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Format Battle General Discussion Thread III: Discuss it here! - Page 2  

post #31 of 4862
I expect cheaper players on both sides, but I'm gonna put my money on HD DVD getting their economy machines months prior to BD. There is nothing I see that tells me BD is going to get their act together in time for cheapo players in 07, but HD DVD still might pull it off because their specs are good-to-go.

If HD DVD pumps out the disks at the levels they are talking about, there will be plenty to buy this fall. More than on BD anyway.

Your more than welcome to tell me I'm FOS, but I assume you wait until early Spring of 08 to do so, because a lot is going to happen (and not happen) by then.
post #32 of 4862
Quote:
Originally Posted by scaesare View Post

Tsk, tsk, tsk. You are putting words in my mouth.

No, I am simply pointing out the fact that certain HD DVD supporters are using this Phase Hydra conspiracy nonsense as an excuse to attack new Blu-ray supporters on this forum. Haven't you noticed the insults that have been made because of that or the conspiracy theories that certain HD DVD supporters have made up?


Quote:
Originally Posted by scaesare View Post

You said that, "'Phase Hydra' was a pure conspiracy theory without a hint of proof".

I made a mistake by not being clear enough with that statement. It is somewhat sad that is the only thing you seem to be interested in from what I have posted.


Quote:
Originally Posted by scaesare View Post

I pointed out that Alex provided exactly such a "hint of proof" that it existed. Which you acknowledge above.

Phase Hydra was the title of a presentation at a BDA meeting. I am trying to explain that to people since many HD DVD supporters believe it to be far more than that. I believe people are best served by accurate information and not mere rumors and conspiracy theories.


Quote:
Originally Posted by scaesare View Post

What it was, or wasn't, an excuse for anybody to do is something I've not addressed at all.

True, though I get the impression that you don't even understand why I am posting against the rumors and conspiracy theories that I see being made about Phase Hydra. I am simply trying to provide a bit of light in the darkness.
post #33 of 4862
Quote:
Originally Posted by nataraj View Post

We have seen dwindling sales of BD movies even as more than a million players are in users hands.

We have also seen sales decrease for HD DVD at times but I don't remember you making a big deal about that when it happens. Sales will fluctuate for both HD formats depending on the releases for that week.


Quote:
Originally Posted by 2Channel View Post

I would say that neither one of us knows for sure what they meant.

paidgeek's explanation sounded logical to me and I don't remember any of the HD DVD insiders trying to refute what he said.


Quote:
Originally Posted by 2Channel View Post

When this information was originally posted, a number of BD supporters posted to say we should expect that both sides are doing viral marketing and this was nothing to get upset over.

That only shows that some posters are far to quick in accepting rumors and conspiracy theories. Personally I try to maintain a certain amount of skepticism since most rumors and conspiracy theories are nothing more than hot air.
post #34 of 4862
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Paul View Post

No, I am simply pointing out the fact that certain HD DVD supporters are using this Phase Hydra conspiracy nonsense as an excuse to attack new Blu-ray supporters on this forum. Haven't you noticed the insults that have been made because of that or the conspiracy theories that certain HD DVD supporters have made up?


I made a mistake by not being clear enough with that statement. It is somewhat sad that is the only thing you seem to be interested in from what I have posted.


Phase Hydra was the title of a presentation at a BDA meeting. I am trying to explain that to people since many HD DVD supporters believe it to be far more than that. I believe people are best served by accurate information and not mere rumors and conspiracy theories.


True, though I get the impression that you don't even understand why I am posting against the rumors and conspiracy theories that I see being made about Phase Hydra. I am simply trying to provide a bit of light in the darkness.

Just striving for accuracy. There seems to be a lot of "remembering thru blu rose-colored glasses" going on these days.

We've cleared up what was actually posted. Let's move on.
post #35 of 4862
Thread Starter 
I think we have had enough of your bickering: take it off AVS or face mod action
post #36 of 4862
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Paul View Post

We have also seen sales decrease for HD DVD at times but I don't remember you making a big deal about that when it happens. Sales will fluctuate for both HD formats depending on the releases for that week.

We have a whole thread for that.

The question is how is BD ever going to come out of this low stagnation ? Atleast HD DVD's strategy is inexpensive players - they are even taking off $100 of already low prices with more inexpensive players on the way - whether it works or not is a different matter - atleast they are trying.
post #37 of 4862
Quote:
Originally Posted by nataraj View Post

The question is how is BD ever going to come out of this low stagnation ? Atleast HD DVD's strategy is inexpensive players - they are even taking off $100 of already low prices with more inexpensive players on the way - whether it works or not is a different matter - atleast they are trying.

Trying... rhymes with dying.

As far as Blu-ray, the strategy appears to be ever increasing advertising and ubiquitous displays at the major B&M's pushing adoption of the format, periodic big blockbusters released leveraging their superior studio support, slowly bringing down player pricing per generation and various aesthetic and performance selections leveraging their superior CE support, and of course, the 3 million and growing base of PS3 owners.

Off hand, I'd say the rate of adoption for each appears pretty rapid to me. Even if it's not up to par with DVD, which could be seen as very atypical in it's rapid adoption (which didn't really happen until 99-00 anyways).
post #38 of 4862
Quote:
Originally Posted by nataraj View Post

We have a whole thread for that.

The question is how is BD ever going to come out of this low stagnation ? Atleast HD DVD's strategy is inexpensive players - they are even taking off $100 of already low prices with more inexpensive players on the way - whether it works or not is a different matter - atleast they are trying.


How do we know it's not working? I haven't seem much data since they really knocked down pricing.

The problem with either format (which everybody forgets) is that it's not like DVD where everyone had a TV which could show off the advanced quality, and the convenience factor is no different than SD.
post #39 of 4862
What troubles me is that many discs and players of both formats are not "all they could be" in that advanced codecs are missing and/or native 24p is not there (or is problematic).
post #40 of 4862
Quote:
Originally Posted by UxiSXRD View Post

Trying... rhymes with dying.

Didn't read the rest of your "logic" ...
post #41 of 4862
Quote:
Originally Posted by Timothy Ramzyk View Post

How do we know it's not working? I haven't seem much data since they really knocked down pricing.

Well, it's only been three or four days, hasn't it?
post #42 of 4862
Quote:
Originally Posted by Adam Tyner View Post

Well, it's only been three or four days, hasn't it?

I don't know, I bought in the wave of price-cuts prior to this, and I never saw numbers on those either. Someone may have posted them, but I suspect they were buried in the Nielson thread, which can be really, really tedious to wade through.
post #43 of 4862
Quote:
Originally Posted by pepar View Post

What troubles me is that many discs and players of both formats are not "all they could be" in that advanced codecs are missing and/or native 24p is not there (or is problematic).

Both are new, and very complex, formats -- what did you expect? It took ~2 years to get the first HDTVs working due to software issues. DVD was wobbly for ~3 years before it finally settled down and became stable.
post #44 of 4862
I see Sony is at least taking up the sword of PS3 SD upscaling again. I always thought it was a little mercenary for them not to include that feature, as it seemed like a little too much of an arm-twist to go BD and BD only. So, good for you PS3 owners.

Now if we can get Toshiba to put PAL capability in, I'd be a happy clam. Anything that lets me pull one more player out of my stack.
post #45 of 4862
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Paul View Post

No, I am simply pointing out the fact that certain HD DVD supporters are using this Phase Hydra conspiracy nonsense as an excuse to attack new Blu-ray supporters on this forum. Haven't you noticed the insults that have been made because of that or the conspiracy theories that certain HD DVD supporters have made up?

You did point out a name I did call someone on this board. I apologized in the next post after hearing his side. I admit that I jumped the gun there. What also should be said is that he was outright wrong in his statement about Disney abstaining from the vote when it has been said by the insiders as otherwise. I work for Disney (contracted) and knew what he was saying wasn't correct. I won't go into further details as everyone can read the thread if they want to know more.

But with someone with such few posts, also being a new member to this forum when I have been one for several years, and he fed a complete lie to us I got upset and said something I probably shouldn't.

Again I apologize.
post #46 of 4862
Quote:
Originally Posted by pepar View Post

What troubles me is that many discs and players of both formats are not "all they could be" in that advanced codecs are missing and/or native 24p is not there (or is problematic).

Few will agree, but I think there comes a time when it's a good idea to content oneself with what we have (I don't mean bugs). HDM looks and sounds pretty great, and usually it's the studios that dropping the ball on the software that puts something iffy up on our screens.
post #47 of 4862
Quote:
Originally Posted by kjack View Post

Both are new, and very complex, formats -- what did you expect? It took ~2 years to get the first HDTVs working due to software issues. DVD was wobbly for ~3 years before it finally settled down and became stable.

What I expected was to not buy Fifth Element two (or three) times again for this next round of content delivery!
post #48 of 4862
Quote:
Originally Posted by Timothy Ramzyk View Post

Few will agree, but I think there comes a time when it's a good idea to content oneself with what we have (I don't mean bugs). HDM looks and sounds pretty great, and usually it's the studios that dropping the ball on the software that puts something iffy up on our screens.

I am content with what I have. I have hi-def cable, subs to HBO, SHO, MAX and Starz and a DVR with a whopping external hard drive. (And a very good upscaling DVD player.) And DVD-A. I am content to wait for everything to be sorted out with the Next Great Thing with respect to codecs and features on both the discs and the players.
post #49 of 4862
Quote:
Originally Posted by pepar View Post

I am content with what I have. I have hi-def cable, subs to HBO, SHO, MAX and Starz and a DVR with a whopping external hard drive. (And a very good upscaling DVD player.) And DVD-A. I am content to wait for everything to be sorted out with the Next Great Thing with respect to codecs and features on both the discs and the players.

Nooo! You must join now. Gooble-gobble, gooble-gobble one of us, one of us!
post #50 of 4862
Quote:
Originally Posted by Timothy Ramzyk View Post

Nooo! You must join now. Gooble-gobble, gooble-gobble one of us, one of us!

When the fanboys move on, then I'll know it's time to partake.
post #51 of 4862
Quote:
Originally Posted by pepar View Post

When the fanboys move on, then I'll know it's time to partake.


Bah! This whole forum is fanboys calling fanboys, fanboys. I surprised the word has any weight left at all to it.
post #52 of 4862
Quote:
Originally Posted by Timothy Ramzyk View Post

Bah! This whole forum is fanboys calling fanboys, fanboys. I surprised the word has any weight left at all to it.

Well, pick whatever metaphor, analogy or term of endearment you choose. I buy no format before its/it's time.
post #53 of 4862
Quote:
Originally Posted by nataraj View Post

We have a whole thread for that.

The question is how is BD ever going to come out of this low stagnation ? Atleast HD DVD's strategy is inexpensive players - they are even taking off $100 of already low prices with more inexpensive players on the way - whether it works or not is a different matter - atleast they are trying.

Yep. A desperate strategy by Toshiba trying to hang on to their precious royalty income while being supported by Microsoft, alienating the rest of the CE industry (sans the chinese players) in the process. Could also backfire. We'll see.

How will BD come out on top? Better and more titles? (Please, don't quote the 800 number again...) Lower (but not as low) player pricing. Better PS3 sales once big titles hit, which will increase movie sales (yes yes, not by much). More marketing (from both sides) increasing awareness of HD.

By far the best card is MORE BIG MOVIES. Sorry, but Universal exclusivity is no match for Sony, Fox and Disney. This fall will make that painfully obvious, and contrary to what most HD fans seem to believe, people will notice.
post #54 of 4862
Quote:
Originally Posted by nilsp View Post

How will BD come out on top? Better and more titles? (Please, don't quote the 800 number again...) Lower (but not as low) player pricing. Better PS3 sales once big titles hit, which will increase movie sales (yes yes, not by much). More marketing (from both sides) increasing awareness of HD.


All HD DVD has to do is keep selling players, which it is. I'm not saying BD is going anywhere, but HD DVD surviving even flourishing, just requires that it turn a profit for it's investors. If it does that, it will also attract new investors.

That includes BD supporters who don't see the point in sitting out HD DVD when it's not going anywhere and the players are $200. If there's ten titles you want on HD DVD by the end of the year, it justifies owning both.

If BD goes under $300, and gets all their ducks in a row in 08, I'm not going to be so stubborn that I won't pick up a player.
post #55 of 4862
People buying those players are going to peeved when BB, Target, and the like stop stocking HDDVD and they have to go online.
post #56 of 4862
Quote:
Originally Posted by UxiSXRD View Post

People buying those players are going to peeved when BB, Target, and the like stop stocking HDDVD and they have to go online.

Do you have some insider info I'm not privy to or just anecdotal FUD?
post #57 of 4862
Quote:
Originally Posted by UxiSXRD View Post

People buying those players are going to peeved when BB, Target, and the like stop stocking HDDVD and they have to go online.

... clearly this is your opinion, and you've stated it over and over and over ... but I don't believe I've seen a single press release to this effect.

What I have seen is HD DVD displays becoming more pronounced in stores like CC and BB though ... which is the complete opposite of what you're trying to suggest. *shrug*
post #58 of 4862
Quote:
Originally Posted by nilsp View Post

Yep. A desperate strategy by Toshiba trying to hang on to their precious royalty income while being supported by Microsoft, alienating the rest of the CE industry (sans the chinese players) in the process. Could also backfire. We'll see.

How will BD come out on top? Better and more titles? (Please, don't quote the 800 number again...) Lower (but not as low) player pricing. Better PS3 sales once big titles hit, which will increase movie sales (yes yes, not by much). More marketing (from both sides) increasing awareness of HD.

By far the best card is MORE BIG MOVIES. Sorry, but Universal exclusivity is no match for Sony, Fox and Disney. This fall will make that painfully obvious, and contrary to what most HD fans seem to believe, people will notice.

But Sony is the only one releasing movies ... Disney and Fox just say they're going to, and then delay the releases due to [insert speculation here].
post #59 of 4862
Perhaps you missed the new about these recent Pirates movies?

I am neither spreading FUD nor baiting flames. If you think the B&M retailers want to keep stocking both formats (including the same titles for the neutrals), that's your perogative, of course, but then we'll have to agree to disagree on that, I suppose.
post #60 of 4862
Quote:
Originally Posted by Timothy Ramzyk View Post

Bah! This whole forum is fanboys calling fanboys, fanboys. I surprised the word has any weight left at all to it.

It doesn't. Thats why we've seen an increase in the number of people calling each other shills/puppets etc.
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AVS › AVS Forum › Blu-ray & HD DVD › HDTV Software Media Discussion › Format Battle General Discussion Thread III: Discuss it here!