The Official Pioneer 8G KURO Owner's Discussions Thread - Page 364

i would agree that it is a worthwhile tool... what irks me about it is that people take it as the be-all, end-all measurement of performance...

there are many who reference the results of these tests without also taking into account that in the great majority of real world viewing situations, they don't matter a whole lot...

i agree there needs to be an objective basis for results... but that objective basis needs to be understood for what it is...

Have you tried it with text optimization "on"?

I agree about the odd cadences. Neither the Reon, Kuro, nor the Gennum VXP do well on them. Maybe the full Teranex solution does.

Agree, for the most part. Multiple small differences can be cumulative though and can end up making a practical difference. For example, I think the excellent SD performance of the Kuro is at least in part validated by the excellent 480i video deinterlacing evident on the HQV test disc. The Kuro also does very well in the SD noise reduction tests.

Does the speed at which the Kuro picks up the 3:2 film cadence make any real difference? Probably not as long as it doesn't lose the lock frequently.

yea i agree with you on that...

common ground. i like it.

1st time post on this thread--I'm in the market for a 50 inch HD plasma and have reduced my choices to the Panasonic 50PZ700U and the Pioneer models 5080 and 5010 with all 3 being offered a great prices by Invision . I went to a local Magnolia HiFi and a salesman showed me all 3 products but the Pioneers weren't hooked up for sound. When I mentioned this forum and complaints about audible buzz with the Pioneers he responded with how this forum was just filled with negative people and whiners. Also he stated that the people who complained about the buzz probably worked for Sony or Panasonic. He claimed he had never had a customer complain about the buzz and told me to stand in front of the Pioneers and listen for a buzz. When I mentioned that the models weren't hooked up for sound, He said it shouldn't matter. He made the statement that all Plasmas buzzed a little. I had to tell him that my 3 year old Panasonic plasma didn't buzz. I have to admit that the Pioneer pictures are better than the Panasonic but this whole thing about audible buzz has me leaning towards the Panasonic model which is a shame since I really like the Pioneer. Why can't tv decisions be easy?

well, if you end up buying locally from magnolia you can return/exchange the set if the buzz is a problem. by the way, if you go for the pioneer, will it be the 5080 or 5010?

BUZZ? I have the 150FD, No buzz, no problems at all. I have been told the same thing by Magnolia Hifi, which I would have to agree on some part. Most of the things you will hear form the forum, are either isolated situations that don't apply to everyone. There is no mass produced product that has walked of the assembly line and not have had 10% or more of its inventory have some sort of problem. If you happen to have a buzzing model, does not mean that that maker makes inferior products. Some buzzing could be caused by not having sufficient voltage current, or other things not even related to the TV. In the end, what you want to do is know how well the customer service background of that tv set is.

Example I bought a Hitachi 50v500 back a few years ago. They have been doomed by a pink blob after so many hours. Mine took over two years to appear. I made a quick call to Hitachi, explained to them the situation. All they asked for was model number, serial number, address, and in 1 week I had a new Light Engine.

So now I know pioneer has pretty good customer service, so In my books, if I ever had problems with their t.v such as a buzz - as long as they take care of me, I would go for their tv being that it's hands down one of the best tv's to get to date.

Very interesting thread folks. Thanks for the comments.

I too am now in the market for the PDP-5080 now that the price point seems to be lowering within my budget.

I would like to know where I can dl a copy of the user manual for the 5080? (Unfortunately, I think I need to be a registered owner of a Pioneer product to dl the manual from their site)

Thanks for any help.

This link should work for you; it did for me when I dl'd a copy before my 5080arrived and I registered on the Pioneer site:

http://www.manualnguide.com/download...rs-manual.html

Pedro2,
I'm leaning toward the 5010 because of the 1080p. I know I may not need it since we sit approximately 12 ft from the screen but it seems to be the latest hot feature and I want to be "future protected" for upcoming technology ie. blur ray, etc. What is frustrating is that Invision is offering a great deal on 5010 compared to Magnolia HiFi but this buzzing issue makes me lean toward a local dealer for buzz problems. Of course a $900 difference between an internet price vs. local dealer is making it a tough decision. Damn this buzz issue!

totally a newbie!

till now, have been using Sony Wega 27" and now going for a huge jump to 150. i have a few questions. i have read pages 1 thru 160 and 300 thru last but couldn't find the info i am looking for. i may sound stupid ....so feel free to laugh if you want to.

1. what exactly break-in is?
2. why it is so important to do break-in settings?
3. why do we need to make a break-in dvd?
4. why it is not mentioned by pioneer in the manual that its important to run break-in dvd for 150 hours, etc...
5. i have already order 150 in edmonton, canada ($8,500 incl gst), and will be good if someone could refer to any link/url or tell me what exactly do i need to do before it got delivered.

many thanks

First run on new 6010FD today watched Rose Bowl using D-Nice's reference settings after putting about 25 hours on the break-in dvd (using post #1 settings). Have to say the picture is pretty damn good though B.Megaburger looked like he was pasted on the screen, his outline was horrible i trust that is due to the reference break-in settings?

Some of the field close-up shots were incredible, I haven't seen anyone comment on the heat these panels put out through the screen. It's like waking passed the oven in the kitchen, this characteristic is going suck during the summer (live in AZ).

-Geiger Counter

from 12 feet most people would not be able to tell the difference between the 5010 and 5080 in terms of the resolution. Try it out yourself with a measuring tape. The price difference between the two is not unsubstantial...

That is a terrific link. Thanks a bunch.

ps.. howya liking yer 5080 so far?

Saw this somewhere searching the net:

"Anyway, first one, a little buzzing at first, went away unless you put your ear about 6 inches from the back.

Second one, louder buzzing at first, bummed me out.... but has gone away as well.

I mentioned this to the tech guy at Pioneer and he said it's totally normal, the transformer windings bed in and it goes away - and he was right.

So, be patient and it will go away or much much much lower after say 50 hours of watching.

Great tv "


Is this true? Do buzzing kuro's become more silent after a break in period? Anyone notice a reduction in buzzing after 50-100-200-500 hours of use?

you're right about the picture looking the same for both models at that distance. I'm probably just convinced that I need 1080p. I have a panny ED plasma now and I convinced myself that I didn't need 720p at that time because of price. Don't get me wrong-the picture still looks good at our viewing distance but I guess I want to stay up with technology this time. You are very right about the cost difference. In fact I had a salesman ask why I didn't just go for the Panny 58pz700u for the same price as the 5010. Something I'm also considering. Deep down I think the buzzing issue may push me to Panny. No buzzing issue=pioneer plasma

Happy New Year to all.

I am probable going to upgrading my 5010fd to a Elite 150fd. The reason i would do this is because of the size. I would sit about 7.5/8 feet away. The room size is small about 10x12 and 10 feet ceiling. Do you think room is big enough for the150fd and added heat? Also would i loose some detail because of the bigger screen size and same pixel count as the 5010fd. From all that i have read here there is a big difference in viewing enjoyment with the bigger 60. I do not care much about the Elite and non Elite because i use a Lumagen S/P in the loop. But what hay i would still go for the Elite this time around .

Thanks.

btw. i will be selling the 5010fd ISF (used D-nice break in dvd for about 225 hours before use) Calibrated by doug@clearlyresolved.com and a Samsung BD-P1400 (latest firmware).
for One Thousand under what it would cost new after discount and get the ISF calibration for free. The only thing, you would have to pick it up from my home, 20miles northwest of Chicago, IL. However i still have the box.

Happy New Year to All,

What is a break in DVD?

thanks

Just to clarify: with the Elites one can make many adjustments *oneself* in the user's menu - i.e. adjustments that you cannot make with a non-Elite. That -and Pure mode - made getting an Elite important to me. I agree with Russ that you'll get a great picture with the 6010; I also think you'll get a better one with the 150 - and without having to necessarily get it professionally calibrated.

Here's what I posted last night in the "OK! Your Plasma! You Tell Me! Got a new one? post it here" 10 question thread:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...3#post12652733

Dang, very tempting...

I heard the same thing from the Best Buy guys. "The avsforum is filled with complainers" and other comments along those lines. I think this is probably true in some cases. There's no such thing as an internet forum that has no extreme posters on it. Then again, most of the guys at the Magnolia store didn't know what I was talking about with respect to the break-in disc.

***

If you're in the market for a television that costs more than $1000.00, you're probably going to research it carefully. I'm dropping close to $6000 on the 110 after owning the 1150. Why? The difference is worth it to me. Why do I keep sending back 110s? Because the difference is worth it to me. I'd have a silent Kuro panel so it's extremely difficult for me to accept one that isn't.

Why do I and others post about our troubling experiences? To find out if there are other people who share our experiences and to give prospective owners a heads-up.

Here's where I'm at.

1. I love the Pioneer Kuro line. It is the state of the art. I'm thrilled by what I've seen on my first 1150 and then even moreso my first 110. But that 110 buzzed too loudly during quiet scenes in movies. My second 110 (currently installed) is worse in that it not only buzzes audibly from 10 feet away during not so quiet scenes, it also exhibits the streaking issue.

2. The buzzing thing is not a trivial issue. I've spent nearly two hundred dollars on return/exchanges because of the buzz issue with the 110. My 1150 was inaudible from my listening position; it buzzed, but not in a way that was detectable unless I was very close to the panel or had my head behind it. My first 110 was quieter, noticeably, than my second. I'm still well within my return period thanks to Best Buy's extension to the end of January for product returns/exchanges. I'm sure some online vendors would be better than others about arranging for exchanges, but I'm still glad I went with a B&M for this big purchase.

3. My third 110 is on the way. I consider this tv to be worth the inconvenience and additional expense that it's apparently going to take to secure a model that performs as it should.

I hope that posting about this issue is helpful to people. I'm sorry if it bothers others. Honestly, I don't understand why it would bother owners of kuros that don't buzz.

btw, HAPPY NEW YEAR!

Thanks again for the reply.

After a day of the Incredibles the pixel remains "dead" (it will show red, but not green or blue).

I've been using one of D-Nice's post-break-in settings for this. If I remember correctly, +34 contrast and 0 brightness in movie mode. Have people had more success curing bad pixels by increasing those values? I'm a little reticent to bump them up during the break-in period with something other than the break-in DVD, but I'm willing to give it a try if there's reason to believe it will succeed.

I have been using zoom mode to make sure that the entire screen is filled, for exactly the reasons you outline.

On the bright side, I'm still amazed by the picture clarity of the TV, particularly when I can stop myself from looking for the dead pixel.

Mitch

Just got our 6010 a few days ago; I've seen NiceD's recommended settings, but since I've got an "infinitely adjustable" Denon 3910 DVD player, its settings can/will interact with the Pio's.

So, does anyone else have a 3910/6010 combo? How've you configured each unit's settings?


Thanx,
Craig

The buzz issue is getting way overblown at this point, IMO.

"The buzz issue is getting way overblown at this point, IMO."

If the buzzing really is as big a problem as made out on this forum, then Pioneer and others are essentially selling a defective product. I think many of these buzzing issues have little to do with the panel and more to do with spinning discs in the players, fans from amps, etc. I thought I had a really annoying buzz in my 6010 until I realized that was the sound of the blu-ray player spinning just below the panel. I have a small New York apartment that is sound-proofed so every little noise coming from within is more audible than it would be in a larger and noiser space.

I really have no explanation for the wildly-divergent experiences reported on this forum concerning buzzing from the Kuro panels. I can't believe there's that much variation in manufacturing to account for the differences. I think all plasmas emit some amount of "buzzing" and larger panels likely emit more. I think the problem is inherent in people's subjective views of what is "loud," "moderate," "quiet," "annoying," etc.

You'll have to experiment, I haven't had anything with a Realta chip here while the 150FD has been here and I've never used the FHD-1.

Don't forget the "other" category - no buzzing heard.

"Don't forget the "other" category - no buzzing heard."

I think that is also subjective. What is "buzzing"? I don't believe a 50+ inch plasma panel can be produced that produces zero db of any kind of sound. So if indeed there are owners hearing literally NO SOUND OF ANY KIND coming from their Kuros, I have no explanation other than that they have difficulty hearing that frequency or other noises from other equipment drown it out.

Quite likely. I suspect sample variations and subjective views of what is acceptable account for all of it. Mine has it, but it's not an issue unless it gets worse. It's definitely not from any other component and is clearly coming from the panel itself. It is very directional; you have to be dead center in the middle of the screen to hear it. Even a little off-angle and you can't. A set volume of more than 10 or so drowns it out. You'd have to be pretty sensitive to find it annoying, and even then only when the house is otherwise very quiet during a low volume segment of a show or movie.