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What would you do? (inputs/sources)

post #1 of 23
Thread Starter 
Right now I'm running my XG off of a HTPC with a fusion HDTV 5 tuner, but I want to be able to use my cable box for encrypted channels as well as any other component/dvi/hdmi sources (hd dvd, ps3, etc), hence the need for some type of transcoder/input module.

The options from what I've researched are:

1. A DVI + component transcoder with gamma correction.

2. A NEC ISS as well as moome's ISS input card with gamma correction (probably the most expensive option).

3. moome's XG input card. The only problem is moome does not make the XG card with gamma correction. However, the advantage is that the input would be digital whereas with the other two options the input is RGB. I'm not sure how much of a difference this makes though.

Unfortunately there isn't a win-all solution because my budget is 250-350$, making a scalar far out of range. It's either gamma correction or digital input.

By the way, I plan on having the XG calibrated by Ken or Terry or whoever else at that expertise level sometime after I get all my sources setup.

So, what would you do?
post #2 of 23
Save money and look for a scaler, try to calibrate it best you can. then later save for a pro calibration.scalers area must i would say for crt's. Lumagens ae great because they have 11 point gamma correction and can be used to get grey scale real close after the crt's grey scale is set. look for a used one and you'll be more than happy.

Athanasios
post #3 of 23
I would get the transcoder if I was low on dough and knew it would be awhile before I got more, but if you can save up for the scaler.
post #4 of 23
Thread Starter 
The only thing about a scaler is I don't think there's much I'm going to scale. I don't have a DVD collection so I'd probably get a HD dvd player soon and rent HD DVDs from netflix or blockbuster. So really the only additional feature of the scaler over a transcoder with gamma is the ability to change the refresh rate, which I don't think is worth 700$. Now if I had a 9" CRT and needed to deinterlace 1080i to 1080p, then that would be another story. Is there any other feature of a scaler that I'm missing?
post #5 of 23
Thread Starter 
bumpty dump...now that everyone's back from the meet
post #6 of 23
I am in the same boat. I have a HTPC and a Dtv HD satellite receiver connected to my CRT projector as well as a plasma TV (for daylight hours). I would like to throw a HDDVD player into the mix and am looking for a method to convert the HDMI output of the HDDVD to the RGBHV input on the projector. Preferably without running a HDMI cable through the walls to the projector.

Thanks in advance.
post #7 of 23
What outputs does your cable box have? Component. HDMI or DVI?

Start with Kim's transcoder. All HD devices provide component. A good transcoder should hold it's value well while you save up for the next step.

Save up for a pro calibration... all the gamma cards in the world won't correct a bad color balance or soft EM spot. You'll learn a lot just by watching. Be very flexible with the time... try to catch them when they're in the area. And show your student ID for a discount.

If you decide on the a HDMI card, you can wait on the gamma option.

How are the 1080i/720p scanlines on your XG now with OTA content? For a 8", you'll do fine staying with native HD... 1080i and 720p. So don't worry about the scaler yet.
post #8 of 23
My HD satellite box has DVI, component, and RGB. I am using the RGB for my CRT and the DVI for the plasma tv.

I apologize for hijacking the thread.
post #9 of 23
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Clarence View Post

What outputs does your cable box have? Component. HDMI or DVI?

Start with Kim's transcoder. All HD devices provide component. A good transcoder should hold it's value well while you save up for the next step.

Save up for a pro calibration... all the gamma cards in the world won't correct a bad color balance or soft EM spot. You'll learn a lot just by watching. Be very flexible with the time... try to catch them when they're in the area. And show your student ID for a discount.

If you decide on the a HDMI card, you can wait on the gamma option.

How are the 1080i/720p scanlines on your XG now with OTA content? For a 8", you'll do fine staying with native HD... 1080i and 720p. So don't worry about the scaler yet.

The cable box has DVI and component.

I'm pretty sure I want this to be the one and only transcoder/input card/scaler so I'd like to just move to transcoding + gamma. I just can't justify spending $1000 on a scaler when the projector was nearly that much, especially when I'll be going to college in a year and a half. The RTC2200 (component transcoding + gamma) looks nice, unless HDMI/DVI/component direct input is that much better than RGB (see below).

I think what would help a lot in deciding this is knowing what kind of difference gamma makes as well as the difference between HDMI/DVI input and VGA input into the projector.

I also plan to have Ken calibrate once I get this situated. The whole point of getting the transcoder is so I can finally the XG calibrated. Ken actually said he wanted to come measure my light output while he was still in town, which would be a good opportunity to discuss a few issues I'm having that should be worked out before calibration.

As for the scanlines, I honestly don't know. I'm running 720p instead of 1080i because I was having some porch issues with 1080i on the HTPC. I know focus isn't that great since focusing a torus is more difficult, I don't know where to set scheimpflug (the manual doesn't include my setup), and the green astigmatism flares. Convergence is alright, but it can definitly get better. Right now its very watchable, looks better than anything I've seen (save other CRT setups) and has great black levels. I just need to get the rest of my sources setup and fix a few issues before I pay for a calibration.
post #10 of 23
If you want to really get a great calibration the lumagen scalers are a great addition even for the money, there are so many options for calibrators, especialy the gamma control at 11 points. I know its alot of money for a young guy but if you plan to stay into crt and want to upgrade later a scaler now will be one less thing to get later . And i think with lets say the lumagen hdp with rgbhv outs added would be a great addition.

Athanasios
post #11 of 23
Thread Starter 
So is there anything that will do component + DVI transcoding with gamma control? Moome said hes making a XG and/or external box that does component + DVI with gamma sometime in July, but I don't think I can wait until October. What about an external gamma device? From searching, it looks like theres a lot of Marquee and Sony stuff, but NEC gets no love .

Sorry, a scaler is completely off the table. It would take me nearly half of the summer working to earn enough money, and I don't think its worth it for a little better gamma control and the ability to change the refresh rate. Now if I had a 9"er and needed 1080p that would be a totally different story.
post #12 of 23
Quote:
Originally Posted by nashou66 View Post

If you want to really get a great calibration the lumagen scalers are a great addition even for the money, there are so many options for calibrators, especialy the gamma control at 11 points. I know its alot of money for a young guy but if you plan to stay into crt and want to upgrade later a scaler now will be one less thing to get later . And i think with lets say the lumagen hdp with rgbhv outs added would be a great addition.

Athanasios

Thanks for the info
post #13 of 23
Quote:
Originally Posted by dcnblues View Post

Thanks for the info

Your Welcome.

Athanasios
post #14 of 23
Get Kim's for component.

When you need DVI, but the HDFury and plug it into the RGB input of the kimcoder. You'll have component and DVI both with gamma correction. And it will look fabulous on your XG.

Dave
post #15 of 23
Quote:
Originally Posted by Person99 View Post

Get Kim's for component.

When you need DVI, but the HDFury and plug it into the RGB input of the kimcoder. You'll have component and DVI both with gamma correction. And it will look fabulous on your XG.

This is exactly what I plan on doing. Already have the RTC2200 (Kimcoder) and the HDfury will hopefully arrive soon.... the combo is pretty cheap and I don't have to change any cabling:

HD-DVD player -> short HDMI-to-DVI cable -> HDfury -> Kim's RTC2200 transcoder VGA passthru -> 25' RGBHV cable -> CRT projector

The HDfury's not really meant to drive really long cables but in this manner you're using the RTC2200's output stage which *is* meant to drive longer cables.

Kal
post #16 of 23
Thread Starter 
So you would recommend a longer RGBHV cable as opposed to a longer HDMI cable?
post #17 of 23
No, not necessarily - my way requires most people to not change out their cabling. If your RGBHV cabling is good, and you're driving it properly, you're not going to notice a difference
from running a longer RGBHV cable vs longer HDMI cable (IMHO).

Kal
post #18 of 23
Quote:
Originally Posted by kal View Post

No, not necessarily - my way requires most people to not change out their cabling. If your RGBHV cabling is good, and you're driving it properly, you're not going to notice a difference
from running a longer RGBHV cable vs longer HDMI cable (IMHO).

Kal

I would tend to agree, but I've seen info on both sides. I've seen good HDMI calbes look OK at 25' but in my set up, I like the Belden 1694a to be the long run as I've liked it better than a long HDMI run, but I'll try the long DVI for fun when I get the Fury, but I doubt I'll change.

One of the local guys with a G90 could not get a good 35' digital run even with a repeater in the middle. When he switched to fiber optic cabling, it was flawless.

Dave
post #19 of 23
Thread Starter 
All my equipment is directly below the projector, so cable runs dont have to be more than 6ft all together. I was thinking of ouputting DVI directly into the HDfury and then go the 3ft/6ft to the kimcoder via VGA and then use a small breakout cable from the kimcoder to the projector? I'd need to output VGA from the HDFury to got to the kimcoder and by using the VGA as the longer cable run I could use the same VGA cable for the HTPC. How does this sound?

Also, where would you recommend cables from? I see a lot of people recommending monoprice, but 6$ cables aren't exactly comforting.

Thanks
post #20 of 23
Keep the cable between the HDFury and the kimcoder as short as possible: Plug the HDfury directly into the Kimcoder. (No cable).
post #21 of 23
Thread Starter 
Just curious as to why? (trying to learn here ).

So I can go 6ft to the HDFury via DVI and then a 6 inch RGBHV from the kimcoder to the projector
or
Connect the HDfury directly to the DVI device (or I could use a short cable here if that matters) and use a 6ft vga cable to a 6" RGBHV cable from the kimcoder.
post #22 of 23
The HDfury works best if you keep the output cable short. It wasn't meant to drive long cables.

Kal
post #23 of 23
Quote:
Originally Posted by NautikaL View Post

Just curious as to why? (trying to learn here ).

The chip in the HDFury is designed to be used inside of a device on the PCB. As such, it is not set up to drive cables. To drive cables requires an output stage between the HDFury and the cable. The HDFury does not have this as it is not designed to drive cables but be attached to the device. Kim's tcoder does have this because it is designed to drive cables.

Dave
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