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Copyright Protection Premium Cable Channels

post #1 of 96
8/27/07 at 3:11pm
Thread Starter 
I own two Toshiba DVD/VHS Recorders,one for the living room the other for my bedroom.I am using Sony DVD-RW discs to record movies off my premium Comcast movie channels.

It seems every movie I try to record I get a copyright warning which prevents me from recording it.This is so frustrating.I phoned Comcast and voiced my complaints to a customer service rep there and the guy told me he had no problems recording movies off those movie channels.He suggested I contact Toshiba which I did and they said the problem lied with the brand name media I was using to record.

My question is do certain brand name blank DVD's have these signals embedded in them to prevent copyright violations?If so then these Sony discs I am using are basically worthless?I can however record other broadcasts,it's only movies I run into problems recording.

Is anybody here running into the same issues I am?
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post #2 of 96
8/27/07 at 3:51pm
I have a Pio, not a Tosh, but from reading this forum, I see that is a common problem with the Toshiba, that it refuses to copy things even when they don't have copy protection. It is not the discs.
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post #3 of 96
8/28/07 at 4:51am
Thread Starter 
kjbawc

I've had my 2 Toshibas going on close to a year now and actually this copyright issue just became a major pain within the last month or so of trying to record.I don't know whether that indicates the studios are encoding more of their movies with signals or it's the cable company,or as you suggest Toshiba.

But like I said I had very little problem recording these movies with my unit in the past.I'm still not sure it might not be the 2 spindles of 50 Sony DVD blank disc causing the problem.
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post #4 of 96
8/28/07 at 5:20pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ARISTA View Post

kjbawc

I've had my 2 Toshibas going on close to a year now and actually this copyright issue just became a major pain within the last month or so of trying to record.I don't know whether that indicates the studios are encoding more of their movies with signals or it's the cable company,or as you suggest Toshiba.

But like I said I had very little problem recording these movies with my unit in the past.I'm still not sure it might not be the 2 spindles of 50 Sony DVD blank disc causing the problem.

If your Tosh is giving you a message that it can't record for copyright reasons, I'm near certain that can't be the discs. Try -Rs, instead of RWs, and see if they will record. If you have been recording fine up until now, but it is now happening almost all the time, my guess is that something new has been added at the cable head end, that the Tosh is mis-interpreting. But, that's just a guess...
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post #5 of 96
8/28/07 at 6:41pm
Thread Starter 
kjbawc






At this point your guess is just as good as any because I have none.You haven't encountered this issue and you record some movies off cable like I do?If the answer is no,what equipment are you working with?


I find it rather surprising that only you have responded to this inquiry.I would think many would be having the same problem I'm having.
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post #6 of 96
8/28/07 at 8:21pm
Yeah, I would expect some other Toshiba folks to speak up here...

I have Comcast cable, with a Moto 6412 box. I have NEVER had a copy protection issue, and I have recorded hundreds of things, many from premium channels, like HBO, and Cinemax, and even from VOD, on to my Pio 640's HDD, then to disc.
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post #7 of 96
8/29/07 at 3:46pm
Just to chime in as another Toshi owner.

Recently spent time cleaning up the hdd on my Toshiba XS35, the copy protection I ran into was all that we had recorded from Encore channels (Dish Sat SD the only premiums I have) were listed as copy never on the hdd. The programs were there and played fine from the hdd.

Not sure what would have happened with a dub (though it did seem to go)because I then started having issues with it not correctly recognizing my Verbatim VideoGard ram disks (did the same with panny rams not long ago) and other problems, just ran out of time to mess with it anymore. Ended after a very frustrating morning just deleting most of the programs to get room on the drive.

I plan on a day in the next week to try again. test, check and troubleshoot, will let you know what happens.
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post #8 of 96
8/30/07 at 1:07pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by kjbawc View Post

Yeah, I would expect some other Toshiba folks to speak up here...

I have Comcast cable, with a Moto 6412 box. I have NEVER had a copy protection issue, and I have recorded hundreds of things, many from premium channels, like HBO, and Cinemax, and even from VOD, on to my Pio 640's HDD, then to disc.


I subscribe to Comcast too.You mention Moto6412?I don't believe I've ever heard of that brand name for a DVD player or recorder.
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post #9 of 96
8/30/07 at 1:24pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Demuddle View Post

Just to chime in as another Toshi owner.

Recently spent time cleaning up the hdd on my Toshiba XS35, the copy protection I ran into was all that we had recorded from Encore channels (Dish Sat SD the only premiums I have) were listed as copy never on the hdd. The programs were there and played fine from the hdd.

Not sure what would have happened with a dub (though it did seem to go)because I then started having issues with it not correctly recognizing my Verbatim VideoGard ram disks (did the same with panny rams not long ago) and other problems, just ran out of time to mess with it anymore. Ended after a very frustrating morning just deleting most of the programs to get room on the drive.

I plan on a day in the next week to try again. test, check and troubleshoot, will let you know what happens.


Demuddle

I understand a good deal of what you're saying.You mention the Encore channels.I have noticed many of their movies along with Starz will send out a copyright protected signal.Not surprising since Encore/Stars are basically one and the same.

I'm not exactly sure what Verbatim VideoGard ram disks are and do.So I'll wait for your next reply to maybe clear that up for me.
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post #10 of 96
9/1/07 at 4:58pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ARISTA View Post

I subscribe to Comcast too.You mention Moto6412?I don't believe I've ever heard of that brand name for a DVD player or recorder.

A "Moto6412" is a Motorola 6412 HD DVR cable box, supplied to me by Comcast.
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post #11 of 96
9/2/07 at 10:49am
ive started getting the copyright notice also in the last two months on my comcast sa8000hd stbs for starz. hbo, max, others have had the protection ever since ive had the boxes, 3 yrs. this is w/ 2 tosh dr2s and pan es15. i dont know whos originating the messages, studio, cable co., ?? i strictly use -r discs that are on sale, sony, memorex, tdk, etc.
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post #12 of 96
9/2/07 at 12:53pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ARISTA View Post

Demuddle

I understand a good deal of what you're saying. You mention the Encore channels.I have noticed many of their movies along with Starz will send out a copyright protected signal. Not surprising since Encore/Stars are basically one and the same.

I'm not exactly sure what Verbatim VideoGard ram disks are and do. So I'll wait for your next reply to maybe clear that up for me.

I can't say I was surprised that they were protected, just expected maybe a copy once rather than copy never.

Verbatim VideoGard = Just a dvd in ram format with an extra layer of scratch protection.
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post #13 of 96
9/2/07 at 3:53pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Demuddle View Post

I can't say I was surprised that they were protected, just expected maybe a copy once rather than copy never.

Verbatim VideoGard = Just a dvd in ram format with an extra layer of scratch protection.

I believe a copy-once flag does not mean you can copy it once to any media of you choice, but rather to CPRM compliant media, such as RAM or DVD-RW. For example, on a Panasonic HDD recorder you can record a copy-once program to the HDD or RAM but not anything else. If recorded to the HDD, you can only burn it off to a RAM disk and when you do the unit automatically deletes the first copy off of the HDD. If you go the reverse back to the HDD, it is deleted from the RAM upon transfer. That way you can only have 1 copy of the program - period.
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post #14 of 96
9/3/07 at 3:25pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by westgate View Post

ive started getting the copyright notice also in the last two months on my comcast sa8000hd stbs for starz. hbo, max, others have had the protection ever since ive had the boxes, 3 yrs. this is w/ 2 tosh dr2s and pan es15. i dont know whos originating the messages, studio, cable co., ?? i strictly use -r discs that are on sale, sony, memorex, tdk, etc.

westgate

You're experiencing the same thing?It is a mystery just where those signals are coming from.I will take your advice however.I'll try the DVD-R instead.Hopefully that will clear most of this problem up.
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post #15 of 96
9/3/07 at 3:28pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Demuddle View Post

I can't say I was surprised that they were protected, just expected maybe a copy once rather than copy never.

Verbatim VideoGard = Just a dvd in ram format with an extra layer of scratch protection.


Demuddle

Thanks I never heard of the Verbatim VG before.I'm using the Sony 50 spindle DVD-RW.Guess I'll just have to put them away and try the DVD-R instead.
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post #16 of 96
9/3/07 at 7:10pm
I doubt that DVD-R is going to work. DVD-RAM might, but I've run into the same problem posted above with my XS35 not recognizing my panny DVD-RAM disks anymore.

The content providers and/or cable companies are definitely applying more copy protection signals - probably because they're moving to digital. Anyway, it's a real pain in the arse.

Luckily my Sony HX-900 ignores them, the XS-35 is OK for most things, though.
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post #17 of 96
9/3/07 at 7:35pm
AFAIK, There is only one device out there which can change the state of the CGMS flag to Copy Always. It is the Video Filter.
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post #18 of 96
9/4/07 at 7:52am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bron View Post

I doubt that DVD-R is going to work. DVD-RAM might, but I've run into the same problem posted above with my XS35 not recognizing my panny DVD-RAM disks anymore.

The content providers and/or cable companies are definitely applying more copy protection signals - probably because they're moving to digital. Anyway, it's a real pain in the arse.

Luckily my Sony HX-900 ignores them, the XS-35 is OK for most things, though.


bron

You're suggesting I not try DVD-R and that DVD-RAM might do the trick?Yes it's actually happening then,these providers/cable companies/studios are applying more and more protection signals.


Either way and whoever the culprit is,they are getting our money subscribing to watch their films.I feel we have a right to be able to record movies for our own personal use at home.Certainly those pictures released back in the '90's.I was so shocked that I wasn't able to record a few of those because of the copyright signal.Just outrageous.
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post #19 of 96
9/4/07 at 8:53am
Who is the "technical" culprit? FWIW - I can record to HDD AND copy to DVD from all my premium channels (HBO, SHO, TMC, STAR, CMAX), with no problem. In fact, I don't even know what these "flags" look like. I am using TWC in NYC, and a Philips 3575 DVDR - so it's not the cable company, nor the content itself. The DVDR reportedly uses copy protection. But it's yet to be triggered...
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post #20 of 96
9/4/07 at 9:30am
Quote:
Originally Posted by ARISTA View Post

bron

You're suggesting I not try DVD-R and that DVD-RAM might do the trick?Yes it's actually happening then,these providers/cable companies/studios are applying more and more protection signals.


Either way and whoever the culprit is,they are getting our money subscribing to watch their films.I feel we have a right to be able to record movies for our own personal use at home.Certainly those pictures released back in the '90's.I was so shocked that I wasn't able to record a few of those because of the copyright signal.Just outrageous.

this is just another example of "the fleecing of america." hi, fellow sheep(s)!
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post #21 of 96
9/5/07 at 1:13am
Quote:
Originally Posted by ARISTA View Post

I feel we have a right to be able to record movies for our own personal use at home.Certainly those pictures released back in the '90's.I was so shocked that I wasn't able to record a few of those because of the copyright signal.Just outrageous.

Google "ATX 500".
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post #22 of 96
9/5/07 at 7:45am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rammitinski View Post

Google "ATX 500".


Rammitinski


Interesting,do you yourself use one and if so how effective are they?Will they actually work with Comcast?

BTW:Took me a minute to figure out screen name,lol, funny funny.
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post #23 of 96
9/5/07 at 8:01am
Anyone having any problems with the SciFi channel? I have my Cox digital cable box hooked up to my Panasonic EZ-17K via S-Video. It won't record the premiere episode of Flash Gordon since the first week. Oddly, it records repeats of it just fine. At first, I thought it was a glitch in the EZ-17K since I just hooked the cable box to it and started timer recording the digital cable channels that way. It seems like more than a coincidence after a few weeks of the same. The first time I had set it as a one time recording and the timer showed it greyed out after, as if it had failed to record. After subsequently setting it to every Friday, the timer setting just passes by but there is nothing recorded to the disc.

BTW - The JVC DH30000 D-VHS deck also removes CGMS flags, even if you just pass the video thru it and record with another device.
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post #24 of 96
9/5/07 at 10:31am
Quote:
Originally Posted by HomeVideoGuy View Post

Anyone having any problems with the SciFi channel? I have my Cox digital cable box hooked up to my Panasonic EZ-17K via S-Video. It won't record the premiere episode of Flash Gordon since the first week. Oddly, it records repeats of it just fine. At first, I thought it was a glitch in the EZ-17K since I just hooked the cable box to it and started timer recording the digital cable channels that way. It seems like more than a coincidence after a few weeks of the same. The first time I had set it as a one time recording and the timer showed it greyed out after, as if it had failed to record. After subsequently setting it to every Friday, the timer setting just passes by but there is nothing recorded to the disc.

BTW - The JVC DH30000 D-VHS deck also removes CGMS flags, even if you just pass the video thru it and record with another device.

who is the actual manufacturer of your cox stb? some sa8000hd/8300hd stbs cause issues w/ panasonic dvdrs like slow or no response from remote controls when hooked up w/ s vid or composite cables (which is the only way i know of).
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post #25 of 96
9/5/07 at 10:48am
Quote:
Originally Posted by westgate View Post

who is the actual manufacturer of your cox stb? some sa8000hd/8300hd stbs cause issues w/ panasonic dvdrs like slow or no response from remote controls when hooked up w/ s vid or composite cables (which is the only way i know of).

Turning Daylight Saving Time (DST) OFF should make Pannys run better when hooked to certain cable boxes from certain providers. They prob. uploaded the NEW DST programming but the Panny has the OLD DST programming. They conflict in many different and strange ways. (Might also need a reset before setting DST off, but may not be necessary.)
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post #26 of 96
9/5/07 at 10:55am
Quote:
Originally Posted by wabjxo View Post

Turning Daylight Saving Time (DST) OFF should make Pannys run better when hooked to certain cable boxes from certain providers. They prob. uploaded the NEW DST programming but the Panny has the OLD DST programming. They conflict in many different and strange ways. (Might also need a reset before setting DST off, but may not be necessary.)

i tried that but it didnt seem to make any difference. i inserted a sima ct-2 into the s video circuit which 'isolates' the two components and alleviates the problem. just dumb luck on my part. i realize that that may not be possible for most people.
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post #27 of 96
9/5/07 at 11:14am
Quote:
Originally Posted by westgate View Post

i tried that but it didnt seem to make any difference. i inserted a sima ct-2 into the s video circuit which 'isolates' the two components and alleviates the problem. just dumb luck on my part. i realize that that may not be possible for most people.

Westgate, I'm trying to collect info on the DST problem and there are some steps I'm not sure are necessary or not. I wonder if you recall:

1. Did you disconnect all inputs from your RF/STB first.
2. Did you reset your DVDR before setting DST OFF.
2. Did you set your clock manually instead of on Auto?
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post #28 of 96
9/5/07 at 11:23am
Off hand, I think my cable box is a Scientific Atlanta. I'd have to verify. I am not using it to control the Panny though. I set them both seperately and record off IN1.


I already turned DST to off a long time ago. That's the only reason my EZ-17K has been working so well.

BTW, I thought the Sima CT-2 removed CGMS flags. Probably not dumb luck after all.

Oh well, it is not a big deal. I just record the repeat airings later in the week. I just thought it was more than a coincidence after 4 or more weeks now. But why they would stop you from recording the first airing and not later repeat airings is beyond me.
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post #29 of 96
9/5/07 at 12:07pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ARISTA View Post

Rammitinski

Interesting,do you yourself use one and if so how effective are they? Will they actually work with Comcast?

Judging by what I've read here, they seem to work more often than not.

As far as Comcast specifically, I don't know. I never really paid that much attention to the providers people have mentioned, but I recall they have mentioned both cable and satellite. I guess you can just search here under Sima (it's the same device), and see what kind of information you can unearth.

I just got a Sima ct200 last week (it's predecessor), but I haven't had a chance to use it yet. I don't seem to have any problems recording things from Dish, anyway - at least not with the 3 older recorders I've got.
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post #30 of 96
9/5/07 at 5:30pm
With my original Comcast Pace DVR, I was getting the copywrite problem with certain History Channel programs. Since I upgraded to the Comcast Motorola DVR, that problem is not there.
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