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My Journey to find the "perfect" speaker... - Page 12

post #331 of 6914
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zues View Post

The fours have a unfair advantage in the bass because they use subwoofers. But dont dodge the real question, are there any speakers better than nht in your opinion under 3k say?

Better? By what standard? I'm sure there are lots of speakers under $3K that people will *prefer*, but that doesn't necessarily make them "better" except for that person.
Quote:



I would bet canton karots with the same design are superior in quality..100% german parts.

Well, the $30K Cantons don't measure as well as the Fours in many ways, so I kind of doubt it, except maybe on a subjective level to some people. Made in Germany is a slogan, not a guarantee of quality. It is a guarantee of a high price though.
Quote:



Not euro driver, tawain tweeter, questionable crossover parts quality. Nht is not a speaker company, just a speaker builder.. Mine as well diy at that point, or just by the real deal 100% euro speakers.

What is the obsession with european drivers? Does that mean that a Smart Car is better than a Lexus? If you think you can design and build a speaker that looks as good and sounds as good as the Fours for $2000, please do. You might get rich if you do it. NHT's drivers are all custom designed and more than just an impedance change. There's some serious engineering go on. So, I can't wait to see what you come up with that competes with it!
post #332 of 6914
Brandon, I don't know why, but Audio Advisor is blowing out NHT Fours' Special Dark finish (prettier than the black ones for most women - oh, wait, Audio Advisor customers don't have girlfriends! ) for $999/pr. At that price, well, hell, you could turn around and sell them in a month or two for that much money if you don't like them.
post #333 of 6914
Nuance -

While your search for the perfect speaker continues, my search has finally ended. After four years of listening to dozens of speakers; owning some for as little as a few months and my previous set for almost two years, I can honestly say that I have never been more content than I am at this moment. But the new speakers I chose are only part of what made my dream of a great sound system a reality.

Replacing my Paradigm Signatures with Monitor Audio GS's got me significantly closer to my goal with improved transparency, detail and clarity, but much to my surprise it was a new Lexicon front-end (processor, amp, and universal disc player) that really pushed the sound quality over the edge from good to outstanding.

If you know me at all, I have posted numerous times in the past that I could hear little to no difference between a Denon 5800 and 4306 AVR that I've been using for the past 6 years and the separates I've tried. My first attempt at a new front-end was with the NAD Master Series and then more recently, Anthem Statement. The NAD may have sounded slightly more relaxed than the Denon, but only slightly so. The differences were so minor that I returned the two NAD pieces (NADs? ) just two weeks after purchase. The Anthem Statement gear sounded virtually identical to the Denon, so those didn't stay in my system long either. Surprisingly, even though both the NAD and Anthem amps were considerably more powerful than the Denon, I didn't even gain the ability to play my music at higher volumes. Sure, these amps could drive my speakers to silly levels, but the sound became uncomfortable to listen to at those volumes.

My experiences with the NAD and the Anthem gear didn't keep me from trying though, and two days ago I took ownership of a Lexicon MC-12HD prepro, the matching Lexicon LX-7 amp, and a Lexicon RT-20 CD/DVD/SACD/DVDA player. I have a friend that has been using a Lexicon prepro in his system for years, and his system sounds amazing. Ever since he demoed his system for me I wanted to give the Lexicon stuff a try, but frankly it was just too damn expensive. Well, thanks to Audiogon that has changed and I was able to pick up my dream gear for a much more reasonable price.

All I can say is holy crap! I am in total amazement of the sound that fills my room now. I had no idea that front-end gear could make such a difference. I don't know if there is some sort of synergy between the Lexicon and the Monitor Audio GS's, but the sound is effortless at much higher levels than I have ever been able to achieve before; the sound is smooth yet highly detailed, and balanced from top to bottom. No longer does the sound become hard and aggressive at high levels. Now of course the sound quality of a system isn't judged solely on the ability to play at rock concert levels (though it sure is fun), the goal is also to get closer to realitywhere it sounds less like a good sound system and more like the performers are either in your room or you have been transported to the venue of the recording. I know that this may be hard to believe, but even with my untreated living room, with the front speakers unequal distance from the side walls, I now have sound that is just as good if not better than the systems I have listened to at the local high-end AV store.

One of the things that the Lexicon MC-12 does better than any other processor I have listened to is surround processing, especially with converting two-channel music into multi-channel surround. (With four 32-bit processors on board just for surround sound, it's no wonder it does this so well.) You'll often read about a pair of speakers having a soundstage with good depth and width around the speaker plane, but the Lexicon takes that soundstage and wraps it around and even into the room, and it does it in a completely believable way. You are no longer listening at the music, the sound is now fully three dimensional, with all of the spatial information being extracted and sent to the surround channels. And it does this without sacrificing imaging in the front soundstage. It may not be the purist audiophile approach, but I don't think I will be listening to straight two-channel anytime soon.

For example, on The Ubiquitous Mr. Lovegrove from the Dead Can Dance album, Into the Labyrinth, there is a fair amount of reverb on the vocals. In standard two-channel, the sound of the male singer's voice is centered, but the reverb extends out and around the speaker plane. With the Lex, the sound of his voice stays up front and center where it should be, but the reverb fills the room. In this case instead of it sounding like the performer is in room, it sounds like you have been transported the venue of the recording. It's a totally amazing and entrancing experience.

Up to this point, I had always placed most of the importance on speakers, but the Lexicon gear has nearly turned my priorities upside-down. It almost seems ridiculous to have more than twice the money in my front-end than my speakers, and I still wouldn't recommend this approach to others, but this is what it took for me and I'm happy I did it. I still believe that speakers will make the largest and most easily distinguishable difference in sound quality, but if you are diligent, you may also be able to find a front-end that takes your system to the next level. However, if your experience is anything like mine, be prepared to go through a few different pieces before you find the right combination.

Nuance, and all others out there in search of great sound, I know it can seem like you're chasing a rainbow sometimes, but I wish you luck. And . . I never thought I would be saying this, but make sure to put some thought into your front end.

My system before:
http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j1...r/PDR_0520.jpg

http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j1...r/PDR_0613.jpg

My system now:
http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j1...r/IMG_0276.jpg

http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j1...r/IMG_0279.jpg

http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j1...r/IMG_0240.jpg

http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j1...r/IMG_0232.jpg

http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j1...r/IMG_0236.jpg

Cheers,

- Tim
post #334 of 6914
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alimentall View Post

Brandon, I don't know why, but Audio Advisor is blowing out NHT Fours' Special Dark finish (prettier than the black ones for most women - oh, wait, Audio Advisor customers don't have girlfriends! ) for $999/pr. At that price, well, hell, you could turn around and sell them in a month or two for that much money if you don't like them.

That's pretty crazy. Is audio advisor a trustworthy website?
I will be calling to make an appointment to hear the NHT Classic Three's today.

Tim:

That is amazing my friend; I am very happy for you! That is one sweet looking system!

As monotonous as it may be, I am planning on starting a thread in the amps/preamps sections with the goal of finding the "perfect" preamp and power amp combo for my ears and needs. Lexicon is a very expensive brand, but I certainly won't rule it out.

Tim, I completely agree that it may be wise to spend more money on your front end electronics than on your speakers. In my opinion even a mediocre speaker will benefit from a truly awesome source player, preamp and amp. This is one thing I had to be aware of when we were auditioning at Ultra Fidelis; the front end gear cost more than three times the price of the speakers until we listened to the 5A's. Even then the gear was similar in price to the speakers (over $30,000 in audio gear...I can just hear my wife laughing and saying "dream on"). As good as the lower priced Vandersteen 2CE Sig II's sounded, the source player and front end gear cost 5 to 6 times their price. This is why, when my speaker journey ends (or is appeased for some time), my preamp and power amp journey will begin.

Wow...this is never going to end, is it?

Tim, I am very happy for you pal. I hope to one day get to the point you have reached, but I know it won't be for some time yet. I am still young and have more important things to spend my money on. However, once the kids go off to college it's time for daddy's dream system! Or, maybe I can just build it piece by piece over time. Whichever way I go, as long as my dream system becomes a reality (some day) I will be a happy Audio Videoholic.
post #335 of 6914
Thread Starter 
My "journey" continues on Saturday when I hit the road with Shadow Hunter (Justin) and my brother to visit Craigsub for an evening of good food, good drinks, good company and lots of fun A/V toys. Nice!
post #336 of 6914
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuance View Post

That's pretty crazy. Is audio advisor a trustworthy website?

Authorized dealer, 30 day MBG, I'd say they're pretty trustworthy. I have bought thousands of dollars of gear from them over a 15 year period and I've always been satisfied.
post #337 of 6914
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuance View Post

Wow...this is never going to end, is it?

It will end when you by the 5As.
post #338 of 6914
Thread Starter 
HA, yeah, you may be correct, Tony. Although, Richard Vandersteen is apparently working on a new model (7 series) that he says will measure so flat that the 5A will sound veiled in comparison. He is developing new proprietary drivers and says he has a midrange driver that has the ability to extend to 15KHz. Perhaps my journey will end with those...lol.

Thanks for the info about Audio Advisor, Tony.
post #339 of 6914
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuance View Post

HA, yeah, you may be correct, Tony. Although, Richard Vandersteen is apparently working on a new model (7 series) that he says will measure so flat that the 5A will sound veiled in comparison. He is developing new proprietary drivers and says he has a midrange driver that has the ability to extend to 15KHz. Perhaps my journey will end with those...lol.

Not if the price of the 5A is scaring you. I'm sure the 7 will be even more expensive.
post #340 of 6914
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuance View Post

HA, yeah, you may be correct, Tony. Although, Richard Vandersteen is apparently working on a new model (7 series) that he says will measure so flat that the 5A will sound veiled in comparison. He is developing new proprietary drivers and says he has a midrange driver that has the ability to extend to 15KHz. Perhaps my journey will end with those...lol.

It never ends because it always gets better. The 5As *are* on the softer, more veiled side of life, even with the 7 not being here. They are a very warm, engaging speaker with a lush midrange *but* they don't have as much resolution as other speakers, nor the bass precision nor, at least from the Vandersteen demo, the imaging . Therefore, there is no final answer, unfortunately. My issue with very expensive speakers is that they're still a big compromise. I find it's more fun to have different speakers for awhile, then upgrade a little, then go sideways, then spending a lot of money for a speaker that still doesn't do everything at 95% or better.
post #341 of 6914
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuance View Post

So I guess its back to the drawing board Oh well, a man can dream.

The journey continues

No matter What you hear in a show room, Brandon, the speakers-equipment-gear WILL sound different in Your Room! You are planning to "test" your choice(s) in your own home listening environment, huh?!

I auditioned some top of the line Boston Acoustics in a well set up Audio Salon that blew me away with their accuracy, soundstage and 3-D like presentation. Paid for the pair in order to bring home and test drive with My equipment, in My room. I was very disappointed and unwilling to tear out walls and reconfigure my home to get them to sound as I had heard before...brought them back to try something else.

Anyway, great you were satisfied with capturing a wonderful "sound reference (5A's)" that you can take forth and better understand what you are looking for...hopefully, I'll get -Real Close- with the LS-6's in My Current HT Environment!

Good Luck,

Ted
post #342 of 6914
Thread Starter 
I hear ya, Ted. I certainly plan on treating my room to avoid reflections that will muddy up the sound, but I will be unable to do a dedicated home theater until our next home is purchased. I highly doubt I will have saved enough money for the 5A's by then, so I'll have plenty of time to get the room acoustically sound.

So you popped for the LS-6's huh? I would certainly love to take a spin with those speakers but my room is just not big enough to do them justice. If you don't mind, please let me know what you think of them when they arrive. Thanks!
post #343 of 6914
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alimentall View Post

It never ends because it always gets better. The 5As *are* on the softer, more veiled side of life, even with the 7 not being here. They are a very warm, engaging speaker with a lush midrange *but* they don't have as much resolution as other speakers, nor the bass precision nor, at least from the Vandersteen demo, the imaging . Therefore, there is no final answer, unfortunately. My issue with very expensive speakers is that they're still a big compromise. I find it's more fun to have different speakers for awhile, then upgrade a little, then go sideways, then spending a lot of money for a speaker that still doesn't do everything at 95% or better.

So you heard them at an audio fest as well? It's weird because when I heard them the first time I was let down, but having heard them at Ultra Fidelis I can say with authority that the bass was precise, the imaging was phenomenal and they certainly were not soft. I blame the room acoustics concerning my first audition of them.

I sometimes wonder if I should do exactly what you described above: just go between some of the more affordable speakers, spending time with a few pairs every couple years. I think this approach would drive my wife nuts, however. Also, it would be nice to have a reference, even if I can't afford them. Now I have that.
post #344 of 6914
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuance View Post

So you heard them at an audio fest as well? It's weird because when I heard them the first time I was let down, but having heard them at Ultra Fidelis I can say with authority that the bass was precise, the imaging was phenomenal and they certainly were not soft. I blame the room acoustics concerning my first audition of them.

Well, it could be. They do have a softer, less detailed sound than many speakers. I think the imaging/bass problems could certainly have been room/setup, though Vandersteen actually set up the booth. I wouldn't have set them up that way, but maybe that's how they sounded best.

It's amazing how different a speaker will sound from room to room *though* I do find that my preferences largely stay the same, unless the rooms are really different.
post #345 of 6914
Thread Starter 
I didn't feel they were soft at all, nor did the others with me. Again, I blame the room at Vandersteen's booth. Of course, we both may hear differently, though you did you say you wouldn't have set them up that way. Hmm, I would love to see the FR measurements for those bad boys.

You are correct, though; different rooms equal different sound, even from the exact same electronics and speakers.
post #346 of 6914
Nuance, again I just want to you serious props on your hunt. I thought I was serious during my search for my first high quality pair... but, I didn't know of you back then Thanks for the reviews as well. Look forward to future impressions, however many of them there might be, for, um, however many years this may take
post #347 of 6914
Thread Starter 
LOL, thanks jostenmeat.

I will be updating this thread every time I audition a different pair of speakers with the hope that it will become a useful thread to others who are searching. And maybe one day I will actually find and/or be able to afford my perfect speaker.
post #348 of 6914
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuance View Post

Tim:

That is amazing my friend; I am very happy for you! That is one sweet looking system!

As monotonous as it may be, I am planning on starting a thread in the amps/preamps sections with the goal of finding the "perfect" preamp and power amp combo for my ears and needs. Lexicon is a very expensive brand, but I certainly won't rule it out.

Tim, I completely agree that it may be wise to spend more money on your front end electronics than on your speakers. In my opinion even a mediocre speaker will benefit from a truly awesome source player, preamp and amp. This is one thing I had to be aware of when we were auditioning at Ultra Fidelis; the front end gear cost more than three times the price of the speakers until we listened to the 5A's. Even then the gear was similar in price to the speakers (over $30,000 in audio gear...I can just hear my wife laughing and saying "dream on"). As good as the lower priced Vandersteen 2CE Sig II's sounded, the source player and front end gear cost 5 to 6 times their price. This is why, when my speaker journey ends (or is appeased for some time), my preamp and power amp journey will begin.

Wow...this is never going to end, is it?

Tim, I am very happy for you pal. I hope to one day get to the point you have reached, but I know it won't be for some time yet. I am still young and have more important things to spend my money on. However, once the kids go off to college it's time for daddy's dream system! Or, maybe I can just build it piece by piece over time. Whichever way I go, as long as my dream system becomes a reality (some day) I will be a happy Audio Videoholic.

I'll readily admit that going with the Lex gear was quite a stretch for me money-wise, but buying all of it used put it just within reach. I'll miss the chase, but now it is time to start building my music collection again. I think I'll talk to the guys at the local high-end AV shop. They always have the most interesting and high-quality recordings.
post #349 of 6914
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alimentall View Post

NHT's drivers are all custom designed and more than just an impedance change. There's some serious engineering go on. So, I can't wait to see what you come up with that competes with it!

I was hoping that you would come up with some other brands besides NHT for the price...And just curious how did you compare the 802d's to the fours? Did someone actually trade in their b&W's for nht's

The cantons i was speaking about are the 1k and the 2k pair thats similar design to the fours. Few other speakers in that range i would consider would be Revel, dynaudio audience 72, and a few others. I know you're biased, payed to tout nht, especially when you advertise online competitors prices. Ohh well, i'm curious what nuance thinks of the three's, i know when i demoed the towers blew the bookshelves away with dynamics. But the overall sound, although well balanced, seemed odd to me and had very little emotional impact.
post #350 of 6914
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuance View Post

I didn't feel they were soft at all, nor did the others with me. Again, I blame the room at Vandersteen's booth. Of course, we both may hear differently, though you did you say you wouldn't have set them up that way. Hmm, I would love to see the FR measurements for those bad boys.

You are correct, though; different rooms equal different sound, even from the exact same electronics and speakers.


Couldn't find any measurements on the 5A's, but did find some on your other great speaker of the day - the 2Ce sig II's

http://www.stereophile.com/floorloud...dy/index4.html

Based on the FR, it would seem that these are a slightly bright and detailed speaker. Does that sound about right?

Oh, and I forgot to mention that I had the same experience with the Sonus Faber's that you did. They had a very distinct hollow quality. Come to find out, this is common with speakers that us a first-order crossover. If you are not posistioned in just the right spot, the crossover causes a deep suckout at the transition between the tweeter and the mid driver.
post #351 of 6914
Nuance, did you listen to the 3A Signatures as well or did you skip from the 2A Sig IIs to the 5A's?
I auditioned the 2A Sig II's and 3A Sigs several months ago during my own quest for audio perfection and I preferred the 3A Sigs over the 2A Sig II's. But, budget wise, the 3 A Sigs were out of my range.
Back then, the 3 A Sigs shared the same tweeter and midrange as the 5A's, but the 2 A Sig II's did not. Has this changed over the past few months?
Anyway, just wondering your impression of the 3 A Sig's.
Thanks again for this wonderful thread and for sharing your journey. I for one have learned a ton from it and will make better judgements on my next speaker purchase.
Sean
post #352 of 6914
are you limiting your choices to a couple brands? From reading through this it seems like it.
post #353 of 6914
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by hifisponge View Post

Couldn't find any measurements on the 5A's, but did find some on your other great speaker of the day - the 2Ce sig II's

http://www.stereophile.com/floorloud...dy/index4.html

Based on the FR, it would seem that these are a slightly bright and detailed speaker. Does that sound about right?

Oh, and I forgot to mention that I had the same experience with the Sonus Faber's that you did. They had a very distinct hollow quality. Come to find out, this is common with speakers that us a first-order crossover. If you are not posistioned in just the right spot, the crossover causes a deep suckout at the transition between the tweeter and the mid driver.

To my ears they weren't bright at all, but rather very neutral. Maybe something in the listening room tamed that slow 3dB rise?

So the Sonus Faber's use a first order crossover like the Vandersteen's do? Hmm, interesting. The different between the two was night and day and they were right next to each other. I remained in the sweet spot the entire time, but maybe their was some weird room reflections or something, though that's probably unlikely. It's good to know someone else felt the same way (besides the two guys with me) because that tells me it wasn't the room acoustics. I certainly learned I do not like that hollow sound.

Oh, enjoy your music collection journey (that's the best one)!
post #354 of 6914
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by SeanCJ View Post

Nuance, did you listen to the 3A Signatures as well or did you skip from the 2A Sig IIs to the 5A's?
I auditioned the 2A Sig II's and 3A Sigs several months ago during my own quest for audio perfection and I preferred the 3A Sigs over the 2A Sig II's. But, budget wise, the 3 A Sigs were out of my range.
Back then, the 3 A Sigs shared the same tweeter and midrange as the 5A's, but the 2 A Sig II's did not. Has this changed over the past few months?
Anyway, just wondering your impression of the 3 A Sig's.
Thanks again for this wonderful thread and for sharing your journey. I for one have learned a ton from it and will make better judgements on my next speaker purchase.
Sean

I did not listen to the 3A Sigs because the newer 2CE Sig II's (also called MKII's) now share the tweeter and midrange with the 3A Sig. I have heard the 3A in the past, but the 2CE Sig II came very close due to sharing those drivers.

I do not know if the 3A Sig still shares the same midrange and tweeter with the model 5, but if I had to guess I would say no. I think once the Model 5 was revamped into the 5A, that changed. I could be wrong, though.
Quote:
Originally Posted by realred2 View Post

are you limiting your choices to a couple brands? From reading through this it seems like it.

No, I am not. Read back a few pages and you will see that I listened to Monitor Audio Silver and Gold series, Vandersteen, Sonus Faber, Vienna Acoustics and Paradigm so far. From the brands and models auditioned I only liked a few...if that's what you mean. I am also listening to some NHT Three's this week and heading to Craig(sub)'s home this weekend audition Def Tech, Onix Rocket and perhaps a few others.
post #355 of 6914
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuance View Post

To my ears they (the 2Ce sig II's) weren't bright at all, but rather very neutral. Maybe something in the listening room tamed that slow 3dB rise?

So the Sonus Faber's use a first order crossover like the Vandersteen's do? Hmm, interesting. The different between the two was night and day and they were right next to each other. I remained in the sweet spot the entire time, but maybe their was some weird room reflections or something, though that's probably unlikely. It's good to know someone else felt the same way (besides the two guys with me) because that tells me it wasn't the room acoustics. I certainly learned I do not like that hollow sound.

Oh, enjoy your music collection journey (that's the best one)!

My bad, I should know better than to attempt to judge a speaker's tonal quality by the anechoic FR plot. Looking at the in-room response in that same set of Seterophile measurements, the treble rolls off gradually, which should balance out the slight rise in the direct FR.

I forgot that the Vandy's also use a first-order crossover. It mus be less of a problem in that speaker due to the staggered driver array and possibly a crossover point that doesn't fall so close to the midrange. Just a guess.
post #356 of 6914
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zues View Post

I was hoping that you would come up with some other brands besides NHT for the price...And just curious how did you compare the 802d's to the fours? Did someone actually trade in their b&W's for nht's

Well, sure, there are other good products - the Revel F12s for one. Cantons are good too. The problem is, coming up with expensive good speakers is far easier than coming up with inexpensive ones. Especially towers. The 802Ds/Four comparison was in a customer's house. They were really amazingly close to each other. He said he was surprised how the Fours kept up. I was quietly thinking the opposite with a big smile on my face.
Quote:



I know you're biased, payed to tout nht, especially when you advertise online competitors prices.

Really? Well, that shows how much you know about *anything*. I tout NHT because people should hear it. Period. The deal that AA has is ridiculously good and if I were a normal consumer, I'd be desperate to know about deals like that. They once closed out Genesis Genre 1s for $650. That was a deal I told some of my own customers to grab.
Quote:



Ohh well, i'm curious what nuance thinks of the three's, i know when i demoed the towers blew the bookshelves away with dynamics. But the overall sound, although well balanced, seemed odd to me and had very little emotional impact.

It's up to the music to have emotional impact. Not the speakers. It has *never* really been a speaker's job to create emotional impact. That's why we have so many speakers trying to create that which either a) doesn't exist in the music or b) doesn't exist in the listener. I listen to music with emotional impact and am an emotional listner, so I don't require that from the speaker. In fact, it's the last thing I need.
post #357 of 6914
Good music has emotional impact, and some speakers are better than others at conveying the emotion in the music.

To date, a pair of properly set up Klipsch Heritage are some of the best I have heard at doing this.

Unfortunately, NHT's, while measuring well, are some of the worst, in terms of recreating emotional impact.

Try listening to a live jazz ensemble, then listening to Klipschhorns, and most listeners will "get it".
post #358 of 6914
I've had a few of the Vandersteen Speakers and just loved them and still do. I started with the 2Ce Sigs and then moved to a pair of 3A Sigs and was very satisfied with the upgrade. I added a pair of 2Wq's subs to the 3A's and it really made the 3A's sound much better taking the base load off of the amps and speakers. It really made the 3A's shine. I never tried the subs with the 2Ce Sigs but I would imagine it would have done wonders for them. The Vandy 3A Sigs with a pair of 2Wq's is a great combination for a very reasonable price and probably compete very well with a pair of Quatros. They didn't break a sweat playing at 90-95db on any music I put at them. Well, then I bought a pair of 5A's. Everything was perfect, so transparant, such perfect bass and I haven't had them calibrated by a Vandersteen tech yet. Oh by the way the 5A's in Ebony are simply beautiful. All of the speakers have been run by Sonic Frontier CD and Pre and either Krell 250 Mono's or VTL 450 Sig Mono's. I purchased all of them used in my area (So. Cal) so trading up and changing gear isn't as expensive. You can get a great price on a pair of 5's since it's too expensive to have them upgraded to 5A's and probably get 95% of the 5A sound.
post #359 of 6914
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by hifisponge View Post

My bad, I should know better than to attempt to judge a speaker's tonal quality by the anechoic FR plot. Looking at the in-room response in that same set of Seterophile measurements, the treble rolls off gradually, which should balance out the slight rise in the direct FR.

I forgot that the Vandy's also use a first-order crossover. It mus be less of a problem in that speaker due to the staggered driver array and possibly a crossover point that doesn't fall so close to the midrange. Just a guess.

Yeah, I dunno. The tonality was so perfect...but I wouldn't be surprised if there was a +/- 3 dB along the FR. I can hear well, but I dunno if I can hear that well.

The Vandersteen is the only speaker that I've heard that uses a first order crossover yet sounds real good to my ears (other than Thiel...but I forgot which model). It must have to do with the baffleless design and the overall engineering/crossover. In fact, it's one speaker we all agreed that we could live with for a while without the upgrade-itus bug striking. Now I just have to find the latter but in a sexy wooden finish (to appease my beautiful wife).
Quote:
Originally Posted by craigsub View Post

Good music has emotional impact, and some speakers are better than others at conveying the emotion in the music.

I totally agree with that statement, hence my journey. My music already has emotional impact (at least for me), so I need a speaker that will capture all of it while not ruining it.

Craig, just for the sake of those reading this thread (and for my curiosity), is the list of speakers we will be auditioning finalized? If so, what is it?
Quote:
Originally Posted by bhaaf View Post

I've had a few of the Vandersteen Speakers and just loved them and still do. I started with the 2Ce Sigs and then moved to a pair of 3A Sigs and was very satisfied with the upgrade. I added a pair of 2Wq's subs to the 3A's and it really made the 3A's sound much better taking the base load off of the amps and speakers. It really made the 3A's shine. I never tried the subs with the 2Ce Sigs but I would imagine it would have done wonders for them. The Vandy 3A Sigs with a pair of 2Wq's is a great combination for a very reasonable price and probably compete very well with a pair of Quatros. They didn't break a sweat playing at 90-95db on any music I put at them. Well, then I bought a pair of 5A's. Everything was perfect, so transparant, such perfect bass and I haven't had them calibrated by a Vandersteen tech yet. Oh by the way the 5A's in Ebony are simply beautiful. All of the speakers have been run by Sonic Frontier CD and Pre and either Krell 250 Mono's or VTL 450 Sig Mono's. I purchased all of them used in my area (So. Cal) so trading up and changing gear isn't as expensive. You can get a great price on a pair of 5's since it's too expensive to have them upgraded to 5A's and probably get 95% of the 5A sound.

I have heard the 2wq sub and it's wicked good. In fact, it may be the best sub for music that I have ever experienced. I should have had the guy at Ultra Fidelis put them on with the quatros so my bro and Justin could have experienced them. Stereo subs...nothing like it!

The 3A's rock, but the 2CE Sig II's now offer 95% of what the 3A's do because they now share the same midrange and tweeter drivers. And for $2200 with the stands, they are a bargain! I would love to hear the 2CE Sig II's with dual 2wq's!

bhaaf, glad you like the 5A's! I knew there was someone else out there that felt the way I (we) do. I am so jealous!! Enjoy the heck out of those 5A's bud!
post #360 of 6914
Thread Starter 
John, no worries pal. I have noticed some people don't share the same opinions as you concerning the NHT line of speakers but I won't let that cloud my judgement. Nor will I let your eternal praise for them brainwash me. I will let my own ears decide and will report back the truth without bias.
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