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Official Epik Subwoofer Thread - Page 338

post #10111 of 20352
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hksvr4 View Post

Stark Trek is a good movie. I've seen it on blu and it has a good amount of LFE.

We really enjoyed Star Trek, even on our mini-bookshelf speakers. I can't wait to get the Sentinels & SongTowers to really bring it to life!

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post #10112 of 20352
Quote:
Originally Posted by irishluck73 View Post

We really enjoyed Star Trek, even on our mini-bookshelf speakers. I can't wait to get the Sentinels & SongTowers to really bring it to life!

Star Trek (2009) is one of my favorite movies from the last few years, great LFE, picture (even though they chose to use anamorphic instead of digital cam's) and a really fun storyline.

Congrats on the new setup you've got coming. The Song Towers are very nice speakers and the Sentinels sound to be pretty darn good subs. You should see a pretty nice bump in performance over mini-bookshelves. A good system can add so much to the movie watching experience.
post #10113 of 20352
Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowmanick View Post

Star Trek (2009) is one of my favorite movies from the last few years, great LFE, picture (even though they chose to use anamorphic instead of digital cam's) and a really fun storyline.

Co

Yep, it was a breathe of fresh air after watching G.I Joe.
post #10114 of 20352
[quote=Snowmanick;17617619]Star Trek (2009) is one of my favorite movies from the last few years, great LFE, picture (even though they chose to use anamorphic instead of digital cam's) and a really fun storyline.



My wife and I just watched it tonight on BD and loved it. The Conquest was rocking the couch and everything else in the house!!

Both of us loved the story and the way they brought everyone in and really kept the movie in line with the rest of the Star Trek series and movies. I am really glad all the characters had the same personalities and interactions with each other as i the past and it really does roll with the whole movie series.
One of the most enjoyable films to watch over the past couple years.
post #10115 of 20352
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt34 View Post

Yep, it was a breathe of fresh air after watching G.I Joe.

Couldn't agree with you more! The new Ice Age should sound really good through the Epiks! Watched it last night using my old school JBL L100s and it sounded great, must be truly awesome through a dedicated sub!
post #10116 of 20352
Ok, so what will the Dragon bring to the table that the Sentinel will not? Yeah I know the Sentinel brings ALOT of 20Hz booyah, BUT, will it give me that pounding in your gut, SLAM!? You know that mid bass 30-60Hz stuff that you can feel in your insides. Also, I want to feel those rumbles under 20Hz. Will the Dragon extend lower than the Sentinel, like noticeably lower?

I know Chad has steered many to go with the Sentinel when choosing between the 2 but I gotta believe the 18 inch Dragon can reeeally bring some more output across the board, no?

Please direct your thoughts or input to these 2 subs specifically, I already know what subs would trump either one of them including the Pheonix.
Thanks!
post #10117 of 20352
If you are comparing 1 Sentinel to 1 Dragon. There is no comparison. Now if you are comparing 2 Sentinels to 1 Dragon or 1 Phoenix then you have a huge toss up that is really dominated by the extra impact and full bodied bass you get out of 2 subs. No matter how phenomenal the Dragon or the Phoenix sounds 2 Sentinels will be able to carry a room better a large majority of the time. But if you are like me 2 Phoenixs are the way to go.
post #10118 of 20352
Quote:
Originally Posted by HDisMe View Post

Ok, so what will the Dragon bring to the table that the Sentinel will not? Yeah I know the Sentinel brings ALOT of 20Hz booyah, BUT, will it give me that pounding in your gut, SLAM!? You know that mid bass 30-60Hz stuff that you can feel in your insides. Also, I want to feel those rumbles under 20Hz. Will the Dragon extend lower than the Sentinel, like noticeably lower?

I know Chad has steered many to go with the Sentinel when choosing between the 2 but I gotta believe the 18 inch Dragon can reeeally bring some more output across the board, no?

The Dragon should definitely have more output across most of the FR, larger driver and cabinet. Beyond that they are two different designs, the Sentinel being ported will have a more level response across it's range down to it's tuning point then it will fall off fast. The Dragon being sealed will have wider roll off that will start higher in the frequency range and probably extend a little beyond the Sentinels capability on the low end. As far as rumbles on the low end the Sentinel will give you more there due to the level response down to the tuning point. Midbass 30-60hz stuff and I haven't heard the Dragon but it gets Praised for this so it would probably have the edge.
post #10119 of 20352
Quote:
Originally Posted by HDisMe View Post

Ok, so what will the Dragon bring to the table that the Sentinel will not? Yeah I know the Sentinel brings ALOT of 20Hz booyah, BUT, will it give me that pounding in your gut, SLAM!? You know that mid bass 30-60Hz stuff that you can feel in your insides. Also, I want to feel those rumbles under 20Hz. Will the Dragon extend lower than the Sentinel, like noticeably lower?

I know Chad has steered many to go with the Sentinel when choosing between the 2 but I gotta believe the 18 inch Dragon can reeeally bring some more output across the board, no?

Please direct your thoughts or input to these 2 subs specifically, I already know what subs would trump either one of them including the Pheonix.
Thanks!

Are you talking dual Sentinels VS 1 Dragon?
post #10120 of 20352
The Dragon has amazing slam. I have not heard the Sentinel but I would assume that it would have more rumble over the dragon. But the slam on the 18" driver takes the cake. I have a 10'X13' room. The Dragon really shines with music. I listen to RnB, hip-hop, dance, rock, and a bit of country. A little of everything. The sub does not miss a beat and stops on a dime. With movies, it still has pretty good rumble. It just rolls off quickly. I perfer the "hit in your chest" bass over rumble.
post #10121 of 20352
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hksvr4 View Post

The Dragon has amazing slam. I have not heard the Sentinel but I would assume that it would have more rumble over the dragon. But the slam on the 18" driver takes the cake. I have a 10'X13' room. The Dragon really shines with music. I listen to RnB, hip-hop, dance, rock, and a bit of country. A little of everything. The sub does not miss a beat and stops on a dime. With movies, it still has pretty good rumble. It just rolls off quickly. I perfer the "hit in your chest" bass over rumble.

Thats my problem. I have a dynasty and need more "slam" but have no idea how I would EQ the two together.

The as-eq1 just isn't made for that kind of mixture
post #10122 of 20352
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mister House View Post

If you are comparing 1 Sentinel to 1 Dragon. There is no comparison.

For the record, I am strictly talking about a 1 on 1 comparison. I know dual Sentinels will win that battle but do you mind alloborating on what you mean by "there is no comparison" 1 on 1??? Do you mean 1 Sentinel would not compare to 1 Dragon and if so in what way?
post #10123 of 20352
Quote:
Originally Posted by HDisMe View Post

For the record, I am strictly talking about a 1 on 1 comparison. I know dual Sentinels will win that battle but do you mind alloborating on what you mean by "there is no comparison" 1 on 1??? Do you mean 1 Sentinel would not compare to 1 Dragon and if so in what way?

They are two very different subs. The only thing they share is the amp.
post #10124 of 20352
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hksvr4 View Post

They are two very different subs. The only thing they share is the amp.

Any that ridiculous fact is probably why the dynasty and phoenix have been reported to have crappy mid bass...

It is insane that they make all those subs with a single amp and just 2 woofers, nothing is designed to go together and all that changes is the box and whatever happens happens. It really is bull crap.
post #10125 of 20352
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jakeman02 View Post

The Dragon should definitely have more output across most of the FR, larger driver and cabinet. Beyond that they are two different designs, the Sentinel being ported will have a more level response across it's range down to it's tuning point then it will fall off fast. The Dragon being sealed will have wider roll off that will start higher in the frequency range and probably extend a little beyond the Sentinels capability on the low end. As far as rumbles on the low end the Sentinel will give you more there due to the level response down to the tuning point.

Thanks for your input and since Im still learning sub lingo and how subs work in general, when you say the Sentinel will have a more level response does that mean that in order for the Dragon to achieve that it would require more EQ than than the Sentinel? Is that the advantage of a ported design that they usually have more of a level response across its range?
post #10126 of 20352
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hksvr4 View Post

They are two very different subs. The only thing they share is the amp.

I understand that but what I want to know are the basics when it comes to an A/B comparison, such as the things I mentioned, which one will go lower or dig deeper, which will have more output/ headroom (Is that the same thing?), which has more of that mid bass slam? Those are the kinds of things I want to know. Im sure due to there designs they will sound a bit different but then again I thought ported vs. sealed wasnt really that big of a debate or difference when they're both of superb quality? Yes, Im still learning folks and having fun in the process so keep the knowledge coming.
post #10127 of 20352
Quote:
Originally Posted by goonstopher View Post

Any that ridiculous fact is probably why the dynasty and phoenix have been reported to have crappy mid bass...

It is insane that they make all those subs with a single amp and just 2 woofers, nothing is designed to go together and all that changes is the box and whatever happens happens. It really is bull crap.

What?!?!
post #10128 of 20352
Epik has a single amp and only 2 drivers and simply switches boxes...

How is that a good sub design?

I wish I had realized this before I bought mine...
post #10129 of 20352
It is a great design. Tell my why you need multiple amp options when the one you have works? Tell my why you need multiple driver options when the one you have works? Only reason to change boxes is to get different setups for different reasons. The only real thing you need to change for a great woofer and a great amp is the enclosure. I worked in the car audio business for years and we always built the best box possible to match up with the proper sub and amp. Subs have wattage recommendations and once you match them up it is up to the enclosure to make them sound great together. Goonie I have followed you through this forum for a while now and I have never heard you speak badly of Epik till now. What is wrong bro?
post #10130 of 20352
Read the last few pages...

I was nice but it is starting to build up. The nice mid bass I had before with my pb13 is replaced by this rumbling, slam free lug.

There are at least 2 phoenix owners and a conquest owner actively complaining of a lack of mid bass as well.

Things just rumble but don't sound or feel like they should and the one size fits all, completely unspecialized design could easily be why. Whatever the reason, my sub is eq'ed flat and even when I let it run un eq'ed just to prove a point (even though flat brings up a mid bass suckout of only 5db), the result is still the same.
post #10131 of 20352
Oh Man that is sad to hear. Well I guess one size fits all isn't always the way to go but I am certainly pleased with the results of my Phoenix but every ear is different. I hope you find the sub you are looking for bro.
post #10132 of 20352
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mister House View Post

Oh Man that is sad to hear. Well I guess one size fits all isn't always the way to go but I am certainly pleased with the results of my Phoenix but every ear is different. I hope you find the sub you are looking for bro.

Have you owned other comparable higher end ID subs?

I've noticed that people who have seem to be the ones who notice what is lacking
post #10133 of 20352
Perhaps the lack of mid-bass has to do with more with room acoustics and less to do with the sub? Have you moved the sub around or adjusted your listening/measurement position? The PB13 may have worked better (than the Dynasty) in the spot where you have placed your sub(s). I don't recall reading many posts about lack of mid-bass with the Phoenix and the Dynasty and I have read through this entire thread. Of course, I was mostly focused on the Sentinel.
post #10134 of 20352
Quote:
Originally Posted by goonstopher View Post

Have you owned other comparable higher end ID subs?

I've noticed that people who have seem to be the ones who notice what is lacking

Maybe that is what it is. I have lots of HT friends with subs from big companies like Paradigm and Klipsch but none from IDs. The strange thing is when they come over and hear my sub they all get that little kid grin and tell me how much they love it. I also never get any let downs when I listen to rock n' roll on kick drums or mid range bass notes. I can't tell you why my subs handles mid bass so well but it does. However I do still the slam free lub when I need it too. Anyways I hope you find what you are looking for soon. I know I hate going without bass.
post #10135 of 20352
Quote:
Originally Posted by BleedGreen View Post

Perhaps the lack of mid-bass has to do with more with room acoustics and less to do with the sub? Have you moved the sub around or adjusted your listening/measurement position? The PB13 may have worked better (than the Dynasty) in the spot where you have placed your sub(s). I don't recall reading many posts about lack of mid-bass with the Phoenix and the Dynasty and I have read through this entire thread. Of course, I was mostly focused on the Sentinel.

Very few epik owners i have seen have owned higher end ID subs and can verify a flat in room response. My room was and is flat when I observe this, it is not the room or placement because other subs have done better...

This is not like a submersive or even a pb13 ultra, both of whose slightly higher price range and renowned tonal qualities tend to attract a different, possibly more experienced buyer. Much like eD, you tend to notice a ton of people saying it is their first real sub, or their strongest sub so far.

I think lack of poor reviews or even good reviews don't mean the problems are not there. The several poor reviews on this subject come from listeners whose experience in the area makes me value them much more.

Like a VERRRRY knowledgeable subwoofer listener told me (he may even be behind a renowned subwoofer rating list ) "If you put a ****** sub in your room your ear adapts and you get use to it... with a good sounding sub it doesn't have to)"

SPL and response graphs suggest I am insane but my ear (and innards) refuse to accept what they are lacking.

I am only using such strong languadge because it needs to be done to fight the trend of unabated praise without intelligent and experienced discussion.
post #10136 of 20352
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mister House View Post

Maybe that is what it is. I have lots of HT friends with subs from big companies like Paradigm and Klipsch but none from IDs. The strange thing is when they come over and hear my sub they all get that little kid grin and tell me how much they love it. I also never get any let downs when I listen to rock n' roll on kick drums or mid range bass notes. I can't tell you why my subs handles mid bass so well but it does. However I do still the slam free lub when I need it too. Anyways I hope you find what you are looking for soon. I know I hate going without bass.

I am just pissed that I wasted over 3500 to end up with this sub!

I sold a pb13 and botched a DIY project and in the end bought this when the pb13 did everything this does and 10 times more.
post #10137 of 20352
Well good luck to you, your ear and your innards brother. And watch your damn language lol just kidding
post #10138 of 20352
I will give it one more try with hitman I guess... If the mid bass in that can't thump then its worse than I expected

I simply doesn't have the concussive force of the pb13. I wonder how long the slotted port is and if it is adding its own harmonics...

Either way looks like there is no market for it right now (at least not fair market compared to a sliding scale for the phoenix) so it looks like I will have it for a while before it depreciates enough in my mind to justify selling and hopefully by then the holiday season will have passed and people will have money.

What REALLY has me angry is I am going to miss my chance to get a dts-10
post #10139 of 20352
Goonie - I am sorry to hear about your issues, and I have to agree with you on what quite a few others have said with regards to mid bass punch. I have been looking for a new sub (coming from a Paradigm Servo 15) and I was ready to order an Epik (dual sents or a phoenix), and something told me to wait a bit (and I did quite a bit more research during this time). I have heard of (as you have) quite a few people saying they get a lot of low end rumble, but the kick you in your chest feeling is missing (compared to some others). The final straw for me was seeing that they are out of all subs until likely after the holidays. In the end, I am going with a Submersive (a bit more money, but no doubt worth it). Good luck getting the response out of the sub you are looking for (or selling it and going another direction).
post #10140 of 20352
Quote:
Originally Posted by gtsum2 View Post

Goonie - I am sorry to hear about your issues, and I have to agree with you on what quite a few others have said with regards to mid bass punch. I have been looking for a new sub (coming from a Paradigm Servo 15) and I was ready to order an Epik (dual sents or a phoenix), and something told me to wait a bit (and I did quite a bit more research during this time). I have heard of (as you have) quite a few people saying they get a lot of low end rumble, but the kick you in your chest feeling is missing (compared to some others). The final straw for me was seeing that they are out of all subs until likely after the holidays. In the end, I am going with a Submersive (a bit more money, but no doubt worth it). Good luck getting the response out of the sub you are looking for (or selling it and going another direction).

If you can hurry I would get the dts-10... Huge but easy to stick against a wall or under a seat.

Or if you wait you can look at craig (craigsub) new 18.2 and 18.1 subs and see how they pan out although no one complains with a submersive unless they are bass freaks and then they just want multiples of it
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