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Official Toshiba 65HM167 and 57HM167 Owner's thread - Page 9

post #241 of 3106
Just a heads up for all those interesetd, NFM is selling the 67 for $1499.99, and it is in stock.
post #242 of 3106
Quote:
Originally Posted by egroh View Post

Just a heads up for all those interesetd, NFM is selling the 67 for $1499.99, and it is in stock.

I'm interested next week, but what (or who, lol) is NFM?

Edit: Which TV is for sale for $1,499, the 57" or 65"?
post #243 of 3106
Nebraska Furniture Mart (www.NFM.com). If you dont live within driving distance, you can buy online, or over the phone; I just ordered mine over the phone, its being delivered tomorrow (TV, stand, HD-A20)!


oh yeah, and I got no interest financing!
post #244 of 3106
I'm sorry, I know there is no 67", I meant 65. the 65HM167, is going for $1499.99 at NFM. the stand is going for $379.
post #245 of 3106
Now that's a good price. I wonder if they are an authorized dealer though...
post #246 of 3106
I got the Toshiba stand (ST6587) at MACCONNECTION - DOT - COM (newbies can't post URL's) for $239 shipped. They were having a FREE SHIPPING offer a couple of weeks ago (I believe their current offer is free shipping on purchases over $249 -- but it appears to exclude heavyweight items). The stand was backordered so it took about 2 weeks for delivery.

Now all I have to do is wait for the TV to arrive.
post #247 of 3106
I picked up the 65hm167 last Sunday. I have a few issues.

1) I have a small darkish irregular spot in the low right hand corner of the screen. I only see it in white or very light colored pictures on the set. It is easiest to see when watching hockey or on static white backgrounds. I think this is the issue others have noticed. I don't want to go through the hassle of bringing the set back for an exchange. I have considered getting a service call. My wife thinks that the service people can screw it up more. she prefers to accept the defect since it is so small. Has anyone had a service call for this problem and was the outcome satisfactory.

2) The other issue is finding the optimum settings. The color reproduction seems a bit difficult to control Blacks are very black in bright scenes. The colors seem to be unpredictable in subdued lighting and indoor shots. Here is the example. In watching the DVD of Boston Legal the suit colors are much different depending on the shot. A black or gray suit can take on a greenish tint depending on the location of the shot and the camera angle. In some shots the part on the suit nearest the light is black and the portion farther away has a greenish tint. I also agree that skin tones are inconstant from scene to scene. Can anyone tell me if the source material is the cause or the TV?
post #248 of 3106
The best reference for accurate skin color that I use is the opening scenes of The Fifth Element when the professor is in the cave and asks for the light.

Another dependable source is any of the home shopping networks (although they are sd).

Usually inconsistent flesh tones would be source related.

I'll post my own 65hm167 impressions soon as the set is to be delivered within the next two hours. All cables in place and ready to go.

Shelly
post #249 of 3106
Quote:
Originally Posted by shelly View Post

The best reference for accurate skin color that I use is the opening scenes of The Fifth Element when the professor is in the cave and asks for the light.

Shelly


I am looking forward to your response. My wife is trying to save me from my compulsion to critically analyze the picture. I got the set for a steal at my local CC store. I saved enough to pay for a professional calibration compared to the HLS6187 or the Mits 65731.
post #250 of 3106
Quote:
Originally Posted by piturra View Post

Yes - you can read about it in my earlier Post #51.

Phil

Thanks!
It's looking more and more like I'll pick up this set. Now I just need to be able to get it for under $2k including taxes and also get 18 months to 24 months no interest. I wish I would have been looking before Memorial weekend. I would have been able to easily get the set for under $2k from CC and BB then.
post #251 of 3106
Quote:
Originally Posted by shelly View Post

The best reference for accurate skin color that I use is the opening scenes of The Fifth Element when the professor is in the cave and asks for the light.

...

Shelly

AFTER you CALIBRATE the VIDEO (skin color - specifically 'Tint' w/BLUE Filter) using Digital Video Essentials, ... Fifth Element is a very good DVD (Superbit) to use ...

... or ... any of the following DVDs ...

1) Mr. & Mrs. Smith
2) Serenity
3) Sahara
4) Star Wars Ep. 3 or 4
5) Spider-Man 1 or 2
6) Aeon Flux
7) Charlie's Angels
8) The Mask of Zorro
9) Miss Congeniality
10) The Phantom of the Opera

Once your VIDEO is CALIBRATED, you can watch ... any great blockbuster DVD and you'll see the correct NTSC color palette.

FYI: Get DVE (linked above) and use the 20% OFF coupon 'SUPERSALE' (ends June 17)

Phil
post #252 of 3106
My main concern is geting a near perfect black and white picture. That should ensure that all colors will be accurate. This can be seen by taking the Çolor control down to 0.

If the Gray Scale is really off, then a professional calibration would be in order.

The two 65hm167s I played with at 2 stores both gave this with the Medium color temperature. High ct was blueish and Warm ct was reddish, as they should be.

I have high hopes that only slight adjustments will be necessary.

I have been quite pleased with the colors and flesh tones I achieved with both of my front projectors (one now retired) and my Sony crt rptv (about to be retired), all done by eye. I do have the Avia set up dvd but rarely have used it. I find that Contrast and Brightness often have to be changed depending on the time of day.

Going into the Service menu to work with the Gain and Bias controls is another thing, though, and would require some equipment or discs ffor help in that regard. Should not be necessary here.

I have now gone a few minutes beyond the delivery window. Waiing impatiently.

Shelly
post #253 of 3106
Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronwt View Post

Thanks!
It's looking more and more like I'll pick up this set. Now I just need to be able to get it for under $2k including taxes and also get 18 months to 24 months no interest. I wish I would have been looking before Memorial weekend. I would have been able to easily get the set for under $2k from CC and BB then.


I was able to get CC to come in well below that mark including taxes.
post #254 of 3106
Quote:
Originally Posted by shelly View Post

My main concern is geting a near perfect black and white picture. That should ensure that all colors will be accurate. This can be seen by taking the Çolor control down to 0.

To ensure that your colors are accurate, you'll need to Calibrate it using the supplied BLUE filter & NTSC color test screen!

FYI: Here's my Toshiba 62HM196 REF Video Calibration vs. INPUTS using HD DVD DVE:

1) Toshiba HD-A1 HD DVD Player (HDMI #1)***Note 1
Contrast..... 75
Brightness... 53
Color........ 66
Tint......... 14

Sharpness.... 0

2) Samsung DVD-VR330 DVR / VCR Combo Recorder (Component #1 = 480p)***Note 1
Contrast..... 75
Brightness... 54
Color........ 57
Tint......... 10

Sharpness.... 5

3) Phillips DVP5960/37 - (HDMI #2 / upconverting = 1080i)***Note 1
Contrast..... 75
Brightness... 45
Color........ 51
Tint......... -20

Sharpness.... 5

The following is based on visual source material...
4) HD & Digital Cable TV
Contrast..... 75
Brightness... 53
Color........ 45
Tint......... -13
Sharpness.... 5

***NOTES:
-----------
1) REF Video
(Color & Tint w/BLUE Filter, Contrast & Brightness w/Pluge Test Screen) Calibrated w/HD DVE, verified w/VE, DVE & AVIA (letterbox - so I don't use AVIA anymore)

2) YOUR VIDEO CALIBRATION will most likely be DIFFERENT vs. My REF Video CAL

3) Contrast and Brightness from your calibrated DVD values, ... generally works for your OTA/Cable HD & Digital TV broadcasts w/minor changes.

4) NEW RCA 80GB DVR Unit (Component #2 @ 480p): I also Calibrated the Video but don't have those values with me and YES, ... the Video Calibration Values is slightly different to the 3 INPUTS (HDMI & Component) listed above!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by shelly View Post

If the Gray Scale is really off, then a professional calibration would be in order.

The two 65hm167s I played with at 2 stores both gave this with the Medium color temperature. High ct was blueish and Warm ct was reddish, as they should be.

Toshiba's are notorious for being too cool (blue) right out of the factory based on all the Reviews / Benchmarks I've read over the years ranging over 7,000 to a really hot / blue 12,000 Kelvin temp.!

ALL Those Reviews / Benchmarks noted in their comments that using WARM Temp. got it closer to the 6,500 Kelvin temp standard, ... which is what I use for my present 62HM196 1080p DLP (& previously owned 50H81 CRT base RPTV & 56HM195 1080p DLP)!!!

You won't know if the MFG. Tolerance Temp Setting favors 7,000 or 12,000 Kelvin temp. until you at the very least Calibrated your Video using DVE and view some B&W material like "Casablanca", "The Day Earth Stood Still", etc.

If after you do the Video Calibration and your B&W DVD's still looks too blue in the white areas, ... then the only solution is a PRO Calibration.

FYI: My set is closer to 7,000 Kelvin temp based on the following samples -

Sample 1 HD DVD Aeon Flux
.... (Close-up view)

Sample 2 HD DVD Digital Video Essentials

... so I can live with the 1080p PQ!!! (this includes my usual family and friends that come over to my once or twice a month HD DVD presentations - Tonight's HD DVD presentation = "Dragonheart" )

Quote:
Originally Posted by shelly View Post

I have high hopes that only slight adjustments will be necessary.

In most cases, it really depends on how it was calibrated @ the Manufacture to begin with vs. the Video Test Screens - Pluge and Blue Filter w/NTSC Color Test Screens.

Quote:
Originally Posted by shelly View Post

I have been quite pleased with the colors and flesh tones I achieved with both of my front projectors (one now retired) and my Sony crt rptv (about to be retired), all done by eye. I do have the Avia set up dvd but rarely have used it.

Your just guessing by using your eye memory, ... why not just NAIL-Down your Video by Calibration using the same Calibration Standards used by the Movie and DVD Mastering Studios!

Look again @ my Color & Tint Video Calibration above, ... they are all slightly different because, ... I USED the BLUE Filter & NTSC Test Screens!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by shelly View Post

I find that Contrast and Brightness often have to be changed depending on the time of day.

I never change the Brightness, but I'll tweak up the Contrast up to 90 - 95 during the day and return it to it's Calibrated Value once the sun has set.


Quote:
Originally Posted by shelly View Post

Going into the Service menu to work with the Gain and Bias controls is another thing, though, and would require some equipment or discs ffor help in that regard. Should not be necessary here.

I have now gone a few minutes beyond the delivery window. Waiing impatiently.

Shelly

Yeah, playing with the Service Menu can improve your Calibration if you have the right equipment and Calibration DVD (or HD DVD).

Have fun with your new HDTV!!!
Phil
post #255 of 3106
After a few hours of checking out my 65hm167, everything is very positive.

I have 2 tiny flecks of black plastic between screens in the upper right corner but they're only visible from about 6" and absolutely disappear at 1' and certainly not a factor at my 10' viewing distance.

No smudges.

Almost inaudible fan/color wheel noise. I have to turn volume down to 0, and put my ear near the rear of the set to hear it. My Comcast hd dvr makes more noise.

Medium color temperature has almost black and white. There is the slightest shading of sepia but nowhere near as much as the Warm setting and the Cool setting is on the blue side.

Flesh tones on live broadcasts is near perfect. No green tinting at all.

Using Preference. Changed Contrast to 80, Lamp to Low, Color Temp to Medium. Made changes to all active Inputs and have already hidden the unused Inputs for faster toggling through my sources. Won't have a hd dvd player for a week or so, although I do have one in my front projector room.

Digital sd from my Comcast box via hdmi is much, much better than I expected and the Theaterwide 1 stretch is as natural as the one I had on the Sony (which I thought was among the best I had seen.).

Although the gray scale is slightly off, it's hardly noticable and certainly not to my wife, nor I suspect any friends. Not sure it's worth the $400 (including round trip transportation) to have it calibrated. We can get very picky here on this forum.

I have the set on a 17" high coffee table. The table is 1" deeper than the set and 20" less wide (so it stickes out 10" on each side but tapers in quickly) but the set is rock steady on it and the table looks like a pedistal base.

I thought that the viewing screen might be too low and that my feet would get in the way but the screen starts 4 1/4" up from the bottom of the set, so my eyes are within the bottom 1/3 and my toes are still several inches below the screen.

The picture is as crisp or more so as my front projector and miles ahead of the 5 1/2 year old Sony crt rptv it replaces. Everything about it is a step up.

Even my older Dish 6000 sat receiver with component output looks great. I keep just the original 15 channel hd package to which I am grandfathered in at a low price. It was very soft and washed out with the Sony but is now approaching the hd level I expected. Still a notch or two beneath the Comcast hd picture but I am glad I kept it active with Dish. Probably a result of the greater compression of the Dish signal compared to Comcast.

Still more tweaking to do as I figure out the effects of some of the settings. I do know that I prefer the High setting for Dynamic Contrast. Turning it off or down tends to wash out the picture. We on the forum are often too quick to disable every feature that can acutally enhance the picture.

I can't believe I lived with a 57" hd set for so many years. It got smaller and smaller through the years. At my 10' seating distance, this 65"er is not at all too big. Wish I had room for a 70" but I am using all available space in my den for this one.

Already ordered my Mack extended warranty from Texas Tapeworks.

Shelly
post #256 of 3106
Hello shelly, thanks for the review.. glad you're liking the TV =) I am loving it so far except the fact it has black specks just like the others. Same damn thing - different places heh. But like you said, it disappear as you are farther away but sometime I could see it if I look hard enough but then why looking for it when you're watching TV.
post #257 of 3106
Quote:
Originally Posted by egroh View Post

Just a heads up for all those interesetd, NFM is selling the 67 for $1499.99, and it is in stock.


Dang. I just got the 57" from them for not much lower than that. I'll have to be returning it before the 30 days is up and get the 65". Plus, I've got black specks on my 57" so they already know that I was thinking of exchanging for another 57" anyways. That's a hot price for a 65". The only thing is it's going to stick out about 4" on each side on my stand that I just got
post #258 of 3106
Quote:
Originally Posted by sambao21 View Post

Dang. I just got the 57" from them for not much lower than that. I'll have to be returning it before the 30 days is up and get the 65". Plus, I've got black specks on my 57" so they already know that I was thinking of exchanging for another 57" anyways. That's a hot price for a 65". The only thing is it's going to stick out about 4" on each side on my stand that I just got

I still haven't figured out what NFM means for the store with that price. Is it Nebraska Furniture Market? I already own the tv and I don't care about that price since I paid $250 more shipped no tax from a reliable online store on memorial weekend. I just hope no one is taking a risk buying from a place that low.
post #259 of 3106
Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronwt View Post

Thanks!
It's looking more and more like I'll pick up this set. Now I just need to be able to get it for under $2k including taxes and also get 18 months to 24 months no interest. I wish I would have been looking before Memorial weekend. I would have been able to easily get the set for under $2k from CC and BB then.

Well you're in luck, if you go to Nebraska Furniture Mart, or call them, or go on their site, you can pick up the 65 for 1499; that price is good through Tuesday!

I ordered the TV (1499), stand (230), and the HD-A20 (300); after warranties on both the TV and the player, taxes, and a couple HD movies, I paid $2508, AND I got 15 months no interest!
post #260 of 3106
Not to be a begger but i need some screenshots!!! Can any of you post sample shots, HD DVD(Or Blu-Ray) and Xbox 360.
post #261 of 3106
Also, in case some people are not aware, there is an instant rebate on the HD-A2 DVD player; the instant rebate through fathers day, and starting Sunday (the 10th) the (instant) rebate will be available on ALL three models, furthermore if you buy ANY toshiba HDTV (42" or bigger) AND an HD DVD player, you will get $200 off instantly!

read more about it here:
http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/deals/dea...ate-260970.php

http://www.thelookandsoundofperfect....pringpromo.pdf
post #262 of 3106
Quote:
Originally Posted by jodeci4l View Post

Not to be a begger but i need some screenshots!!! Can any of you post sample shots, HD DVD(Or Blu-Ray) and Xbox 360.

Mine is getting delivered tomorrow, and I will have pictures up shortly there after. Until then, the best picture that i have found of the 65...
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attac...chmentid=72751 YUM!

I will be sure to take pics of both my 360 Elite and my HD-A20.
post #263 of 3106
Can anybody tell my why the contrast ratio is nowhere in the specs listed?
post #264 of 3106
Quote:
Originally Posted by White Knight View Post

Can anybody tell my why the contrast ratio is nowhere in the specs listed?

Some manufacturers simply don't list CR and since there is no stardard method for measuring CR, comparisons between different manufacturer's claims are not meaningful. Toshiba appears to use an always active dynamic iris (DI), as do many other RPTV manufacturers, and this produces high CR values, but with the negative of some pumping of black (and white) levels depending on content the displayed video material. I don't know for certain if its possible on the Toshiba to adjust the action of the DI thru the user or service menu. Perhaps the "dynamic contrast" setting in the user menu adjusts the DI, but even with "dynamic contrast" set to off I'm still seeing some pumping action that I assume is being caused by the DI. Has any other forum member with one of the new Toshibas seen this?
post #265 of 3106
I'm new to this forum but am now on my third (3) 65hm167, which replaced a defective 62hm196

1)the first one had a dark dot on the screen as well as a tilted and expanding line on the lefthand side of the screen when viewing sdtv signals streched to theatre wide.
2)My second one had numerous dots on the screen as well as plastic fibers imbedded behind the screen but visible when turned on, it did not have the line tilt when viewing in sdtv channels like the previous one i had though, which also stretched to theatre wide automatically with out me having to use the controls. while waiting for best buy to replace that set the bulb also blew.
3)the third one arrived last wednesday and it again had a few dark dots but also numerous smudges inside the center area of the screen making the stanley cup finals look like it was played on dirty ice.

All three have been of inferior quality as far as the shell of the television as well, looking well worn on the back of the television(fading) as all the structural supports inside the tv were worn through the back making the tv look old which i could have lived with except that the front casing over the screen was also semi warped so certain scenes of HDTV looked warped on the edges like a wave of shadows, more so on the sides of the tv.

Has any one had any of these problems? id like to give it one more shot because the picture that is visible with out the smudges dots or waves is great. But im tired of having best buy here every week, this last trip they broke part of the stucco finish on my house

Everyone here seems so happy with the set and i'm wondering if maybe it might be something here on the west coast maybe with Quality control.

Any way any reply would be helpful every on here seems very helpful as well
post #266 of 3106
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron Jones View Post

Some manufacturers simply don't list CR and since there is no stardard method for measuring CR, comparisons between different manufacturer's claims are not meaningful. Toshiba appears to use an always active dynamic iris (DI), as do many other RPTV manufacturers, and this produces high CR values, but with the negative of some pumping of black (and white) levels depending on content the displayed video material. I don't know for certain if its possible on the Toshiba to adjust the action of the DI thru the user or service menu. Perhaps the "dynamic contrast" setting in the user menu adjusts the DI, but even with "dynamic contrast" set to off I'm still seeing some pumping action that I assume is being caused by the DI. Has any other forum member with one of the new Toshibas seen this?

I have not noticed any of the pumping. I can easily see the action of a dynamic iris with my front projector if I used certain factory presets. And I, for now, prefer to keep dynamic contrast at the maximum level for the greater conrast ratio it produces.

My wife, who rarely watches tv, sat down with me to watch a PBS show on crafts that I had recorded on my Comcast hd dvd, and she said "Wow!" three times during the hour program, "That's incredible and 3'D like." once and at the end, told me I had done good in chosing this set. Also the size, going from a 57" to the 65" was not overwhelming to her as this set has a smaller profile than the replaced crt rptv.

Later on, I decided to use the Channel Scan for the cable coaz input and it came up with 408 channels, including some hd ones. But the lack of a program guide to actually know which channel was which (many of the digital channels were, e.g., 100-1 through 100-8, etc.), not sure I will be using this source input as he Comcast box has he program guide built in.

Unlike the mirror like reflective screen on the replaced Sony, the screen on the Toshiba has an anti glare affect. All relections are very muted. I often saw my reflection super imposed on the picture with the Sony screen while watching but have not yet had the pleasure with the Toshiba.

And in reply to the unfortunate experience of the last poster, I looked at the back of my set and it is pristine. The front frame has no warping, no distortions anywhere. Purchased from Circuit City. Sounds like that Bes Buy got a bad shipment in.

Shelly
post #267 of 3106
Here are a couple of photos. I am on couch directly in front of set and cannot be seen. The light in upper right is reflection of small window coming from another room. Sun coming through that window a the moment.

The equipment cabinet is atached to the wall and is 20" deep so screen is avtually a few inches in front of it. I prefer to keep equipment higher rather than lower, say on a tv stand.

Shelly
LL
LL
post #268 of 3106
Quote:
Originally Posted by marbles1 View Post

All three have been of inferior quality as far as the shell of the television as well, looking well worn on the back of the television(fading) as all the structural supports inside the tv were worn through the back making the tv look old which i could have lived with except that the front casing over the screen was also semi warped so certain scenes of HDTV looked warped on the edges like a wave of shadows, more so on the sides of the tv.

As Shelly said, sounds like BB received a bad batch. The 57HM167 I bought from Sears here on the East coast had no specks or other blemishes that I could find, and I looked closely. Your bad luck, unfortunately. Hopefully Toshiba is getting reports on these returns and does something about quality control in the manufacturing plant.
post #269 of 3106
Quote:
Originally Posted by egroh View Post

Well you're in luck, if you go to Nebraska Furniture Mart, or call them, or go on their site, you can pick up the 65 for 1499; that price is good through Tuesday!

I ordered the TV (1499), stand (230), and the HD-A20 (300); after warranties on both the TV and the player, taxes, and a couple HD movies, I paid $2508, AND I got 15 months no interest!

I've been amazed at the low prices I've seen on the 65HM167, but there was a
catch...none of these low price on-line retailers (like Tigerdirect) accept
returns. So if you don't like the TV, you're stuck with it. The local guys,
like CC, allow full refunds but they are 600-700 more money. So I checked
NFM on-line and they do allow for full refunds, AND they are cheap!
OK, that's WAY to good to be true, so there must be a catch somewhere.
Sure enough, there's a catch with NFM too...they want $425-$1000
for shipping! That's right, if you live more than 500 miles from their area,
shipping starts at $425 and could go up to around $1000. So if you wind
up taking advantage of their return policy, you would be out at least
$825 if you return the set (they don't refund shipping charges and you'd
have to pay a like amount to ship it back). So if you were, say, on the east or west
coast, you'd pay about $2300 - $2500 for the set delivered , and if you sent it
back, you'd be out $1600 - $2000.
post #270 of 3106
Quote:
Originally Posted by roller11 View Post

I've been amazed at the low prices I've seen on the 65HM167, but there was a
catch...none of these low price on-line retailers (like Tigerdirect) accept
returns. So if you don't like the TV, you're stuck with it. The local guys,
like CC, allow full refunds but they are 600-700 more money. So I checked
NFM on-line and they do allow for full refunds, AND they are cheap!
OK, that's WAY to good to be true, so there must be a catch somewhere.
Sure enough, there's a catch with NFM too...they want $425-$1000
for shipping! That's right, if you live more than 500 miles from their area,
shipping starts at $425 and could go up to around $1000. So if you wind
up taking advantage of their return policy, you would be out at least
$825 if you return the set (they don't refund shipping charges and you'd
have to pay a like amount to ship it back). So if you were, say, on the east or west
coast, you'd pay about $2300 - $2500 for the set delivered , and if you sent it
back, you'd be out $1600 - $2000.

Off Topic:
Fortunately for me, I live close to one of the NFM, and I bought my 57" and will exchange it for the 65" and it's free shipping. It was only free shipping for my 57" too because I had bought furniture from them at the same time, and they charged me only like $50 shipping for the funiture and the tv wasn't charge additional. For people that don't live near Nebraska Furniture Mart, may be skeptical, but for us Midwest folks, everyone knows NFM reputation as having really low prices and superior customer service. They're not a small mom and pop store. They have a store the size of 2, maybe 3, super walmarts together here in Kansas. The store is managed by Warren Buffet's managing company, and is awesome. I like going there to buy electronics, furniture, appliances, whatever. If they sold groceries, I'd shop there exclusively. It would eliminate the need for Walmart/Target/Best Buy/Sears/JCPennys in one swoop.
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