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The "Official" Denon AVR-2808CI Owners Thread - Page 55

post #1621 of 3815
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Warner View Post

Yes, I ran the setup using 8 positions. As a matter of fact I ran the test twice changing the mic position at each position slightly.

If these speakers are mounted in the ceiling (as the appear to be designed for,) you probably have little hope of getting an accurate calibration from Audyssey.

In wall maybe ...
post #1622 of 3815
Quote:
Originally Posted by popeye123 View Post

Just curious. My buddy has the 3809 and there is a new software update that allows him to add Sirius to the receiver like the XM that is already came with unit. Is there any software updates for the 2808? Also the Sirius add this available for the 2808? I did call tech and they said if brought in to service can update, but not sure if there are any updates for 2808. I just purchased one and love it compared to my old Harmon Kardon 235. Thanks.

The 2808 is not designed to received formal updates as it is considered by Denon as low end. The mid range line beginning with the 3808 is both hardware capable and software ready to receive that update.
post #1623 of 3815
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Warner View Post

Yes, I ran the setup using 8 positions. As a matter of fact I ran the test twice changing the mic position at each position slightly.

Slightly? Although the very first position taken should be the ideal seating position (and about ear level), the remaining positions should be taken throughout the listening area or at the very least in front of and the sides of the couch or sofa crisscrossing each time from one side to the other and always ideally at ear level (which is why ideally a tripod is recommended). Exactly where are your speakers placed anyway?
post #1624 of 3815
Quote:
Originally Posted by dlenart25 View Post

Smoothie.
Why would you recommend trying another 988? I don't see how there could be any difference? Do you think there could be a problem with the Center channel amp in the AVR? I'm thinking that since it gets plenty loud that there shouldn't be a problem. It just doesn't blend in.

All speakers are from same manufacturer, same tweeters and driver materials. So sonically matched they are. I know it's not a problem with the center channel speaker because it sounded flawless with the 3805...

BTW...I had this same exact issue with a Yamaha RX-V661 I used to have. Center Channel never blended in well.


Simply to rule out that it's a problem with that particular 988. And no there probably isn't going to be a difference. Have you tried adjusting the Audyssey ROOM EQ to either Flat or Byp L/R to see if that makes a difference? You indicate all the speakers are the same. Have you tried swapping another speaker into the center channel position and get the same results? What has Denon tech support suggested?
post #1625 of 3815
Quote:
Originally Posted by nosferatu2xlc View Post

i need to buy eather 988 or 2808 in few days post above makes me wanna buy 988 even that is more expensive than 2808

Although the 988 and 2808 are virtually identical, the 2808 is the better buy and generally costs about $100-$150 more than the 988. It has a better remote (which offers programmable features) as well as the capability to pump stereo audio to a 3rd zone (the 988 only offers 2 zones). If you can get the 2808 for less than the 988 ... buy the 2808.
post #1626 of 3815
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

Simply to rule out that it's a problem with that particular 988. And no there probably isn't going to be a difference. Have you tried adjusting the Audyssey ROOM EQ to either Flat or Byp L/R to see if that makes a difference? You indicate all the speakers are the same. Have you tried swapping another speaker into the center channel position and get the same results? What has Denon tech support suggested?

Maybe he could try running the pre outs from the 988 to the 7.1 in on his 3805. That would isolate the problem a little at least. If the blending of the center channel was still off with the 3805 amps, then the problem could lie in the front end of the 988......I'm stumped.
If he is re-setting the crossovers to the values they should be, there should be no difference in matching speakers across the front.
You touched on my next question, what does the system sound like with the room correction turned off? Does the center still sound odd with the 988 running them flat?

dlenart.....Did you move the center speaker at all?...edit again, did you check the speaker distance settings?
post #1627 of 3815
Quote:
Originally Posted by dlenart25 View Post

Changing the crossover from 250-80 was one of the first things I did after I ran Audyssey. Something is odd here...

I don't recall you mentioning how it sounded at 250hz before setting it back to 80hz? And again, I'll agree with LS2JSTS's suggestion ... try using the 988 as a pre-amp and then get back to us.
post #1628 of 3815
personally i don't like to 2808 remote its too big for my taste. when i look on amazon the new2808 cost less than 988 and less than 2808 refurbished. ( now that don't make seance why refurbished is more than new ...?.?.)
post #1629 of 3815
If you had a chance of buying the new Denon AVR-889 or the old Denon AVR-2808CI, which one would you buy and why? An online retailer is selling the Denon AVR-2808CI at a great price right now.
post #1630 of 3815
Quote:
Originally Posted by pglover19 View Post

If you had a chance of buying the new Denon AVR-889 or the old Denon AVR-2808CI, which one would you buy and why? An online retailer is selling the Denon AVR-2808CI at a great price right now.

Does the 889 decode SACD over HDMI this year? Last year the 888 didn't and the 988 was the lowest in the Denon lineup that did. If SACD is important to you over HDMI then check that out on the 889.

The new volume controls are very tempting and function well by most accounts...it would be tempting to get the 889 just for that feature. SQ wise they will be very similar, the DSD over HDMI would be the decision maker in my case.
post #1631 of 3815
Quote:
Originally Posted by nosferatu2xlc View Post

personally i don't like to 2808 remote its too big for my taste. when i look on amazon the new2808 cost less than 988 and less than 2808 refurbished. ( now that don't make seance why refurbished is more than new ...?.?.)

Denon doesn't make a good remote.....

The 2808 remote is bad, the 988 remote is abysmal....You have to flip it over to access the main menu, you have to flip it over to access some of the inputs......just an aweful design!

All of the above is why God gave us the Harmony One....
post #1632 of 3815
Quote:
Originally Posted by pglover19 View Post

If you had a chance of buying the new Denon AVR-889 or the old Denon AVR-2808CI, which one would you buy and why? An online retailer is selling the Denon AVR-2808CI at a great price right now.

for you and nosferatu2xlc. I was down to the same two receivers and almost pulled the trigger on the 988, over the 889 and 2808CI - until I say the 2808CI was cheaper on Amazon. Ordered it last Friday, got it Tuesday and it is amazing. Using it with my PS3 and the sound is incredible!

Both - I recommend the 2808CI. Then get U-571 and have a listen. Oh my!!!
post #1633 of 3815
Have you tried Audessy off or in flat mode to see if there is a difference ?

Sorry, this was meant for the guy with center channel blending problem comapred to 3805.
post #1634 of 3815
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ericc1970 View Post

for you and nosferatu2xlc. I was down to the same two receivers and almost pulled the trigger on the 988, over the 889 and 2808CI - until I say the 2808CI was cheaper on Amazon. Ordered it last Friday, got it Tuesday and it is amazing. Using it with my PS3 and the sound is incredible!

Both - I recommend the 2808CI. Then get U-571 and have a listen. Oh my!!!


im replacing my 688 with either one of them i wonder if i notice sound improvement
post #1635 of 3815
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

Slightly? Although the very first position taken should be the ideal seating position (and about ear level), the remaining positions should be taken throughout the listening area or at the very least in front of and the sides of the couch or sofa crisscrossing each time from one side to the other and always ideally at ear level (which is why ideally a tripod is recommended). Exactly where are your speakers placed anyway?

The speakers are ceiling mounted (These are designed for ceiling mounting). I can aim the woofer (mid range) and tweeter in any direction. I have them aimed at the primary listning position. I called Speaker Craft and they said that aiming the speakers was not critical if using the Audyssey auto set up. I took the first reading at the main listning position (center of couch), then at each side of main listning position (These were in front of the couch), then took the next three at the rear of the couch (Each end & Middle) then the last two positions were further out and forward of the couch. I mounted the mike on a camera tri-pod at ear level when seated.
post #1636 of 3815
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

The manual says using a DVI-HDMI adapter is hit or miss. Have you tried the 2nd HDMI jack? You also have to use HDMI to the TV as well.

Tried it in both HDMI jacks with no success. I am using a HDMI from the receiver to tv. However, if I bypass the receiver and go straight from dvd player to tv using the DVI/HDMI adapter, the player works just fine and the picture shows up fine. My HDTV has only one HDMI input so I was hoping to use the Denon as a switcher, in essence combining two HDMI sources for one output. Hmmmmm.
Another question..... the subwoofer works only when a movie DVD is playing. When I put a blu-ray movie in the PS3, the sub works just fine. However, the tuner, cd player, and music channels from my cable box all are output without the sub turning on. I checked the parameters to verify the sub is checked "yes" and when I do the channel levels, you can hear it rumble, but no signal comes out when music is playing. If I put a cd in the PS3, no sub signal. I have also tried all the different modes such as surround, direct, etc. with no results. Any thoughts on this mystery??? This set up is really causing me to pull my hair out!!
post #1637 of 3815
Quote:
Originally Posted by LS2JSTS View Post

The 2808 remote is bad, the 988 remote is abysmal....You have to flip it over to access the main menu, you have to flip it over to access some of the inputs......just an aweful design!

I'll certainly agree with you on this point. The AVR-988's remote is one of the worst designs I've ever encountered for any piece of A/V equipment. Good receiver... horrible remote.
post #1638 of 3815
Quote:
Originally Posted by nosferatu2xlc View Post

im replacing my 688 with either one of them i wonder if i notice sound improvement

you will. if you have a blu-ray player and hook up the HDMI for lossless audio - look out man. It is incredible the difference.

hope you have good speakers too.

Last up for me is a new sub. I'm leaning towards HSU Research.

good luck.
post #1639 of 3815
Quote:
Originally Posted by nosferatu2xlc View Post

personally i don't like to 2808 remote its too big for my taste. when i look on amazon the new2808 cost less than 988 and less than 2808 refurbished. ( now that don't make seance why refurbished is more than new ...?.?.)

I actually like the 2808 remote, especially the (3) System Call programmable features. Regarding the different prices ... they are each sold by a different vendor. Why is it strange to see different prices?

Quote:
Originally Posted by pglover19 View Post

If you had a chance of buying the new Denon AVR-889 or the old Denon AVR-2808CI, which one would you buy and why? An online retailer is selling the Denon AVR-2808CI at a great price right now.

Depends on your requirements. What you need and don't need.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Warner View Post

The speakers are ceiling mounted (These are designed for ceiling mounting). I can aim the woofer (mid range) and tweeter in any direction. I have them aimed at the primary listning position. I called Speaker Craft and they said that aiming the speakers was not critical if using the Audyssey auto set up. I took the first reading at the main listning position (center of couch), then at each side of main listning position (These were in front of the couch), then took the next three at the rear of the couch (Each end & Middle) then the last two positions were further out and forward of the couch. I mounted the mike on a camera tri-pod at ear level when seated.

Audyssey actually recommends crisscrossing each position rather than doing 3 here and 3 there. Try that and see if it makes a difference for you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ew1976 View Post

Another question..... the subwoofer works only when a movie DVD is playing. When I put a blu-ray movie in the PS3, the sub works just fine. However, the tuner, cd player, and music channels from my cable box all are output without the sub turning on. I checked the parameters to verify the sub is checked "yes" and when I do the channel levels, you can hear it rumble, but no signal comes out when music is playing. If I put a cd in the PS3, no sub signal. I have also tried all the different modes such as surround, direct, etc. with no results. Any thoughts on this mystery??? This set up is really causing me to pull my hair out!!

Most Blu-Ray DVDs are broadcast in DD 5.1 at a minimum if not one of the new HD audio codecs which is why you're getting the 5.1. The tuner, cd player, and music channels are "stereo" 2.0 sources. If you want 5.1 from one of the stereo sources you have mentioned then you've got to have the Surround Mode set to Dolby PLII. (or Pro Logic).
post #1640 of 3815
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ericc1970 View Post

you will. if you have a blu-ray player and hook up the DIM for lossless audio - look out man. It is incredible the difference.

hope you have good speakers too.

Last up for me is a new sub. I'm leaning towards HSU Research.

good luck.


i have PSB with Outlaw sub ( i recommend over HSU )
post #1641 of 3815
Outlaw's subs are Hsu subs, or at least were the last time I checked (a few months ago).
post #1642 of 3815
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Warner View Post

I called Speaker Craft and they said that aiming the speakers was not critical if using the Audyssey auto set up.

They are wrong ... the Audyssey setup relies on mic being setup to receive the audio in a grazing manner. If you're ceiling mounted, there's no way you'll be able to get the mic in a reasonable position.

Speaker aiming is *always* critical (regardless of whether you use Audyssey or not.)
post #1643 of 3815
Quote:
Originally Posted by LS2JSTS View Post

Does the 889 decode SACD over HDMI this year? Last year the 888 didn't and the 988 was the lowest in the Denon lineup that did. If SACD is important to you over HDMI then check that out on the 889.

The new volume controls are very tempting and function well by most accounts...it would be tempting to get the 889 just for that feature. SQ wise they will be very similar, the DSD over HDMI would be the decision maker in my case.

I'm a little confused about this SACD decoding. Before upgrading to the 988, I had the 788. It also played SACDs and DVD-A with no problem via HDMI. I have an OPPO 981 for these formats. My PS3(60 Gig) also played SACDs via HDMI to the 788 with no trouble. Why would the receiver need to have onboard decoding to play SACD? Are there actually SACD players out there with HDMI outs that don't decode SACD internally?
post #1644 of 3815
Quote:
Originally Posted by HDTVChallenged View Post

They are wrong ... the Audyssey setup relies on mic being setup to receive the audio in a grazing manner. If you're ceiling mounted, there's no way you'll be able to get the mic in a reasonable position.

Speaker aiming is *always* critical (regardless of whether you use Audyssey or not.)

+1

I did a quick google search on ceiling mounted speakers with Audyssey and this is very true. This article goes into detail about speaker placement and although ceiling speakers might be necessary in some situations are ineffective as a good surround system which is why the Audyssey has problems with it. Speaker "aiming" is most definitely critical in any situation for ideal surround sound performance.
post #1645 of 3815
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post

+1

I did a quick google search on ceiling mounted speakers with Audyssey and this is very true. This article goes into detail about speaker placement and although ceiling speakers might be necessary in some situations are ineffective as a good surround system which is why the Audyssey has problems with it. Speaker "aiming" is most definitely critical in any situation for ideal surround sound performance.

I do have the woofer (mid Range) and Tweeter aimed at the prime listening position. There was no need to readjust them even though Speaker Craft said when using Audyssey setup it didn't matter. The only thing I didn't do was to crisscross.
post #1646 of 3815
[quote=jdsmoothie;147968



Most Blu-Ray DVDs are broadcast in DD 5.1 at a minimum if not one of the new HD audio codecs which is why you're getting the 5.1. The tuner, cd player, and music channels are "stereo" 2.0 sources. If you want 5.1 from one of the stereo sources you have mentioned then you've got to have the Surround Mode set to Dolby PLII. (or Pro Logic).[/QUOTE]

I just gave up and used the component hook up on the DVD and it works fine. Just have to wait till I upgrade the tv for more HDMI inputs.
When I go to try Dolby surround mode, all I can chose from are Dolby cinema and neo cinema. No music mode?? And the sub doesn't work in that either. Thank you for all your help so far. I'm so close to getting this thing working! Other than that, it's great!
post #1647 of 3815
Quote:
Originally Posted by tbuick6 View Post

I'm a little confused about this SACD decoding. Before upgrading to the 988, I had the 788. It also played SACDs and DVD-A with no problem via HDMI. I have an OPPO 981 for these formats. My PS3(60 Gig) also played SACDs via HDMI to the 788 with no trouble. Why would the receiver need to have onboard decoding to play SACD? Are there actually SACD players out there with HDMI outs that don't decode SACD internally?

The lower lines decode the PCM stream from the PS3 or other DVD players HDMI output. If you want to stream the DSD bitstream I think it requires the 988 or above, at least that was the case last year.

There are a number of players that stream the DSD bitstream and let the AVR decode it, otherwise they usually stream DSD as decoded PCM. The Pioneer DV-48, DV-58 and the Oppo 980 are three that stream DSD over HDMI that I know of. Of course the value of this is argueable, your AVR MAY do a better job and have better D/A front end or you could have a player with better decoders. Which is better gets into what your actual situation is and where your best D/A conversion is taking place. Could be your player in some cases, in many, the AVR has the better set of decoders.

edit....I use a PS3 for SACD playback on some occasions, I bought a DV-48 just to try streaming DSD directly to the 988. While the PS3 sounds great sending PCM to the 988, I found the HDMI DSD stream to provide slightly more openess, it just sounded slightly more alive to me. I know these are useless terms and I didnt do any level matching, so my results may be nothing more than a slight difference in levels. But in the end I prefered the DV-48 streaming DSD to the 988 over the PS3 streaming PCM.
post #1648 of 3815
will 2808ci handle 4ohm speakers ?
post #1649 of 3815
I think I narrowed it down to this receiver as a pre/pro to my Emotiva LPA-1 or the new Emotiva UMC-1 processor. What would you choose?
post #1650 of 3815
Quote:
Originally Posted by nosferatu2xlc View Post

will 2808ci handle 4ohm speakers ?

I would say yes as long as you don't push high SPL's often
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