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The NAD T775/T785 AVRs w/ HDMI 1.3 Thread! - Page 21

post #601 of 4166
12/17/07 at 10:41am
Totem has used Arcam in CEDIA and CES shows for years to drive their speakers. I doubt if they feel the resultant sound is 'too bright'.
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post #602 of 4166
12/17/07 at 4:51pm
My T785 has finally shipped to me today. I hope to have it hooked up for the weekend. I have not seen any reviews yet so I am assuming everyone that has these on order has been waiting like me? I know people were having 1080p problems with the T775, but I will not be able to test this feature. My pioneer elite plasma only goes to 768 with the capability of 1080p/24. Anyway, I will report back when I have more.
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post #603 of 4166
12/17/07 at 9:26pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by sstiles4 View Post

My T785 has finally shipped to me today

great!

Quote:
Originally Posted by sstiles4 View Post

people were having 1080p problems with the T775, but I will not be able to test this feature. My pioneer elite plasma only goes to 768 with the capability of 1080p/24

same here. But you should still be able to "pass" a 1080p signal to the Pioneer, it should still process it (if I'm correct)?
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post #604 of 4166
12/17/07 at 10:15pm
Yes, all the 8G Kuros accept 1080p (both /24 and /60).
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post #605 of 4166
12/18/07 at 9:30am
Quote:
Originally Posted by GaryMB View Post

Yes, all the 8G Kuros accept 1080p (both /24 and /60).

I have a 7th Generation Elite 1140, which does accept 1080p/24. I just assumed the problem was different. I still need a source to pass the 1080p/24. I have been putting off buying an HD or BR player because I wass hoping to get the Samsung BD-UP5000 that plays both. However the early reviews are not so good. My next decision is in that area.
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post #606 of 4166
12/19/07 at 8:36am
Quote:
Originally Posted by thekiwibloke View Post

really made me question NADs Quality Assurance commitment for the new audio formats - especially when my brother in law has had no luck getting a subwoofer bug fixed in his older NAD receiver (could be New Zealand's NAD support).

Raymond

I was dead set on purchasing the T785 when my dealer talked me out of it. He told me if I wanted it he would order it but told me to get plenty of opinions before doing so because of NAD's quality and customer service in the past years. I have been a diehard NAD fan for years still using my 7240PE 2 channel receiver on a daily basis. I went with a less expensive brand for now hoping to be able to audition a T785 once they are on display and NAD gets some of the bugs worked out. Hopefully this will happen, I really want to get back to the NAD basics of great power and sound.
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post #607 of 4166
12/19/07 at 9:08am
Well, you never know. I've sold lots of brands and they've all had lemons, including Sony ES, Nakamichi, Denon. What I can tell you is that NAD has put a *lot* of energy into reliability with the new units and it's a totally ground up design, at least partly for that reason. And NAD has been *very* good with me about handling customer problems with older units.
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post #608 of 4166
12/19/07 at 10:02am
HT1 - I think your dealer is still under the assumption that NAD has severe quality control issues. I use the word "severe" because their receivers from 3 to 4 years ago had numerous problems (T7_3 and T7_4 series) and failure rates, prompting a number of loyal NAD dealers to either drop NAD entirely or to just carry NAD's 2 channel lineup since NAD's Home Theater gear caused dealers nothing but headaches and servicing nightmares.

I think this is what prompted NAD to go back to the drawing board with their new generation of gear. New production partners were found and new architecture was developed to help avoid all the problems of the past few years. I hope all of this results in new dealer commitment but I guess we will have to wait and see how the reliability of this new gen gear holds up before apprehensive dealers beigin to test the waters again.

I spent the better part of yesterday trying to track down a NAD dealer who would sell me a T-175. NAD's website listed 14 dealers in my area, of which, after calling them all, only 2 dealers carried NAD's home theater gear. Of the two, only one dealer actually had any of NAD's new product on the showroom floor. The other would only special order the gear for me at MSRP.

I will say that I do like NAD gear. I had the T-754 for a year or so and liked how it sounded but I had too many problems with the unit to hang onto it. That said, I truly hope their new gear is in a different league from a reliability standpoint and that it helps broaden the dealer network. When NAD gear works, it sounds great - truly different from the rest of the pack. It would be nice to see them return to the stature they once held in the early 1980s.
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post #609 of 4166
12/19/07 at 10:17am
Quote:
Originally Posted by m@rkus View Post

HT1 - I think your dealer is still under the assumption that NAD has severe quality control issues. I use the word "severe" because their receivers from 3 to 4 years ago had numerous problems (T7_3 and T7_4 series) and failure rates, prompting a number of loyal NAD dealers to either drop NAD entirely or to just carry NAD's 2 channel lineup since NAD's Home Theater gear caused dealers nothing but headaches and servicing nightmares.

Well, more like T7x1 and T7x2 series, with far fewer of those problems in the T7x3 series and pretty close to none in T7x4. Still, some of the issues remained because of the design, hence the new design. We had *worse* problems with B&Ks from that era and while B&K kept telling me I was the only one and no problems existed except for my ridiculous failure rate, NAD stepped up to the plate and resolved things on a case by case basis.
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post #610 of 4166
12/19/07 at 1:23pm
I finally received my T785 today. A lot of people have been asking me where I purchased the receiver. Like many others NAD shows a few local dealers in my area, but none of them were going to stock the 785. One was stocking the 765 and maybe the 775. Of course they would special order the 785 for me at either full retail or just below it.

I purchased the receiver from Saturday Audio. They have a website saturdayaudio.com. They are an authorized dealer out of Chicago. I live in upstate NY and they shipped it to me on Monday and it was here today. I dealt with Andy and the price he gave me included shipping and no sales tax. Since I am not suppose to say specific prices here I will say i paid between $2,000 to $2,400, and again that included shipping and insurance. Thats much better then the full retail price of 2,999.00 plus tax. I also used Saturday Audio for my Monitor Audio speakers, so I feel pretty comfortable saying I would use them again.
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post #611 of 4166
12/19/07 at 5:27pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by webhammer View Post

Totem has used Arcam in CEDIA and CES shows for years to drive their speakers. I doubt if they feel the resultant sound is 'too bright'.

It was just my opinion. . . .
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post #612 of 4166
12/19/07 at 10:28pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alimentall View Post

Well, you never know. I've sold lots of brands and they've all had lemons, including Sony ES, Nakamichi, Denon. What I can tell you is that NAD has put a *lot* of energy into reliability with the new units and it's a totally ground up design, at least partly for that reason. And NAD has been *very* good with me about handling customer problems with older units.

It's good to hear someone has had good experiences with NAD lately. My 775 was a total lemon and I can't get any response from NAD suport. If I didn't know any better, I'd think NAD is going out of business because of the problems with the latest models and they let all their people go. My dealer is getting a replacement for me in the next few days so I hope to see if it was a just a bad unit. I would HIGHLY recommend anybody thinking about the 775 to look elsewhere.

This was my first ever NAD component and if the replacement is anything like the first one, it will be my last.

In case you're wondering what was the problem... it couldn't handle 1080p very well. It also had issues with 1080i. It sent random pops and snaps to my speakers. And on top of all that, the poor support.

Other than that, it's a great unit.
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post #613 of 4166
12/19/07 at 11:42pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrTaxMan View Post

Batteries in remote would only last two weeks

approximately how long have you had your T775?
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post #614 of 4166
12/20/07 at 6:34am
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrTaxMan View Post

In case you're wondering what was the problem... it couldn't handle 1080p very well. It also had issues with 1080i. It sent random pops and snaps to my speakers. It couldn't 'remember' speaker settings. Batteries in remote would only last two weeks. And on top of all that, the poor support.

Other than that, it's a great unit.

Did you check/update the firmware version?
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post #615 of 4166
12/20/07 at 8:25am
I am thorughly disappointed and discouraged by the new NAD products. After reading that NAD was acutely aware of the problems with past unit's reliability, and was designing the new units from the ground up with reliability in mind, I was looking forward to the new NAD products. it is clear NAD did not meet its goal.

First there was the problem with no audio passing via HDMI. Sure NAD fixed it, but the new units should never have been released with so glaring a problem. Word has it the new units were delayed to get the best HDMI 1.3a boards. And NAD releases them with no audio?

Then there was the problem with passing 1080p. It turns out that if the firmware was 1.07 or higher, the problem was resolved. NAD should NEVER have released units without updating the firmware before shipping them out. The current firmware version is 1.12. I wonder what the variety of firmware versions is in the units released? My guess is few have 1.12.

Then there are the reports of the individual problems, like the dealer with a T175 who can only get HDMI Input #3 to work. And the post above. Or how about no one being able to figure out how to switch inputs with the remote that comes with the T785? Poor manual or defect?

To give NAD the benefit of the doubt, maybe its engineers did design reliable, great units and NAD picked a lousy factory to build them. Beyond doubt is that the quality control at the factory is non existant. And the units were released before they were ready to be shipped out.

I had intended on getting two T785s (2 systems). When the problems first showed up, I figured it was just the usual kinks in a new product that would be worked out, and I'd wait for that to happen before getting them.

It is now obvious that that is not going to happen any time soon, if at all. Add in the number of individually defective units showing up, and I must rate NAD's attempt to reform its reliability reputation as a dismal failure.

People have complained lately about the slowness of NAD to respond to problems. I am sure this is because they are absolutly inunditated with calls and emails about defective units.

I wanted the NAD T785 for its sound quality, straight forward design, simplicity of use, etc. I have abandoned that idea. I have no desire to buy Onkyo, Pioneer, Denon, Yamaha, and their ilk. Read the reviews of their rec'rs. There is always some criticism of the sound quality (at least in www.ultimateav.com ) as opposed to the accolades that NADs get about their sound quality.

The only other brands that I have found with similar accolades about sound quality are B&K, and, oddly, Sherwood Newcastle. (Of course, B&K has its own problems on initial release on new units.) Arcam is good, but its rec'rs HDMI switching/processing is 1.1 video only, eliminating them (same w/Rotel BTW).

So it appars my next rec'r will be a B&K AVR707 or Sherwood Newcastle R-972 (W/Trinnov room eq). Any other suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

I would still like to get the T785s. But, at this point, I see little short of a miracle, that would solve the problems with the new NAD units.

I posted long ago a somewhat similar post, much shorter, and was accused of being pessimistic. I don't think that accusation will stand anymore; I am simply being realistic.
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post #616 of 4166
12/20/07 at 9:03am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Whitehead View Post

I am thorughly disappointed and discouraged by the new NAD products. After reading that NAD was acutely aware of the problems with past unit's reliability, and was designing the new units from the ground up with reliability in mind, I was looking forward to the new NAD products. it is clear NAD did not meet its goal.

First there was the problem with no audio passing via HDMI. Sure NAD fixed it, but the new units should never have been released with so glaring a problem. Word has it the new units were delayed to get the best HDMI 1.3a boards. And NAD releases them with no audio?

Then there was the problem with passing 1080p. It turns out that if the firmware was 1.07 or higher, the problem was resolved. NAD should NEVER have released units without updating the firmware before shipping them out. The current firmware version is 1.12. I wonder what the variety of firmware versions is in the units released? My guess is few have 1.12.

Then there are the reports of the individual problems, like the dealer with a T175 who can only get HDMI Input #3 to work. And the post above. Or how about no one being able to figure out how to switch inputs with the remote that comes with the T785? Poor manual or defect?

To give NAD the benefit of the doubt, maybe its engineers did design reliable, great units and NAD picked a lousy factory to build them. Beyond doubt is that the quality control at the factory is non existant. And the units were released before they were ready to be shipped out.

I had intended on getting two T785s (2 systems). When the problems first showed up, I figured it was just the usual kinks in a new product that would be worked out, and I'd wait for that to happen before getting them.

It is now obvious that that is not going to happen any time soon, if at all. Add in the number of individually defective units showing up, and I must rate NAD's attempt to reform its reliability reputation as a dismal failure.

People have complained lately about the slowness of NAD to respond to problems. I am sure this is because they are absolutly inunditated with calls and emails about defective units.

I wanted the NAD T785 for its sound quality, straight forward design, simplicity of use, etc. I have abandoned that idea. I have no desire to buy Onkyo, Pioneer, Denon, Yamaha, and their ilk. Read the reviews of their rec'rs. There is always some criticism of the sound quality (at least in www.ultimateav.com ) as opposed to the accolades that NADs get about their sound quality.

The only other brands that I have found with similar accolades about sound quality are B&K, and, oddly, Sherwood Newcastle. (Of course, B&K has its own problems on initial release on new units.) Arcam is good, but its rec'rs HDMI switching/processing is 1.1 video only, eliminating them (same w/Rotel BTW).

So it appars my next rec'r will be a B&K AVR707 or Sherwood Newcastle R-972 (W/Trinnov room eq). Any other suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

I would still like to get the T785s. But, at this point, I see little short of a miracle, that would solve the problems with the new NAD units.

I posted long ago a somewhat similar post, much shorter, and was accused of being pessimistic. I don't think that accusation will stand anymore; I am simply being realistic.

Have you looked at the Marantz SR8002? I have been comparing features between the T775 and it, and was wondering how their sound quality compares.
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post #617 of 4166
12/20/07 at 9:23am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Whitehead View Post

I posted long ago a somewhat similar post, much shorter, and was accused of being pessimistic. I don't think that accusation will stand anymore; I am simply being realistic.

Good god, I'm upgrading you from "pessimistic" to "suicidal"! You know, NAD can't win. If they sit on product to iron out every little software bug, then the RWs of the world hammer them. If they bring out product early to meet demand knowing that they're going to have to drop in a software upgrade, they get hammered.

By this standard, you don't own a PC or a Mac, so how to you get online to say all this stuff? I think if you skip out on buying a T785 because NAD put out a software fix for something, you're crazy and you're only doing it to yourself. What's next, you won't like the brown boxes they come in?

You know, there are people that are homeless or have cancer or just had a death in the family. Are we THAT consumeristic and "me, me, me" that it's come to this?!? Unbelievable.
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post #618 of 4166
12/20/07 at 9:24am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Whitehead View Post

I am thorughly disappointed and discouraged by the new NAD products. After reading that NAD was acutely aware of the problems with past unit's reliability, and was designing the new units from the ground up with reliability in mind, I was looking forward to the new NAD products. it is clear NAD did not meet its goal.

First there was the problem with no audio passing via HDMI. Sure NAD fixed it, but the new units should never have been released with so glaring a problem. Word has it the new units were delayed to get the best HDMI 1.3a boards. And NAD releases them with no audio?

Then there was the problem with passing 1080p. It turns out that if the firmware was 1.07 or higher, the problem was resolved. NAD should NEVER have released units without updating the firmware before shipping them out. The current firmware version is 1.12. I wonder what the variety of firmware versions is in the units released? My guess is few have 1.12.

Then there are the reports of the individual problems, like the dealer with a T175 who can only get HDMI Input #3 to work. And the post above. Or how about no one being able to figure out how to switch inputs with the remote that comes with the T785? Poor manual or defect?

To give NAD the benefit of the doubt, maybe its engineers did design reliable, great units and NAD picked a lousy factory to build them. Beyond doubt is that the quality control at the factory is non existant. And the units were released before they were ready to be shipped out.

I had intended on getting two T785s (2 systems). When the problems first showed up, I figured it was just the usual kinks in a new product that would be worked out, and I'd wait for that to happen before getting them.

It is now obvious that that is not going to happen any time soon, if at all. Add in the number of individually defective units showing up, and I must rate NAD's attempt to reform its reliability reputation as a dismal failure.

People have complained lately about the slowness of NAD to respond to problems. I am sure this is because they are absolutly inunditated with calls and emails about defective units.

I wanted the NAD T785 for its sound quality, straight forward design, simplicity of use, etc. I have abandoned that idea. I have no desire to buy Onkyo, Pioneer, Denon, Yamaha, and their ilk. Read the reviews of their rec'rs. There is always some criticism of the sound quality (at least in www.ultimateav.com ) as opposed to the accolades that NADs get about their sound quality.

The only other brands that I have found with similar accolades about sound quality are B&K, and, oddly, Sherwood Newcastle. (Of course, B&K has its own problems on initial release on new units.) Arcam is good, but its rec'rs HDMI switching/processing is 1.1 video only, eliminating them (same w/Rotel BTW).

So it appars my next rec'r will be a B&K AVR707 or Sherwood Newcastle R-972 (W/Trinnov room eq). Any other suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

I would still like to get the T785s. But, at this point, I see little short of a miracle, that would solve the problems with the new NAD units.

I posted long ago a somewhat similar post, much shorter, and was accused of being pessimistic. I don't think that accusation will stand anymore; I am simply being realistic.

Robert,

I have been following the threads for a while myself and like you want NAD for its clean sound. I had my 785 on order and was going to cancel after hearing the stories on here about the 775, but then kept asking myself what would I get instead of the 785? Like you I am not interested in the Onkyo, Pioneer, Yamaha, etc that offers all of the bells and whistles but suffer in sound and quality control. If you look at those threads they are loaded with people complaining about defects and features that dont perform as they should.

The way I look at it is that with all threads you usually only get people writing if they have problems, either to find help or just bash the company because they are upset about the receiver. Most people that have equipment that is working fine and are happy do not post on these forums. So as far as I am concerned, yes it is great to come here and listen to the pros and cons of the equipment you are looking at purchasing, but I dont think I would base a purchase on it since it is usually only people with problems posting. Of course there are people that post positive reviews, but in my experience with all of these threads it is the negative reviews that stand out.

I received my 785 yesterday and will hopefully have it set up this weekend. I will be connecting my Monitor Audio GS60's, GS10's, GSLCR and Velodyne Sub. to it. I will also be connecting my TWC Cable Box, standard DVD player via HDMI. I have the NAD Ipod dock coming in as well tomorrow so Im looking forward to seeing that interface as well. I have a Pioneer Plasma Elite that accepts 1080p/24 but I dont have any way of testing the NAD since I dont have the DVD player that outputs it yet.

Once I have it all hooked up I will come back here and give a review. Again, I think no matter what you buy there are going to be defected units, and peole that have buyers remorse. I hope I dont have either

By the way I am sure once the B&K AVR707 official owners thread opens up in 2008, you will find people posting problems there as well. Its just the nature of the beast lol. Good luck with your search.
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post #619 of 4166
12/20/07 at 9:41am
Bravery is not dead!

Look, I have a v1.00 T765 and it works flawlessly. I just set up a T175 and the people *love* it and felt it was a huge sound improvement over their one year old NHT preamp. I set up a T775 for another customer and it solved all of his previous issues and then some. I have one customer who says he gets no sound with Audyssey engaged but one of two things will happen - either it's a hiccup in the software and will be fixed today with Bob's excellent help at NAD or there will be a replacement FedExed today (I just found out about the problem this morning). That's how NAD works. I suspect it's just a software hiccup and either doing a restart or loading in the newest software will work.

I mean, look, they call it "v1.00" for a reason. If everything was expected to be perfect, there would only be one "version" and v1.07 and v1.12 wouldn't exist already. You don't whip out a new software version in a week. These guys have been hard at work getting the software perfect even as the hardware is rolling out. You think Apple's going to stop selling MacBooks until Leopard is perfect? I've had 10 different upgrades to my OS since getting Leopard a couple of months ago. Software is software, hardware is hardware. And, if the report of having a bad HDMI board is correct, guess what is going to happen? NAD will send out a new HDMI board which will drop right in the back in about 5 minutes. Who else can do that? Not many!

Speaking of Apple, my Macbook had an odd thing where the keyboard would just stop working. A simple restart cured it when it happened, but it was a bit irritating. So, I could have gone berserk complaining over every website, but I knew it was a software glitch and assumed it would be fixed. 3 weeks later, last night, there's a fix available. I drop it in, it works. I never got my blood pressure up or stressed or angry or anything. I just knew it would be addressed and went on about my business and it was. That's being realistic.
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post #620 of 4166
12/20/07 at 9:52am
Ok Alimentall, I think Robert got your points. I am with you, thanks for the laughs during lunch.

Scott
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post #621 of 4166
12/20/07 at 9:54am
I'm loving my T775. It's upgraded to the latest firmware and nothing could be better. Obviously NAD rushed this to market to get the pre-Christmas sales, but the hardware is great - even if the software was a little behind it.

Switching sources isn't a problem - even though I use a Universal remote, it uses the same IR codes.

I'll say it again - for $1,750 you can't go wrong with the T775. Plenty of power to handle my 16' x 23' home theater/music room.
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post #622 of 4166
12/20/07 at 10:06am
Okay, I'll risk it. But I would like to see more posts reporting no problems.

I can guarantee, given B&K's past, there will be a lot of complaints when its new products actually come out.
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post #623 of 4166
12/20/07 at 10:14am
I am having a problem with the 1080P signal not passing over HDMI on my T775. Does the firmware upgrade fix this? How do I get it?

Other than this problem, the unit works and sounds fantastic. Really very happy with this receiver.
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post #624 of 4166
12/20/07 at 10:42am
Quote:
Originally Posted by ak2000 View Post

I am having a problem with the 1080P signal not passing over HDMI on my T775. Does the firmware upgrade fix this? How do I get it?

Other than this problem, the unit works and sounds fantastic. Really very happy with this receiver.

You can get the firmware upgrade from NAD and install it thru the serial port. There is at least one post with a PS3 that the firmware upgrade solved the problem with 1080p. I on the other hand have not solved the problem with the v1.12 firmware. What is your source?

By the way I have had my T775 for 3 weeks and this is the only problem I have. I upgraded from an early B&K receiver and this thing blows it away. Even without 1080p I'm not giving it up!
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post #625 of 4166
12/20/07 at 11:12am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Whitehead View Post

I would still like to get the T785s. But, at this point, I see little short of a miracle, that would solve the problems with the new NAD units

I still say the new NAD products (T785 in your case) will be the better choice in the short future-- once these initial problems are addressed. Your comments confirm there are some sort of problems with just about every product- whether there are functional failures, no HDMI, poor sound-quality, etc.,...
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post #626 of 4166
12/20/07 at 11:53am
Quote:
Originally Posted by SimpleTheater View Post

I'm loving my T775. It's upgraded to the latest firmware and nothing could be better. Obviously NAD rushed this to market to get the pre-Christmas sales, but the hardware is great - even if the software was a little behind it.

Switching sources isn't a problem - even though I use a Universal remote, it uses the same IR codes.

I'll say it again - for $1,750 you can't go wrong with the T775. Plenty of power to handle my 16' x 23' home theater/music room.

$1750???
The list is $2500. IM me with your dealer, please.
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post #627 of 4166
12/20/07 at 12:47pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by glwarner View Post

You can get the firmware upgrade from NAD and install it thru the serial port. There is at least one post with a PS3 that the firmware upgrade solved the problem with 1080p. I on the other hand have not solved the problem with the v1.12 firmware. What is your source?

Thanks for the info. The sources are a HTPC with 8600GTS card and a Denon 3930CI. As long as I have the outputs on either set to 1080i, there is no problem.
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post #628 of 4166
12/20/07 at 12:47pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil Tomaskovic View Post

$1750???
The list is $2500. IM me with your dealer, please.

Damn!!! And I thought that I got a really great deal @ 20% off!
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post #629 of 4166
12/20/07 at 1:02pm
Just thought I would comment on my experience with my 775 that I've had for 4 weeks now. I purchased this unit along the the T585-player, which initially I could not get working together (thru HDMI). Turns out the problem was with the player and a quick firmware upgrade would fix the problem. Also the player's remote did not work. So my dealer had a new unit brought in (with the latest firmware) and swapped it for my original player. Since I do not have a 1080p source (720p /1080i are my highest) I have not encountered the switching problems mentioned here. At the time of purchase I was told that I had the latest firmware 1.07. Last week I got a call from my dealer indicating that a new firmware was available 1.12 and to bring my 775 in as he will swap it for a brand new one with the latest firmware. I am not having any problems at all with the unit but I find this to be great customer service (yes I know its the dealer doing this and not NAD, but in the end I am having a great experience purchasing the 775 and other NAD products).
The main reason for purchasing the 775 was for its sound quality .. and my KEF reference speakers (5.1) have never sounded better. 100% satisfied customer and have recommended it to all my friends & family.
Regards, Cliff.
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post #630 of 4166
12/20/07 at 1:23pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Whitehead View Post

First there was the problem with no audio passing via HDMI. Sure NAD fixed it, but the new units should never have been released with so glaring a problem. Word has it the new units were delayed to get the best HDMI 1.3a boards. And NAD releases them with no audio?

Welcome to the computer age. These processors anymore are like computers. If you go and look, several other mfg. including Yamaha, Onkyo, etc have also done firmware upgrades on new products and it is not uncommon for any mfg. to ship something that may require an upgrade like that. This type of thing will won't be changing anytime soon from what I can see. You shoudl buy whatever your happy with.
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