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OPPO Digital Presents: DV-980H (1080p, SACD DSD, 7.1 Surround, USB 2.0) - Page 199

post #5941 of 6369
Quote:
Originally Posted by GSB View Post

Good grief, man, this is completely abnormal! You should definitely call OPPO. If the player is at fault, they will make it right. Any number of things could have happened to your player... a solder joint may have cracked due to temperature extremes during shipping... who knows? It may not be their fault at all.

Don't just sit on a bad unit and let it spoil your experience with OPPO. All the while, you are steering people away from OPPO, instead of giving OPPO the opportunity to demonstrate their fantastic customer support.

Gary

We shall see what happens.
Quote:


Dear Oppo,

Back in April of this year, I purchased a new DV-980H via Amazon. I have never been quite happy with this unit, for the following reasons:
  • Overall picture softness
  • Overall picture noise
  • Color error - there is an extreme lack of blue in the video output. Everything has an an overall yellow cast to it unless I bring the Blue Contrast setting up by a significant amount (in my TV or in my AVR video settings). Note that playback of still images via the USB port do not exhibit the same color shift.
  • Occasional blasts of "digital noise" during SACD playback, regardless of whether the 980 is bitstreaming the DSD stream or decoding the DSD to MPCM.
These issues are present regardless of any setting (output resolution, color space, etc) I have tried in the 980's menu. I have tried both firmware versions posted on your website, and have performed a factory default reset several times.

The 980 is connected via HDMI to an Onkyo TX-SR876 receiver, which is in turn connected to a Samsung A550 LCD display. I have also connected the 980 directly to the the display, with the same results. I do not have any of these issues with any other source in my system. DVD playback looks SIGNIFICANTLY better using any of the other DVD capable devices I have in the same system, including:
  • Panasonic DMP-BD35 Blu-ray player (HDMI)
  • Denon DVD-758 DVD player (HDMI)
  • Panasonic DMR-E85H DVR/DVDR (Component)
All are connected to the same AVR & TV. All exhibit significantly better color accuracy, sharpness and lack of noise in comparison to the 980.

I had consigned myself to using the 980 for SACD and DVD-R playback only, but have had several other Oppo owners insist that this is not normal behavior for the 980 and that I should contact you for recommendations and/or service on my unit.

Can you assist with this situation?


post #5942 of 6369
How big of a difference in Video Upscaling quality is the DV-980H, DV-981HD, and DV-983H. On a scale of 1-10. I currently have a Samsung LN46B650 and have been looking at getting a Oppo since I started looking for a TV which was a few months ago. Well now that I finally have the tv I wish to buy one. Most of the DV-983H that you find on the market are used from what I've seen and run about $300.

BTW if anybody happens to have one that lives in the OKC Metro area I would really like to see one in person.

post #5943 of 6369
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bean007 View Post

How big of a difference in Video Upscaling quality is the DV-980H, DV-981HD, and DV-983H. On a scale of 1-10. I currently have a Samsung LN46B650 and have been looking at getting a Oppo since I started looking for a TV which was a few months ago. Well now that I finally have the tv I wish to buy one. Most of the DV-983H that you find on the market are used from what I've seen and run about $300.

BTW if anybody happens to have one that lives in the OKC Metro area I would really like to see one in person.


It would be hard to rank; much of this is a matter of subjective preference. Much depends on the viewing angle: the larger the screen and the closer you sit the more deinterlacing errors will be visible.

Are you using a calibration disc? That will make a bigger difference than buying new gear.

The 981 has a film-like image which some people call "soft". The Faroudja chip players sometime enhance macroblocking on DLP, but I have hardly ever seen it on LCD.

The 980 seems sharper by comparison, but with rougher deinterlacing. I noticed this only a few times, seeing a bit of horizontal combing on quick cuts in animation.

The 983 (and Blu-ray BDP-83) is the best of both worlds: sharp and film-like. The 981 does seem soft by comparison.

You might look at the section on DVD performance in the BDP-83 FAQ; there are some good links: Is the DVD picture quality of this player amazingly better than any other player?

-Bill
post #5944 of 6369
Had my DV-980H for a couple of days now. Its stunning for a SD DVD player. Crisp, beautiful picture, and even on my as yet uncalibrated TV, the contrast and brightness are almost perfect. I can't really judge audio quality since I don't have a home theater set up (just headphones and TV speakers), but I still hear nuances that were missed previously (only gripe is that dialog is too soft vs. action/music). All in all its definitely worth $169, even with Blu-Ray starting to come into its own. In a year or so I can probably pick up a good BD player (when its worth it to me) and use the Oppo solely for DVDs.

I also have (and will soon return) a Pioneer DV-420V-K that I bought prior to the Oppo. I'm definitely glad I found this thread that gave me the incentive I needed to try it. The Oppo has a noticeably better picture (and the Pioneer was rated tops by Consumer Reports of the ones they tested!).
post #5945 of 6369
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffredo View Post

(only gripe is that dialog is too soft vs. action/music).

This is a common problem with audio mixing on many movies. It could also be your speakers, or speaker placement, or room acoustics, etc, but you might be able to compensate. While running an audio calibration with a sound level meter, I discovered that my center channel speaker needed a bit of a boost from the AV receiver. This has helped tremendously with dialog. If you are using analog outputs, the OPPO allows you to do independant level trim on each channel.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffredo View Post

All in all its definitely worth $169, even with Blu-Ray starting to come into its own. In a year or so I can probably pick up a good BD player (when its worth it to me) and use the Oppo solely for DVDs.

I also have (and will soon return) a Pioneer DV-420V-K that I bought prior to the Oppo. I'm definitely glad I found this thread that gave me the incentive I needed to try it. The Oppo has a noticeably better picture (and the Pioneer was rated tops by Consumer Reports of the ones they tested!).

Good to hear.

Gary
post #5946 of 6369
Quote:
Originally Posted by GSB View Post

This is a common problem with audio mixing on many movies. It could also be your speakers, or speaker placement, or room acoustics, etc, but you might be able to compensate. While running an audio calibration with a sound level meter, I discovered that my center channel speaker needed a bit of a boost from the AV receiver. This has helped tremendously with dialog. If you are using analog outputs, the OPPO allows you to do independant level trim on each channel.

Well, again I have no home theater set up. Just the two stereo speakers on my HDTV and the headphones I use often at night. I did set the DRC to "full" and set the EQ to "Live" in the player. It seems to make the sound fuller and richer. I tried the nice Sennheiser headphones from my PC that I use for gaming. Though the cord is short and not suitable for the living room they sounded much, much better (more even action/music/dialog) than the cheap Koss ones I use there. May just have to shop around for some better headphones with a long cord (or cordless) for TV use.
post #5947 of 6369
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffredo View Post

Well, again I have no home theater set up. Just the two stereo speakers on my HDTV and the headphones I use often at night. I did set the DRC to "full" and set the EQ to "Live" in the player. It seems to make the sound fuller and richer. I tried the nice Sennheiser headphones from my PC that I use for gaming. Though the cord is short and not suitable for the living room they sounded much, much better (more even action/music/dialog) than the cheap Koss ones I use there. May just have to shop around for some better headphones with a long cord (or cordless) for TV use.

Cordless headphones are crap, don't bother.
When not just get an extention cable for the pair you already have and like.
post #5948 of 6369
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smarty-pants View Post

Cordless headphones are crap, don't bother.
When not just get an extention cable for the pair you already have and like.

Yeah, that's the solution. Found a nice Sony brand one on Amazon for less than $10 that is 3 meters long. That'll do.
post #5949 of 6369
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffredo View Post

I can't really judge audio quality...only gripe is that dialog is too soft vs. action/music...

Have you adjusted the down mix settings?

blairy
post #5950 of 6369
Quote:
Originally Posted by jcalabria View Post

We shall see what happens.



If Oppo doesn't fix the problem and your objective is really good upconversion, then in the alternative: (1)see if you can get a Toshiba HD-A3[preferably new or good condition used], OR (2)if you have not already done so, try a Toshiba XDE500 or XDE600; get one at BestBuy or wherever; the Toshibas do a superb job, with the XDE500 unit which I tried fractionally better than an HD-A3(or an older HD-A1). The mix of hardware will of course be different for every user, but there's no reason to stick with something that just doesn't meet your needs.
post #5951 of 6369
Quote:
Originally Posted by blairy View Post

Have you adjusted the down mix settings?

blairy

Yeah, I changed it from Stereo to Lt/Rt (no difference), V. Surround (weaker still), and 5.1 (even though I don't have it, the audio seems a little stronger on this setting).

Sure wish they had a "Dialog Enhancement" setting like so many other brands...
post #5952 of 6369
Quote:
Originally Posted by dudley07726 View Post

Rep at Oppo said it will have to be a hardware fix and not a program fix.

Oppo received my player on Monday, fixed it and already shipped it back out on Tuesday. What Service!
post #5953 of 6369
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrsmith View Post

If Oppo doesn't fix the problem and your objective is really good upconversion, then in the alternative: (1)see if you can get a Toshiba HD-A3[preferably new or good condition used], OR (2)if you have not already done so, try a Toshiba XDE500 or XDE600; get one at BestBuy or wherever; the Toshibas do a superb job, with the XDE500 unit which I tried fractionally better than an HD-A3(or an older HD-A1). The mix of hardware will of course be different for every user, but there's no reason to stick with something that just doesn't meet your needs.

They just sent me an RMA and a call tag... I will get it sent out to them this weekend.

BTW... DVD player upconversion capabilities are not important to me as I have a REON HQV scaler in the Onkyo 876 and would prefer the DVD player output native 480i. It's the color error that so far has relegated the 980 to audio playback only for me. I can get superb DVD playback out of either the Panny BD35 or the Denon 758 coupled with the Reon scaler.

As I stated earlier, what I wanted out of the Oppo was a single unit to handle DVD-A/SACD playback over HDMI (the Denon cannot do SACD over HDMI) and provide a 480i DVD transport that could be calibrated independently of Blu-ray playback. The color error and noise have prevented it from fulfilling that role... one that it SHOULD be tailor-made for. Hopefully, it will come back to me in better shape.
post #5954 of 6369
I noticed what this reviewer in ExtremeTech was saying regarding the 980. I always thought, in addition to the faint dialog, that the sound was a little shrill or too "crisp". Just not enough default warmth and with just TV speakers or headphones there's no way to add it.

"One other issue we encountered was audio, and this was a purely subjective issue. For whatever reason, audio playback over HDMI sounded different than the same audio played back through either the Toshiba or Sony high definition disc players. I'd go so far as to say the OPPO sounded "thin" by comparison. I checked and rechecked the settings several times, and all looked fine. The Onkyo receiver was properly detecting Dolby Digital signals, and my speakers were working perfectly. Yet, the DV-980H's audio playback just didn't sound quite as full or robust. Most people probably wouldn't notice it unless they had another source to compare it to. Audiophiles may find this a little distressing, though."

Almost gives me a headache after an hour or so of watching - something the Pioneer DV-420V I was also trying out never did.
post #5955 of 6369
Reproduction and sound, and the personal preferences within that domain, vary so greatly, no one can say that any audio from a professionally manufactured player is sub_par... especially the 980.
This player is not a high end player. It is a VERY good player that offers many features that are not normally offered in it's price class.
The player has good enough analog audio that thousands of buyers thought it was worth purchasing.
Just as well, a player like this is meant to be hooked up through an audio processor of some kind, and that situation will always require calibration.
We can go and get 10 different players in the under $200 price class and set them side by side for comparison, and I can guarantee that they will all sound different without calibration in an untreated room... or even via headphones for that matter.
Today's equipment is meant to be calibrated for optimum sound and video.
IF the end user wishes to listen to uncalibrated music via "direct" audio, the only way that will sound even close to great is to use a player with Benchmark DACs and all the other high quality guts and connectors that is needed for such a beast.
One thing I can guarantee, that player is going to cost a hell of a lot more than $200.
post #5956 of 6369
Can anyone please tell me how I can purchase a 980H from a reliable source in greater Toronto area? Shipping from the US seems expensive. I saw it on the web that Solutions AV sell Oppo products. Are they good supplier? Does equipment purchased in Canada covered under their standard 1 year warranty?

Thanks
post #5957 of 6369
Quote:
Originally Posted by mlai01 View Post

Can anyone please tell me how I can purchase a 980H from a reliable source in greater Toronto area? Shipping from the US seems expensive. I saw it on the web that Solutions AV sell Oppo products. Are they good supplier? Does equipment purchased in Canada covered under their standard 1 year warranty?

Thanks

There is one you can buy now on ebay if you can't find one elsewhere. That's how I got my 983H. here is a link:
ttp://cgi.ebay.com/OPPO-DV-980H-1080p-Up-Converting-DVD-Player-w-HDMI-NEW_W0QQitemZ300321573534QQcmdZViewItemQQptZDVD_Players_Reco rders?hash=item45ec8f8a9e&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14#ht_1987wt_1167
post #5958 of 6369
I just bought an Oppo bdp-83 blu ray player for my Kuro in our living room which means I'm going to sell either my 980 or 981 on ebay. I'm not sure which one I should keep and which to sell. I need to keep one of them for the 42" Panny 768p plasma in the bedroom. The 981 is about a year old and the 980 is about 1 1/2 yrs old and both have had light use and they both work great (I love Oppo!). I'm not sure if there is a good reason to keep one vs. the other. Any advice is greatly appreciated.
post #5959 of 6369
^Your plasma could possibly be subject to macroblocking with the Faroudja processing in the 981, as well as I hear the 981 may also have a tendency to highten a bit of green in the picture too.
Personally I have never used the 981 in my own setup (the only OPPO player I have never owned), but I love what the 980 can do.

Another thing to keep in mind, is that this holiday season will for sure be offering sub $100 Blu-ray players. You may also want to consider one of those for the bedroom too. However, I think if I personally had to sell off two OPPO players at the same time, it might just break my heart.
post #5960 of 6369
Smarty -
I agree! I love my Oppos. In fact, I have a Sony blu-ray player with my Kuro right now as well as the Oppo 981 because I preferred it to the Sony BR player for standard DVDs. But now that I'm getting the 983 for the Kuro, I am planning to move the Sony BR to bedroom and use one of the older Oppos in there too. This way, I'll still have an Oppo on both tvs.

I'm leaning toward keeping the 980 because it has the USB port on the front which makes it easy to play DIVX files off of a thumb drive.

Know anyone who wants a 981? (Sorry, I'm not trying to spam the channel.)


Quote:
Originally Posted by Smarty-pants View Post

^Your plasma could possibly be subject to macroblocking with the Faroudja processing in the 981, as well as I hear the 981 may also have a tendency to highten a bit of green in the picture too.
Personally I have never used the 981 in my own setup (the only OPPO player I have never owned), but I love what the 980 can do.

Another thing to keep in mind, is that this holiday season will for sure be offering sub $100 Blu-ray players. You may also want to consider one of those for the bedroom too. However, I think if I personally had to sell off two OPPO players at the same time, it might just break my heart.
post #5961 of 6369
Quote:
Originally Posted by mlai01 View Post

Can anyone please tell me how I can purchase a 980H from a reliable source in greater Toronto area? Shipping from the US seems expensive. I saw it on the web that Solutions AV sell Oppo products. Are they good supplier? Does equipment purchased in Canada covered under their standard 1 year warranty?

Thanks

I bought mine from Solutions AV two years ago. I was pleased with the speed of delivery. They struck me as a legitimate company and not a fly by night selling them out of the back of a car. Like I said I got my two years ago so they must be OK if they are still around. Don't let the simple web site make you nervous. I believe you could pick it up yourself to save a few bucks too.
post #5962 of 6369
Quote:
Originally Posted by merc82 View Post

I bought mine from Solutions AV two years ago. I was pleased with the speed of delivery. They struck me as a legitimate company and not a fly by night selling them out of the back of a car. Like I said I got my two years ago so they must be OK if they are still around. Don't let the simple web site make you nervous. I believe you could pick it up yourself to save a few bucks too.

Thank you for giving me that peace of mind. Their primitive web site did make me feel a little uncomfortable but talking to them over the phone seemed to give me increased confidence. They even have a 15 days return policy. Unfortunately, 980 is out of stock and I'll have to wait for 2-3 weeks.

BTW, what is your comments on the player? How does it look on your Kuro? I am trying out a Panny BD60 which also received a great review on the internet on its upscaling capability. Its performance is better than my older 1080i Panny S97 player but I hope that 980 will even do better on SD source. My plan is to buy a PS3 slim for BD and use 980 solely for DVD playback.
post #5963 of 6369
I noticed on the ASi-Tek website they mentioned that the 980H has backwards A/C polarity (http://www.asi-tek.com/Oppo4.html) which they fixed when they added their IEC socket. I have played around with swapping the polarity on components, and it does make a difference.

I use a cheater plug with the bigger end filed down to test this.

Sure enough, the Oppo sounds better with the polarity reversed. Much more volume, depth, to the sound as well as better separation. And I also noticed the video looks better. What stuck out here was depth of field and just overall better pop. It is not night and day, and it is hard to test because it takes so long for the player to boot, but the differences are certainly noticeable to me and worth the effort.

I was using HDMI for video and analog for audio. The only thing I can test HDMI audio with is my TV which makes it a lot harder to hear the differneces, but if the video is better, the audio should be too. Not that should is 100 percent. I am going to test this out too.

I swapped the pins on the A/C connector on the power supply internally to correct this. A pick is really handy for getting the pins out. One could file down the stock plug and insert it the other way if going inside is too much.

Anyway, just thought I would share.
post #5964 of 6369
Quote:
Originally Posted by mlai01 View Post

Thank you for giving me that peace of mind. Their primitive web site did make me feel a little uncomfortable but talking to them over the phone seemed to give me increased confidence. They even have a 15 days return policy.

I also bought mine from SolutionsAV. No problems whatsoever. I had bought the 970 and the 980s were announced a few days later. I paid the difference and ended up with two 980s that have served me well for the last few years.

R
post #5965 of 6369
Quote:
Originally Posted by kellybob View Post

Sure enough, the Oppo sounds better with the polarity reversed. Much more volume, depth, to the sound as well as better separation. And I also noticed the video looks better. What stuck out here was depth of field and just overall better pop.

I'm sorry, but as an electronics R&D Engineer, I cannot agree with this. It is completely and utterly impossible, from an electrical standpoint.

I'm really glad that you are happy with the change, but others should not feel impelled to modify their units.

The power supply creates EXACTLY the same DC output voltages, with EXACTLY the same performance, no matter which way around you connect the AC power. The OPPO design may be isolated enough to allow for connection in either direction, but I would not recommend this to others, for fear of creating a potential safety hazard.

Gary
post #5966 of 6369
Quote:
Originally Posted by dudley07726 View Post

Oppo received my player on Monday, fixed it and already shipped it back out on Tuesday. What Service!


The first second of a cd is no longer cut off. It plays right from the beginning even if the HDMI cable (used for video purposes only) is attatched.
post #5967 of 6369
Quote:
Originally Posted by mlai01 View Post

Thank you for giving me that peace of mind. Their primitive web site did make me feel a little uncomfortable but talking to them over the phone seemed to give me increased confidence. They even have a 15 days return policy. Unfortunately, 980 is out of stock and I'll have to wait for 2-3 weeks.

BTW, what is your comments on the player? How does it look on your Kuro? I am trying out a Panny BD60 which also received a great review on the internet on its upscaling capability. Its performance is better than my older 1080i Panny S97 player but I hope that 980 will even do better on SD source. My plan is to buy a PS3 slim for BD and use 980 solely for DVD playback.

I have bought two Oppos from Solutions A/V. Fast service (received 980 the next day), cheap shipping. Oppos are very nicely packed, if you've never seen a new one...

Here's my opinion with DVD: the PS3 upscales DVD *very* slightly better than the 980. The Oppo BDP-83 upscales very noticeably better than both of those, as well as can do DVD in 24fps mode. The 980 does non-R1 DVD just fine, but I have mainly used it in 50Hz PAL mode to my Kuro (Pio 151) since it takes that.

Noise: the regular PS3 can be like a small jet after it's been upscaling DVD for a while, but doing other stuff (BD, games) it's reasonably quiet but audible. The slim PS3 is quieter. The 83 is very quiet. The 980 is virtually silent.

The PS3 does NOT upscale non-1080p content on BDs. There is tons of it as extras, even for new film title BDs. You'd think a great display like the Pio 151 would upscale that nicely, eh? It is absolute garbage compared to the BDP-83, and the 83 deinterlaces far better too. Otherwise the PS3 and 83 BD PQ is pretty much identical, the PS3 really is a good BD player, as is the 83 which is a bit more flexible.

Really, if you just want a PS3 for BD and a 980 just for R1 DVD upscaling, you would probably be better off getting the BDP-83 and be done with it in one box, or else just get the PS3 and try it with DVD for a while and see if the noise bothers you (return if it does, you'll know in a couple hours).

The 980 is very competent, and good at what it does. But many of us got it for its other features that you don't seem to want (music formats, especially over HDMI, and non-R1 DVDs).

The PS3 is harder and it costs more to integrate it into an HT system (you need some kind of IR->Bluetooth adapter to do it very nicely, or can do it cheaply).

I got the 980 because it handles ALL my DVD and DVD-A/SACD music discs. I could not stand the PS3 noise ONLY while playing DVDs, but otherwise was happy with it for all else it does including BD. Then my CD player in my bedroom system broke. So the 980 went there. The 980 was replaced in the main system with the BDP-83. So now I have two "respected" BD players in the main system, and go back and forth. Frankly, for BD, I just use whichever one's turned on, they look equal to me and measure equally with the S&M test disc (except the 83 deinterlaces etc. "weird" video formats much better than the PS3). The 83 handles the hi-res music discs, and I'm happy to have the 980 as backup for that as IME DVD-A/SACD players don't seem too reliable.

Edit: I gave the wrong impression. I think the PS3 and 980 make a great combo, together they do a helluva lot more than the BDP-83 does, for less (initial) $$ too. However, what the BDP-83 *does* do, it does better than that combo does. Quality vs quantity when it comes to capability/features...if it was an easy decision we wouldn't have forums like this...
post #5968 of 6369
Quote:
Originally Posted by GSB View Post

I'm sorry, but as an electronics R&D Engineer, I cannot agree with this. It is completely and utterly impossible, from an electrical standpoint.

I'm really glad that you are happy with the change, but others should not feel impelled to modify their units.

The power supply creates EXACTLY the same DC output voltages, with EXACTLY the same performance, no matter which way around you connect the AC power. The OPPO design may be isolated enough to allow for connection in either direction, but I would not recommend this to others, for fear of creating a potential safety hazard.

Gary


If you have a decently revealing system and can listen with an open mind, I think you will see there is quite a difference with the A/C polarity reversed. I have tested this with many components, and it makes a difference.

Think of it this way, the only way for two things to be exactly the same is if they are one thing. The mere fact that the polarity can be reversed should tell you that it absolutely will make a difference. The only way for polarity reversal to not make a difference would be if it was not possible. It is a distinct, different possibility so will manifest distinct, different effects.

Many people will say that wires can make no difference in sound because they say cause and effect stops working at a certain level. Meaning a wire is a wire and cause and effect not longer works past this level. But the only way for two wires not to sound different is if they are one wire.

I imagine if I took this argument and said well I am a person and you are a person, so there are no differences between us, they would not agree, but that is exactly the argument they are presenting.

You as an engineer cannot MEASURE a difference, but that does not mean there is not a difference. Just give it a try and see if you HEAR a difference.

To repeat, it does take a decent (not great or expensive system) and you do have to have the ability to listen to hear this. I could hear a difference on my TV, but this took a LOT of back and forth and was not dramatic.

On my better system, it really stood out because the better system creates (recreates) space and this is where the big differences are. There are other differences, but this stands out.

I do think that critical listening is something that is learned, meaning sometimes I can do tests with others and they may not hear something at first, but if I point it out for them, then their ability to hear it improves.

I have done this for a long time, and I do think that like everything else, this is cause and effect. The more you listen critically with an open mind, the better your ability to hear and appreciate certain things.

If you do not think you will hear a difference, you will not. Not because there is absolutely no difference, but simply because you are not willing to put out the cause.

Nam Myoho Renge Kyo,
Kelly
post #5969 of 6369
Quote:
Originally Posted by kellybob View Post

If you do not think you will hear a difference, you will not.

Slight hole in your logic there.

The reverse is also equally true. If you expect to hear differences, you will.

And don't drink the KoolAid.
post #5970 of 6369
Quote:
Originally Posted by rdgrimes View Post


And don't drink the KoolAid.

You got that right. I think the put some saltpeter in there.
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