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AVS › AVS Forum › Display Devices › Plasma Flat Panel Displays › Panasonic 42pz700, 50pz700u, 50pz750u, 58pz700u and 58pz750u Owners Thread!
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Panasonic 42pz700, 50pz700u, 50pz750u, 58pz700u and 58pz750u Owners Thread! - Page 310

post #9271 of 10937
Quote:
Originally Posted by twentw View Post

I just flipped through the first 70 channels or so. My recollection is that on Comcast, those low channels are still analog. Would the QAM channels be the digital ones higher up?

Yes. I'd advise letting the TV do a full auto-scan. It took almost 30 minutes on my set, but it did a lot of searching and found the QAM channels in the sub-70s, with some exceptions. (Like Fox-HD on 73-13, for instance, but PBS-HD on 9-5.)
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post #9272 of 10937
Quote:
Originally Posted by chris0 View Post

Try the FW update I posted earlier. I'm interested to hear about someone updating the FW on one of these sets.

In my 58/750U's About screen, it has several version numbers. The top one, "TV", shows 0140-0030. I seem to recall we need to read this in reverse, so is my firmware 03.00.04.10? Or do I look elsewhere in the service menu for firmware revs?
post #9273 of 10937
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimInPT View Post

In my 58/750U's About screen, it has several version numbers. The top one, "TV", shows 0140-0030. I seem to recall we need to read this in reverse, so is my firmware 03.00.04.10? Or do I look elsewhere in the service menu for firmware revs?

I have no idea. I've never had reason yet to try and figure it out.
post #9274 of 10937
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimInPT View Post

In my 58/750U's About screen, it has several version numbers. The top one, "TV", shows 0140-0030. I seem to recall we need to read this in reverse, so is my firmware 03.00.04.10? Or do I look elsewhere in the service menu for firmware revs?

As I understand it, your TV version would be 3.04. The only update for the 750 series is 3.02 so you're covered.
post #9275 of 10937
How would you read 01001020 into a version number?
post #9276 of 10937
Quote:
Originally Posted by j_bee View Post

How would you read 01001020 into a version number?

Based on what I was told by Plasma Concierge awhile back on my set's version of 0100-0300 equating to 3.01, yours should be 2.101 which would make sense given the last update was 2.090 dated 7/07, however, a call to Plasma Concierge would be your best bet to confirm.
post #9277 of 10937
Quote:
Originally Posted by seemenewd View Post

That's my puck.. so thanks for the encouragement! One of the things that has me dragging my feet is the figuring out of that program and what do do first, second, etc.

There is a steep learning curve with the software, charts, data, terminology/concepts, and getting familiar what the idiosynchrasies of the TV's controls. Eventually it all comes together, but be prepared to spend some long nights annoying everyone in your house while you tweak away.

Quote:


I know there is a document "Calibration for Dummies" or the like that they've written, but it's in French and I haven't yet tried to see if I can put it through a translator to see if the results make sense. :-)

Someone recently posted a so-so translated version of that docment in the ColorHCFR 2.0 thread.
Quote:


Also I'd currently have to use their straight non-HD PAL DVD played in my OPPO 981 (which will convert and upscale) as the pattern data source for it (as best as I can tell). Know if AVIA (etc) has patterns for it? The PAL conversion is of concern, even if the OPPO does it well.

I have verified that my Oppo 970 converts the HCFR PAL DVD correctly. You can use Avia, DVE, GetGray, as well as free (SD)DVD, HD-DVD and BluRay disks available in the AVS calibration forums.
post #9278 of 10937
Quote:
Originally Posted by garyc8710 View Post

..I did this with good results.Is there any downside to making this adjustment to the baseline bright setting that I'm unaware of?By the way, Sub-Brt setting is Global, only one change is needed for all pic modes anf inputs.

Sub-Brt is the master control for the user Brightness control. If you raise it, you would have to lower the user brightness to get the same black level. And it has the same affect as the user Brightness control except that it is more granular (finer). For example, (and I don't know the exact relationship) 5 sub-brt clicks does the same thing as 1 brightness click in the same direction.

Quote:


Now as colnago mentioned earlier, increasing the Sub-brt from the default of 7DE would allow one to use the Cinema mode and dark setting more often .

Have you checked this with a black-level test pattern? My guess is that Dark will still clip blacks even if you pushed sub-brt to excessive (unwatchable) levels.
post #9279 of 10937
Quote:
Originally Posted by sr20fd3st View Post

I don't know if this is normal or not, but with my 42pz700 i noticed that during things like sunsets ot things that represent a great deal of shading, that the shading fails to be gradual. i noticed sectors of shade int he sunset, meaning that it is not one smooth transition, but looks like a not so greatly rendered video game image. i would understand if this was happening when playing a video game since i would blame it on the game, but durings something like a 1080i image of a sunset on Discovery HD Theater, it makes me think the TV isn't shading correctly.

I have it set to about as good of a picture as i can get, but i don't know what to do
about this shading crap. Can that be improved primarily through settings or is there a limit to how well this TV can resolve shading like I described?

Thanks in advance,
Oliver

This is called false contouring or color banding. To some extent it is the fault of the display, although I don't think the 700u has any serious false contouring issues.

It could very well be in the source. Mpeg compression often created this effect.
post #9280 of 10937
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdbimmer View Post

There is a steep learning curve with the software, charts, data, terminology/concepts, and getting familiar what the idiosynchrasies of the TV's controls. Eventually it all comes together, but be prepared to spend some long nights annoying everyone in your house while you tweak away.

Thanks for the info! I hadn't checked that other thread in a while. I've now downloaded the document translation and took a quick peek at it. Lot of the terms up front are ones I already know from having calibrated and profiled my home monitors for many years (I'm on my second puck). Only a teeny tiny step, but it's a start and the information in that thread hopefully will get me past the more "fun" parts.

Should get interesting.... but I think it'll be fun (for the first couple hours anyway... :-).

Thanks again!!!
post #9281 of 10937
Hello Gang,

I just saw some pretty good price for 50pz77u on Fry's.com (free shipping too). I was leaning toward the pz700u but the price differential is quite substantial. Any thought on this?
Thanks.
post #9282 of 10937
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdbimmer View Post

Sub-Brt is the master control for the user Brightness control. If you raise it, you would have to lower the user brightness to get the same black level. And it has the same affect as the user Brightness control except that it is more granular (finer). For example, (and I don't know the exact relationship) 5 sub-brt clicks does the same thing as 1 brightness click in the same direction.

Have you checked this with a black-level test pattern? My guess is that Dark will still clip blacks even if you pushed sub-brt to excessive (unwatchable) levels.

I've seen very similar results with Bright/Sub-Brt ratios, based on all my "testing". Dark mode, while it looks great for say, "watching older (pre-2000) movies" which seem kinda "pale" on HD channels, does still crush out more modern video content. Its all relative based on what's done in Service vs. User menu, as one setting could negate the other's changes.
post #9283 of 10937
Quote:
Originally Posted by garyc8710 View Post

...Now as colnago mentioned earlier, increasing the Sub-brt from the default of 7DE would allow one to use the Cinema mode and dark setting more often . I did this with good results.Is there any downside to making this adjustment to the baseline bright setting that I'm unaware of?By the way, Sub-Brt setting is Global, only one change is needed for all pic modes anf inputs.

Ok guys and gals, I think I may be on to something. I just woke up and did some quick changes at 3am (fell asleep on couch at 10pm after making minor changes to "Contrast" on Component) so take this with a grain of salt.

I was a little worried going into Service menu a few weeks ago, on the Component port, because the Contrast has what I'll n00bishly call "active Contrast monitor", which has realtime contrast level display of sorts (I was calibrating live TV). Initially, I thought I had a stuck volume key on the remote. Anyway long story shorter, I initially had Contrast set to about 185, which is near what I think the set came with, and had dropped it down to ~150 tonight. This seemed to help out with the "torchy whites".

When I went back in later, I dropped the value to 11B, and now I do not get that glare from "reflections" on peoples' faces, etc, that I had mentioned earlier. This allowed me to push Picture in Custom mode, up to +30, without giving it that super-saturated look. Subsequently, I was able dig out even more detail in the dark sections. The Dark Knight and Hellboy 2 trailers on HDNet look much much better in this respect. These changes seem to give that extra brightness people were looking for from Cinema mode, while still retaining an overall clean PQ.

The biggest discovery though was that the changes on the Component port seem to carry over to HDMI (global setting?), whereas Contrast is "not" configurable on HDMI (at least not my set, firmware issue?). My once "soft/blurry" component PQ is now really sharp/focused, even with my $40 Monster Cables. The little bit of SD I watched after the changes, via DishNetwork I was complaining about, also looks markedly better.

My preliminary settings are:

User Menu/Component
Picture: +25
Brightness: +4
Color: (-3)
Tint: (-3)
Sharpness: (+2)
Black Level: Light
Color Temp: Warm

Service Menu
Contrast: 11B (HDMI port still says 000; I'll still be working with this value)
Color: 35
Sub-Brt: 820 (I'll be backing this down to ~800)
Tint: 00
R Cut: 80
B Cut: 80
G Cut: 80
R Drv: DE
G Drv: DB
B Drv: 99
All Cut: 80
All Drv: DE

(All of the Cut/Drv Settings are pretty much Default)

There is still some wiggle room and fine tuning left in it, but where my previous posts got me in the ball park, I now have some good seats. At this point, "I feel like I have a better TV". I no longer feel the "need" to get an ISF, where I was once on the fence. I think I've pretty much resolved the few issues I had regarding the: over-saturated Reds, slight Green push (minor Tint changes), torchy whites, and crushed blacks (still need a lil work, but much more liveable now).

Hope this helps.
post #9284 of 10937
Quote:
Originally Posted by HDClueless View Post

Hello Gang,

I just saw some pretty good price for 50pz77u on Fry's.com (free shipping too). I was leaning toward the pz700u but the price differential is quite substantial. Any thought on this?
Thanks.

Use the "Search this Thread" feature to read what others have said about 77u vs. 700u, however, the consensus (given this is the 700 thread) is the 700u will provide the better picture. Just depends on how much the better picture is worth to you.

Edit: Fry's has discounted the 77u and is Out of Stock on the 700u. That should tell you something right there.
post #9285 of 10937
Quote:
Originally Posted by HDClueless View Post

Hello Gang,

I just saw some pretty good price for 50pz77u on Fry's.com (free shipping too). I was leaning toward the pz700u but the price differential is quite substantial. Any thought on this?
Thanks.

I had the 77U first...then returned it for the 700U...the 77U anti-glare screen is very effective but it creates a matte-like LCD picture quality...for my plasma tastes, the 77U lacked the Wow-Factor PQ...then I got the 700U...Wow!

To my eyes, the difference is pretty profound...perhaps, it depends on your viewing enviroment and wallet.
post #9286 of 10937
I am believer in the fewest processes the better. I set up my 42PZ700U to convert the native output of my Directv HR 21. The SD was definitely better. The only downside is the time the TV takes to convert at channel change. This takes up to 3 seconds more when there is a resolution change. Not a bad trade-off for a better SD picture. So I was intrigued with the Firmware update for the 42PZ700U. The update (47.09t2) was for the D-Board. This controls the Format Converter/Plasma AL/Sub-Field Processor. The improvements were supposed to be listed in the instructions. They were not. So I decided to take a chance and upgrade. I downloaded the firmware into the SD chip and installed. A check of the service menu confirmed the installation. So what has changed? No visible effect as yet. The only thing I have noticed is that the conversion time has stretched another 2 seconds. Not a great trade-off if there is no corresponding visual improvement.
post #9287 of 10937
What are your settings for the HR21...

Native = ON

All resolutions checked off?

How did you setup your 42PZ700U to convert the "native" output?

Quote:
Originally Posted by robertbobw View Post

I am believer in the fewest processes the better. I set up my 42PZ700U to convert the native output of my Directv HR 21. The SD was definitely better. The only downside is the time the TV takes to convert at channel change. This takes up to 3 seconds more when there is a resolution change. Not a bad trade-off for a better SD picture. So I was intrigued with the Firmware update for the 42PZ700U. The update (47.09t2) was for the D-Board. This controls the Format Converter/Plasma AL/Sub-Field Processor. The improvements were supposed to be listed in the instructions. They were not. So I decided to take a chance and upgrade. I downloaded the firmware into the SD chip and installed. A check of the service menu confirmed the installation. So what has changed? No visible effect as yet. The only thing I have noticed is that the conversion time has stretched another 2 seconds. Not a great trade-off if there is no corresponding visual improvement.
post #9288 of 10937
Quote:
Originally Posted by robertbobw View Post

I am believer in the fewest processes the better. I set up my 42PZ700U to convert the “native” output of my Directv HR 21. The SD was definitely better. The only downside is the time the TV takes to convert at channel change. This takes up to 3 seconds more when there is a resolution change. Not a bad trade-off for a better SD picture. So I was intrigued with the Firmware update for the 42PZ700U. The update (47.09t2) was for the D-Board. This controls the Format Converter/Plasma AL/Sub-Field Processor. The improvements were supposed to be listed in the instructions. They were not. So I decided to take a chance and upgrade. I downloaded the firmware into the SD chip and installed. A check of the service menu confirmed the installation. So what has changed? No visible effect as yet. The only thing I have noticed is that the conversion time has stretched another 2 seconds. Not a great trade-off if there is no corresponding visual improvement.

My understanding is that D-Board firmware update is only for those folks that have had their D-Board previously replaced by a technician so there probably would not be any noticeable difference otherwise. And thankfully for those of us that see no noticable difference with the Panny upscaling, we're able to take advantage of the speedier channel changes. Although my SD channel watching is rapidly disappearing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by csunflip View Post

How did you setup your 42PZ700U to convert the "native" output?

The 700/750u automatically converts all inputs to 1080p .. there's no switch.
post #9289 of 10937
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

The 700/750u automatically converts all inputs to 1080p .. there's no switch.

He was talking about the settings on his DirecTV box. You can set them to output native signal, or to have a fixed resolution. In other words, let the DVR upscale or let the TV. He is choosing to let the TV upscale, which I agree with.
post #9290 of 10937
Quote:
Originally Posted by billbillw View Post

He was talking about the settings on his DirecTV box. You can set them to output native signal, or to have a fixed resolution. In other words, let the DVR upscale or let the TV. He is choosing to let the TV upscale, which I agree with.

So setting native = ON and checking all the resolutions off on the D* HR21 will do the trick and will let the TV upscale?
post #9291 of 10937
The first part of his question, yes he was, however, the part I cut out he was referring directly to the 700u which is the part I addressed.
post #9292 of 10937
Quote:
Originally Posted by csunflip View Post

So setting native = ON and checking all the resolutions off on the D* HR21 will do the trick and will let the TV upscale?

You should have the boxes for 480i, 720p and 1080i checked and native 'ON'. This will let the TV do the upscaling/deinterlacing.

When you say checking off, I assume you mean the boxes ARE checked. If you uncheck them, then the DVR will not send that signal.
post #9293 of 10937
Quote:
Originally Posted by billbillw View Post

He was talking about the settings on his DirecTV box. You can set them to output native signal, or to have a fixed resolution. In other words, let the DVR upscale or let the TV. He is choosing to let the TV upscale, which I agree with.

Quote:
Originally Posted by billbillw View Post

You should have the boxes for 480i, 720p and 1080i checked and native 'ON'. This will let the TV do the upscaling/deinterlacing.

When you say checking off, I assume you mean the boxes ARE checked. If you uncheck them, then the DVR will not send that signal.

Yes....that is what I meant by checked off

Thakns for the info!
post #9294 of 10937
Quote:
Originally Posted by BMAN1212 View Post

I had the 77U first...then returned it for the 700U...the 77U anti-glare screen is very effective but it creates a matte-like LCD picture quality...for my plasma tastes, the 77U lacked the Wow-Factor PQ...then I got the 700U...Wow!

To my eyes, the difference is pretty profound...perhaps, it depends on your viewing enviroment and wallet.

I am totally satisfied with the anti-reflection aspect of my 58pz700. I can watch it with lights on nearby the listening area, lamps located on either side of the listening sofa, and there is no noticeable distraction/reflection on the screen from this. It is totally awesome IMO.
post #9295 of 10937
How far are you seated from the 58pz700? I am deciding between the 50 and the 58. Also, does the 58 overly dominate the room (your expectations vs reality)?
post #9296 of 10937
Quote:
Originally Posted by sourbeef View Post

I am totally satisfied with the anti-reflection aspect of my 58pz700. I can watch it with lights on nearby the listening area, lamps located on either side of the listening sofa, and there is no noticeable distraction/reflection on the screen from this. It is totally awesome IMO.

I'm actually kinda disappointed with that aspect of my 42PZ700. I just received it a few days ago as a warranty replacement for my PX600, and I cannot tell any difference between them (with respect to being anti-reflective). I see exactly the same reflections. I even compared them side by side before the Panny rep took away the old one. There is no improvement in the anti-reflective coating on the 700 series versus the older 600 series. I was hoping for more.
I really think that this is just something that the marketing folks decided to throw in there, just like the "480Hz sub-field drive", which has probably been a 'feature' for a few years, but never advertised, until they felt they had to compete with 120Hz LCDs.
post #9297 of 10937
Quote:
Originally Posted by billbillw View Post

I'm actually kinda disappointed with that aspect of my 42PZ700.

Agreed. I can readily see lamps set on either side of my sofa which is especially noticable in dark scenes. That's what prompted me to set up bias lighting on the rear of the Panny resulting in no annoying reflections.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigfan9999 View Post

How far are you seated from the 58pz700? I am deciding between the 50 and the 58. Also, does the 58 overly dominate the room (your expectations vs reality)?

Many would agree bigger is better limited only by one's budget. Ideal viewing for a 50" is 8'-11' and for a 58" is 10'-13'. Several posters have commented viewing their 58" at 9'-10'.

To fully appreciate the quality of an HDTV, you're going to want to sit closer than what you're used to with an SDTV. The general rule of thumb for ideal viewing distance range:

HDTV: 2-3 times display width
SDTV: 3-5 times display width

My first look at an HDTV was my dad's 42" Samsung which initially I thought was HUGE compared to his old 25" SDTV. I thought that size was more than sufficient until I did more research on HDTV's and opted for the 50". Now when I visit him, his 42" seems rather small in comparison to the 50". Had I known beforehand just how spectactular viewing HD programming is on this set, I would have opted for the 58" had it been in the budget as it definitely would not have been too large in my family room of 15'x12'.
post #9298 of 10937
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimInPT View Post

I have a 58/750U, and CBS-HD (tuned via QAM; I have no cable box - hate 'em) disappeared for a while last night. Not a big deal, since I watch almost no network stuff, but wanted to throw a HD picture up to check the image. It was just gone.

But about 30 minutes later, it was back. Just like that. FoxHD, ABCHD and the rest of the QAM channels were fine all along; it was just CBS-HD that poofed out for a while.

If you still don't get anything after a reset, try just standing by for a while; yours may just reappear as well.

And FWIW, none of my QAM channels have moved around yet. If they do, I'll just call the cable guys and threaten to go satellite.


Well, after a little tweaking, it does turn out that my cable company switched around where the HD channels are located. So I found all the HD channels again -- though I'm still having an issue with ABC (7-1).

The TV picked up two different channels on the 7-1 designation. One is the true ABC-HD... The other is nothing but static.

If I assign the HD channel to my favorites, it also picks up the static version.

Then, if I'm browsing my channels via favorite, it only picks up the static channel and not the HD one.

Annoying. Think I'll just wipe all the channels clean and start again.

Thanks again for everyone's help on this one-
post #9299 of 10937
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jag2112 View Post

Well, after a little tweaking, it does turn out that my cable company switched around where the HD channels are located.


I believe what we tried to tell you. And it's going to happen again.
post #9300 of 10937
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigfan9999 View Post

How far are you seated from the 58pz700? I am deciding between the 50 and the 58. Also, does the 58 overly dominate the room (your expectations vs reality)?

I'm a little further than that recommended by some places for a 58" set (but optimum by some others ... seems to vary) so it's theoretically good if we had one even bigger (but wouldn't fit -- I measured first and chose the largest one that would fit into the corner where it's located, fireplace mantle on the side is a boundary). We're 12' from our sitting back in the chair eyes to the center of the screen in a almost perfect horizontal line. If I sit up on the front edge of the chair and lean forward a little I'd be at the 9 feet that's the normal stated optimum for a 1080p set of this size (can't say things blossom wonderfully when leaning forward like that, actually I don't notice anything :-).

As to dominating the room, it does currently, but in a few years I expect that it'll lose that distinction will go back to the room's focus that it was before when we had what's now thought of as the small, puny, tiny, 32" Sony XBR set we had previously. The set being new, and so awesome, the room revolves around it for now. :-)

Anyway... one place to play with numbers is here:

http://myhometheater.homestead.com/v...l#anchor_13194

But there are others. I think my method, practically speaking, is the proper one: largest one before one's wall runs out or one's wallet runs out, whichever limit is met first. :-)
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AVS › AVS Forum › Display Devices › Plasma Flat Panel Displays › Panasonic 42pz700, 50pz700u, 50pz750u, 58pz700u and 58pz750u Owners Thread!