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The Fifth Element REMASTERED edition*PIX* + review - Page 15

post #421 of 600
Got mine yesterday from Amazon and watched 1/2 of last night (I getup to early to stay up to watch a movie during the night)..but my oh my..what an improvement the made and the audio was the best of any of the previous SD releases...amazing..
post #422 of 600
Quote:
Originally Posted by richlo View Post

Got mine yesterday from Amazon and watched 1/2 of last night (I getup to early to stay up to watch a movie during the night)..but my oh my..what an improvement the made and the audio was the best of any of the previous SD releases...amazing..

I got through about 60%, so there.

Anyways, I never saw the original version to compare, but this one definitely looked fantastic.
post #423 of 600
I think, we are all for replacement wont have luxury to compare both.
post #424 of 600
I'm sure someone has asked this, but how can I get my new copy without paying for it? You know, switching it with Sony?
post #425 of 600
Quote:
Originally Posted by BoSoxMole View Post

I'm sure someone has asked this, but how can I get my new copy without paying for it?

Shoplift.
post #426 of 600
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steeb View Post

Shoplift.

funny guy
post #427 of 600
Has anyone recieved there replacment copy yet from Sony? I sent mine off 2 weeks ago and still nothing returned to me........
post #428 of 600
Quote:
Originally Posted by BLK 04 View Post

Has anyone recieved there replacment copy yet from Sony? I sent mine off 2 weeks ago and still nothing returned to me........

How do I do this?
post #429 of 600
Finally found a remastered copy today.
post #430 of 600
Man, if y'all has just ordered from Amazon you'd have had it already!
And cheap!

post #431 of 600
Can't wait to ge this one..
post #432 of 600
Did they remaster Guardian also or has it always been avc mpeg4?
post #433 of 600
What's the context of that pic? A blurry picture taken with a possibly crappy camera of a potentially crappy video setup is pretty iffy. Maybe Xylon can post the actual frame for detailed analysis and arguement.
post #434 of 600
And some of the blue-screen work can produce halo's as well.. It is possible that EE was applied to some Special effects shots since they can look more blurry than the rest of the film. I'll have the film this week hopefully and be able to compare with all the versions with a G2G with other AVS'ers...
post #435 of 600
Also, HD-TV's often has a lot of fancy filtering/processing turned on by default (like XD-engine, TrueMotion and all sorts of fancy names) It's emperative that ALL such processing is turned OFF and that the TV is properly calibrated. (such processing can cause a hole lot of troubles like contrast-boosting which crushes blacks and whites, grain-"smoothing" which destroys detail, sharpening filters which adds halos like EE etc, etc.)
You also have to remember that the digital camera taking the picture, most likely has a lot of default processing chips, "fixing" (read: screwing up) the picture. So a digital camera photo of a TV or projection is highly ureliable, almost useless to discuss.

However, I got my remastered Blu-Ray today and decided to look at it on my properly calibrated 47" LG 47LB2 TV. I stuck my face as close to the screen as I could get it to look for any EE. Iv'e only watched the first 15 minutes now. And the first ten minutes was surely beautifull. I found no signs of EE whatsoever, if there were any it must have been so minimal that I couldn't tell. I was beginning to believe that the reports of EE was just a bunch of BS. I was wrong tough, at 11:56 when the space ship leaves the earth anno 1913, you can see excessive EE causing halos on the outline of the alien ship. That makes me believe that only SOME scenes, possibly scenes containing matte compositions/Special Effects, have been "beefed up" with EE. I do not know if this is innherent in the old digital special effects shots or if the EE has been added in the encoding phase of the new remaster.
Update: I just checked my Superbit DVD, it has the exact same overblown EE halos at 11:56. That might indicate that the EE in some of the Special Effects shots was added digital back in the day (1995), and transferred to 35mm. i.e. the EE is in the print itself, and that the BR and Superbit DVD for that matter just shows us what is there, no more no less.
Regardless, it's a beautifull Blu-Ray and I'm glad I bought it



Btw, this also shows the danger of using EE in effect shots which is transferred to film, because the damage is done and cannot be reversed. In a matter of fact I don't think EE should be used at all EVER. The dangerous thing, is making digital masters for future storing with EE. Take for example the digital master of Akira made a couple of years ago. They cleaned it up and made a digital master scanned from the 70mm frames. They added a LOT of EE, so the master is totally useless... Both the restored japanese and US DVDs looked horrible. I hope they make a new digital scan for the BR release, but I wouldn't hold my breath. The creation of the previous "future-proof" digital master cost a lot of money. So if any studio-people are reading this; if you're going to make 4k digital masters for future use/storing. Do NOT apply EE or any other post-filtering crap. Just scan the negatives and that's it! Make a color-corrected/contrast corrected version, but keep the untouched orignal scanned master for storing. Just in case, you know color corrections aren't always done correctly. (Remember Warner got a lot of critisism over the differnt color timings on "The Searchers" and "Rio Bravo" to mention a few)
post #436 of 600
Very interesting post Kishiro!
post #437 of 600
Quote:
Originally Posted by BoSoxMole View Post

How do I do this?

Quote:
Originally Posted by LKM466 View Post

Would you or anyone here be so kind to educate us on how to get the remastered version as a free replacement from Sony? I have not even opened my original BD version yet. Thanks in advance.


You will first of all send an email to Consumer@SPHECustomerSupport.Sony.com

You should receive an email with the following information:

Dear Valued Consumer,

Thank you for your e-mail. We appreciate your interest in Sony Pictures Home Entertainment products.

To receive an exchange for your Fifth Element Blu Ray disc, please return your disc (case not needed) to the following address:

SPHE Consumer Support
PO Box 157
Neenah, WI 54957
Attn: ###### <---- will be specific for you

Please be sure to include your return address (no PO Boxes) and a copy of this email. Your replacement will be shipped to you via Fed Ex Ground. The disc will be sent out after July 17th.

Regards,

SPHE Consumer Affairs Team
post #438 of 600
the old way of doing special effects did create outlines. usually it is not as apparent over black backgrounds as trying to do something like light gray over white. so it's possible it is just that. then again, it very well may plain old EE.

also should note, that sharpening can also be done without producing much in the way of halos, so even if a title has no halos it could potentially have had muh sharpening applied anyway. also with some techniques you could even get a darker outline rather than the whiter standard halo.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kishiro View Post

Also, HD-TV's often has a lot of fancy filtering/processing turned on by default (like XD-engine, TrueMotion and all sorts of fancy names) It's emperative that ALL such processing is turned OFF and that the TV is properly calibrated. (such processing can cause a hole lot of troubles like contrast-boosting which crushes blacks and whites, grain-"smoothing" which destroys detail, sharpening filters which adds halos like EE etc, etc.)
You also have to remember that the digital camera taking the picture, most likely has a lot of default processing chips, "fixing" (read: screwing up) the picture. So a digital camera photo of a TV or projection is highly ureliable, almost useless to discuss.

However, I got my remastered Blu-Ray today and decided to look at it on my properly calibrated 47" LG 47LB2 TV. I stuck my face as close to the screen as I could get it to look for any EE. Iv'e only watched the first 15 minutes now. And the first ten minutes was surely beautifull. I found no signs of EE whatsoever, if there were any it must have been so minimal that I couldn't tell. I was beginning to believe that the reports of EE was just a bunch of BS. I was wrong tough, at 11:56 when the space ship leaves the earth anno 1913, you can see excessive EE causing halos on the outline of the alien ship. That makes me believe that only SOME scenes, possibly scenes containing matte compositions/Special Effects, have been "beefed up" with EE. I do not know if this is innherent in the old digital special effects shots or if the EE has been added in the encoding phase of the new remaster.
Update: I just checked my Superbit DVD, it has the exact same overblown EE halos at 11:56. That might indicate that the EE in some of the Special Effects shots was added digital back in the day (1995), and transferred to 35mm. i.e. the EE is in the print itself, and that the BR and Superbit DVD for that matter just shows us what is there, no more no less.
Regardless, it's a beautifull Blu-Ray and I'm glad I bought it



Btw, this also shows the danger of using EE in effect shots which is transferred to film, because the damage is done and cannot be reversed. In a matter of fact I don't think EE should be used at all EVER. The dangerous thing, is making digital masters for future storing with EE. Take for example the digital master of Akira made a couple of years ago. They cleaned it up and made a digital master scanned from the 70mm frames. They added a LOT of EE, so the master is totally useless... Both the restored japanese and US DVDs looked horrible. I hope they make a new digital scan for the BR release, but I wouldn't hold my breath. The creation of the previous "future-proof" digital master cost a lot of money. So if any studio-people are reading this; if you're going to make 4k digital masters for future use/storing. Do NOT apply EE or any other post-filtering crap. Just scan the negatives and that's it! Make a color-corrected/contrast corrected version, but keep the untouched orignal scanned master for storing. Just in case, you know color corrections aren't always done correctly. (Remember Warner got a lot of critisism over the differnt color timings on "The Searchers" and "Rio Bravo" to mention a few)
post #439 of 600
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kishiro View Post

Btw, this also shows the danger of using EE in effect shots which is transferred to film, because the damage is done and cannot be reversed. In a matter of fact I don't think EE should be used at all EVER. The dangerous thing, is making digital masters for future storing with EE. Take for example the digital master of Akira made a couple of years ago. They cleaned it up and made a digital master scanned from the 70mm frames. They added a LOT of EE, so the master is totally useless... Both the restored japanese and US DVDs looked horrible. I hope they make a new digital scan for the BR release, but I wouldn't hold my breath. The creation of the previous "future-proof" digital master cost a lot of money. So if any studio-people are reading this; if you're going to make 4k digital masters for future use/storing. Do NOT apply EE or any other post-filtering crap. Just scan the negatives and that's it! Make a color-corrected/contrast corrected version, but keep the untouched orignal scanned master for storing. Just in case, you know color corrections aren't always done correctly. (Remember Warner got a lot of critisism over the differnt color timings on "The Searchers" and "Rio Bravo" to mention a few)

good advice. also for digital photography. they are always coming up with better RAW processing, etc. always store the original as close to RAW as possible, in addition to best current attempt at full post-processing.
post #440 of 600
I was happy with it... I am glad they rereleased it and in a timely manner...
post #441 of 600
that pic. above looks like good old EE to me. Is it possible the reviewer had his sharpness cranked creating a false "halo"...? Maybe.
But several others have already chimed in including Bjoern that there is noticeable EE.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bjoern Roy View Post

Huh? Looking at the reconstruction above you can see that they further enhanced the hell out at least some of the scenes, leading to horribly pronouced grain and mighty halos. The halos ARE a direct result of the sharpening here.

Some other shots look like they do indeed show a bit more real detail. Why didn't they just leave the soft shots alone.

So they trade everyones soft, reasonably non-edgy, compression artefact ladden copy of TFE with an artifically grainy, real edgy version which is at least good from the compression side. Hooray!

The problem is the transfer. My hope would have been a new state-of-the-art transfer. Oh well.


from avforum's review...


highdefdigest...


"Are there any problems? Sure. The biggest issue is that there is some noticeable edge enhancement applied. It's certainly not the worst I've seen, but in an apparent effort to boost sharpness, some slight halos are clearly visible, and grain can be exacerbated as a result. Is this fatal? Not at all, but it does knock the video down a half-peg."


While I'm not saying that this transfer isn't clearly better than the old, it's a shame about the EE. My copy is on it's way.


From avforum's review...

"There is some edge enhancement, though, that is more obvious in some shots than others. It poses no major detraction from the clarity of the image but it would have been nicer if they could have eliminated it altogether..."


Just because this is an improvement doesn't mean we can't still critique the new transfer. I know that many don't notice EE or it doesn't bother them.
Many people I know also can't tell if an instrument is out of tune (including some musicians I know!) But, some of us do notice and are bothered by EE is all.
Once again, maybe it's not the new transfer. I will check this week...

post #442 of 600
I'm new to Blu-ray and originally hadn't planned on double-dipping any titles that I have on DVD, only some favorites that are LDs. The Super Bit version of The Fifth Element looks pretty darn good. How much better is the B-d re-release?
post #443 of 600
IIRC, paidgeek stated the previous version of TFE was transferred using a flying scanner (most likely a Rank Cintel). He did not say what was used for the latest version but most likely it is CCD based telecine. Even with a high count CCD the need still exist to adjust for Aperture Correction for the best Modulation Transfer Function (MTF). This adjustment can produce an effect that looks similar to EE.

To little correction results in a Softer Image, too much correction results in a Harsh look. As in most things there are many Tradeoffs one has to make. Then add in personal preferences and you will always have a mixed bag on the final results. I preferred a picture on the soft side because it had less noise. The other video people accepted the noise because they liked a Sharper picture.
post #444 of 600
Quote:
Originally Posted by joerod View Post

I was happy with it... I am glad they rereleased it and in a timely manner...

Same here. Watched it last night... not perfect but still great PQ and AQ!
post #445 of 600
Quote:
Originally Posted by OldCodger73 View Post

I'm new to Blu-ray and originally hadn't planned on double-dipping any titles that I have on DVD, only some favorites that are LDs. The Super Bit version of The Fifth Element looks pretty darn good. How much better is the B-d re-release?

Page 12 Post #337
post #446 of 600
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Mack View Post


"Are there any problems? Sure. The biggest issue is that there is some noticeable edge enhancement applied. It's certainly not the worst I've seen, but in an apparent effort to boost sharpness, some slight halos are clearly visible, and grain can be exacerbated as a result.

That alone will kill this re-release for many who won't tolerate any edge enhancement. Too bad.
post #447 of 600
There's been 5 direct captures so far in this thread. 1 shows some EE, 1 shows possible EE, and the rest are EE free. I await a capture that shows obvious halos.
post #448 of 600
just saw it, much better than original but not a top tier release.
post #449 of 600
"I was happy with it... I am glad they rereleased it and in a timely manner... "

You must be joking? A YEAR later we finally get what should have been put forth from day one. Come on. I was just at WM and they had the 2006 version.

Another way to tell the difference I think is the copyright date.
Old=2006
New=2007

Let the double dipping begin.

From Both BD and HD-DVD Studio's: "Im sorry for such a crappy initial release, but here we have a better transfer for just 29.99 you can buy. We thought we could pull a fast one on you consumers, you would never notice the difference and should just be happy we offered you anything in HD........"
post #450 of 600
My copy finally shipped from Amazon today. Looking forward to watching this tongue in cheek classic!
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