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Plasma for PC Gaming - Looking for advice

post #1 of 30
Thread Starter 
Hey there, I was directed to this forum because I'm told it's the be-all and end-all of AV information. Please go easy on me as this is my first post. I did a search and gatherred some info but I just want to make sure I get some up-to-date opinions and facts about my situation.

Now to the point:

I want to get a large, widescreen display to use as a PC monitor. I use my PC for gaming, movies/shows and general use. I've read that Plasma technology is much better now than it has been in the past for things like lifespan of the device and IR and all that jazz. So I'm very interested in getting a plasma for its contrast, true-black and vivid color advantages over an LCD.

What I'm concerned about is ghosting and refresh rate on games (mainly want to know if this is going to be an issue). I'm quite picky about graphics and framerate so I wanted to check with the plethera of knowledge on this forum for suggestions on what specs to look for and what to know about using a plasma for PC gaming.

I'm also on a budget. I want to get something that is good quality and will last a while (and will spend what is needed) but the cheaper the better.

Thanks in advance for your advice.
post #2 of 30
plasma for gaming and movies is great, but be careful about general computer use. the static images of your windows desktop would have a serious burn-in potential.
post #3 of 30
Thread Starter 
I currently have a dual-monitor setup and plan to use one of my CRTs as my main desktop and the plasma for display of games and video.

I'm sure I'll use the plasma sometimes when using various apps and browsing but I'll be careful with static images.
post #4 of 30
see if you can find a panasonic px600u, they come in 42", 50" and 58" and offer a vga input. since they are a discontinued 2006 model, if you can find one online, you should get a great deal. i know the 42" can be found online for around 1300
post #5 of 30
Thread Starter 
What's the status on refresh rate on plasmas? I tend to adjust my graphics settings a lot on games to get a good framerate with the best graphics possible. Can plasmas do 60 frames per second? Higher? Lower? and is response time an issue? or ghosting? this is what I'm really interested in.

Thanks
post #6 of 30
60Hz is normal
post #7 of 30
response rates are better on plasma's than lcd's, ghosting shouldnt be an issue
post #8 of 30
There is a reason there are many posts from whining gamers about IR on their plasmas. The owners manuals warn about static images but no one seems to listen. In 2 months we'll look for your post complaining about the negligent manufacturers that sold you a defective set.
post #9 of 30
Thread Starter 
Actually I like to read up and make sure I have all the information I need to enjoy and take care of a device to the best of my ability. That's why I created this thread.

Do different models have different max refresh rates? Can you change the refresh rate or is it set to a specific frequency for the device.

Any info will help me out
post #10 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by omeletpants View Post

There is a reason there are many posts from whining gamers about IR on their plasmas. The owners manuals warn about static images but no one seems to listen. In 2 months we'll look for your post complaining about the negligent manufacturers that sold you a defective set.

I game some on my Panny Plasma with my Xbox 360 and now my PC via DVI-HDMI cable. I never have had any IR problems. There are fewer complaints anymore.
omeletpants, I take it that you either do not game or you do not own a plasma?
post #11 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by sd72667 View Post

I game some on my Panny Plasma with my Xbox 360 and now my PC via DVI-HDMI cable. I never have had any IR problems. There are fewer complaints anymore.
omeletpants, I take it that you either do not game or you do not own a plasma?

Love your sarcasm. Actually, I do own a plasma but I don't game as I'm an adult
post #12 of 30
Thread Starter 
Hey now, try not to skew the thread tooo much

"Love your sarcasm. Actually, I do own a plasma but I don't game as I'm an adult"

ROFL couldn't help but comment on this... as if to say your preferrence in entertainment is telling of whether you're mature or not.

Anyway, hypocritically changing the subject... won't do it again
post #13 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by omeletpants View Post

Love your sarcasm. Actually, I do own a plasma but I don't game as I'm an adult

You're an adult??? No freakin' way! Did they change the age of adults?
post #14 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by omeletpants View Post

Love your sarcasm. Actually, I do own a plasma but I don't game as I'm an adult

You sound like my parents. Oh wait a minute, my father is 64 yrs old and he spends most of his retirement gaming with my 2 kids and my nieces and nephews.
He has 5 computers using a LAN and a Xbox. Even "adults" need to let their hair down and have fun. I have no problem that you do not game, as I do not like to
ballroom dance.
post #15 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by sd72667 View Post

You sound like my parents. Oh wait a minute, my father is 64 yrs old and he spends most of his retirement gaming with my 2 kids and my nieces and nephews.
He has 5 computers using a LAN and a Xbox. Even "adults" need to let their hair down and have fun. I have no problem that you do not game, as I do not like to
ballroom dance.

post #16 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by omeletpants View Post

Love your sarcasm. Actually, I do own a plasma but I don't game as I'm an adult


I love the fact that you have to let the world know you are too mature for videogames, but your name is omeletpants......WTF are you Spongebob or something??
post #17 of 30
Thread Starter 
Oooook, about enough thread hijacking. It's nice to chat but I'd like to ask to keep this thread to the point so that I can get the best information.

Please read up higher to see what the real point of this thread is. Thanks!
post #18 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by silentbob17 View Post

Oooook, about enough thread hijacking. It's nice to chat but I'd like to ask to keep this thread to the point so that I can get the best information.

Please read up higher to see what the real point of this thread is. Thanks!

Thanks Mom
post #19 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by randycsvt View Post

I love the fact that you have to let the world know you are too mature for videogames, but your name is omeletpants......WTF are you Spongebob or something??

rofl
post #20 of 30
i game on my 5070 plasma all the timeeeee, its great! Play company of heroes for hours then surf the internet, i use my plasma primarily as my monitor now and have put my old CRT monitor in the garage. I also have my contrast set high so i can enjoy the full value of my plasma. I am about 500 - 600 hours in and have *NEVER* had any IR or Burn-In. I love it, but sometimes it has vsync tearing.. anyone figured out a way to fix that?
post #21 of 30
Thread Starter 
V-Sync is an option that is availible in a lot of games and in your video card configuration that resolves image tearing. It syncs up your framerate with your monitors refresh rate. But it can really reduce framerate because your card will have to wait until the monitor and card are ready to work together, resulting in a lower and sometimes jumpy framerate.
post #22 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by omeletpants View Post

Thanks Mom

Mom caught him at the keyboard AGAIN?
post #23 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elemental1 View Post

Mom caught him at the keyboard AGAIN?

Watch out or the newbie with 7 posts will scold and lecture you
post #24 of 30
I've been using my plasma as a TV monitor for quite a while now, so I can hopefully shed some light and general comments. I have an industrial 50" Panasonic. Some comments and responses to you questions:

- Plasma's with VGA and/or DVI inputs will accept varying refresh rates much like a regular CRT will. However I can't be certain if the Panasonic panel will take the 75Hz signal and just display it at 60Hz, or if it really switches to 75Hz because really the screen doesn't even refresh like we used to think of a CRT as refreshing. Regardless, because the screen never flickers, I find 60Hz to be most suitable, and it is also the documented native refresh rate of the monitor, so it makes the most sense.
- It will make a big difference in clarity and visual quality if you can achieve 1:1 pixel mapping. This means I'd advise against a consumer panel with only HDMI and no 1:1 pixel mode. Anything with a DVI input or VGA input should work. Also, because 42" panels use non-square pixels you can't get 1:1 with them and maintain proper aspect ratio, so I'd rule them out for explicit PC use like you're planning. If you have lots of cash to blow get a 65" 1080p panel, but for a more modest budget then get a 1366x768 panel.
- For gaming your goal should be to run the screen's native res at 60+ fps. Then you can turn vsync on and your game will run perfectly smooth. Playing Oblivion my PC usually can't even get up to 30 fps, but I still leave vsync on to eliminate tearing which IMO is much worse than a dropped frame. Also count on requiring at least 2x AA to get the most out of the PQ. The good news is that for the life of the vid card it only has to produce 1 resolution, and then the rest of the PQ is up to the power you can dedicate to AA, AF, etc.
- The ghosting can be a problem as these displays still aren't perfect. By ghosting, the effect I mean is that green trials follow bright objects as they pass through a dark background. Once you see it for the first time you can always pick it up again, but honestly it's a very minor issue IMO. It's difficult to reproduce unless you have control over the picture and can get white scrolling over black. I'd still take the minimal green trail effect over the artifacts that other display technologies reproduce...
- The burn-in issue really is a non-issue, even for 'reasonable' desktop usage. I got this TV about 18 months ago and havent used a PC monitor since. Granted I only use it for surfing and games, etc and not 6 hours a day with the taskbar showing. But plenty of days have 1-2 hours of windows desktop and there are no ill effects at all. This could be due to the varied content (TV, games, etc) that it gets between the PC sessions.

Oh, Pioneer TV's will also do native 72Hz refresh. Nevertheless, in summary I'd say that you need to map 1:1 as a first priority (thus a 1366x768 or 1920x1080 panel), you should run vsync'd at 60Hz and strive to clear that fps in your games, and finally that Plasma offers the best PQ for an immersive (large screen) PC gaming experience despite the fact that they arent perfect.

For the money, the Panasonic industrial monitor 50ph9uk available at the forum sponsor Visual Apex will work very well for you (the 8uk works great for me). No speakers but if you don't already have a surround sound system that should be a part of your new PC gaming plans anyways, so speakers aren't needed (or wanted, IMO).
post #25 of 30
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Felgar View Post

I've been using my plasma as a TV monitor for quite a while now, so I can hopefully shed some light and general comments. I have an industrial 50" Panasonic. Some comments and responses to you questions:

- Plasma's with VGA and/or DVI inputs will accept varying refresh rates much like a regular CRT will. However I can't be certain if the Panasonic panel will take the 75Hz signal and just display it at 60Hz, or if it really switches to 75Hz because really the screen doesn't even refresh like we used to think of a CRT as refreshing. Regardless, because the screen never flickers, I find 60Hz to be most suitable, and it is also the documented native refresh rate of the monitor, so it makes the most sense.
- It will make a big difference in clarity and visual quality if you can achieve 1:1 pixel mapping. This means I'd advise against a consumer panel with only HDMI and no 1:1 pixel mode. Anything with a DVI input or VGA input should work. Also, because 42" panels use non-square pixels you can't get 1:1 with them and maintain proper aspect ratio, so I'd rule them out for explicit PC use like you're planning. If you have lots of cash to blow get a 65" 1080p panel, but for a more modest budget then get a 1366x768 panel.
- For gaming your goal should be to run the screen's native res at 60+ fps. Then you can turn vsync on and your game will run perfectly smooth. Playing Oblivion my PC usually can't even get up to 30 fps, but I still leave vsync on to eliminate tearing which IMO is much worse than a dropped frame. Also count on requiring at least 2x AA to get the most out of the PQ. The good news is that for the life of the vid card it only has to produce 1 resolution, and then the rest of the PQ is up to the power you can dedicate to AA, AF, etc.
- The ghosting can be a problem as these displays still aren't perfect. By ghosting, the effect I mean is that green trials follow bright objects as they pass through a dark background. Once you see it for the first time you can always pick it up again, but honestly it's a very minor issue IMO. It's difficult to reproduce unless you have control over the picture and can get white scrolling over black. I'd still take the minimal green trail effect over the artifacts that other display technologies reproduce...
- The burn-in issue really is a non-issue, even for 'reasonable' desktop usage. I got this TV about 18 months ago and havent used a PC monitor since. Granted I only use it for surfing and games, etc and not 6 hours a day with the taskbar showing. But plenty of days have 1-2 hours of windows desktop and there are no ill effects at all. This could be due to the varied content (TV, games, etc) that it gets between the PC sessions.

Oh, Pioneer TV's will also do native 72Hz refresh. Nevertheless, in summary I'd say that you need to map 1:1 as a first priority (thus a 1366x768 or 1920x1080 panel), you should run vsync'd at 60Hz and strive to clear that fps in your games, and finally that Plasma offers the best PQ for an immersive (large screen) PC gaming experience despite the fact that they arent perfect.

For the money, the Panasonic industrial monitor 50ph9uk available at the forum sponsor Visual Apex will work very well for you (the 8uk works great for me). No speakers but if you don't already have a surround sound system that should be a part of your new PC gaming plans anyways, so speakers aren't needed (or wanted, IMO).


Wow, thanks a lot man. I really appreciate you taking the time to respond so thoroughly. I've been looking at LCDs again due to my budget, but all of this info is extremely helpful. Thanks again.
post #26 of 30
Thread Starter 
Hey! I just got home and was going to check the link out but it's been editted out!
Can someone PM it to me or something. Thanks
post #27 of 30
Thread Starter 
Hey, still looking for that link... have no idea what it was...

Rofl found it.... somehow didn't see the text "Visual Apex" till just now.

Thanks
post #28 of 30
You're welcome SB. FWIW I'd stick with the 50" Panasonic. Any LCD that's cheaper will certainly be a step down in PQ IMO. Even very expensive LCD's aren't to my taste but the cheapies certainly aren't great.

Yeah, there's a banner at the top since they are a forum sponsor...
post #29 of 30
Great post Felgar...can anyone comment on this setup?

I'm going to have 1 Nvidia 8800GTX playing PC games at 1080p, piped thru HDMI or DVI or whatever the TV will accept. I'm planning on having a LCD desktop monitor for surfing the web, etc. So that much doesn't matter to me. This will be strictly for games and movies. I was going to do a 42", but he said those pics aren't square. I guess that leaves 50"??? I don't want to go bigger than that as I think that's overkill for my needs and wallet.

According to Felgar, the 1:1 pixel mapping is the important thing to look for in a set.

So, my question: Is a plasma the best for gaming/picture quality of all the types of TV set ups including DLP, LCD, projectors, etc?

Thanks in advance for helping.
post #30 of 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by tomfoolery_79 View Post

Great post Felgar...can anyone comment on this setup?

I'm going to have 1 Nvidia 8800GTX playing PC games at 1080p, piped thru HDMI or DVI or whatever the TV will accept. I'm planning on having a LCD desktop monitor for surfing the web, etc. So that much doesn't matter to me. This will be strictly for games and movies. I was going to do a 42", but he said those pics aren't square. I guess that leaves 50"??? I don't want to go bigger than that as I think that's overkill for my needs and wallet.

According to Felgar, the 1:1 pixel mapping is the important thing to look for in a set.

So, my question: Is a plasma the best for gaming/picture quality of all the types of TV set ups including DLP, LCD, projectors, etc?

Thanks in advance for helping.

There are 42" plasmas with square pixels -- just make sure that it has a resolution of 1366x768 or 1920x1080. What you probably don't want is a plasma with 1024x768.

It's a matter of personal preference whether plasmas are better than other techs for games. DLPs look fantastic, but they are mircodisplays that must be either rear or front projection. There are no flat panel DLPs. They've also been plagued by awful lag over the years (very bad for gaming), though that may have improved.

Projectors can look incredible for gaming, but be sure you understand the amount of setup that one requires -- light control, mounting, etc. It's not the kind of thing that you just turn on and use.

LCDs have suffered from motion blur and poor black levels, though new models are definitely better. If money is no object, look at the Samsung 81 series. The black levels are supposed to better than virtually any plasma.
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