Official Epik Subwoofer Thread - Page 475

Originally Posted by crimsonwrath

Finally set up my Empire to where I think it sounds best in my listening position, and after running MCACC I definitely have to say it sounds amazing! Granted, I haven't had a subwoofer until now so nothing to compare to really, but I'm very glad I made the investment. Later on I will definitely have plans on adding at least one more. My first place I had it was in front, to the left of the TV, and it didn't sound very good. I did the sub crawl test and discovered a much more tight and powerful sound and feeling when I put it in the back corner next to the couch, at only a couple feet from the listening position. At first I didn't think that I would like it being that far away from the TV, where I would lose the simulated feeling of the bass coming from the TV, however I quickly got used to it.

Still haven't tweaked it as much as I can probably, but for the mean time it sounds and feels terrific.

Originally Posted by bsoko2

Manual adjustment of the sub gain does the same thing. You loose Audyssey on the subwoofer. Check with Chris.

Originally Posted by JHAz

I'm not sure. My understanding is that you have to invoke the receiver's EQ (bass and treble controls) to "turn off" the Audyssey corrections. Changing speaker levels or distances does not change the Audyssey corrections. Of course it does indeed change the overall FR from the Audyssey corrected FR. And it'll make dynamic EQ's compensations way over the top, potentially.

Originally Posted by bsoko2

But you are changing the sub volume at the gain and that impacts the set point on the gain at the time of calibration with Audyssey. What Audyssey saw is no longer there so the filter setting for that is no good. Now speakers can't be changed by more than + or - 3 db. Sub volume from the reciever the same and changing the sub gain at the sub is a no-no. Speakers have no gain because they are not powered at the speaker where the sub is.

Bill

Originally Posted by JHAz

Your receiver ignores all speaker level settings when running Audyssey. The corrections are the same regardless of the volume at which the tests are made. If different base corrections are required at 80 dB than at 95 dB to achieve the target curve, then all is lost and Audyssey cannot work correctly. Because I routinely put my volume control at different places. If the corrections are only "correct" at one volume level, then they're wrong most of the time in my house.

If you've ever done an Audyssey run where there was interference sound-wise, it willre-ping the same speaker at a higher level. If it can "hear" what is going on, it calculates its corrections based on that result. The dB level at which the test occurs does not affect the needed corrections to get to the target curve. If you have a 3 dB hump at 100 Hz, you have the same 3 dB hump at all volume levels until you start getting compression.

IOW, when I turn my sub channel down 1.5 dB, what happens in the sub channel is exactly the same thing that happens in the sub channel when I turn down my volume control 1.5 dB (leaving aside dynamic EQ/Volume). Same if I turn up the sub channel. The result in that channel is indistinguishable from what happens in the channel when I turn up the master volume by the same amount.

Originally Posted by corey99699

I just tried changing my crossover level in the AVR from 80 to 90 for my empires,didn't notice much difference with movies and TV but tried switching back and forth while listening to Dark side of the moon SACD came to the conclusion that it sounds much better to me at 90.Does anyone think this is too high to set them at?I have another question,If I lower the crossover to my front 3 from 80 to say 50 or 60,will this affect the LFE output in any way?

Originally Posted by bsoko2

+ or - 3 db has nothing to do with speaker volume from the receiver. It has to do with the signal strength of bass that is sent from the receiver to the sub. It also has to do with where the gain was set on the sub when the calibration was done. If you boost the signal volume at the sub you loose what Audyssey is doing. This is where the + or - 3 db rule comes into play with Audyssey. Go ahead and post this question on the Audyssey forum for Chris to answer. I no longer have anything Audyssey as I have gone back to MCACC. I didn't like the flat of Audyssey nor the contol that it has over the sub channel.

VBill

Originally Posted by JHAz

Describe what you mean by "you lose what Audyssey is doing."

When you turn up the sub, you turn it up. When you turn down the sub you turn it down. HWne you turn up the volume on your receiver, you turn up the volume, when you turn it down it turns it down. How do you think that changing the volume with one control versus with another changes Audyssey is doing? (leaving aside dynamic volume and dynamic EQ). It can't, AFAIK, for the reasons I tried to explain before. The Audyssey corrections are what they are, and they are the same, exactly the same, whether you listen at volume X or volume X + 10 dB. Nothing about the Audyssey corrections changes. If you've changed the sub output level or the volume level on the sub itself, the bass is either louder or quieter than it "should be' but the Audyssey corrections are exactly the same as they were before.

Originally Posted by THANKGOD4PLASMA

One of my children stepped on my Subwoofer cable that is hooked to my Empire, and the cable snapped at the connector, and the metal pin is jammed all the way inside!!! Sould I take this thing apart, or just start using the crossover connection? Is there a big difference in the two? What would any of you Empire fans do?

Originally Posted by bsoko2

I see that you know about the Audyssey forum. This is what Chris had to say about the sub gain moving or any other volume more than + or - 3 db with Audyssey:

Dynamic EQ has two components: static and dynamic (hence the name). The static component looks at the volume control setting and the trims and then makes an adjustment based on the loudness curve used in the model. The dynamic part is continuously looking at the content in each channel and making fine adjustments. The soft and loud parts of the content are being treated differently because they fall on different loudness curves. A boost or cut in the sub channel trim will shift this balance from what was intended. You would be in preference land.

As has already been stated, it's best to tweak the level in the AVR so you always know what exactly was done.
__________________
Chris



Bill

Originally Posted by vraxoin

I wish I could say that I knew of a trick to extract it, but I don't. I would call Chad at Epik and see what he says. In the meantime, you should be able to turn the crossover setting up to its max frequency and use that input for your LFE. Shouldn't really be much, if any, difference.

Edit: Here are a couple of suggestions that I found:

http://www.hometheaterforum.com/foru...in-on-servo-15

http://www.mp3car.com/vbulletin/car-...ml#post1256829

Originally Posted by THANKGOD4PLASMA

One of my children stepped on my Subwoofer cable that is hooked to my Empire, and the cable snapped at the connector, and the metal pin is jammed all the way inside!!! Sould I take this thing apart, or just start using the crossover connection? Is there a big difference in the two? What would any of you Empire fans do?

Originally Posted by THANKGOD4PLASMA

One of my children stepped on my Subwoofer cable that is hooked to my Empire, and the cable snapped at the connector, and the metal pin is jammed all the way inside!!! Sould I take this thing apart, or just start using the crossover connection? Is there a big difference in the two? What would any of you Empire fans do?

Originally Posted by shivaji

the Darla scene supposedly goes down to 10hz.

Originally Posted by dasanii19

Reading the Audyessy setup guide, it says to set the subwoofer to 120hz instead of 80hz (in the avr). Did I read this right?

Originally Posted by dasanii19

Reading the Audyessy setup guide, it says to set the subwoofer to 120hz instead of 80hz (in the avr). Did I read this right?

Originally Posted by bsoko2

The sub is as high as you can set it in the reciever and that usually is at 120 for the crossover.