or Connect
AVS › AVS Forum › HDTV › HDTV Programming › 'LOST' on ABC HD
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

'LOST' on ABC HD - Page 693

post #20761 of 21026
"Fans" as in uncritical, unquestioning lemmings?
post #20762 of 21026
Quote:
Originally Posted by wco81 View Post

"Fans" as in uncritical, unquestioning lemmings?

What's it like being such a bitter little dude?


ron
post #20763 of 21026
What's it like being a dupe?
post #20764 of 21026
I watched every episode of Lost and enjoyed the heck out of it, even the last episode that so many hated, but in the words of Ferris Bueller - "You're still here? It's over! Go home. Go!"

post #20765 of 21026
Quote:
Originally Posted by wco81 View Post

What's it like being a dupe?

You should tell us. You've duped yourself into disliking one of the best visual narratives ever created, just because the ending didn't fulfill your expectations.
post #20766 of 21026
Quote:
Originally Posted by lwright84 View Post

For all LOST fans, I have two great interviews for you to watch.

First is one with JJ Abrams and Michael Giacchino where they talk about their friendship, LOST, Star Trek, Super 8, and other things.

The video link is embedded in the article: http://www.slashfilm.com/watch-hour-...ael-giacchino/

The second one is an awesome interview with Damon Lindelof, where he discussed everything from finale criticism to the first meeting with JJ to his whole experience running the show. There's more honesty and depth here than I've ever seen before. Great stuff.

http://www.slashfilm.com/watch-kevin...amon-lindelof/



[23:00] Intro of Lindelof
[26:00] Lost, including criticism of finale (and talk about other show finales), and feud with George RR Martin
[50:00] Inspirations, including (George Lucas & Stephen King)
[59:00] Early writing and time at NYU
[1:07:00] Early life in Hollywood
[1:15:00] More on Stephen King and King film/TV adaptations
[1:26:00] Admits likes Star Wars more than Star Trek (in series of This v That questions)
[1:27:00] Genesis Lost and his starting his JJ Abrams collaboration, and becoming showrunner, and even more Lost
[2:10:00] Cowboys & Aliens and working with Jon Favreu, and collaborating with Orci, Kurtzman and other writers (on C&A)
[2:18:00] Prometheus (and working with Ridley Scott) and its connection to Alien franchise
[2:24:00] How the writer's strike allowed him to produce Star Trek while also working on Lost
[2:25:00] More on Ridley Scott and Prometheus [fun fact: took 2 weeks to write first draft of script]
[2:34:00] Talks briefly about newly announced 1952 project with Disney, clarifies he won't be working on it until after the Star Trek sequel
[2:38:00] Wrapping up and outro
[2:43:00] Damon plays Larry King Game (doing bad Larry King impression)

Just watched the Pollak interview. That's just a great interview man. Thanks for posting it up bro!


ron
post #20767 of 21026
Quote:
Originally Posted by lwright84 View Post

You should tell us. You've duped yourself into disliking one of the best visual narratives ever created, just because the ending didn't fulfill your expectations.

I disliked it well before the ending.

"One of the best visual narratives ever created."


BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
post #20768 of 21026
Quote:
Originally Posted by wco81 View Post


I disliked it well before the ending.

"One of the best visual narratives ever created."

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

I find your ineptitude hilarious as well. Now that we're all on the same page, let's move on. Or better yet, go to a thread about something you DO like.. Two and a Half Men should be starting back up soon I hear.
post #20769 of 21026
Nah, I'm too busy watching two and a half hour interviews with creators of dead shows to be watching Two and a Half Men.
post #20770 of 21026
Flaming TROLLS who HATE every single show that doesn't conform/end by PRECISELY CONFORMING to their limited vision of what "the world" SHOULD BE... Gotta love 'em, huh? NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOPE!!!

MeThinks SOMEBODY HERE needs to start watching (in fact, CATCH UP ON) all the episodes of "Through the Wormhole" on the Science Channel, where SERIOUS PHYSICISTS are finally proposing real theories and actually finding some evidence for things like a soul, universal consciousness, etc. -- even proposing that ALL MATTER EXISTS ONLY because of consciousness!

All this stuff used to be considered METAphysics, but now SERIOUS PHYSICISTS are talking about it! Put THAT in your pipe and smoke it, wco81!
post #20771 of 21026
This is why I never get emotionally invested in television. I know I'll be disappointed eventually because it's impossible to produce multiple seasons of any show without making terrible mistakes, especially with shows that take risks.
post #20772 of 21026
I'm NOT emotionally invested in it... Perhaps the HATER(s) are/were. I just find it sort of ridiculous that more than A YEAR after the show ended they're still coming around to BLAST the show. Frankly, I didn't even check out this thread until the show ended because I KNEW there was no way I could keep up with it -- and even then, I didn't very often -- just too many posts -- but seeing new posts NOW got me curious.
Jeff
post #20773 of 21026
I'm NOT EMOTIONALLY INVESTED!

I'M NOT, I'M NOT, I'M NOT!

LOST is the BESTEST show EVAHHHH!
post #20774 of 21026
Well it was, until S6.
post #20775 of 21026
Quote:
Originally Posted by slowbiscuit View Post

Well it was, until S6.


+1. Hope there's more room in that duck blind.

The thing that's so frustrating about LOST is the wasted opportunity to craft a final chapter befitting all the awesomeness that came before. What many fans don't understand is how people that talented and bold for 5 years could have dropped the ball on the 1-yard line. It's not just an artistic frak-up, either. They've lost zillions in revenue because of it. I was all set to buy the whole series BD set someday, no matter what it cost. But after that finale, I never will since I now have no desire to watch it again, or turn it on to others as I had been doing for the previous 5 years. I don't want them to end up as invested, and disappointed, as I was.

And it's not just that they didn't craft an ending "I" would have enjoyed, so it's on me. They left so many loose ends dangling, storylines started and abandoned, and ended up with such a cheap mcguffin in that joke of a finale that it just boggles the mind.

As I've said before, no book editor worth his salt would have allowed them to get away with what they did in the literary world - when the readers may have only had a few weeks or months invested in reading the book. In a serialized thriller, people expect resolutions. Why should viewers tolerate something like that in a TV show, especially when we had invested five years in their work?
post #20776 of 21026
Quote:
Originally Posted by archiguy View Post


+1. Hope there's more room in that duck blind.

The thing that's so frustrating about LOST is the wasted opportunity to craft a final chapter befitting all the awesomeness that came before. What many fans don't understand is how people that talented and bold for 5 years could have dropped the ball on the 1-yard line. It's not just an artistic frak-up, either. They've lost zillions in revenue because of it. I was all set to buy the whole series BD set someday, no matter what it cost. But after that finale, I never will since I now have no desire to watch it again, or turn it on to others as I had been doing for the previous 5 years. I don't want them to end up as invested, and disappointed, as I was.

And it's not just that they didn't craft an ending "I" would have enjoyed, so it's on me. They left so many loose ends dangling, storylines started and abandoned, and ended up with such a cheap mcguffin in that joke of a finale that it just boggles the mind.

As I've said before, no book editor worth his salt would have allowed them to get away with what they did in the literary world - when the readers may have only had a few weeks or months invested in reading the book. In a serialized thriller, people expect resolutions. Why should viewers tolerate something like that in a TV show, especially when we had invested five years in their work?

Archi, I'm confident if you did rewatch the series you would feel differently. They really didn't leave that much hanging, it's that they didn't spoon feed the answers. Which is just one of many reasons why it is such a brilliant visual narrative.

One thing also to understand is that the endgame was in mind from the beginning. Not to the exact measure we ended up getting, but the majority of the themes, story conclusions, and and notes it hit were. I think when their show went on for longer than they expected it became increasingly difficult for them to naturally lead the show to that pre-conceived conclusion. Inevitably there would be a group of people disappointed no matter what the finale was, but i think that another group of people disappointed in the show arose from this circumstance. You should really watch the interview I posted for more insight on this point.
post #20777 of 21026
Quote:
Originally Posted by lwright84 View Post

Archi, I'm confident if you did rewatch the series you would feel differently. They really didn't leave that much hanging, it's that they didn't spoon feed the answers. Which is just one of many reasons why it is such a brilliant visual narrative.

Actually, they left an enormous amount of stuff hanging. There was a really clever YouTube vid that someone did that had quick cuts of all the show's unanswered questions - dozens of them - with a rapid-fire narration as the clips flew by. I thought I saved it but guess I didn't. Anybody have that link?

Quote:
Originally Posted by lwright84 View Post

One thing also to understand is that the endgame was in mind from the beginning. Not to the exact measure we ended up getting, but the majority of the themes, story conclusions, and and notes it hit were. I think when their show went on for longer than they expected it became increasingly difficult for them to naturally lead the show to that pre-conceived conclusion. Inevitably there would be a group of people disappointed no matter what the finale was, but i think that another group of people disappointed in the show arose from this circumstance. You should really watch the interview I posted for more insight on this point.

Yeah, I haven't watched that interview yet, but I have seen several in which Darlton try to justify their decisions. They tend to raise my blood pressure.

Look, I don't think it would have been prohibitively difficult to answer the big questions and shape a different concluding narrative that covered more of the abandoned bases, especially considering it was basically a science fiction show. I've done it in my head. They could have done it also, and achieved lasting greatness, a legendary position in TV history. They simply chose the easy way out, IMO.
post #20778 of 21026
We interrupt this program for the following special report....

Evangeline Lilly has just been cast as an elf in Peter Jackson's two part film "The Hobbit". I hear it's a character not in the book and that she will have speaking parts in elvish.

I like this. I think she will be great. She has the look for the part. I'm just not sure how the fans will accept a new character created just for the movie.

Plus, the fact that her husband ex-boyfriend is a hobbit probably gave her an inside track to the part.

And now back to the regularly scheduled trolling and bickering....
post #20779 of 21026
Quote:
Originally Posted by wdkerbow View Post

Plus, the fact that her husband is a hobbit probably gave her an inside track to the part.

Her baby-daddy is not the hobbit you're thinking of.
post #20780 of 21026
Quote:
Originally Posted by archiguy View Post

Actually, they left an enormous amount of stuff hanging. There was a really clever YouTube vid that someone did that had quick cuts of all the show's unanswered questions - dozens of them - with a rapid-fire narration as the clips flew by. I thought I saved it but guess I didn't.

I think that YouTube video was done before the finale and from my recollection, many of those "unanswered" questions actually were answered at some point during the series.
post #20781 of 21026
Quote:
Originally Posted by archiguy View Post

Her baby-daddy is not the hobbit you're thinking of.

Whooops! I have corrected my original statement! Thanks!

post #20782 of 21026
Quote:
Originally Posted by nottenst View Post

I think that YouTube video was done before the finale and from my recollection, many of those "unanswered" questions actually were answered at some point during the series.

Perhaps we're thinking of different vids. The one I'm thinking of has 40+ answered questions in little clips with a really clever narrative overlay. It was hilarious. I'm pretty sure it was done just after the finale but may have been done right before the finale, which wouldn't matter since the finale didn't really answer much of anything. I'm pretty sure it was posted somewhere in this massive thread, but I don't have the patience it would take to find it.
post #20783 of 21026
Quote:
Originally Posted by archiguy View Post

Actually, they left an enormous amount of stuff hanging. There was a really clever YouTube vid that someone did that had quick cuts of all the show's unanswered questions - dozens of them - with a rapid-fire narration as the clips flew by. I thought I saved it but guess I didn't. Anybody have that link?

Again, they really didn't. I've seen that video clip, and it's clearly made by someone like wco81. Have you seen the blog post that someone wrote in response to that video clip, showing that the vast majority of those were either in fact answered, or were a result of people not understanding that some things really had served their complete purpose already (like Walt's comic book)? Or were ambiguous and insignificant questions to begin with? IIRC, I think one was "what was the deal with the polar bears?". Facepalm. This is why I think a rewatch of the series would be very enjoyable and possibly eye-opening for you and others who feel as you do.

And the show is legendary and will be remembered for it's brilliance much longer and by more people than those who choose to dismiss it due to their perception of the ending.
post #20784 of 21026
Quote:
Originally Posted by wco81 View Post

Nah, I'm too busy watching two and a half hour interviews with creators of dead shows to be watching Two and a Half Men.

How sad. Perhaps it's more than you can fathom, but Lindelof has been and is involved in a multitude of different projects. His story is really pretty cool. And he's a very entertaining interview. It might do you good to really watch it... Although it seems highly unlikely, maybe you would pick up a thing or two about how a person can make something good out of their life?


ron
post #20785 of 21026
Quote:
Originally Posted by archiguy View Post

The thing that's so frustrating about LOST is the wasted opportunity to craft a final chapter befitting all the awesomeness that came before. What many fans don't understand is how people that talented and bold for 5 years could have dropped the ball on the 1-yard line. It's not just an artistic frak-up, either.

It was clear to me that the show had great potential to go wrong at the end of the second season. They had us all drawn into the mystery of the hatch. They spent most of season one making us believe that the hatch would be the key to many if not all mysteries of the island. When we got in there we got tons of information. Most incredibly it was consistent and foreshadowed a lot of potential. The numbers. The old computer. The instructional film. And the map! Remember the map? More hatches. Actual history of the island! Frightening Latin phrases! One terrifying question mark in the middle of it! This map was going to lead us through the resolution of the series, no doubt about it.

Then they blew it all up.

Why? I guess some writers felt they had better ideas so they chucked most of what happened in the first two seasons and rebooted. Right there that was a bad sign and I lowered my expectations. Season three set the series into several different directions, dumped a pile of plots on our backs and demanded that we carry them around. Instead of a linear story slowly revealing itself, nearly every episode had another damned twist that we'd have to remember in case it had something to do with anything. Most of them didn't and became distractions and loose ends. It seemed like they were bringing in guest writers for every episode.

Once the time traveling stuff happened, it was mostly for fun and the mystery was put on hold. They thought it would be cute to send of the cast back into the 70's and it was an easy way to clear up some of the many many subplots they had thrown at us. The "and a miracle happened" plane "crash" to bring in more characters was just to have a tear-jerking reunion. That showed how the writers were concentrating on the characters at the expense of the story.

The last season promised something absolutely incredible and just didn't deliver. It was shameless show extender. Frankly, Abrams did a better job with the time traveling plot to extend the last season of Felicity. At least we weren't asked to take that seriously.

Quote:
They've lost zillions in revenue because of it. I was all set to buy the whole series BD set someday, no matter what it cost. But after that finale, I never will since I now have no desire to watch it again, or turn it on to others as I had been doing for the previous 5 years. I don't want them to end up as invested, and disappointed, as I was.

I never bought the last season BD because it had very little to do with the story. They decided that the audience loved the characters so much that they didn't need a believable or understandable mystery to make us watch another season. Abrams already used this trick successfully at the end of Felicity and saved what would have been a dull final season.

Quote:
As I've said before, no book editor worth his salt would have allowed them to get away with what they did in the literary world - when the readers may have only had a few weeks or months invested in reading the book. In a serialized thriller, people expect resolutions. Why should viewers tolerate something like that in a TV show, especially when we had invested five years in their work?

It's very hard to make anything work for five years on television. Screenwriters are trained to think in five acts that last two hours but they're taught nothing about how to make a television show work, mainly because no one really knows. They have network executives in their faces all the time giving dumb suggestions based on no information (the original Lost concept actually came from ABC executives). Competition within a show is tough. Good writers come up with great ideas that get thrown out for weaker ideas so they give up. There's lots of turnover and everyone expects to be working someplace else in a year so who cares what happens next season? These losers will be stuck on this television show while you're writing screen plays for feature films! That's just how television works.

True Blood has the same pattern. Start with a great idea and great characters and generate two successful seasons. Then in the third season give every character their own subplot so they don't talk to each other and make the plot ever more complicated.

Breaking Bad did the opposite by making the plots less character centric and concentrating more on action and violence, probably because there are no truly likable characters on Breaking Bad.
post #20786 of 21026
Quote:
Originally Posted by slowbiscuit View Post

Well it was, until S6.


Quote:
Originally Posted by archiguy View Post

+1. Hope there's more room in that duck blind.

The thing that's so frustrating about LOST is the wasted opportunity to craft a final chapter befitting all the awesomeness that came before. What many fans don't understand is how people that talented and bold for 5 years could have dropped the ball on the 1-yard line. It's not just an artistic frak-up, either. They've lost zillions in revenue because of it. I was all set to buy the whole series BD set someday, no matter what it cost. But after that finale, I never will since I now have no desire to watch it again, or turn it on to others as I had been doing for the previous 5 years. I don't want them to end up as invested, and disappointed, as I was.

And it's not just that they didn't craft an ending "I" would have enjoyed, so it's on me. They left so many loose ends dangling, storylines started and abandoned, and ended up with such a cheap mcguffin in that joke of a finale that it just boggles the mind.

Totally agree.

It seems the writers lost control absolutely and just didn't have a clue how or what to do in S6.

Perhaps Alan Dale (who plays Widmore) summed it up excellently in the Jimmy Kimmel Show which was aired right after the finale -
"I still don't know whether I was a good guy or a bad guy"
post #20787 of 21026
Quote:
Originally Posted by scowl View Post

Then they blew it all up.

Why? I guess some writers felt they had better ideas so they chucked most of what happened in the first two seasons and rebooted. Right there that was a bad sign and I lowered my expectations. Season three set the series into several different directions, dumped a pile of plots on our backs and demanded that we carry them around. Instead of a linear story slowly revealing itself, nearly every episode had another damned twist that we'd have to remember in case it had something to do with anything. Most of them didn't and became distractions and loose ends. It seemed like they were bringing in guest writers for every episode.

Once the time traveling stuff happened, it was mostly for fun and the mystery was put on hold. They thought it would be cute to send of the cast back into the 70's and it was an easy way to clear up some of the many many subplots they had thrown at us. The "and a miracle happened" plane "crash" to bring in more characters was just to have a tear-jerking reunion. That showed how the writers were concentrating on the characters at the expense of the story.

The last season promised something absolutely incredible and just didn't deliver. It was shameless show extender. Frankly, Abrams did a better job with the time traveling plot to extend the last season of Felicity. At least we weren't asked to take that seriously.

I never bought the last season BD because it had very little to do with the story. They decided that the audience loved the characters so much that they didn't need a believable or understandable mystery to make us watch another season. Abrams already used this trick successfully at the end of Felicity and saved what would have been a dull final season.

It's amazing how someone -- who clearly is not dumb -- can take misinformation and inaccurate assumptions, apparently do no research to substantiate or cross reference any of it, and offer their perspective up so matter-of-factly. "Shameless show extender", blaming Abrams for things in much later seasons, etc... and there is plenty more easily refutable nonsense along these same lines from various other people who -- more often than not -- are also clearly not dumb. It is simply mind-boggling.
post #20788 of 21026
Why don't we let this thread go away into the "light"?
post #20789 of 21026
Quote:
Originally Posted by rezzy View Post

Why don't we let this thread go away into the "light"?

Because we haven't suffered enough yet.
post #20790 of 21026
Quote:
Originally Posted by scowl View Post

It's very hard to make anything work for five years on television. Screenwriters are trained to think in five acts that last two hours but they're taught nothing about how to make a television show work, mainly because no one really knows. They have network executives in their faces all the time giving dumb suggestions based on no information (the original Lost concept actually came from ABC executives). Competition within a show is tough. Good writers come up with great ideas that get thrown out for weaker ideas so they give up. There's lots of turnover and everyone expects to be working someplace else in a year so who cares what happens next season? These losers will be stuck on this television show while you're writing screen plays for feature films! That's just how television works.

True Blood has the same pattern. Start with a great idea and great characters and generate two successful seasons. Then in the third season give every character their own subplot so they don't talk to each other and make the plot ever more complicated.

Breaking Bad did the opposite by making the plots less character centric and concentrating more on action and violence, probably because there are no truly likable characters on Breaking Bad.

Writers probably come and go. They're the hired help. It's the showrunners and executive producers who own the trajectory of the plots within and across seasons.

They have an incentive to produce 5 seasons or 100 episodes to make the big syndication and DVD money. For a big show, that could be hundreds of millions each going to individuals.

Think those kinds of considerations might affect the way the story is shaped and told?
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: HDTV Programming
AVS › AVS Forum › HDTV › HDTV Programming › 'LOST' on ABC HD