The NAD T775/T785 AVRs w/ HDMI 1.3 Thread! - Page 10

This is a good point. I'll probably end up doing something like this in the future.

Not to be a wet blanket, but it's not really biamping because both sets of amps are still getting full range instead of freq-divided signals, so they're still subject to voltage clipping from the low and high freq signals adding together.

And the amp power is still going through the speakers' passive XO components.

The biggest benefit, though likely only audible when driving the system to its limits, is less load on the power supply by only driving tweeters w/two of the channels, but you could do the same thing by just not using those channels at all.

Tried it once. I have B&W 703's and I tried out a Sony 5200 ES a few months ago (my current Sony 5ES doesn't support bi-amp). I didn't notice an appreciable difference, but it may be due to the 5200's lack of power.

New Review of NAD T955 100x5 PowerAmp:
www.hometheatersound.com/equipment/nad_t955.htm

I was looking at reviews of the of the T773, a 110x7 rec'r. Anyone familiar with rec'rs know that lots of them can't put out anywhere near their rated output when driven into 5 or 7 channels, and that the power at 20Hz is way lower than the power at 1k Hz.

Here are two reviews results with the 110x7 watt NAD T773:

5 chans driven into 8 ohms: 105 wpc (HT mag)

7 chans driven into 8 ohms @ 20Hz: 103 wpc;
into 4 ohms @ 20 Hz: 120 wpc
7 chans driven into 8 ohms @ 1kHZ: 108wpc;
into 4 ohms @ 1kHz: 131 wpc (Ultimate AV Mag)

Few rec'rs can begin to compare.

I'll be very interested to see review measurements for the T775 when someone gets around to reviewing it. I anticipate more of the same...you have to hand it to NAD--they don't fudge their specifications.

If you bi-amp the fronts, can you still play through the A & B speakers at the same time? I know the manual says that when both A&B are selected then the source is downmixed to stereo. Wasn't sure if that meant the back surround outputs would still be active for bi-amping?

I don't see why that wouldn't work.

Hello,

the manuals for the T7x5 series is now online at the NAD site.

This means that I am unlikely to buy one of these NAD receivers.

Right on, in fact what he was calling "biamping" is commonly referred to as biwiring, i have done it on my front stage, benefit is there but many will argue it makes no difference at low amp loads.

The T785 manual is not available for download on the NAD site. The 775 is.

which other [new] surround processors, or receivers for example, decode a native DSD bit-stream? (ie. Integra DTS-9.8?, new Denon recievers?, new Yamaha receivers?, etc.,..)

It should be pretty well identical except for a few small facts on weight/size/power, etc. The remote might be different, I forget. I haven't seen the remote on the T785.

There would be no real difference though. If the SACD player can turn it into a PCM signal it is the same as the NAD taking it in and then decoding it with a PCM DAC. Besides, what's the point of having expensive DSD DACs on an SACD player if you plan on avoiding them entirely.

so we should be able to play multi-channel SACD sources via-HDMI with the NAD T775/T785/T175?

If the SACD can reformat the signal as PCM, I don't see why not.

the reason why I'm asking is that I'd like to interface, both, my Denon DVD-3930CI and Oppo DV-980H players to the T175 using HDMI (for audio and video).

I believe the Oppo will do PCM
http://www.oppodigital.com/dv980h/default.asp

Althoug I'm not sure abut the Denon
http://usa.denon.com/ProductDetails/3297.asp

I may just run the Denon using, both, the T175 multi-channel inputs and HDMI, and connect the Oppo via-HDMI only.

Yeah, the Oppo looks like it will convert SACD to PCM for HDMI, but you wouldn't be able to use the DSD output over HDMI. I can't say for sure, it's not specific, but it does mention SACD over HDMI, then also mentions DSD over HDMI.

yeah, from what I gather on the Oppo DV-980 thread this player [does] output DSD for SACD sources. Although I guess I could'nt use it anyway as the T175 will not decode it.

Appreciate your input!

Well, I'm saying that it *might* convert it to PCM. Just check to see if there's a setting for that.

I don't claim to have a complete understanding of the differences in DAC's for DSD vs. PCM, but I would think some would argue that a "native" DSD DAC would be beneficial when listening to SACD, because it should be able to decode the DSD stream at its native 2.8Mhz sampling rate. The way I understand it, when the DSD stream is converted to PCM, it must of course be down-converted to whatever rate the PCM DAC's are capable of decoding, which in the case of the new NAD's is 192Khz. Again I'm not an acoustical engineer, but I would think there is some sort of compromise that occurs in this process. For example, if I understand it correctly, when one is listening to an SACD over multichannel HDMI from, say, a PS3 that has converted the DSD stream to PCM, what one is really hearing is a PCM sampling of the DSD stream itself. Does this conversion create an audible degradation? Probably not, but the purists might argue otherwise, and after all this should be expected as those that back SACD (DSD) contend the superiority of the format against those that back DVD-A (PCM). With these things in mind I can understand why some are bothered that a DSD stream cannot be decoded by the NAD.

I would assume that including a DSD DAC-set would probably have driven the cost of these units beyond a level that NAD deemed acceptable...

One thing that I just realized and may push me from the NAD to the Denon is the lack of inputs. I need inputs for dvd, hd-dvd, phono, dvr/cable tv, tape and MD. Granted I seldom use the cassette and MD anymore, but I have them and would like to keep them connected. So I'm already short an input for one of my units and if I get the IPod dock then I need to disconnect another. My Sony 5ES handles all of these with a couple to spare.

Slightly off topic but,... The dvd player is connected now to a 7.1 input and optical input. 7.1 is for playing SACDs and optical for regular CDs. I could conceivably only connect the dvd player to 7.1 input on the NAD, but the problem I see is that on the 5ES, I don't get any output to the SUB if I'm playing regular CDs. I assume that is because 7.1 input only sends to the speakers what it receives. Not sure if can tell the dvd player (Sony 555es) to send to the SUB output when playing stereo CDs?

Phil, you could set up different presets that would allow you to hook up as much as you want. I'd have to count though, I find it hard to believe you need more!

yeah, it looks like the DV-980H does convert DSD to PCM:


So I will connect the Oppo to the T175 via-HDMI only (for audio and video). While the Denon will be interfaced to the T175 using 5.1ch multi-channel inputs as well as HDMI.

As far as I know only Oppo players (980 at least) can output SACD as PCM over HDMI. The other players I looked at could not do that. For instance, the Denon players cannot nor the Yamaha, or the Marantz for that matter.

So does the PS3.

OK, Looking at the "Quick Start" chart in the manual, I thought there was just Source1-4 and iPod that you have defined for back connections plus the Source7 for 7.1 input and then 2 inputs for the front panel audio and mini-stereo inputs.

I just looked further in the manual under Source Setup and it says there are 10 configurable Sources! So there are 2 more unused/undefined sources besides the 8 predefined and looks like you could set up so that the front inputs are not used and get 2 more rear inputs.

Thanks!

My Pioneer DV-600AV player can also output SACD as PCM over HDMI

Ken

Hi Ken,

I tried the new Yamaha 3800 over the weekend but the video side let it down to the Onkyo 905 - The Reon wins hands down - so I took it back this morning

Any news yet on the 785 arriving over here?

Hi mate,

1st week in December for the T785 In UK - possibly a little sooner according to Nad - a nice early toy for Christmas then

Ken