anyone else.
post #60 of 191
Quote:
Originally Posted by DTV TiVo Dealer View Post

And regarding up-converting, I can tell you SD DVDs played in the XA2 with a little tweaking of the color and image enhancement tools you can get most BD exclusive titles in SD DVD to look just like the best BD player with the BD title playing.

...

-Robert

I can't believe that I just read that.

Any credibility that you may have had left just flew out the window. And it is doubtful that it will return.

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