ColorVision 6.0 users - Not compatible with Eyeone Display LT or CF Optimagery sensor

I autodetect Optimagery with CF6.0 - but it is for the Spyder2 prototype so it uses the Spyder2 drivers in Windows - not the Spyder1 drivers. I use the license file since this combo did not work with the golden dongle. Did you manually select the Optimagery in CF? Ask what their refurb/upgrade policy is - your original Spyder has likely drifted - the Spyder2 is much better regarding drift/sensitivity. They also have the Platinum Spyder now with CF7.0 - presumably individually calibrated though not confirmed yet. Try to bypass DataColor/Colorvision support and get to one of the ex-Milori desks - her number has been posted before....

is the Display LT the same as on the list (this is from CF7.0)

GretagMacbeth Eye-One Monitor (w/ spectral graphing)
GretagMacbeth Eye-One Display
GretagMacbeth Eye-One Pro (NEW)

You can't use the generic Sequal Imaging driver with the Display2 or the Display LT which is what ColorFacts 6 and 7 use. The Display2 and LT are a modified Sequal Imaging device so require a modified driver. So to use the Display LT you only have two choices CalMAN or colorHCFR. With CalMAN I have spent a considerable amount of time perfecting our Display2 and LT support along with all of the other meters we support.

I spoke directly to ColorVision about this. CF does not now (and has no plans in the future) to support the GTB Display 2 probe.

The older EyeOne Display meter from GMB only needed the generic Sequal Imaging driver, so that's why it was and is supported by CF6/7. But when GMB designed the Display2 and the DisplayLT which is the same hardware as a Display2 they made it so you needed to license the driver SDK from them and could no longer use the generic Sequal Imaging driver. So I guess CV/CF never bothered to license the newer driver SDK from GMB.

I will have Bill Blackwell contact you on the AVS member CalMAN pricing.

The Display 2and LT are password protected and use the same USB driver as all of the other instruments which GretagMacbeth has used for several years now. Since Datacolor is not licensed to sell these instruments they do not have the password which the probes require in their software!

Regarding software packages which support these instruments Progressive Labs software will support these probes for use with its software. The licensed user must supply the probe serial number to Progressive Labs to recieve a serial number file which unlocks the software for use with these probes!

With this and the previous post, I'm even more confused. CF6 and CF7 both support the GMB Eye-One Pro. So are you guys saying the E1Pro isn't password protected driver -- and is much older than it appears?

I'm open to the idea that I'm totally confused...so just whack me upside the head if I am.

The EyeOne Pro is supported by CF6/7. It's the EyeOne Display2/LT that are not. The older EyeOne Display is.

Sorry, you didn't clear up my question. It's probably just semantic differences, but I'll ask again anyways.

The previous posts said the reason the E1D2 and E1LT aren't supported is because they are sensors that require a password protected USB driver -- presumably newer sensors. According to the posts, the password protection requires an SDK (presumably for creating the driver), and that CV doesn't have the license.

So what about the E1 Pro and E1 Beamer (both of which I believe are "newer")? Do they require a password driver? If so, is this a case where CV has the password driver for these, but not the others (because they don't sell them)?

What's the skinny?

There may be technical reasons why ColorVision doesn't support the Display 2, but I doubt it.

The fact is that this probe is a direct competitor to the Spyder2, so I'm guessing that they have made a business decision not to support it out of a desire not to help market a competitor's product.

This would be consistent with some of our discussions with them. I think Derek and Cliff were more talking about what was probably a convenient minor technical issue that provided the opportunity for them to re-think an existing practice and make an overarching business decision more in line with what they are trying to achieve strategically. The same can be said for the inclusion of the Spyder2 with CF6 and the Platinum for CF7.

Pencil Geek,

Password protection is a feature which is available in all of the Sequel Imaging/Gretagmacbeth/x-Rite probes. The eeprom has a space which can contain a manufacturers or oem's password which performs a handshake with the software upon start-up of the software. If the software can perform a "handshake" with the probe when it checks for the password then the software will work. This has nothing whatsoever to do with the USB driver.

The USB driver for the Gretagmacbeth probes has been the same for all of them for several years now (approximately 7 years). most of the past models of the probes have all been supplied unlocked however the Display 2 and Display LT are provided factory password protected. This means any third party software must contain the password to perform the "handshake" upon start-up or it will not communicate with the probe.

Got it...thanks.

As for CalMAN we have a license agreement and official SDK with all of the manufactures we support. ColorVision for the Spyder2 and it's family. Gretagmacbeth for the EyeOne family including the Pro, Display, Display2 and DisplayLT. x-rite for the DTP94. We are also working with others to license many/many more. When v3 is released we will have at least if not more meter and source support than CF7.

as a fellow collector of probes ( ), what is the likelihood you'd ever support the HCFR DIY probe?

Well since colorHCFR is an open source project I could incorporate the support if the demand justified the time and support to do it.

BTW just added a few more older Sequal Imaging probes to the collection a chroma3 and two chroma4's. So that puts the count some around 15 meters. I should create a museum for calibration equipment I'm still looking for other types of Sequal Imaging based probes mostly the OEM'd ones.

Since a number of the probes which you have recently integrated to the software package are not able to do a decent job of calibrating most of the new displays it seems like you have gone through a lot of trouble for nothing. Why would someone expect to use a Chroma 3, Chroma 4 or Chroma 4 LCD on almost any new display and expect to get decent results? This is why these pieces were discontinued over twelve months ago! The filter sets used as well as other enhancements have made the current products substantially better at performing calibration on virtually any display out now.

Its isn't about how many instruments you work with if they don't perform well! We currently support 15 instruments as well with all but three pieces being currently manufactured with the remainder being pieces which we sold previously.

Do to the fact that many new display technologies exhibit wide gamuts exceeding the design characteristics of most probes filter sets the color accuracy is in many cases very poor. Integrating these older instruments so that one can use them with a current software package is useles unless the individual is planning on calibrating an older display which the instrument is known to work well with.

Because we can/did and that's what our users have asked for. Why exclude a probe just because it was designed over 12 months ago if it works perfectly well with the display it was built for.

Yes the newer probes have a wider range of display support and we provide support for them as well including spectroradiometers.

So you are saying the probes from Sencore which are based on the Chroma3 and Chroma4 LCD are no longer valid for the displays they where built for because they were designed a few years ago. I'm sure Sencore would disagree.

Yes this is a moving target and that's why we are not married to a single manufacture or design. Let them design and build the hardware and we "CalMAN" will provide the best software support for them.

I think its awesome to incorporate so many probes - gives those owners some software that will still supported instead of axing it and render them useless

Sencore probes are both Chroma 4 they never used Chroma 3. I am not saying that the probes if used for the displays which were current at the time the probes were made are not suitable for measurement with these probes today! Sencore is still selling the same probes which have been discontinued for more than one year now, does this mean that the probes do an adequate job of calibrating all of the current displays! I am confident that since you have worked with the other instruments that you would have to agree with me as well.

Another thing to consider since you mention interest in trying to integrate with other OEM Sequel probes is that you will not have access to the custom enhancements to the .dll's which make a number of features work on these probes. Several features were added to a number of products which I am aware of that without the enhancements would not function very well.

Most of the low cost probes which are being sold for ICC computer monitor profiling have several limitations and are not very well suited for calibration of FPTV/RPTV due to inadequate low light level sensitivity as well as filter limitations which are not designed for the home theater based displays ie Samsung to name just one. Most users which try to utilize the majority of these instruments do not receive the full benefit of the software as the hardware data returned is not accurate.

Although it seems "awesome" to integrate so many instruments to a software package it is only useful if the calibration results with these products are accurate. The integration of the instrument to the software will only hold value to those that wish to calibrate an older display. Rule out LCD flat panels (with the exception of Chroma 4 LCD) as the probe calibration is specifically done for LCD application as well as having a considerably smaller field of view required for direct contact measurement of the panels. A large number of plasma panels currently do not work well with the older model instruments due to a combination of issues such as color gamut (filters are not correct for these) as well as IR emission related issues. DLP FPTV/RPTV displays with enhanced color gamut and R,G,B,C,M,Y color wheels also cause issues with a number of instruments.

Caveat Emptor!

I'm not sure why you have such an interest in why CalMAN has decided to support the hardware we do. Again we are because we have been asked to by our users which is very important to us.

You are correct in the that Sencore never had a Chroma3 I was just generalizing but the CP II was a Chroma4 v410, the CP III was a Chroma4 v500 and the CP IV was a Chroma4 v500 LCD.

Yes we are very aware of what each probe design is/is not capable of. That is part of our support, online documentation and intergraded docs as to what probe is useful and accurate for each display type. Like IR/UV filtering, wide or different color gamuts, odd color wheels, etc... the list goes on and on.

I have no interest whatsoever in what Calman is doing my comments are intended to educate end users so that they can make the correct choice in their search for display calibration software.

Fair enough, that is my goal as well so I guess we agree on that

This is the last comment from us in this thread since the thread was about CF. We offered some opinions on why some things might or might not have occured, but folks should realize that we are both a competitor and a partner with Colorvision, and are not speaking in any official capacity about them or necessarily with any inside information. Please treat the speculation about business motives as just that. AVS is the equivalent of "guys talking over the fence about home theater".

Colorvision vs. HCFR? I don't think it is appropriate for me to speculate any more than I have done so previously. The HT enthusiast and business geek in me would love to talk about product strategies, price bracketing, etc., but it's really not my place to say.

What I can definitively say is this: our license agreements do not allow for any type of open source implementation. Beyond that, both GMB and CV are great folks with whom to do business at the B2B level for a start-up software company. The documentation in the SDKs is quite good, even if the depth in some of them is far beyond what we would expect our users to need (we are not getting into textiles or food any time soon...). This is why we are confused when we don't see support in software for things like diffusers that are included in the manufacturer's hardware bundle.

Bill

Hi Derek,

If you don't mind I'm interested in the AVS member CalMAN pricing too.

Thanks.