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Why buy Blue Ray over HD-DVD? - Page 2

post #31 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by TwinTurboZX View Post

Nice spin! So is this HDDVD supporters' new mantra, "We aren't getting our asses kicked THAT bad"?

Fact is, HDDVD is losing and it's only going to get worse. doogiehowser, don't waste money on a losing format. There is a reason why they are cutting prices on their players every week and offering 20 free movies with HDDVD. They know they have lost and are trying desperately to sell to unsuspecting consumers.


This coming from a guy who has a signature that states that blu-ray is more reliable when the truth is that the format is still being worked on and many early adopters are going to be pretty pissed after halloween. You guys crack me up.
post #32 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by TwinTurboZX View Post

Nice spin! So is this HDDVD supporters' new mantra, "We aren't getting our asses kicked THAT bad"?

Fact is, HDDVD is losing and it's only going to get worse. doogiehowser, don't waste money on a losing format. There is a reason why they are cutting prices on their players every week and offering 20 free movies with HDDVD. They know they have lost and are trying desperately to sell to unsuspecting consumers.


Have you thought about why HDDVD is picking up more and more hardware supporters then. Oh I see... you've looked into your Blue Ray crystal ball again and are predicting the future. If thats the case, maybe you should call Samsung, LG, and Denon, and offer your services for a price, considering they would pay kindly for your insight since they're buying into a format that is fire bombing their stuff to get out of the market.

Theres one born every minute.

Doogie look at the more informative posts and try to weed through the foolishness and pick out helpful information that will bring you to a beautifull HD decision, be it BD or HDDVD.
post #33 of 157
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kdbing View Post

Things to consider....

I am a neutral owner and would like to give my insight and concerns I have about both formats to aid your decision.

As a PS3 owner I believe having studio support of Fox @ Disney is the best weapon BR has. Many people on this forum will tout storage capacity and currents sales data up to the 18th of March, as if that makes BR more of the staple format, but the fact of the matter is, both formats have the capacity to deliver the exact same transfer with extras and sales are pretty similar regarding total #s sold title wise, so this is a mute point. BR currently doesn't have their final coding finished and this has put a question in many's minds whether their players today will play all the features on a BR disks of tomorrow. This is the first concerning factor with going BD right now. Owning a PS3 and being able to upgrade it makes the PS3 kind of future proof and a safer bet than current stand alone players. If I was gonna buy a BD today I would get a PS3 still as I did before. Currently, I also wanna stress my current dissatisfaction with Disney and Fox. As I bought in to BD second from going HDDVD for the sole reason of wanting more Pixar and FOX catalog releases, but since FOX has pulled all 2007 releases, the advantage of having that studio is hard to see for this year. Pixar hasn't released any titles, and as I stated this was a big reason for me going BD.

As an HDDVD owner I believe low price and future proof players are a huge advantage in purchasing right now, I also feel the upconverting on my XA2 is much better than any BD player out their if you have a lot of SDVD. Although FOX and Disney are huge disadvantages, Universal does have good catalog titles that have sustained them so far. My biggest complaint for HDDVD is studio support of FOX and Disney and they may lose the war based on that fact; although, the drop in the price of players, and the stand alone player install base has renewed my faith as of late.
I also don't have the same inclinations regarding codec changes that I have with BD, HDDVD is finalized.

As for a suggestion right now what to buy, if its BD I would say go PS3, if you are dead set against a game console then I would say hold off. Buying a stand alone bd player puts you in the category of buying a more expensive player and not knowing if it will play all features of a BD of tomorrow. (this goes for the even just released Samsung BD-1200)

For an HDDVD suggestion the 299.00 price point you mentioned I assumed you're talking about the toshiba HD-A2. I have this player in my bedroom and its very nice as well, and its almost like its an impulse buy @ that price to just have one; couple that with the 5 free Hddvd's and its like a 199.00 player. Look at it this way, with the 300-400 you'll save buy not getting a BR player NOW, you can put that into a BR player tomorrow when they have finalized their licensing set.

My 0.2 or 0.3 cents.

Thanks for the great advice!! Your post helped me make my choice. I'll probably end up with both, but for now I'll buy the HD-DVD. My plasma has a bunch of inputs including 2 HDMI and 2 component. In a couple months when Blue Ray falls to $300 or $400 I'll buy it. I'll wait until the Blue Ray update is out in October and buy one then. It is better than spending $600+ now and having 1. I can spend $300 now on HD-DVD and $300 later on Blue Ray and have both.

I remember when DVD players came out and were over $500. It took a year to have prices fall in the $200 range. Hopefully the same will happen with Blue Ray. I would love to see a Blue Ray player for $300 with a couple free movies thrown in like the HD-DVD deal.

I have a large SD DVD collection. I was thinging about selling them all at the second hand store. They pay about $2 to $3 per movie and I have about 200 in my collection. I was going to use this money to start a new HD collection. But if HD-DVD can play them and make SD DVD's look good on a 50" plasma I will keep them. This is one reason why HD-DVD might be better for me since people posted that Blue Ray does not do as well upconverting SD DVD's.

One of my friends said he heard that Blue Ray and HD-DVD discs will start comming out with movies on one DVD. He said that Blue Ray is written 1nm deep and HD is written 6nm deep. Studio's will code movies on both the 1nm and 6nm deep so DVD's will play in both Blue Ray and HD-DVD players. I hope this is true. That way it will not matter what player is used.

Thank you to everyone who replied. I'll look back at this thread before buying tomorrow to see if there is any more information I missed.
post #34 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kdbing View Post

LOL I just checked.. you do have a Yamaha RXV just like me, I have the 1600 though.

What can I say, great minds think alike
I'm waiting for next generation RX-V to upgrade my receiver to HDMI, although the upcoming Onkyo has me very interested.
post #35 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by xradman View Post

What can I say, great minds think alike
I'm waiting for next generation RX-V to upgrade my receiver to HDMI, although the upcoming Onkyo has me very interested.

Ive got an off topic question for you, many people say that mixing Yamy with Klipsch makes their music too bright for taste, any thoughts since thats your mix.
post #36 of 157
Hmm I was in your position a while back, and was more excited about BR, but then I saw how much cheaper the HD players were, so I jumped on with them. Am i disappointed-no. I would love to have pirates, and spiderman, but I'll see what happens later on with the dual format players. I figure its a risk that one or the other might fail, so I chose the cheapest route so I wouldn't feel to bad if I picked the wrong one.
Far as picture quality, they are both based on the same technology-a blue laser, so there isn't going to be much difference. If I was in the market again, I'd wait and see what Samsung has to offer with that dual player-obviously they feel confident enough in HD to bring this player to market.
One other thing HD disks are region free so you can pick up some BR movies (put on Hd)from other countries and play them on your HD player. BR players are region coded, so you can't import HD movies and play them on your BR player.
post #37 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by doogiehowser View Post

Thanks for the great advice!! Your post helped me make my choice. I'll probably end up with both, but for now I'll buy the HD-DVD. My plasma has a bunch of inputs including 2 HDMI and 2 component. In a couple months when Blue Ray falls to $300 or $400 I'll buy it. I'll wait until the Blue Ray update is out in October and buy one then. It is better than spending $600+ now and having 1. I can spend $300 now on HD-DVD and $300 later on Blue Ray and have both.

I remember when DVD players came out and were over $500. It took a year to have prices fall in the $200 range. Hopefully the same will happen with Blue Ray. I would love to see a Blue Ray player for $300 with a couple free movies thrown in like the HD-DVD deal.

I have a large SD DVD collection. I was thinging about selling them all at the second hand store. They pay about $2 to $3 per movie and I have about 200 in my collection. I was going to use this money to start a new HD collection. But if HD-DVD can play them and make SD DVD's look good on a 50" plasma I will keep them. This is one reason why HD-DVD might be better for me since people posted that Blue Ray does not do as well upconverting SD DVD's.

One of my friends said he heard that Blue Ray and HD-DVD discs will start comming out with movies on one DVD. He said that Blue Ray is written 1nm deep and HD is written 6nm deep. Studio's will code movies on both the 1nm and 6nm deep so DVD's will play in both Blue Ray and HD-DVD players. I hope this is true. That way it will not matter what player is used.

Thank you to everyone who replied. I'll look back at this thread before buying tomorrow to see if there is any more information I missed.

Glad I could help, youll love HD whichever road you went.
Total HD are the discs your buddy is referring to and Warner Brothers is pushing these. Dont know if we'll see them before the end of the year though.
WB currently is having a sale on HDDVD's and BD of 30% off, so I thought I would give you a link here to help you get started in your collection of media @ a good price.

got to
http://whv.warnerbros.com/WHVPORTAL/...matType=HD-DVD

pick your movies, then when you go to checkout,
enter coupon codes in this order.
1st WBNEWS = 20% off
2nd USD = 10% off

youll get a total of 30% off and if you spend $60 youll get free shipping to boot.

you cant beat HDDVD's for 14 bux
post #38 of 157
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by d james View Post

Hmm I was in your position a while back, and was more excited about BR, but then I saw how much cheaper the HD players were, so I jumped on with them. Am i disappointed-no. I would love to have pirates, and spiderman, but I'll see what happens later on with the dual format players. I figure its a risk that one or the other might fail, so I chose the cheapest route so I wouldn't feel to bad if I picked the wrong one.
Far as picture quality, they are both based on the same technology-a blue laser, so there isn't going to be much difference. If I was in the market again, I'd wait and see what Samsung has to offer with that dual player-obviously they feel confident enough in HD to bring this player to market.
One other thing HD disks are region free so you can pick up some BR movies (put on Hd)from other countries and play them on your HD player. BR players are region coded, so you can't import HD movies and play them on your BR player.

Thank you for posting this! I buy many imported movies. Do you know if there is a difference between PAL and NTSC, or is that irrelevent with HDTV's?
post #39 of 157
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kdbing View Post

Glad I could help, youll love HD whichever road you went.
Total HD are the discs your buddy is referring to and Warner Brothers is pushing these. Dont know if we'll see them before the end of the year though.
WB currently is having a sale on HDDVD's and BD of 30% off, so I thought I would give you a link here to help you get started in your collection of media @ a good price.

got to
http://whv.warnerbros.com/WHVPORTAL/...matType=HD-DVD

pick your movies, then when you go to checkout,
enter coupon codes in this order.
1st WBNEWS = 20% off
2nd USD = 10% off

youll get a total of 30% off and if you spend $60 youll get free shipping to boot.

you cant beat HDDVD's for 14 bux

WOW. Thanks for the link. This makes my choice easy. $14 per HD-DVD is a great price. If you lived in my neck of the woods I'd invite you over for movie night.
post #40 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by doogiehowser View Post

WOW. Thanks for the link. This makes my choice easy. $14 per HD-DVD is a great price. If you lived in my neck of the woods I'd invite you over for movie night.

To be fair, the sale also applies to Blu-rays...
post #41 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by JE3146 View Post

To be fair, the sale also applies to Blu-rays...

I noted it was for both.
post #42 of 157
I didn't. I own both. HD DVD has some titles I had to own. BR has some titles I had to own. the good news is that there are a lot of cross over titles so I can pick the one I like better. For example, I don't like the HD DVD combo discs so I got the Blu-ray version of The Departed. On the other hand, I went for the HD version of Bullit just because. Owners of just one are missing out on a lot and their ignorance of this fact shien through when they adovcate one being better than the other.
post #43 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kdbing View Post

I noted it was for both.


It seemed as if he missed it, so I assumed you didn't mention it.

My apologies.
post #44 of 157
I actually like Combos for new releases.
post #45 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by doogiehowser View Post

I just purchased a 50" plasma that looks great in HDTV. SD looks good too, but HD is jaw dropping wow good. So now I want to buy a format for HD on DVD. There are two choices, and I need help deciding which way. I do not want to buy beta.

Just about everyone is on the second generation hardware now in both the BD and HD DVD camps, so you're not getting 1st gen/beta stuff.

Regarding what to buy - well there's a lot of variables that are unique to each individual.
- Do you have a large DVD library?
- Do you have a good upscaling DVD player?
- Are you dead set on HD content from a studio or studios?
- BD player specs are not finalized until Oct of this year, so there's a chance you may get something that's incompatible with future offerings like IME.

Whether one format will die or both will survive nobody knows, but there's definitely no shortage of FUD flying around. Blu-ray has more studios behind it than HD DVD, so that's definitely something to keep in mind.

If you don't have a good upscaling DVD player right now and you own a fair amount of DVDs, IMO, HD DVD is a no brainer for you. The cost of entry is dramatically lower and you get both a HD DVD player and a superb upscaling player in the HD-A2. If you already own a good DVD player, then it gets a little more difficult. There's no denying Blu-ray has more studios behind it, but when you look at the releases they've scheduled, you could almost buy HD DVD now, save some more pennies and get Blu-ray in 10 months and not miss much.

Quote:
Originally Posted by doogiehowser View Post

Are most of the Blue Ray owners people who like Play Station 3?

By a wide margin, the majority of Blu-ray players in homes now are PS3s. Whether or not those players are used for movies, games or both is unknown and only up to speculation. The PS3 is an outstanding value for BD playback, though, it's often argued it's the best value right now.
post #46 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by joshd2012 View Post

Both will play your existing DVDs and upconvert them

It comes down to if you like Universal and Weinstein better than Sony, Fox, and Disney. Paramount and Warner make discs for both. So look at the movies available and what is soon to come and decide by which titles appeal to you more.

This has to be the best answer. As long as the studios are divided, you'll want to consider both. If you can only afford one solution, the PS3 is the one to beat.
post #47 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by doogiehowser View Post

Thanks for responding. I really don't know which format to buy. Are you suggesting to buy based on titles available?

Do I need HDMI cables to get the highest possible resolution or will component cables look good?

$700 is a high price to pay when the competition is offering a HD player for $300 with 5 free movies. Will any of the Blue Ray studio supporters release movies in HD-DVD format?

First it's "Blu-Ray"

Yes u need HDMI cable if u want highest res. 1080P & your tv needs to be 1080P.
Component looks great & not to far off from HDMI @ least for most people's eyes!

No reason u can't get a "Blu-Ray" player for $450.00 or less?

I just bought my first "Blu-Ray" player "Samsung BD-P1000" and I love it!
post #48 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by doogiehowser View Post

Thank you for posting this! I buy many imported movies. Do you know if there is a difference between PAL and NTSC, or is that irrelevent with HDTV's?

As far as HD movies are concerned, there is no PAL or NTSC. Both Blu-ray and HD DVD movies are encoded 1080P at 24FPS.
post #49 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kdbing View Post

Ive got an off topic question for you, many people say that mixing Yamy with Klipsch makes their music too bright for taste, any thoughts since thats your mix.

I like it. I think it's great sounding system for HT. Yamaha RX-V also has a nice built in automatic equalization system (YPAO), but you already knew that.
post #50 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by Barry657 View Post

First it's "Blu-Ray"

Yes u need HDMI cable if u want highest res. 1080P & your tv needs to be 1080P.
Component looks great & not to far off from HDMI @ least for most people's eyes!

No reason u can't get a "Blu-Ray" player for $450.00 or less?

I just bought my first "Blu-Ray" player "Samsung BD-P1000" and I love it!

Ok guys I dont think he wants a first generation BD player, no one suggested him getting an A1.
post #51 of 157
Something nobody has mentioned here. The less expensive hd-dvd players do not have hdmi 1.3 and 1080p output. It is not until you go to the more expensive toshiba units that you can get both specs. For blu-ray the PS3 at this moment is the best bang for the buck. If the hdmi 1.3 and 1080p are not important then the less expensive hd-dvd players are a great buy. Just something to consider IMO.
post #52 of 157
Here is why:






post #53 of 157
I recommend your tv has 2 HDMI in and cableCard. Then get the HD-A1/2 and the 20GB PS3 (if you can find one). Do that and you will be a happy boy
There are a lot of blu-ray fan boys here that are being paid by Sony to spread the BS real deep. It bothers not only me, but a lot of AVS forum members that we allow this kind of crap.
post #54 of 157
First, you really have to look deeply not to get the rah!-rah!, hooray for my side propaganda. As you can see from the posts above they are there if you look (i.e. BillP).
I don't really understand the whole concept of this "fanboy" cr#p. It is childish and boring. I found the same idiocy when I was shopping for my HDTV: there was the Sony camp and the Samsung camp. It was like a debate class or like American politics; it didn't matter who was right or wrong just "I want to win this arguement". Ahrrg!!!!This is not a religion or a politcal ideology!

Anyway, I am still watching and waiting. I have been a thread rat for a long time.
From what I have learned the
-2 formats have great PQ.
-Both have exclusive titles. Some advantage (right now) for BD.
-HD DVD may have some advantage with future interactive menus (with todays players).
-HD DVD has the advantage in terms of hardware price for what you get (right now).
-In term of game console players (which I am absolutely not interested in) BD has the advantage.
-The in terms of upscaling HD DVD has the advantage with the A20 and certainly the XA2 although the new BD palyer (BD1200?) apparantly will be up there with the Reon? chip.
For me, I am leaning toward the XA2 at this point because of the price (as low as $550-$560 shipped which changes moment to moment) for a flagship top of the line player (again, right now) and for the upscaling. The upscaling apparantly gives you near HD quality and many older titles aren't available in the new formats and all new releases are available in SD so BD titles can be watched with good results.
As we all know, in electronics you have to decide when you're ready and don't look back because in 6 months there will be a better player for less money. We also know that someone is now going to skewer me!
post #55 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by paesan View Post

Something nobody has mentioned here. The less expensive hd-dvd players do not have hdmi 1.3 and 1080p output. It is not until you go to the more expensive toshiba units that you can get both specs. For blu-ray the PS3 at this moment is the best bang for the buck. If the hdmi 1.3 and 1080p are not important then the less expensive hd-dvd players are a great buy. Just something to consider IMO.


By adding this you need to also note that.
1. Not many TV's support HDMI 1.3, and no Receivers currently do, so theres no current benefit PQ or AQ wise right now. Also lossless audio is supported over PCM, with the HD-A20 and the HD-A2 so from an audio stand point you gain nothing, making it a bullet point on higher end machines that really doesn't matter. You're not getting any better sound with HDMI 1.3.

2. I don't know if he has a full 1080p set that has HDMI support rated @ 1080p, and either way, the difference between 1080i and 1080p in real world eye differences is extremely minimal, and if he does have an end to end 1080p set, the A20 is $380 @ amazon which will serve one technical need to have the best possible resolution output #, this currently is basically just a # that makes one feel kind of superior that they have the best you can buy without clear advantages. I have an HD-XA2 as I've stated before, and an HD-A2, and there are no clear differences on my Sony 60" XBR. Only huge difference is the XA2 is a better upconverter, but the A2 is darn good itself, and compared to my PS3, the upconverter is waaaay better in both Toshibas. My 0.2, 0.3 cents.

So Doogie the only real concern from what the above poster said is whether your TV supports true 1080p through your HDMI inputs.(cant believe were getting so technical on matters that don't mean much) If it does, you may consider the HD-A20 that still gets you the 5 free movies, and 1080p(that doesn't result in much from a PQ eye stand point) for $80 more @ Amazon. My 0.2, 0.3 cents.
post #56 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave-Blu-Ray View Post

Here is why:

Reproducing marketing pieces (your first image) is not the most creditable way to make a point.
post #57 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by RealAudiophobe View Post

-HD DVD has the advantage in terms of hardware price for what you get (right now).

I disagree. IMO, not being able to play HD discs from Disney, Fox, Sony and MGM makes an HD-DVD player a poor value, certainly not an advantage. In a typical year, movies from Disney, Fox, Sony, and MGM represent 40-50% of box office (dollars). That's too many HD movies that an HD-DVD player can't play.
post #58 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by fa8362 View Post

I disagree. IMO, not being able to play HD discs from Disney, Fox, Sony and MGM makes an HD-DVD player a poor value,

If all you want to do is play HD movies, then maybe. But my $400 A1 upscales better than my $600 Denon did. So how is that a poor value? For $200 less, I get a player that upscales with the best of them AND plays HD DVD's. Seems like a good deal.
post #59 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by fa8362 View Post

I disagree. IMO, not being able to play HD discs from Disney, Fox, Sony and MGM makes an HD-DVD player a poor value, certainly not an advantage. In a typical year, movies from Disney, Fox, Sony, and MGM represent 40-50% of box office (dollars). That's too many HD movies that an HD-DVD player can't play.

Come on guys, are we actually going to tell a man that I have said the PS3 is the best BD solution if you go BD, but... he said he doesnt want a PS3 gaming solution. Fox and Disney currently arent amounting to heavily supportive studios right now, after the new year thats a different story, and with the $300 he will save, the new Sony player thats coming out after November with an MSRP of 699.00 which will support BR finalzed code, and will definitely be cheaper than its MSRP even @ launch, and less when he's ready to buy after the New Year, will be a an easy $200 out of pocket cost with his savings.

Telling him to buy BD stand alone player right now, amounts to you just wanting him to buy in because you want another BR supporter, Im saying buying HDDVD right now cause your interest is for right now, HDDVD will put $ in your pocket, and put you in a position to take advantage of BR bullet points later when they actually mean something later this year or early 08.
post #60 of 157
Quote:
Originally Posted by doogiehowser View Post


One more question. I own many DVD TV sets. Will either the Blue Ray or HD-DVD play them, and if they do will the picture improve? Or will the picture for these DVD TV sets stay at 480?

If a "DVD TV set" is a TV with a standard DVD player, then an hd-dvd combo disk is the only disk you can use on that TV set. Blu-ray has no combo format.
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