Legacy Audio Speakers

I used to sell the Legacy line. Very decent speakers but they used to be a far better deal than they are now. They had some veneering issues but that may have been because I bought the entire lot of the Classics and some were from the old factory. The earlier version Classic was a winner, a heck of a lot of speaker for the $$. I had a set of Classics, a set of Focus 20/20's and a set of Whispers on display with twin LFXtreme subs and the matching Whisper center channel. The LFXtreme was a pretty good sub but there are subs that now surpass it. The updated version, I haven't heard but there is a lot of serious competition in the $3.5K range so they better have done a very big upgrade...listen first.

The only speaker that I could never get along with was the one that made them...the Focus 20/20. I tried and tried and just never could warm up to it.
Ultimately, they priced themselves out of the market for my tastes (the Focus nearly doubled in price in a year and a half) and I ended up dropping them and picking up Klipsch and PMC.

I, too, would be interested in hearing some opinions on the Legacy's. I thought I was set on some B&W 804s's and was introduced to the Focus HD because the size of my room is rather large and the Legacy's seemed to have more bottom end. I only heard them for a minute and was not able to do side by side but I think I may go back and compare them to the 803d's because of the $ range. I was also informed that the B&W's may need a significant upgrade in power to really get them to deliver.

I have a pair of Legacy Whisper in my system for over five years. I have heard the Focus (not the 20/20), and thought they were excellent for the asking price ($6K) at the time. I had B&W 801 II's before I got the Whisper, and I would say the Focus was the B&W's equivalent at about half to two-thirds the price at the time.

Ive listened to most of everything in the legacy line. I live less than 2 miles from their factory and one of my friends growing up...his brother is a big wig there. They sound unlike anything i have heard. They seemed to emerse me in the sound. Unforunatly no matter how much i like them i will never be able to afford them. The Focus (the model i would like to have) starts at around $6,000. I can tell you if you have the money you will not be disappointed. RiceRocket: $6k for the whispers was a steal of a price.

Ncage

No doubt. that 6k was a steal.

I'd consider selling organs for a pair at that price...LOL (j/k)

That said, the only Legacy's I've really listened to (spent about an hour or more in the Legacy booth at the Newport Beach HT show in 2004, I think) was the Whispers. They had a 300k HT setup as a "lets wow the noobs" setup with Watt puppies and such. I wasn't terribly impressed as the room was just horrible accoustically and they just threw a ton of speaker at it. The Whispers, otoh, were just stunning. I'm classically trained in Choral music and I swear, the Whispers do the best piano of any speaker, ever, and that includes the several planar speakers I've heard. I could actually hear the hammer hitting the string IN THE PIANO. It didn't sound like a "piano" sound, it sounded like I could hear into the piano. I could hear the artists fingers on the keys. The ambient cues led to a seemless feeling of being there that just RUINED me on speakers for years. Had money to buy speaker about 2 years later and just gave up in disgust.

If you don't have the money for Whispers, DON'T LISTEN TO THEM. Honestly, they are an experience; one that I'll never forget.

As a question, does anyone have any experience with the Helix, Whisper or their new in-walls?

OK, let's jump-start this sucker.

Anybody heard the Focus SE perchance? It looks like a lot of speaker for the money, to me, but I've never been in a position to audition ANY Legacy loudspeaker. I do know they allow returns, no questions asked, and they claim to not have many!

Bill Dudleston seems like a great guy, too. I have communicated with him via e-mail, as well as with Doug Brown at Legacy. Both very open and informative.

Anyway, what about those Legacy Focus SEs? Anyone?...

Edit: And if you'll read closely, NOBODY got a pair of Whispers for $6k. He was saying he thought the Focus sounded good at the (then) $6k asking price.

I am very familiar with most of the Legacy Audio line. I still own an original pair of Studios from about 10 years ago, and they are fantastic for their size. I love their full sound, great bass extension, and excellent imaging.

Recently, I decided to revisit the Legacy line of speakers, and I listened to the Whisper, Focus HD, Classic HD, and Studio HD. They have had 2 generations of upgrades since my original Studios, and I think their new carbon graphite drivers, ribbon midrange, and ribbon tweeters across the whole line are really, really good. Since you asked about the Focus, I will tell you about my experience with the Focus HD.

I was VERY impressed with the Focus HD. Powerful, effortless, deep, tight bass, warm, full mids and an extended, transparent, airy treble. I heard the original Focus years ago, and to me, the bass was kind of out of control, but the new drivers, design, and balance of the HD are perfect from top to bottom.

I could actually hear the breath pop from the mics on vocal recordings. Complex, busy bass lines were easily sorted out and pitch perfect. I could hear the fingers on acoustic bass strings, the wood resonance of the bass, and no change in the quality of sound as the bass played up into the higher registers. The HD goes really low too, rated to 18 Hz. I can honestly say that the Focus HD is the first speaker I have heard that I felt did not need any subwoofer help! Pipe organ tracks and movie soundtracks were awesome, presented with ease and authority. Guys from the other side of the building were asking "what subs are you using"? The answer - "none - just the Focus HD's alone"!

I was a little unsure about a ribbon midrange at first, but after hearing it, I loved the full-bodied sound. Very transparent, yet warm with 3-D imaging. Not only side-to-side imaging, but image depth was very good. The ribbon tweeter is great - very airy and extended up to 30kHz. Its a very natural sounding treble, no harshness or spittiness that domes can have - no problem in the treble at all.

I would say the Focus HD beats any speaker I've ever heard at twice the Focus' price! It's really a very special speaker.

I have not heard the Focus SE yet, but I would love to hear them knowing how great the HD is. Legacy tells me that the new SE cabinet is stiffer and is good for bass response down to 16 Hz. The SE adds silver internal wiring, precision matched drivers, and hand tuned crossovers. All of which can only make a great speaker even better.

Personally, I am planning on buying either the Focus HD or the SE for the LCR channels in my home theater!

Nice write-up!

Jeff

DMark1, thank you very much for the comprehensive reply.

As you mentioned, the SE edition of the Focus has some tweaking done to it that should only serve to increase the overall performance of the model. I believe Bill Dudleston and one of his main assistants actually do the crossover tweaking personally. They obtain a very very good speaker to speaker frequency response match to the ideal. The cabinet shape was modified to reduce internal standing waves, increase rigidity, and decrease edge diffractions. And you noted the driver updates.

I'm always a little curious about these big multiple driver speaker designs because overall driver integration and coherence can be such a challenge. But from what I've been able to discern from the few on-line test reviews I've been able to locate, Bill and the guys at Legacy seem to have those potential problems very well handled.

Let me ask, would you say the Focus "favors" any particular type of music, or does it do well with "everything"? I listen to a lot of different music types. I need a really good, full-range floorstander that is also an "all arounder"...

I'm certainly considering the Revel Salon2s, and I'm back to reconsidering the Legacy Focus SE as a potential rival at quite a bit lower price point. The difference in cost between the two would buy a lot of other upgrades, or better yet, new music!

You are correct about Bill Dudleston personally tweaking the crossovers and making sure the drivers are matched. I believe the SE comes with certified specs signed by Bill himself!

Also correct about the cabinet upgrades and benefits. I think they are beautifully designed, and Legacy is now offering various wood veneers on the SE, not just the Black Pearl lacquer. I don't know if I had anything to do with that, but I have been talking to Doug Brown about having mine made in Cherry.

BTW, the excellent new carbon graphite drivers are sourced from B&C in Italy, built to Legacy's specs.

Legacy has always specialized in integrating large numbers of drivers, and they do it very, very well. Bill D loves to move lots of air with his speakers, and that really adds to the sonic realism when listening. It makes a lot of sense when you think about a concert bass drum for example. Typically they are at least 36" in diameter, and when you play them, you really feel the air vibrate. 8" woofers in some "full-range" designs just don't cut it! The Focus SE has 2 12" woofers and 2 7" midrange drivers per channel. That's alot of well-controlled displacement!

The Focus is definately an "all-around" speaker. It certainly loves to rock, and is very dynamic for soundtracks with it's 94 dB sensitivity, but it also has the refinement to put you in the room with a small chamber ensemble for instance. It easily handles full scale orchestral works, but is also magical for vocals tracks too. I do think it really likes to rock though! It has a lot of "weight" to pound out kick drums and bass when called for.

The great thing I love about the Focus is the image size. The speaker is large enough to project a life-size image, both in height and depth. This really gives you the sense that the musicians are right there in the room with you. Smaller, lesser speakers really can have trouble with this, and you lose that "suspension of disbelief".

Funny you mentioned the wood veneers. I actually had a deposit down with Legacy early this year, "guaranteeing" me the first pair of SE's in a wood veneer! But I had some expenses come up, and had to ask for a refund of my deposit. Very depressing to have to do that! But Doug and the guys at Legacy were very understanding and helpful. As I said, they seem like great folks.

So in the meantime, I've been looking around some more as I have been repositioning myself to finally make a purchase. I've always been interested in the big Revel speakers, and it looks like there are some "deals" to be had out there if you are careful. I also have two local factory authorized dealers who I can "negotiate" with directly. I've just planted the seeds to get something moving potentially with one dealer this last weekend, in fact.

I understand Bill's philosophies pretty well, I think, as he was kind enough to explain them to me personally in an e-mail. Again, you don't get that kind of attention from most outfits, although, I was very impressed by Kevin Voecks' post in the Revel Owners Thread here a few days ago, too.

So, for all the reasons you mentioned and that we've discussed here, I am pretty much down to the Focus SE's and either the Salon2's or the Studio2's. That's pretty much where I'm at!

I just made a trip to Springfield and auditioned the Focus SE in Rosewood. My friend & I were lucky to catch Bill Dudleston pulling in as we were about to leave. He gave us a tour of the factory and auditioned the Focus for us without an appointment. Bill is a great guy and you can tell he really enjoys what he does. I used to own a pair of classics several years ago and have heard several of their speakers. The new focus speakers were even better than I thought they would be. They have improved significantly IMHO over the older models that I listened to years ago. I love the new ribbons. The Focus have a much tighter sound then they used to have. I will be buying a pair as soon as I can afford them.

gsmeyer, great to hear that info. Thanks for posting. I wish I could hear these SE's somewhere! You really had a great experience, getting to meet Bill and all.

I'm pretty much down to the SE's and the VMPS RM30 at this point. I don't see much of anything else out there at their price point that can compare in the way of a full-range floorstander. I do think a ribbon/planar dynamic hybrid is the way I'm going to go.

Gonna' be a tough decision!...

Where are you located? I have a pair of Focus SE's I purchased this year at the RMAF that you're welcome to audition. Indeed an incredible all around performer - I would say that they handle all of my music equally well.

Bill Dudleston is now out at the CES show, introducing Legacy's brand new design called the Whisper XD. I don't know all the details, but I do know that it has a built-in 500w B&O ICE Power amp to power the bass drivers, and a new version of the Wavelaunch processor by Xilica that allows for new capabilities (not sure of the extent yet).

I believe Whisper XD pricing will be around $19,500, placing it between the Whisper HD ($16,500), and the Helix ($46,000)....

I will be visiting the factory later this month, so I'll get a chance to hear them in person and report back on the forum.

Also, Legacy is now offering wood finishes (natural cherry or rosewood) on the Focus SEs. Previously, they only were available in Black Pearl.

Dmark: Would love to hear your opinion of the new Whisper. You did say you heard most of the lineup, including older Whisper, etc, but it seems you were taken with the Focus. What did you think of the pre-XD Whisper?

Anyone else with impressions of the Focus and Whisper?

It seems that the delicacy of the huge Whisper takes some getting used to, maybe like a gentle giant, as compared to the focus, which bowls you over with sub bass. Just what I'm sensing from reviews. I've asked posters over at agon about highlights at CES/THE, and no one mentioned Legacy. I asked, and got one lukewarm response on the Whisper: good but not great. This poster used to have the Whisper, and moved on to much more expensive Von Schweikert, so not sure how to judge his response.

I heard both the Focus SE and Whisper HD back-to-back in the same room with the same electronics at the RMAF 2009. IMO, the differences are two-fold. First, the Whisper throws a more directional sound field (by design), which creates more precise imaging, but at the expense of soundstage width. Second, the lower midrange and bass of the Whisper is higher resolution, but at the expense of deep bass extension. This is again by design which makes the Whisper easier to integrate into typical rooms than the Focus.

As I own the Focus SE's, I can say they have all the resolution I could ever want and the soundstage width is just right IMO. I do have a smaller room (13' x 16' open), and have found that plugging the ports on the rear of the Focus gives a nicely balanced room response down to below 30 Hz.

Hope this helps!
Matt

If you haven't already, I would consider giving the Salk Sound HT2-TL and HT3's a listen. I have not listened to the Revel's to be able to compare, but at that price point, I would definitely at least consider the Salk's. The customizable finish on the Salk's is top notch.

Jeffkad and mjbuoni:

I would agree with mjbuoni's comments. The Whispers and Focus load the room differently in the bass regions (by design). From my listening auditions, I love both presentations, which are excellent. For my taste, I would add subwoofers to the Whispers in my room for a little more oomph in the nether regions, while I could feel very comfortable listening to the Focus without any subs at all for music. (I know, I couldn't believe it either!)

The Whispers avoid interactions with the side walls, so you can even tuck them back into corners without overloading the room. The soundstage is huge in the sweet spot when they are placed in corners 10 or 12 feet apart, with the listening position also about 10-12 feet away, and angled in. The 4 15" open baffle woofers per side do move alot of air, but they are super quick with zero overhang, which gives the Whisper its tremendous accuracy in the bass. The Whispers reveal everything in the recording with crystal clarity, layered imaging, and tonal accuracy - even in the bass. For example, if you love upright jazz bass, I can't think of a better speaker. I am a drummer and have played many gigs beside bass players. The Whisper nails all the detail and body of an upright bass. Fingerboard sounds, fingers on strings, the woody roundness of the tone - it's all just right, and very natural.

On a side note, because the Whispers are so natural sounding and revealing of the recording, they might come across as "boring" in a show situation. They don't clobber you over the head with "sizzle and boom" - they are subtle and steathly - perfectly capable when the music demands it, but fast and quick, without all the extra resonances that box speakers can exhibit. I can say that the more you listen to the Whispers the more you appreciate them for their neutrality and transparency. If you are used to box speakers, it might be a bit of an adjustment, although it doesn't take long to learn how great these speakers really are. Also, I should mention that the Wavelaunch processor that comes with the system allows alot of flexibility to tailor the sound of the system in your room to your specific tastes. And you can save a bunch of different settings if you want. Bill D. will even help customize them for your room.

The Focus HD and SE models are much more refined than their earlier versions, IMHO. The new silver graphite woofers and ribbon midrange and tweeters are much better. The presentation of the Focus is also big, but weightier than the Whispers, I wrote a bunch about the HD model above, so I won't rehash it here.

I have my plane tickets to Legacy for the last week of Jan, and I will get lots of time to listen to the whole line. I'll post more after that. I'm anxious to see/hear the Focus SEs, and the new Whisper XD. Bill Dudleston tells me that the Whisper XD beefs up the bass with built-in amplification, so it will be interesting to hear how it compares to the HD model and Focus.

DMark1, so what happened with the trip to Legacy? Would love to hear all about your experience and impressions of the Focus and Whisper variants. Please fill us in. Regards...Jeff

Indeed, I would also be very interested in DMark1's impressions of the current Legacy lineup, if he in fact made it to the factory in January as planned.

Still no reply from DMark1? I'm looking to makeover my current home theater setup, and I'm seriously considering using the Studio HD for LCR. Anyone out there heard this speaker that can give some impressions of it? Thanks.

I owned this speaker and later sold to a friend who wanted to build a budget "audiophile" system. IMO, it gives you an impressive slice of the Focus SE in a small and relatively inexpensive package. The plastic perforated grills that were being used (and now replaced I believe) are terrible, reducing the transparency and dispersion. The sound is well balanced with punchy (but not deep) bass, and fairly transparent midrange (not quite as good as the Focus SE) and very clean treble. The sonic signature is a tad bright for my tastes, but the -2dB treble attenuator switch on the back of the speaker tames that nicely.

Thanks for the input.

Hello to everyone who is still watching this thread. My intentions yesterday was to trade my quad 22l2's for a parasound A23 amp at a local hifi shop. Of course they had a A23 amp and parasound P3 pre hooked uo to a pair of Focus HD's and how they say the rest is history. I hate to use this word but, my imo the speakers are awesome. I didn't know speakers can sound so natural. I would hate or love to hear their higher end speakers.

So after serious negotiations with the owner and my wife and a search of Legacy Audio on my wife's phone, I came home with a pair of Focus HD's ( I believe I received a great deal knowing the list price and extra cost for rosewood ). Im not no audiophile or have golden ears. I just love listening to music that makes me feel good inside. I should have never took a music appreciation class as a elective in college ( you would not believe how many old Bugs Bunny cartoons have classical music in it ).

IMO these speakers are not power hungry. Im using an Outlaw 7500 amp and onkyo 885 preamp and a noisey PS3 first generation 80 gb. They need some room to breathe. My room is roughly 20w x 20d x 9h. Only thing I think I need now is their center channel and a good cd transport. I also have a Lg BD 590 that you can rip your cd's to their 250 gb hard drive and use the DAC's in the preamp.

The speakers I've had or still have are AV123 LS'6, rockets 850's, Salk song towers, Monitor Audio GR 20's, SVS mts-01's,Quad 22l2's, and it all started with a pair of DEF tech BP-10's. The Focus HD's outperformed those speakers in every dept. except maybe the LS'6 in bass slam but not controlled bass. Of course, these are just my opinions and I have not cranked up the HD's at all yet and some of the family members are still sleeping ( Teenagers ).

Enough rambling, if you have a chance to listen to some Legacy speakers, do so. I love these ribbon tweeters, smooth, detail and airy. Sorry for all the bad grammer. I'm just an operator at an oil refinery and subjects I liked was math, science, and history.

Later guys and gals

Hi eveyone how much would you say the Focus SE is better that paradigm Signature S8's version 3? as well as there centre channels the marquis vs the C5.

have heard the Sig 8's and love how they sound i am also looking at the new monitor audio gold GX300 once its avaialble to audition.

Also does anyone in the toronto GTA area have the Focus SE that i can audition

anyone

Hi Wasaaaab:

Your best bet might be to call Doug Brown at Legacy (1-800-283-4644), and ask him if he knows of any Focus SE customers in your area, or maybe in the Buffalo, NY area that he could put you in touch with.

I just had a set of rosewood Focus SEs here for a few days, and I can say they are phenomenal sounding and gorgeous speakers. I was able to put about 30 hours on them before I delivered them to Anthony Cordesman for his upcoming review in The Absolute Sound magazine.