Toshiba 47HL167 Gamma, Decoding, Gamut, and Probe Accuracy

Here are my Toshiba 47HL167 results post gray scale calibration. I'm using GetGray sent over HDMI as YCbCr video with HCFR. My probe is the Spyder2.

At Warm, with Brightness and Contrast set correctly per GetGray, my OOB gamma read low at ~1.6 using Display Gamma with BC. This was with Static Gamma (SG) set at 0. When SG was set to -5 OOB, the gamma maxed out at ~1.75 and the curve kept the same shape. My OOB gray scale was also off with too much blue, especially at low IREs.

I was able to calibrate the gray scale to track decently by adjusting the drvs and cuts in the service menu. However, with Brightness and Contrast set correctly, the post gray scale gamma is still right around 1.6 with SG at 0. With that low of gamma, you would think that the picture would be very washed out, but it doesn't look that way to me. In fact, when I move SG to -5 to increase the gamma, the blacks get crushed and I lose a ton of shadow detail. It looks much better at 1.6.

The gamut as you see it now reflects the OOB settings. As you can see, the colors are off, especially green and yellow. When I tried adjusting the colors via the CMS, all of the colors except green and yellow could be adjusted to their references. Even with the hue maxed out, green could not be moved to the reference. The same goes for yellow. No matter how much I increased the saturation, I couldn't get it out to the reference point.

I decided to buy the 47HL167 because its bigger brother, the 52HL167, was able to be calibrated very close to reference standards in this review: http://ultimateavmag.com/flatpaneldi...52/index5.html

Since the review showed a proper calibration of the HL167 series was possible, I initially thought I might be having a probe issue. However, another user's calibration of a 42HL167 with a Spyder2 shows the low gamma and green/yellow issue as well. See results here: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...&postcount=950 My CIE chart looked just like their CIE chart when I was previously trying to adjust my gamut to the references - green and yellow could not be adjusted to their references no matter what.

I am trying to figure out why the 42HL167 and 47HL167 won't calibrate like the 52HL167 did in the review?

Probe issue?: Since the 42HL167 and 47HL167 results are similar, it appears the Spyder2 is precise. However, that does not mean it's accurate. The probe could be inaccurate and providing faulty readings.

Operator error?: Another possibility is that I'm doing something wrong during the calibration. However, the results from our two independent calibrations are very close. This does not appear to be a case of operator error.

Reviewer issue?: The reviewer's results are off. This seems unlikely since reviewers typically have access to the best software and equipment.

Design/Construction issue?: There is a significant difference in design/construction among the 3 different size HL167 models. My research indicates that all 3 models have the same features, use the same video processing, and their panels all come from the same source. It also wouldn't make sense for Toshiba to use vastly different designs amongst the 3 models.

Any thoughts on how I should proceed? Are these results valid or is something else going on? Thanks for your help.

Yes, I noticed the reviewer used a photospectrometer.

The Spyder2 seems to get mixed reviews here on AVS. Some people swear by it, other seems to think it's inaccurate and not well-suited to low light levels. My experience so far indicates that it produces very repeatable results, even down to 3 cd/m2. However, that says nothing about its accuracy.

One of things I was thinking about trying was moving to an Eye One Display LT. Maybe trying the Display LT should be my next step.

The Spyder2 is recommended by Datacolor for use on LCDs. I know it has been used in the past to successfully calibrate LCDs and there are many examples of this on the Net.

However, Toshiba did go to a wider gamut for these models and they supposedly use different backlighting technology than previous LCDs. Toshiba says this about it:

"Wide color gamut LCD expands the number of available colors and improves the color accuracy. While standard LCD panels may only reproduce 72% of the NTSC color gamut, ColorBurst™ utilizes enhanced CCFL back-light technology to expand the color range to 90%+. This significantly improves both color purity and color saturation, and combined with superior processing and a superior back-light, creates colors that are vibrant and natural."

When you say bulb, do you mean maybe the Spyder2 is not compatible with this new technology and only works with previous LCD technology? Could you point me to the posts where others are having trouble? Also, are you aware of any limitations between the Display LT and recent Toshiba/Sony LCD flat panels or any other models using enhanced CCFL back-light technology? Thanks.

If I can't fully understand the issue, how am I supposed to perform an accurate calibration. The why part matters to me. That's also why I asked you if you knew of similar limitations with the Display LT. I wasn't questioning your observations - I was only trying to understand the issue better so that I would know how to proceed fom here. Since you seem to have first-hand experience with this issue - what did you or others use in lieu of spyder-type devices to accurately calibrate these types of displays? The only thing I can think of is a spectrophotometer, like the reviewer used.