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Can I replace the driver and amp in my existing sub?

post #1 of 18
Thread Starter 
I have a old(er) Velodyne F1200 sub, 100 watts sealed. I know I'll probably get a lot of responses along the lines of, "it'll be better if you start from scratch", but what if I want to use my existing box- how do I decide what driver and amp to use? Any suggestion?
post #2 of 18
internal dimensions of box would be a good start.
post #3 of 18
Thread Starter 
I'm not sure actually... the exterior is somewhere along the lines of 16" square, maybe 16 x 16 x 17...
Does it have to be exact? I've never done this, sorry for stupid questions!
post #4 of 18
That's a good size for a most 12" subs. What are you looking to spend? The model number makes it sound as if it had a 12" already so you shouldn't need to cut for the driver, but you'll likely need to cut for the amp if you want something more powerful. Do you have a router handy? (If you don't want to flush mount AND the new hole is considerably bigger than the old hole or the old amp wasn't flushmounted, then you can get away with a jigsaw)
post #5 of 18
Thread Starter 
Yes, it's a 12' driver currently. Playing with WINISD, looks like I can get a nice response curve from 15 - 150 -3db with a Peerless 830500 and a 300 Watt amp, although thats with adding 550 grams to driver. Is that common, to add weight?
No, I don't have a router or any woodworking abilities.... closest I have is a Dremel


Oh yeah... budget question. Nothing crazy I guess, like to keep it under $500 to start I suppose...
post #6 of 18
Thread Starter 
Oh yeah... my sub has a "High Pass Crossover Passive 85 HZ 6 DB slope" in it, I'll probably need to find that and yank it, right? Is that built into the amp?
post #7 of 18
You can add weight, but look at the SPL chart in WinISD. You notice that you're now getting very little sound out of that heavy cone? If you want to go lower, find a different driver, port the box, get a larger box and/or run a Linkwitz Transform circuit.

A dremel isn't going to work here. You'll need to find an amp that fits the size requirement, else you'll need to get some tools.
post #8 of 18
Thread Starter 
I did notice SPL dropped while the curve flattened and the range lowered, but SPL still was over 100... is that loud enough? I have no idea. I've never turned it up past 2 in it's current configuration. Maybe I'll replace just the driver to start, and then worry about the amp later. The thing I'm worried about is the filters; I dont know how to get around them.
post #9 of 18
Over 100dB with that kind of weight added? Not happening, unless you CRANKED the wattage. Also, that'll kill your high frequency response.
post #10 of 18
Thread Starter 
That's this driver in a 1.8 cubic foot sealed box with 300 watts per WinISD program, shows -3db from about 16 to 150hz, SPL 101 at 30Hz


with 550 grams added

I have no idea if that accurate having never used it
post #11 of 18
Quote:
I know I'll probably get a lot of responses along the lines of, "it'll be better if you start from scratch",

Only because that's usually what the original poster ends up concluding.

Quote:
The thing I'm worried about is the filters; I dont know how to get around them.

You don't, not without a schematic and good knowledge of electronics. Since you're asking if the filter is on the amp, I'd use a different amp.
The passive HP filter (speaker-level) is not what you'd worry about, anyway, it's all the eq/filtering built in to get a desired response curve from, and to protect, that specific driver with that specific amp/box. Merely replacing the driver with a "better" one (based on specs) would most likely result in worse performance.

All mass-loading really does is roll off the high end...better off using eq to boost.
post #12 of 18
How and why would one add weight???
post #13 of 18
Some drivers have bolts in the back to allow it. More often people just put like hot glue or similar on the cone. Adding 550g would really screw with the driver, though. I can't imagine the suspension being able to handle it.
post #14 of 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by hometheaterguy View Post

This is something a low life, under paid cable splicer would say.

LOL...I cannot get over how worthless you are on this forum!

Come on...At least try a different line, you sound like a broken record.
post #15 of 18
Ok folks, lets bring it back here
First of all, adding 550 grams most definitely will destroy that driver in no time at all, people usually add a small amount of mass to beefy drivers, I have never heard of someone adding 550 grams before, that is a ton of weight. That driver was made to move 160 grams around, what do you think will happen when you load it down with 710grams? Thats a lot more mass than the LMS 5400 moves and thats about the beefiest driver I have seen. Also, there is absolutely no way you are going to get 100dB anywhere near 20Hz from a 12" driver with 12mm xmax in a sealed box. You will hit about 100dB at 30Hz when the driver hits its excursion limits, this is not powerful enough in my opinion.

Also, lets take a step back here, you are wanting to dump all this money into a project and put it in that crappy box? The spl1200 does not have a well built box, it was not made for a really powerful driver and amp. I know you said you want to use your current box, but it really doesn't make sense to, you will have to completely redo the back, where the amp mounts, who knows how that will work out, also the drivers may have different cutout sizes, 12" drivers can have a pretty big gap between the small ones and big ones.
post #16 of 18
Thread Starter 
Yeah, that weight seemed a little excessive. Either I don't know how to use WinISD or it's pretty useless. Every sub driver I seem to choose or enter shows the response graph too far up the chart to be right - peaks around 100Hz or higher doesn's sound like a sub to me.

Using my existing box was just an idea to save me from attempting to build something. My sub doesn't seem that crappy to me, it weighs 60ish pounds and feels pretty solid, but what do I know - it's really all I know.


EDIT - also my F1200 box is nothing like the SPL1200
post #17 of 18
Sorry bout that, i did know which sub you meant, the SPL1200 has a pretty solid design, the F1200 does not so much. I just don't see how you will use that box without some heavy modifications. Personally, If I were doing it and I didn't want to build a box, I would leave that amp in there and power a new driver with an external amp. A Soundsplinter RL-p12 would work well in that box, you could power it with an EP1500 or something similar, there might be some other budget pro amps out there now that I have overlooked. The real issue here though is that you are box limited, you can't get much more sound out of a box that small without getting a larger driver like JL audio does with their fathom, or with one of TC's 5200 drivers that have huge cone area and strokes, but are still made for tiny boxes. The problem is that the cutout would be way bigger and those drivers are insanely expensive. With a larger box, like the much tried and true sono sub design, you could get incredible low end output for a fraction of the cost of a small sealed design. Also, is your velodyne working? If so, I'd sell the whole thing for cash and start fresh.
post #18 of 18
Thread Starter 
Youve got a point. I was thinking this would be a good way to "get my toes wet" while increasing my performance, but I suppose I'd be better off starting from scratch. Which leads me to another idea, but I'll start a new thread for that. Thanks for your input!
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